Dubbyuh and Gawwud

[MrMarbles]

The bold part is what's confusing. Bush waged war to help poor, downtrodden people.

We all know that Bush's main reason to go to war has to help the poor of Iraq. Even the thinly disguised WMD threat has now been proven wrong. Bush's war has casued great injustice to the people of Iraq. Never in recent history has the average Iraqi been under such great threat. Saddam bad? Yes. I'm not crying that he is gone. But Bush's war has caused way too much suffering for the average person. Alot have people died so that America can make a few extra dollars.http://www.antiwar.com/casualties/


[/QUOTE] He also did not "support the rich while ignoring the poor." That's a bold-faced lie put out there by the left with false statistics to make you believe that Bush is Satan. [/QUOTE]

Bush isn't Satan, but he definitly wasn't appointed by Jesus. Bush's economy is slowly strangeling the average American.http://www.bushtax.com/


[/QUOTE]Also, take a look at things like hurricane and tsunami relief. Are you saying Bush ignores those?[/QUOTE]
If you only put the same amount of effort into heping people as you do with killing them, then maybe people would give you more slack.

[/QUOTE] What about the poor in Iraq and Afghanistan that are voting for the first time in their lives? [/QUOTE]

I'm not argueing about Afghanistan. The terrorsits responsible for attacking you where there. You were justified in your actions. Why you stopped pursueing Bin Laden? I don't know.
I hope the elections in Iraq go smoothly. And that they will be able to govern themselves, might aswell get some good out of it.


[/QUOTE]The leftists contradict themselves. Bush went into Iraq and Afghanistan to help the poor and downtrodden, but that was going too far. However, they later claim he didn't do enough. Which is it left? [/QUOTE]

First off, Americans have this weird ability to polarize people and demonize them. In truth, nothing is black and white, left or right only. There is alot of grey area out there, by making yourself out as either on extreme or the other is dangerous.

What your 'left' are trying to tell you is that either you fight for your cause, or don't. E.G. Invading Afghanistan and not going after Bin Laden. Either invade and finish the job, or don't do anything. E.G. Invading Iraq do to threat against America, but negotiate with a known crazy with bombs already pointed at you, North Korea. So what will it be 'right'. Change the world, or leave it alone, non off this flip-flopping stuff, it's only getting people killed.


[/QUOTE]Not doing enough for the poor my !@#. Next, you'll tell me the one where his IQ is only 80-something (btw, if you think his IQ really is sub-par, go check snopes.com, where they have proven it false).[/QUOTE]


I don't think Bush is as stupid as most people would like, but he is definitily a tool and not sent by Jesus to save you.

 

[Annie]

We all know that Bush's main reason to go to war has to help the poor of Iraq. Even the thinly disguised WMD threat has now been proven wrong. Bush's war has casued great injustice to the people of Iraq. Never in recent history has the average Iraqi been under such great threat. Saddam bad? Yes. I'm not crying that he is gone. But Bush's war has caused way too much suffering for the average person. Alot have people died so that America can make a few extra dollars.http://www.antiwar.com/casualties/

He also did not "support the rich while ignoring the poor." That's a bold-faced lie put out there by the left with false statistics to make you believe that Bush is Satan.

Bush isn't Satan, but he definitly wasn't appointed by Jesus. Bush's economy is slowly strangeling the average American.http://www.bushtax.com/

Also, take a look at things like hurricane and tsunami relief. Are you saying Bush ignores those?

If you only put the same amount of effort into heping people as you do with killing them, then maybe people would give you more slack.

What about the poor in Iraq and Afghanistan that are voting for the first time in their lives?

I'm not argueing about Afghanistan. The terrorsits responsible for attacking you where there. You were justified in your actions. Why you stopped pursueing Bin Laden? I don't know.
I hope the elections in Iraq go smoothly. And that they will be able to govern themselves, might as well get some good out of it.

The leftists contradict themselves. Bush went into Iraq and Afghanistan to help the poor and downtrodden, but that was going too far. However, they later claim he didn't do enough. Which is it left?

First off, Americans have this weird ability to polarize people and demonize them. In truth, nothing is black and white, left or right only. There is alot of grey area out there, by making yourself out as either on extreme or the other is dangerous.

What your 'left' are trying to tell you is that either you fight for your cause, or don't. E.G. Invading Afghanistan and not going after Bin Laden. Either invade and finish the job, or don't do anything. E.G. Invading Iraq do to threat against America, but negotiate with a known crazy with bombs already pointed at you, North Korea. So what will it be 'right'. Change the world, or leave it alone, non off this flip-flopping stuff, it's only getting people killed.

Not doing enough for the poor my !@#. Next, you'll tell me the one where his IQ is only 80-something (btw, if you think his IQ really is sub-par, go check snopes.com, where they have proven it false).

I don't think Bush is as stupid as most people would like, but he is definitily a tool and not sent by Jesus to save you.

Polling of Iraqis does not bear you out:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A3433-2004Jun24.html

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2002156526_iraqvote21.html

 

[tim_duncan2000]

This in contrast to Jimmy Carter whose telling every foreign dignitary he met about the good news of Jesus Christ is legendary. But then, Carter walks it like he talks it.

Where does the complimenting dictators part fit in (Arafat, Castro, and probably many others)?

 

[Hobbit]

I've talked with both Iraqis and U.S. soldiers about the war. Anybody who says the Iraqis are oppressed by us and hate us is either lying, stupid, or has believed someone who was one of the two previous options.

 

[sagegirl]

I'm curious Bully . . . what do you do for a living . How about you Sage Girl or you Mr.Marbles . I am a designer , photographer , fine artist and graphic artist . I imagine I am the type that should be in the column labeled left .After all , an artist . . . he's got to be a liberal . But no I'm not . I feel my intelligence is insulted everytime I hear a liberal try to speak . The self proclaimed progressive are anything but . You categorize people by who they support politically and assume everything about them without meeting them or knowing anything about them . How is that different from judging somebody by the color of their skin? I have been judged by "progressives" because of the state I live in and even by what general section of the country I am from . How is that different from the clowns that reside in the KKK? I haven't stopped trying to be friends with people I know to be the political opposite of me yet they have stopped returning my calls , even one that I have been a friend to for 30 years . The left truely is the side that hates where evryone I know from the so-called right are productive , caring , family oriented people . Why does the left have so much hatred for conservatives , I would love a real thought out explanation . . . I know that may be asking a lot but please , humor me ... any of you .

Oh by the way , as a designer I find it insane to think the incredible amount of diverse life on this planet evolved from fish that walked out of the ocean . Explain how evolution is responcible for a flea or a duck billed platupus or a thinking human that can design crafts that go to and land on Mars , explore and send back photographs for us to look at on our home computers . . . evolution . . .sure.

I will offer up opinions on several of these issues but because I dont neccessarily agree with some of your assumptions I cannot answer to all of it.....
First of all I am a system service engineer....a fancy name for a tech that services computer systems. I suppose from your way of thinking since you are an artist,and I should assume you to be a lib, then since I work for banks, insurance companies, stockbrokers, retailers, etc (people who seriously deal in money) that I would be a solid republican. Well I know people in both professions and they come in all political persuasions....so your first assumption is flawed, a person's profession may or may not reflect their political point of view.
I do not pre judge anyone....I listen to what a person has to say and more importantly observe what they do and take time to get to know them, or not . If you have friends who dont like you or refuse to relate to you because of your politics then they are narrow minded and may not be worth knowing. They could like you instead because you're a nice person, or fun to be with or any other number of reasons. I personally enjoy relating to people who have opinions that differ from mine (I often find myself on the unpopular side of issues here on the board,) but I have respect for almost all the members, I learn, I disagree, I concede, and I stand my ground, it all depends on the topic. I scan thru the various threads and see different sides of people here depending on the category of the posts. Some members that seem uptight in politics post some really good jokes and chat subjects. If a thread gets into a name calling disrespectful back and forth I just abandon it.....there is plenty of good stuff to read.
I share your respect for the artful design of our world....I cant "explain" evolution to a person if they have other beliefs. For myself, I explain all the diversity and all our common bonds with my concepts of evolution just as someone might claim the same observations lead them to believe in a god or a creator.
I sense a tone in your comments that makes me feel like you are uncomfortable when someone dislikes you. When a person disagrees with you it does not absolutely follow that they dont like you. I think you have to get over that hurdle and either seek some common ground with them or write them off as incompatible. I dont pride myself in how many friends I have, but I absolutely trust and respect those friends that I have. I hope/know they feel the same way about me.
I dont assume to speak for anyone else ,these are just my feelings about some of the issues you raised.

 

[MrMarbles]

Doesn't matter the reason or cause the war was justified!! The WMD's have not been proven wron just because the search has ended. Are you ready to go record Marbles by saying there is absolutely no way they were ever there, and possibly not elsewhere now?

Saddam probably had weapons at some point. He was supplied by your military by the way. The largest owner and user of WMD's.

Now that America controls Iraq's oil, you will be able to go on driving your SUV's, if you consider that justified, then sure, I guess the war was.

Never has the average Iraqi been under such great threat? Ar you kiddin'? Theres a friggin war going on over there, did you suspect lives would be all rosey as a war in under there way in there back yard? Draw your conclusion of injustice when it's all said and done, see what the average Iraqi thinks then!

A war America started. They're in danger because of America's war.

I hope when all said and done that the Iraqi people will beable to live in peace under they're own terms and not under the boot of American oil companies.

 

[OCA]

Saddam probably had weapons at some point. He was supplied by your military by the way. The largest owner and user of WMD's.

Now that America controls Iraq's oil, you will be able to go on driving your SUV's, if you consider that justified, then sure, I guess the war was.




A war America started. They're in danger because of America's war.

I hope when all said and done that the Iraqi people will beable to live in peace under they're own terms and not under the boot of American oil companies.

The Iraqi people are not under the boot of American oil companies and we are not recieving cheap oil as evidenced by our skyrocketing gas prices. Stop repeating the mantra of the left and think for yourself once, you sound like a lemming about to go off the cliff.

Sadaam had gassed his own people, murdered people for simple things like losing an Olympic soccer game not to mention political opponents. We gave Sadaam weapons at a time when he was involved with Iran and Iran held some 40 odd American hostages.

If you are to imply that we armed Sadaam, which is true, please be kind enough to mention the context in which we supplied arms to him and refrain from intellectual dishonesty.

Sadaam chose this war, he had umpteen millions of chances to comply with U.N. regs, the blame for current chaos in Iraq lies squarely on the shoulders of Sadaam and in a roundabout way the Sunni muslim people who for some stupiud reason choose chaos over stability. Every innocent American and innocent Iraqi life should be paid for by them.

Your cooperation which i'm sure i'll receive will be appreciated.

 

[Annie]

Saddam probably had weapons at some point. He was supplied by your military by the way. The largest owner and user of WMD's.

Now that America controls Iraq's oil, you will be able to go on driving your SUV's, if you consider that justified, then sure, I guess the war was.




A war America started. They're in danger because of America's war.

I hope when all said and done that the Iraqi people will beable to live in peace under they're own terms and not under the boot of American oil companies.

How are you defining the US use of bio/chemical weapons?

 

[tim_duncan2000]

Sadaam had gassed his own people, murdered people for simple things like losing an Olympic soccer game not to mention political opponents. We gave Sadaam weapons at a time when he was involved with Iran and Iran held some 40 odd American hostages.

If you are to imply that we armed Sadaam, which is true, please be kind enough to mention the context in which we supplied arms to him and refrain from intellectual dishonesty.

He also should mention how France and Russia gave him the most (unless those Migs and tanks were American). Hell, France even gave him a nuclear reactor.

Then, he should also mention how the US aided Iran some in the Iran/Iraq war when it looked like Iraq was going to win.

 

[sitarro]

Saddam probably had weapons at some point. He was supplied by your military by the way. The largest owner and user of WMD's.

Now that America controls Iraq's oil, you will be able to go on driving your SUV's, if you consider that justified, then sure, I guess the war was.




A war America started. They're in danger because of America's war.

I hope when all said and done that the Iraqi people will beable to live in peace under they're own terms and not under the boot of American oil companies.

Hey Mr. Marbles ,
Don't let anyone call you a simpleton with no creative thoughts or ideas because you're not . . . .really . . . (coughs)right...sure . . . I'm not kidding .
What's the price of gas in the Holy Land north of the USA? How are Canada's many airlines doing in this time of high fuel costs? How is your roach. . . er. . I mean extremist muslim asshole population in Oh Canada ? Do you really believe those gay mounties will protect you? Pathetic .

American oil ? Who is that ? Don't you understand that most corporations are multinational , especially the big oil companies . Check Shell Oil out . . . or how about BP . Who do you think discovered , found a use for , drilled and processed the oil that made the roaches . . . I mean the asswipes in the Middle East rich . They have nothing anyone wants , their sand isn't even good for golf courses , they were just lucky enough to be born on top of a energy source that a market was built for by the intelligent civilized people of the world . If left to them we would still be dodging horse shit on are super trailways . Just because you believe that those were better times doesn't make it right . I don't drive an SUV , they are basically tall stationwagons with a high center of gravity and a really good marketing campaign. I have a truck with a topper for carrying stuff and a sports car for driving and enjoying the road . I like the versatility of the two . But then again , I am by myself , no kids to carry around and worry about their safety . People have the right in our country to drive what makes them happy . . . hard to grasp a concept like that isn't it head full of marbles .I would suggest you help your country get it's shit together and leave ours to us .... eh?

 

[sitarro]

Good reply Sitarro!

Thanks Evil , just trying to help out . . . :usa:

 

[Bullypulpit]

Did you ever think that maybe you are the extreme one and not the people who believe in a higher power. God does listen to prayers and He does answer them. Its the truth. i guess you could argue that the truth is extreme but i disagree alittle.

And which God might that be...there have been many in the course of human history.

 

[Bullypulpit]

Doesn't matter the reason or cause the war was justified!! The WMD's have not been proven wron just because the search has ended. Are you ready to go record Marbles by saying there is absolutely no way they were ever there, and possibly not elsewhere now?

Never has the average Iraqi been under such great threat? Ar you kiddin'? Theres a friggin war going on over there, did you suspect lives would be all rosey as a war in under there way in there back yard? Draw your conclusion of injustice when it's all said and done, see what the average Iraqi thinks then!

Justified...?! On what basis? It was a war of aggression, pure and simple. As such, it was in violation of international law. But then, Dubbyuh doesn't much care about international law save where it advances the profits of his corpoartate pimps and johns.

 

[CSM]

Justified...?! On what basis? It was a war of aggression, pure and simple. As such, it was in violation of international law. But then, Dubbyuh doesn't much care about international law save where it advances the profits of his corpoartate pimps and johns.

Who says it was a violation of international law?

 

[Avatar4321]

Justified...?! On what basis? It was a war of aggression, pure and simple. As such, it was in violation of international law. But then, Dubbyuh doesn't much care about international law save where it advances the profits of his corpoartate pimps and johns.

Bully you know nothing about international law. If you did you would show where the President has violated it.

Regardless the law of our land is the Constitution of the United States, not international law. We celebrate the right to elect our own officials and create our own laws and not depend on the laws that others set for us. The war on Iraq was authorized by the only way that matters, through the lawful and Constitutional process for declaring and engaging in war. Nothing else matters.

 

[5stringJeff]

Justified...?! On what basis? It was a war of aggression, pure and simple. As such, it was in violation of international law. But then, Dubbyuh doesn't much care about international law save where it advances the profits of his corpoartate pimps and johns.

Never mind the 1991 cease-fire agreement, which Iraq was violating constantly by firing at planes over Iraq that were enforcing the no-fly zone. That alone is enough legal pretext to go "back to war."

 

[OCA]

Justified...?! On what basis? It was a war of aggression, pure and simple. As such, it was in violation of international law. But then, Dubbyuh doesn't much care about international law save where it advances the profits of his corpoartate pimps and johns.

Corporate pimps and johns, sounds like somebody is jealous looking in.

So you say it was a war of aggression pure and simple, eh? In other words you believe it was for land and resource acquisition, eh? The facts as of this very moment do not bare your position out, high gas prices, an Iraqi election about to be held.

Did Sadaam not have umpteen jillion chances to stop this war before it began? This is a war of Sadaam's doing, you know it and I know it so knock off the intellectual dishonestly and come kiss reality and the truth on the lips.

Your political positions are born out of nothing more than jealousy and envy, you envy what you do not have the intestinal fortitude to attain, pure and simple. You embody everything that is wrong with America today.

 

[OCA]

Bully you know nothing about international law. If you did you would show where the President has violated it.

Regardless the law of our land is the Constitution of the United States, not international law. We celebrate the right to elect our own officials and create our own laws and not depend on the laws that others set for us. The war on Iraq was authorized by the only way that matters, through the lawful and Constitutional process for declaring and engaging in war. Nothing else matters.

Bully has no proof, no nothing for anything he spouts. His political positions are built on conjecture and bullshit and they cave at the slightest movement of wind.

 

[OCA]

Damn I swear don't y'all get it?

BULLY IS AGAINST AMERICA, HE WANTS AMERICA TO LOSE AT EVERY TURN!

He is no more an American than Leonoid Brezhnev was.

 

[MrMarbles]

The Iraqi people are not under the boot of American oil companies and we are not recieving cheap oil as evidenced by our skyrocketing gas prices. Stop repeating the mantra of the left and think for yourself once, you sound like a lemming about to go off the cliff.

Stop repeating the mantra of the 'right', and think for yourself. You sound like a new recruit about to drink the purple kool-aid.


By the end of the 1990s, however, oil-producing governments were mired in political crises, due to corruption, wars, and civil unrest. In Venezuela, Iraq, Algeria, Iran, and other producer countries, the US government appeared to be involved in destabilization measures, deepening existing social instability and what some scholars call “the crisis of the rentier state."
http://www.globalpolicy.org/security/oil/2002/12heart.htm

Sadaam had gassed his own people, murdered people for simple things like losing an Olympic soccer game not to mention political opponents. We gave Sadaam weapons at a time when he was involved with Iran and Iran held some 40 odd American hostages.

I never said he was a nice guy. But there are alot of big bad guys out there that America does nothing about. Going after Saddam and turning your backs on others is very hypocretical.

If you are to imply that we armed Sadaam, which is true, please be kind enough to mention the context in which we supplied arms to him and refrain from intellectual dishonesty.

Then don't say America invaded Iraq to protect herself whne it is about oil, that is intellectual dishonesty.

Sadaam chose this war, he had umpteen millions of chances to comply with U.N. regs, the blame for current chaos in Iraq lies squarely on the shoulders of Sadaam and in a roundabout way the Sunni muslim people who for some stupiud reason choose chaos over stability. Every innocent American and innocent Iraqi life should be paid for by them.

I don't remember Saddam ever saying 'Please attack us". He was contained, de-clawed, and no threat to the international community. He did bad things. But again, so has alot of other people, yet no actions against them.

Hey Mr. Marbles ,,
Don't let anyone call you a simpleton with no creative thoughts or ideas because you're not . . . .really . . . (coughs)right...sure . . . I'm not kidding .
What's the price of gas in the Holy Land north of the USA?

Between 70-80 cents per litre. Well, thats here in Winnipeg.

How are Canada's many airlines doing in this time of high fuel costs?

The big ineffeicent ones are hurting, but we have a lot of discount airlines that are doing alright.

How is your roach. . . er. . I mean extremist muslim asshole population in Oh Canada ?

The same as your extremist white assholes do there. So how are you doing sitarro? I don't think we have been fully introduced.

Do you really believe those gay mounties will protect you? Pathetic .

Have you ever seen their Musical Ride, pretty impressive. If i was a terrorist, i'd be scared.

American oil ? Who is that ? Don't you understand that most corporations are multinational , especially the big oil companies . Check Shell Oil out . . . or how about BP . Who do you think discovered , found a use for , drilled and processed the oil that made the roaches . . . I mean the asswipes in the Middle East rich . They have nothing anyone wants , their sand isn't even good for golf courses , they were just lucky enough to be born on top of a energy source that a market was built for by the intelligent civilized people of the world . If left to them we would still be dodging horse shit on are super trailways . Just because you believe that those were better times doesn't make it right . I don't drive an SUV , they are basically tall stationwagons with a high center of gravity and a really good marketing campaign. I have a truck with a topper for carrying stuff and a sports car for driving and enjoying the road . I like the versatility of the two . But then again , I am by myself , no kids to carry around and worry about their safety . People have the right in our country to drive what makes them happy . . . hard to grasp a concept like that isn't it head full of marbles .I would suggest you help your country get it's shit together and leave ours to us .... eh?

Check out the link above.

My country has it's shit together. We are not under any real, or psuedo-threat for imaginary bad guys. Our biggest threat is from the "White, middle-class right" that keeps trying to import it's views upon us. Maybe racial profiling will work, it will at least cut down on the gun related crime in our country.