Early voting as a misleading indicator and waste of time

[American Horse]

...except for convenience

We are seeing these long lines at the polls for early voting and the whole thing is an exercise in futility and a potential distortion of the process.

First rather than speeding the process, early voting will actually slow counting on election day and delay the American publics’ knowing the winner.

The reason is, all those early voter’s votes are being recorded on paper ballots and will not be added to the count until AFTER THE POLLS CLOSE on Tuesday. Only then are the votes counted in some way. At that time the voters name will be marked off the voting record as having voted.

Early voting will slow our knowing the final vote tally.

Furthermore deception and false anticipation is being built into the process because there is no way pollsters can know how those early voters voted other than asking in “exit polls” which is not practical early in the early voting period; only when the lines get longer right at the end of the early voting period will that work.

Therefore, up to now, or at least the last couples of days, the pollsters have been limited to just getting the raw number of voters from each precinct, and then assume those early votes represented the demographic of each of those precincts from past voting history.

Early voting information not a real early vote count at all; just an assumption (or assumptions) based on precinct R & D makeup.

 

[midcan5]

Voting is an assumption? For the working class in America, those who cook, clean, watch, build and do the tasks the rest of us benefit from, early voting is a way to have your say in a democracy. It is easy to understand why the privileged and entitled in America don't like it, it interferes with their greed and excessive consumption by giving the bottom a voice.

"A final word on politics. As in economics nothing is certain save the certainty that there will be firm prediction by those who do not know. It is possible that in some election, near or far, a presidential candidate will emerge in the United States determined to draw into the campaign those not now impelled to vote. Conceivably those so attracted - those who are not threatened by higher taxes and who are encouraged by the vision of a new governing community committed to the rescue of the cities and the impacted underclass - could outnumber those lost because of the resulting invasion of contentment. If this happens the effort would succeed." John Kenneth Galbraith 'The Culture of Contentment'

"A people that values its privileges above its principles soon loses both." Dwight D. Eisenhower
.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

So, longer lines on voting day make more sense? I know someone who cannot walk or stand for long periods. Should that person rent a wheelchair? Or just stay home.

What about those who cannot get to their polling place on that day? Are you saying they should not be able to vote? Did you know that voting day used to be a national holiday?

You say early voters votes are not counted until after the polls close. Since that's when they would be counted if they had waited in line on voting days, what's the difference?

The op just really doesn't matter because every citizen has the right to vote.

 

[American Horse]

So, longer lines on voting day make more sense? I know someone who cannot walk or stand for long periods. Should that person rent a wheelchair? Or just stay home.

What about those who cannot get to their polling place on that day? Are you saying they should not be able to vote? Did you know that voting day used to be a national holiday?

You say early voters votes are not counted until after the polls close. Since that's when they would be counted if they had waited in line on voting days, what's the difference?

The op just really doesn't matter because every citizen has the right to vote.

Actually Luddly, the lines are so long in early voting because making the vote takes a lot longer on paper than by machine. It's a paper ballot and a small square is placed by each name which has to be marked, but not outside the line.

There are security procedures that have to be followed to secure the ballot once it's marked. It has to be placed in a secure envelope and marked by the voter that it is their vote.

The maching is much faster than the paper ballot. Then, as I said above, the ballot has to be carefully attested to, then placed in a "ballot box" so that none of them get lost.

I can tell you that I, having voted in every election, general or primary, since 1964, for the small number of voters who were present in the polling place, have never seen it go so slowly, nor have spent so much time there.

I believe that lines move more than twice (or more) as fast with machines on election day than in early voting.

EDIT: And luddly my first line in the op was "except for convenience"

 

[American Horse]

MC you must know that my intent was not to say that voting is an assumption, but that I said "voting information" for the purpose of using early voting as a substitute for polling or for exit polling which we have been hearing about for days now. Was I that unclear? If so, I'll try to be clearer.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Even if one were to agree with the OP as to the possible ‘drawbacks’ of early voting, we should all agree allowing more citizens to vote far outweighs any alleged drawbacks.

Early voting also addresses the problems manifested by the anachronism of the ‘first Tuesday of November,’ where the Framers could never have envisioned the modern work week.

 

[American Horse]

Even if one were to agree with the OP as to the possible ‘drawbacks’ of early voting, we should all agree allowing more citizens to vote far outweighs any alleged drawbacks.

Early voting also addresses the problems manifested by the anachronism of the ‘first Tuesday of November,’ where the Framers could never have envisioned the modern work week.

Good points Clayton; but I don't believe that voting was less enjoyed because of the regular work week back in the 20th century.

Voters could always vote absentee by asking for a ballot. They could also vote early in the day, or for the early working people they could vote late before they close. That was always my practice

It seems to me the benefits of early voting go to the candidates more than to the voters because the candidates don't have nearly as many folks to worry about getting to the polls on election day; they've already been there, so there are fewer which haven't.

 

[American Horse]

The voters lose the advantage of the late developing issues or errors on the part of the candidate to take into account in their vote; another benefit to the candidates.

 

[theHawk]

I walked right in and voted without any line.

 

[American Horse]

I walked right in and voted without any line.

And that has to be the most common, but on TV we are seeing long lines for early voting.

 

[American Horse]

Clayton, back to you on voter participation: In the ten elections between 1960-1978 (inclusive) voter participation was 52.23 percent, and in the 5 most early years the average was 56.3.

In the ten elections between 1992-2010 (inclusive) participation was 45.47 percent, in the most recent 5 years the average has been 44.8.

Back in the first time period early voting was not featured while absentee voting was.
So in spite of the availability of earling voting, voting participitation declined rather than improved.


Source of participation figures

 

[American Horse]

Come Tuesday night the states without early voting will be the ones to watch because the vote as it is actually being counted will be a representative sample. Where there has been considerable EV (early voting) there will be greater distortion in reporting because those are paper ballots, are slower to count, and may be affected by the propensity of one or the other of the two major parties to have voted earlly.

Pennnsylvania is non EV so it is exempt from major distortion while being hotly contested,

Other non EV States of interest will be New Hampshire and Michigan which are both hotly contested. Connecticut is also not EV but it's known to be deep blue. The last non EV state is Alabama, a solid red state.

Pennsylvania is the state to watch early on Tuesday eve.

 

[Grandma]

...except for convenience

We are seeing these long lines at the polls for early voting and the whole thing is an exercise in futility and a potential distortion of the process.

First rather than speeding the process, early voting will actually slow counting on election day and delay the American publics’ knowing the winner.

The reason is, all those early voter’s votes are being recorded on paper ballots and will not be added to the count until AFTER THE POLLS CLOSE on Tuesday. Only then are the votes counted in some way. At that time the voters name will be marked off the voting record as having voted.

Early voting will slow our knowing the final vote tally.

Furthermore deception and false anticipation is being built into the process because there is no way pollsters can know how those early voters voted other than asking in “exit polls” which is not practical early in the early voting period; only when the lines get longer right at the end of the early voting period will that work.

Therefore, up to now, or at least the last couples of days, the pollsters have been limited to just getting the raw number of voters from each precinct, and then assume those early votes represented the demographic of each of those precincts from past voting history.

Early voting information not a real early vote count at all; just an assumption (or assumptions) based on precinct R & D makeup.

Negged for deliberate disinfo.

 

[American Horse]

You are an idiot; if you disagree go into detail and justify, don't just throw shit in the face of a person who cares enough about the process to criticise it thoughtfully. What did I say that was disinformation?

 

[Si modo]

Voting is an assumption? ....

Damn, you are a moron.

Here:

....

Early voting information not a real early vote count at all; just an assumption (or assumptions) based on precinct R & D makeup.

 

[auditor0007]

So, longer lines on voting day make more sense? I know someone who cannot walk or stand for long periods. Should that person rent a wheelchair? Or just stay home.

What about those who cannot get to their polling place on that day? Are you saying they should not be able to vote? Did you know that voting day used to be a national holiday?

You say early voters votes are not counted until after the polls close. Since that's when they would be counted if they had waited in line on voting days, what's the difference?

The op just really doesn't matter because every citizen has the right to vote.

Actually Luddly, the lines are so long in early voting because making the vote takes a lot longer on paper than by machine. It's a paper ballot and a small square is placed by each name which has to be marked, but not outside the line.

There are security procedures that have to be followed to secure the ballot once it's marked. It has to be placed in a secure envelope and marked by the voter that it is their vote.

The maching is much faster than the paper ballot. Then, as I said above, the ballot has to be carefully attested to, then placed in a "ballot box" so that none of them get lost.

I can tell you that I, having voted in every election, general or primary, since 1964, for the small number of voters who were present in the polling place, have never seen it go so slowly, nor have spent so much time there.

I believe that lines move more than twice (or more) as fast with machines on election day than in early voting.

EDIT: And luddly my first line in the op was "except for convenience"

I voted early, and we had electronic voting just like they will have on election day.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Even if one were to agree with the OP as to the possible ‘drawbacks’ of early voting, we should all agree allowing more citizens to vote far outweighs any alleged drawbacks.

Early voting also addresses the problems manifested by the anachronism of the ‘first Tuesday of November,’ where the Framers could never have envisioned the modern work week.

Good points Clayton; but I don't believe that voting was less enjoyed because of the regular work week back in the 20th century.

Voters could always vote absentee by asking for a ballot. They could also vote early in the day, or for the early working people they could vote late before they close. That was always my practice

It seems to me the benefits of early voting go to the candidates more than to the voters because the candidates don't have nearly as many folks to worry about getting to the polls on election day; they've already been there, so there are fewer which haven't.

Understood.

Consider the larger picture, however, in the context of voting as a fundamental right, where it’s incumbent upon the states and local jurisdictions to make voting as accessible to citizens as possible.

A compromise might be a ‘long voting weekend,’ for example, running from Saturday to Tuesday, accommodating both religious and working voters’ schedules.

 

[Grandma]

WallyWorld is open 24 hours, why aren't the polls?

 

[rh287]

...except for convenience

We are seeing these long lines at the polls for early voting and the whole thing is an exercise in futility and a potential distortion of the process.

First rather than speeding the process, early voting will actually slow counting on election day and delay the American publics’ knowing the winner.

The reason is, all those early voter’s votes are being recorded on paper ballots and will not be added to the count until AFTER THE POLLS CLOSE on Tuesday. Only then are the votes counted in some way. At that time the voters name will be marked off the voting record as having voted.

Early voting will slow our knowing the final vote tally.

Furthermore deception and false anticipation is being built into the process because there is no way pollsters can know how those early voters voted other than asking in “exit polls” which is not practical early in the early voting period; only when the lines get longer right at the end of the early voting period will that work.

Therefore, up to now, or at least the last couples of days, the pollsters have been limited to just getting the raw number of voters from each precinct, and then assume those early votes represented the demographic of each of those precincts from past voting history.

Early voting information not a real early vote count at all; just an assumption (or assumptions) based on precinct R & D makeup.

Well I thought Nate Silver fucked up this election cycle. I was dead wrong. It seems he truly is the only one who can VERY accurately predict elections. The guy is a fucking genius. The left wing cock sucker..lol