Don't worry American Tax Payer, GM's using the bailout to create jobs in BRAZIL! WTF

They got the money sealy on the premises that they would be insuring the jobs in the United States of America. Not the South American or China jobs.

I begrudge them for giving erroneous precepts on needing these funds for our workers and then taking this tax payer money out of this country.

Next shot around it is F' GM. Or anyone else that takes our United States resources while telling us we have to work for pennies and live like corporate slaves.

One point everyone seems to be missing is that Brazil is the only economy currently not in complete shambles. People in Brazil are still buying things, so shoring up that market makes sense for a global company that is in trouble. There is nothing any of these companies can do to increase car sales at the moment. They're already giving the damn things away and nobody wants them. The point of the bailout is to help them ride out the storm until things begin to pick up again. In the meantime, if they can actually make money in a foreign market, this will also keep them afloat.

Too often, people refuse to look at the big picture.
If that is the case then they should be fully honest about it. In light of MichiganFats post though I will still hold to the facts that they abandon the US worker long time ago.

The big picture includes previous actions also.

These mega giant corporations are not looking to keep the American economy in tact.

Money is power and they are using the American dollar to improve their position not the country's position as a whole. Weaken the American worker to the point of starving and you have weakened the very Spirit of Liberty that this nation was founded on.

Markets are a creation of government, just as corporations exist only by authorization of government. Governments set the rules of the market. And, since our government is of, by, and for We The People, those rules have historically been set to first maximize the public goodresulting from people doing business.

If you want to play the game of business, we've said in the US since 1784 (when Tench Coxe got the first tariffs passed "to protect domestic industries") then you have to play in a way that both makes you money AND serves the public interest.

When government sets the rules of the game of business in such a way that working people must receive a living wage, labor has the power to organize into unions just as capital can organize into corporations, and domestic industries are protected from overseas competition, a middle class will emerge. When government gives up these functions, the middle class vanishes and we return to the Dickens-era "normal" form of totally free market conservative economics where the rich get richer while the working poor are kept in a constant state of fear and anxiety so the cost of their labor will always be cheap.

The fact that the "marketplace" was an artifact of government activity was well known to our Founders. As Thomas Jefferson said in an 1803 letter to David Williams, "The greatest evils of populous society have ever appeared to me to spring from the vicious distribution of its members among the occupations... But when, by a blind concourse, particular occupations are ruinously overcharged and others left in want of hands, the national authorities can do much towards restoring the equilibrium."

And the "national authorities," in Jefferson's mind, should be the Congress, as he wrote in a series of answers to the French politician de Meusnier in 1786: "The commerce of the States cannot be regulated to the best advantage but by a single body, and no body so proper as Congress."

Of course, there were conservatives (like Hamilton and Adams) in Jefferson's time, too, who took exception, thinking that the trickle-down theory that had dominated feudal Europe for ten centuries was a stable and healthy form of governance. Jefferson took exception, in an 1809 letter to members of his Democratic Republican Party (now called the Democratic Party): "The care of human life and happiness, and not their destruction, is the first and only legitimate object of good government."

But, conservatives say, government is the problem, not the solution.

Of course, they can't explain how it was that the repeated series of huge tax cuts for the wealthy by the Herbert Hoover administration brought us the Great Depression, while raising taxes to provide for an active and interventionist government to protect the rights of labor to organize throughout the 1930s, 1940s, and 1950s led us to the Golden Age of the American Middle Class. (The top tax rate in 1930 under Hoover was 25 percent, and even that was only paid by about a fifth of wealthy Americans. Thirty years later, the top tax rate was 91 percent, and held at 70 percent until Reagan began dismantling the middle class. As the top rate dropped, so did the middle class it helped create.)

Thomas Jefferson pointed out, in an 1816 letter to William H. Crawford, "Every society has a right to fix the fundamental principles of its association." He also pointed out in that letter that some people - and businesses - would prefer that government not play referee to the game of business, not fix rules that protect labor or provide for the protection of the commons and the public good.

We must, Jefferson wrote to Crawford, "...say to all [such] individuals, that if they contemplate pursuits beyond the limits of these principles and involving dangers which the society chooses to avoid, they must go somewhere else for their exercise; that we want no citizens, and still less ephemeral and pseudo-citizens [like corporations], on such terms. We may exclude them from our territory, as we do persons infected with disease."

Most of the Founders advocated - and all ultimately passed - tariffs to protect domestic industries and workers. Seventy years later, Abraham Lincoln actively stood up for the right for labor to organize, intervening in several strikes to stop corporations and local governments from using hired goon squads to beat and murder strikers.

But conservative economics - the return of ancient feudalism - rose up after Lincoln's death and reigned through the Gilded Age, creating both great wealth and a huge population of what today we call the "working poor." American reaction to these disparities gave birth to the Populist, Progressive, and modern Labor movements. Two generations later, Franklin Roosevelt brought us out of Herbert Hoover's conservative-economics-produced Great Depression and bequeathed us with more than a half-century of prosperity.

But now the conservatives are back in the driver's seat, and heading us back toward feudalism and serfdom (and possibly another Great Depression).

Only a return to liberal economic policies - a return to We The People again setting and enforcing the rules of the game of business - will reverse this dangerous trend. We've done it before, with tariffs, anti-trust legislation, and worker protections ranging from enforcing the rights of organized labor to restricting American companies' access to cheap foreign labor through visas and tariffs. The result was the production of something never before seen in history: a strong and vibrant middle class.

If the remnants of that modern middle class are to survive - and grow - we must learn the lessons of the past and return to the policies that in the 1780s and the late 1930s brought this nation back from the brink of economic disaster.
 
Yes, GM can do whatever they want. But so can our government. Tariff &/or take away tax breaks, and/or give tax breaks.

And remember the GOP said Michigan was in a one state recession? :eusa_liar:

And it isn't like Toyota and Honda are doing well now.

So they fucked with millions of American middle class people's jobs and now the system is crashing. Not just in blue states.

So they can't blame GM's problems on the Unions. If they do, then what is Toyota's problem? Why are their car sales down so much?

And why aren't people with 700 credit scores getting loans?

The GOP used divide and concur. First they only sent union jobs overseas. Now we see they sent just about everything overseas. Soon Toyota will start outsourcing more and more of their jobs to foreign companies. They'll leave a shell of a plant in Alabama. And if the unions are gone, don't hold your breath for any wage increases. They might even cut your wages. Why not? You don't have a degree, and they can get cheaper labor in Mexico!!!

Then the Toyota employees might wake up and start their own unions. And us liberals will be waiting to help them, despite the years they stabbed us in the backs.


you're sucha fucking tard....the nonsense never stops spewing from your semen infested mouth.

First of all, if you ahve a 700 beacon..you can get a loan...you are talking nonsense...don't tell me I'm wrong cause both my father and brother are in the auto sales field.

They both sell BMW's where everyone usually has good credit and banks are lending...at .9% none the less.

So you're fucking clueless.

My friend just bought a ford 150 and he had a 610 beacon and got approved

Not what I heard.

Oh now you can start bringing up people you know? Didn't you make fun of me for doing that?

Ask them how business is? No one is spending. And a lot of people that want to are being turned down for the loan.

Anyways, it doesn't surprise me that you don't understand the severity of the depression we are in.

Remember you denied it was a recession for the longest time?

So we won't look to you for solutions, since you don't even see the problem.


business is good...my brother put out 15 units last month and my fathers dealer put out 280 units.

It's a decrease from last year however in todays economy they are still good numbers.

Thanks for caring.

Welcome to Marsh. - competitor where I was offered a position. Don't worry about my title numbnuts...I don't need a whacko like you trying to track me down.
 
So all the money Ford makes in Europe & China stays there? I don't believe it.


The majority of the money yes, money will be paid to European & Chinese workers: this will end up into the european economy. Taxes on profits, workers, ... go to the government of that country. (And in the case of china: that s bad)



Don't worry American Tax Payer, GM's using the bailout to create jobs in BRAZIL! WTF

As for the OP: when I look back at the time (picture: third one from the left) the CEO of GM went to Washington (first with his personal jet) to go begging for money from the American taxpayers they already screwed over and over by taking Jobs abroad then I have no words to describe how disgusted I aim about that company. IMAO the US government should withdraw the bailout of GM immediately, fuck em.
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Where is the time that US companies actually cared about their workers?
What happened to the Ford-philosophy? "Furthermore, Ford substantially increased its workers' wages,[2] giving them the means to become customers." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fordism

He understood that it were the workers who were the most important for the economy, something that the republicans seem to have forgotten a long time ago.

What an arrogant pricks.


Why is it that German, Japanese Car companies are doing so good? Because they treat their workers good, they have fucking healthcare & good working conditions and all those other social advantages. Yeah you can go crying that socialism doesn't work, but the fact is that the biggest Car company in the world (Toyota : http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/6586679.stm ) will prove you wrong.
 
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