Education: The Big Lie

Discussion in 'Clean Debate Zone' started by Quantum Windbag, Oct 10, 2012.

  1. Quantum Windbag
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    Quantum Windbag Gold Member

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    I came across a link to this blog today, and thought the guy made some really good points.

    College, Politics, and Wagnerian Opera - The Conservative Reader

    The basic assumption behind the value of an education is that economic growth has unlimited potential. That obviously does not apply in a recession or a period of extended slow growth. The problem is that, even when the economy was booming, the education bubble was ready to burst. We haven't seen it yet, but it is going to crash. We need to prepare for it now and accept that education is not going to fix our economy.
     
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2012
  2. Avatar4321
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    Avatar4321 Diamond Member Gold Supporting Member

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    I think the bigger lie is that one has to go to school to recieve an education.
     
  3. auditor0007
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    auditor0007 Gold Member

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    The liberal arts education is pointless. Just getting a BS or BA is of little value to most employers because they still need to train you to do the job. Employers should be working with universities telling them exactly what they need to teach to prepare students for positions within their firms. A student could sign up for a program that would include an internship with their future employer and a guarantee of employment upon finishing their schooling. These types of programs would work great in many industries, for both blue collar and white collar jobs.
     
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  4. Quantum Windbag
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    Quantum Windbag Gold Member

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    I would go along with that, if it was set up correctly. We would still have the problem that an education is not a guarantee of a job. Even Apple can't employ everyone who graduates from college even if it is specifically designed to meet their needs.
     
  5. Steelplate
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    Steelplate Bluesman

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    the biggest issue I have with education is the emphasis on degrees in the workplace. If you don't have one, it doesn't matter how good of a worker you are, or how intelligent you are. Your earnings potential is severely limited.

    The second biggest issue is the cost involved in attaining that degree. We have a 529 account for both of our kids....our oldest got a four year degree from Penn State and even with the help of the 529 account, he still ended up $26k in debt with student loans. If we hadn't planned....he would have been about $100k in debt....before he started his life. That's way too much to saddle a 22year old with before he even gets his first "career" oriented job.

    even two year degrees from Tech schools cost about 10k/year and your earnings potential is lower after you get it.

    Community colleges, which used to fill that void with affordable Associates degree programs have slowly been swallowed up by private Tech schools, or have become satellite campuses of larger and more expensive Universities.

    The bad thing about the tech schools is that credits don't transfer if one does want to go on and get a Bachelor's. The bad thing about satellite campuses os that they charge the same as their main campuses.

    It's a bad situation all around.
     
  6. editec
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    editec Mr. Forgot-it-All

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    Those who tell us that education will solve the problem of a fibrilating economy are either incapable of understanding the true nature of this economy or simply people who are attempting to blame the VICTIMS of this economy.


    There are far fewer billets (that is to say decent paying jobs) than there are qualified people to fill them in most cases.

    There are, of course, some types of employment that lacks qualified candidates, but compared to the numbers of people who are unemployed, they are insignificant in number.

    And if everybody were qualified enough to take those few open jobs, and did so, too such that wasn't a single open job left in America?

    This nation would still have far too many unemployed people because the economy continues to sluff off jobs that formerly were needed.
     
  7. Katzndogz
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    Katzndogz Diamond Member

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    The biggest lie of all is that passing with good grades means an education has been received. That's how come we have graduates with high GPAs who can't read, write or do simple arithmetic.
     
  8. martybegan
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    martybegan Gold Member

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    The blame for a liberal arts education being pointless lies squarely with those teaching it. Before college became high school plus, a liberal arts degree was based on a classical education, that taught logic, reasoning, eloquence and intellect, all traits that were viable in most non specialized areas of employment. The onset of an academia dominated by one side of the poltical spectrum during the 60's and the onset of poltical corectness, followed by the watering down of the requirements of the degree has eliminated the 4 traits I mentioned above as the outcome of having a BA in Liberal arts. You are not taught to think critically, to weigh all the views, you are not taught the classics anymore, instead you get the "flavor of the month" modern author.

    Right now the only good degees left in the BA/MA range are premed, prelaw (barely), Engineering, Accounting, and computer sciences.
     
  9. there4eyeM
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    there4eyeM unlicensed metaphysician

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    The biggest problem with education is what is not taught.

    Students are not taught the realities of how perceptions work.
    They are not taught how language works to control what and how we communicate.
    They are not taught how words affect the subconscious mind.
    They are not taught the simple facts about the universe and the consequences of discoveries in physics.

    This does not mean a university level intense study of these subjects. Merely the basic facts about all these are easily understood by a ten year old and are necessary to being enabled to think clearly and avoid being manipulated excessively. Equipped with these tools, citizens would be better prepared to deal with the claims and urgings of salesmen and politicians. They could better handle the challenges of foreign ideas and religions. They could more intelligently be themselves.

    Of course, that is why all this is not taught.
     
  10. MHunterB
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    MHunterB Gold Member

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    We already have such 'co-op' programs in place at many schools. Some schools do such an excellent job of educating their students in the fields that a degree from them is a virtual guarantee of future employment - WPI, RPI, Drexel (when it was DIT) to name a couple that I'm aware of.

    Of course those are in the field of engineering - which is an incorrigably practical one, as the theoretical folks will note with curled lip......
     

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