Elderly woman dies because nurse refused to give CPR

[Spoonman]

The woman signed an agreement agreeing that life-saving efforts would not be performed (rather like a do not resuscitate order). As awful as this 911 incident may look, it's what she agreed to.

I still don't understand a place having a policy that says no one can give aid. I mean, then why do they even have a nurse on site?

I don't know all the details of this case, but there are facilities that provide Palliative Care...people are there just to be made comfortable until they die. It's also not unusual for someone in a care or hospital setting to have a Do Not Resuscitate Order. Not everyone aspires to live like a vegetable.

and depending on her condition too. if you are suffering and in pain and it's finally over, do you really want to be brought back?

 

[KissMy]

There is a difference from trying to prevent a confrontation/assault/death by violence and telling someone to attempt to save someone who is dying.

There is not a difference!

You are not legally obligated to do as a 911 operator says.

Police are not even legally obligated to protect you. You can call 911 & they or the police could go take a nap while you are raped & you can't sue them.

Is too!

I suppose you can show us the law that says we have to follow 911 operators orders? How about some court cases?

 

[Katzndogz]

The family say they are happy with the facility and the care their mother received.

That's not what they said last night when they were interviewed.

I don't know who "they" is but her daughter released a statement to abc that said exactly that, this morning.

Ohhhhh ABC!

That's not irrefutable.

 

[Katzndogz]

I still don't understand a place having a policy that says no one can give aid. I mean, then why do they even have a nurse on site?

I don't know all the details of this case, but there are facilities that provide Palliative Care...people are there just to be made comfortable until they die. It's also not unusual for someone in a care or hospital setting to have a Do Not Resuscitate Order. Not everyone aspires to live like a vegetable.

and depending on her condition too. if you are suffering and in pain and it's finally over, do you really want to be brought back?

The old lady wasn't suffering and she wasn't in pain. This was an assisted living facility, not a hospice. While there are facilities that provide palliative care, this facility wasn't one of them.

 

[Katzndogz]

The policy of this facility looks like it's an illegal policy and an attempt to contract away the facility's duty of care. Then of course it doesn't matter what was agreed to, the agreement was illegal.

 

[tinydancer]

The elderly patient signed a DNR.

My mother signed one. I cannot imagine how that poor nurse feels.

I know I felt helpless. But if one is to choose personal freedom in life and death, the DNR is the penultimate.

Stop bashing the nurse.

 

[boedicca]

I still don't understand a place having a policy that says no one can give aid. I mean, then why do they even have a nurse on site?

I don't know all the details of this case, but there are facilities that provide Palliative Care...people are there just to be made comfortable until they die. It's also not unusual for someone in a care or hospital setting to have a Do Not Resuscitate Order. Not everyone aspires to live like a vegetable.

I get that but this place was an independent senior living facility. I don't get why a place like that would have a hands-off policy.

Lawyers and liability lawsuits. If the facility is just there to make old folks comfortable, they don't want the legal risk of being sued for not keeping someone alive at all costs.

 

[boedicca]

I still don't understand a place having a policy that says no one can give aid. I mean, then why do they even have a nurse on site?

I don't know all the details of this case, but there are facilities that provide Palliative Care...people are there just to be made comfortable until they die. It's also not unusual for someone in a care or hospital setting to have a Do Not Resuscitate Order. Not everyone aspires to live like a vegetable.

and depending on her condition too. if you are suffering and in pain and it's finally over, do you really want to be brought back?

For me, no. If I am suffering with no hope of regaining a decent quality of life, I'd rather not have extraordinary measures taken to prolong my life.

 

[Gracie]

The elderly patient signed a DNR.

My mother signed one. I cannot imagine how that poor nurse feels.

I know I felt helpless. But if one is to choose personal freedom in life and death, the DNR is the penultimate.

Stop bashing the nurse.

Ding ding ding!

 

[Luissa]

I've never heard of a nursing home having that type of policy. Really bizarre.

It is weird, they probably have been sued before or something.
We are not suppose to give CPR to people who are NO code, but we are suppose to give it until we know for certain what their DNR status is and if they are not a no code.

Is there any report as to what this lady's DNR status was?

 

[Luissa]

I will say this, if I was 87 and living in a nursing home I would be a no code. If you are that old and already have health problems and have to have CPR. You are not going to be in good shape afterwards. For one, you will have a few broken ribs plus probably about ten other problems.

 

[tinydancer]

I've never heard of a nursing home having that type of policy. Really bizarre.

It is weird, they probably have been sued before or something.
We are not suppose to give CPR to people who are NO code, but we are suppose to give it until we know for certain what their DNR status is and if they are not a no code.

Is there any report as to what this lady's DNR status was?

She signed it. A DNR was signed.

 

[tinydancer]

I'm looking forward to my time in an old folks home.

Those kids better crank Sweet Home Alabama or I'll be doing wheelies down the aisles and burning rubber.

 

[Luissa]

I've never heard of a nursing home having that type of policy. Really bizarre.

It is weird, they probably have been sued before or something.
We are not suppose to give CPR to people who are NO code, but we are suppose to give it until we know for certain what their DNR status is and if they are not a no code.

Is there any report as to what this lady's DNR status was?

She signed it. A DNR was signed.

Then the nurse had no choice.

 

[boedicca]

It is weird, they probably have been sued before or something.
We are not suppose to give CPR to people who are NO code, but we are suppose to give it until we know for certain what their DNR status is and if they are not a no code.

Is there any report as to what this lady's DNR status was?

She signed it. A DNR was signed.

Then the nurse had no choice.

Indeed. She was following the patient's wishes.

 

[tinydancer]

It is weird, they probably have been sued before or something.
We are not suppose to give CPR to people who are NO code, but we are suppose to give it until we know for certain what their DNR status is and if they are not a no code.

Is there any report as to what this lady's DNR status was?

She signed it. A DNR was signed.

Then the nurse had no choice.

Oh Luissa can you imagine what these poor nurses face? When I found out my mom's DNR I thought surely I was like to die.

I can't imagine what they go thru. I understand the 911 operators distress, but I cannot imagine the pain of the worker going "no I can't" It must be the worst on the planet.

 

[Spoonman]

I don't know all the details of this case, but there are facilities that provide Palliative Care...people are there just to be made comfortable until they die. It's also not unusual for someone in a care or hospital setting to have a Do Not Resuscitate Order. Not everyone aspires to live like a vegetable.

and depending on her condition too. if you are suffering and in pain and it's finally over, do you really want to be brought back?

The old lady wasn't suffering and she wasn't in pain. This was an assisted living facility, not a hospice. While there are facilities that provide palliative care, this facility wasn't one of them.

Glenwood Gardens released a statement confirming its policy prohibiting employees from performing CPR.

yea, but this is what this facilities policy is.

 

[Spoonman]

I don't know all the details of this case, but there are facilities that provide Palliative Care...people are there just to be made comfortable until they die. It's also not unusual for someone in a care or hospital setting to have a Do Not Resuscitate Order. Not everyone aspires to live like a vegetable.

and depending on her condition too. if you are suffering and in pain and it's finally over, do you really want to be brought back?

For me, no. If I am suffering with no hope of regaining a decent quality of life, I'd rather not have extraordinary measures taken to prolong my life.

my neighbor had terminal cancer. my wife found him unconcious in bed after we didn't hear from him for a day. she called the ambulence and they picked him up, revived him. he had a DNR but emergency services wasn't aware of it. he lived 3 more days on lots of pain killers and barely awake. whne its time to go it's time to go.

 

[Luissa]

I don't know all the details of this case, but there are facilities that provide Palliative Care...people are there just to be made comfortable until they die. It's also not unusual for someone in a care or hospital setting to have a Do Not Resuscitate Order. Not everyone aspires to live like a vegetable.

and depending on her condition too. if you are suffering and in pain and it's finally over, do you really want to be brought back?

The old lady wasn't suffering and she wasn't in pain. This was an assisted living facility, not a hospice. While there are facilities that provide palliative care, this facility wasn't one of them.

Many people who live at assisted livings are no code and can be on hospice. We have about 8 right now on hospice at my work.

 

[Luissa]

She signed it. A DNR was signed.

Then the nurse had no choice.

Oh Luissa can you imagine what these poor nurses face? When I found out my mom's DNR I thought surely I was like to die.

I can't imagine what they go thru. I understand the 911 operators distress, but I cannot imagine the pain of the worker going "no I can't" It must be the worst on the planet.

I do, I am not a nurse but we are it at my work. We have one nurse at my work, us med techs are the ones who would be doing CPR or calling 911. I had to call 911 just last night.
My friend had to do CPR on a lady on our memory care side a year ago. No clue why she wasn't no code. She said she could hear her ribs breaking. Plus the lady didn't survive. They figured she had died instantly.