DU Lefty Scrambles for Talking Points

[rtwngAvngr]

Lefty brains begin to disintegrate:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x358135
I have a BAD feeling re Iran/today's Wash. Post. Question: WHAT DO WE DO?


Today's Washington Post article by Dafna Linzer harkens back to Judith Miller's stories making the case for an Iraqi nuclear weapons program (Strong Leads and Dead Ends in Nuclear Case Against Iran; http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/20... ).

The problem is, there is likely much more valid evidence that Iran IS pursuing nuclear weapons. At the very least, we know they have the capability to enrich uranium, and they already have long range missiles, and they have much stronger ties to terrorism. They are at least, surely, keeping their options open. Basically, one could make the case for Iran that Bush (falsely) made for Iraq in 2002.

My first response would be to say: So what? Can you blame them? We put them on the "Axis of Evil" in 2001 and then invaded another on that "Axis". Israel has nukes. We let India and Pakistan get them (and, arguably, Pakistan to help Iran get them). We have more nukes than anyone. Why shouldn't they be allowed to have nukes? Our actions practically forced them to pursue nukes!

My second response would be: Assuming they ARE pursuing nukes and not nuclear energy, even IF they posed a "threat" by some definition, why is invading them the only option? Why is it EVEN and option AT ALL? There are many more options than invading and "doing nothing". We're stretched too thin as it is, and our invasion and occupation of Iraq has proved to be a disaster on every level. It is a lesson in why military invasion and occupation is NOT the best recourse in cases like this, if nothing else.

The problem is, I'm not sure those arguments will work. Even with the American public, even after Bush has shot his credibility to hell. I'm sure the first RW talking point will be: "But you argue that we shouldn't have gone into Iraq because he didn't have a WMD-program or ties to terror. We'll, even YOU have to agree that Iran now has BOTH."

Thing is, they'd arguably be right. Sure, it's much more complicated than that (see my points above). But it's almost as though Iraq was a set-up for Iran. Go after the easier one with a weaker rationale, and you'll have a stronger rationale to go after the stronger one next.

Fear is a powerful tool. The fact that Bush was even close enough to win/steal 2004 taught me that. And if Bush could scare people into going along with the threat from balsa-wood planes and phantom mushroom clouds, imagine the more distinctly real possibility of actual warheads on actual missiles.

I fear war with Iran could doom this country. But I also fear that's where we're going.

Millions in the street didn't help last time. What can we do this time? I'm encouraged by the obvious groundswell of action in the fight against Alito. Perhaps such a groundswell of resistance, in today's atmosphere (further from 9/11, with the results of Iraq in the news every day, with Bush's credibility in the toilet), will yield better results than with Iraq. Perhaps winning in November would stop him, but I'm not so sure. I'm worried the invasion will come much sooner than that, and in any case, Bush will still control the executive no matter what happens in November.

The question is, WHAT DO WE DO... NOW?

 

[Avatar4321]

yeah victory in iraq has been such a horrible thing....

How can these people be so oblivious?

 

[theHawk]

The question is, WHAT DO WE DO... NOW?

 

[rtwngAvngr]

yeah victory in iraq has been such a horrible thing....

How can these people be so oblivious?

Oh my gosh, the republicans policies are perfectly suited to the world we actually live in. what are we gonna do!

 

[dmp]

I'd vote:

"We take the leash off Israel and let them kick everyone's ass. Rename 'The Middle East' "Israel" and be done w/ it.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

I'd vote:

"We take the leash off Israel and let them kick everyone's ass. Rename 'The Middle East' "Israel" and be done w/ it.

That'd be a good political cartoon. Big america with a little fiesty jew on a leash in a t shirt that says israel (or I'm with stupid).

 

[manu1959]

"what do we do now?"

what an idiot....you are a democrat.....you..... DO..... nothing.....

you wait until the republicans.....DO....something

then you criticize it and say you have a better plan

 

[rtwngAvngr]

more, from the same thread:

It has to be massive, clear, and bispartisan. It can be a letter-writing campaign but it would have to be the largest in history to be noticed. More effective would be action such as boycott, strike, march, protest....massive organization and participation. I don't know who can motivate and facilitate on that scale...we need a MLK or Ghandi with nightly MSM exposure....Even then.....

We are in a bad position here, against a nearly invulnerable cabal of neocons and corporatists whose work for 30 years has built a GOP fortress that is not likely to go away soon. We need help...need a surprise....need something we can't yet imagine, because politics as usual and normal opposition has already been countered and is useless.

from a letter writing campaign, to a "New Ghandi", to a suprise! LOL.