Don't *Mess* With Texas

Well, this bunch from Texas seems to think that Aquinas had more to do with the enlightenment than Thomas Jefferson.

And then there was the governors race in Texas in which the winning candidate campaigned on getting Latin out of the schools because "English was good enough for Jesus".
 
What I find fascinating is the conservatives who claim they want local control of schools and curriculum, but are all right with this decision potentially controlling textbooks used across the nation so long as the books reflect their own point of view. So much for the right wing being any diferent from the left. :rolleyes:
Not sure it matters to them whether the entire nation follows their textbook standards or not. It matters to them if Texas does.

The rest of the deal, the "nationwide effect" is nothing at all other than economics.

And you're fine with that effect? I'm not. No more than I was with the far left setting de facto nationwide standards regardless of the reason. Propaganda is propaganda and wrong is wrong. If anything, Texas having a greater nationwide impact - and knowing it - means they have a much higher standard of responsibility. California failed when it was their turn, it doesn't give Texas a pass to fail just as badly knowing what the result will be.
You're also either forgetting or not realizing, other states are not REQUIRED to adopt these standards. They can have textbooks any way they want. But custom orders do cost extra.

Example: Texas NEVER adopted the CA standards. Ever.
 
a pass to fail
Great alliteration! Gonna suggest it in next rap song I do with GT!

Alliteration is the repetition of a consonant sound at the beginning of words.
Examples:
do or die safe and sound
now or never sweet smell of success
ALLITERATION IN PROSE
Alliteration is fun to say and enjoyable to hear. Without knowing it, you probably use alliteration to call attention to certain words. Many familiar phrases and expressions use alliteration. These include "down in the dumps," "hale and hearty," and "turn the tables." Tongue twisters rely on alliteration.: "rubber baby buggy bumpers. Many sayings such as these use alliteration:

He who laughs last laughs first.
Time and tide wait for no man.
 
Not sure it matters to them whether the entire nation follows their textbook standards or not. It matters to them if Texas does.

The rest of the deal, the "nationwide effect" is nothing at all other than economics.

And you're fine with that effect? I'm not. No more than I was with the far left setting de facto nationwide standards regardless of the reason. Propaganda is propaganda and wrong is wrong. If anything, Texas having a greater nationwide impact - and knowing it - means they have a much higher standard of responsibility. California failed when it was their turn, it doesn't give Texas a pass to fail just as badly knowing what the result will be.
You're also either forgetting or not realizing, other states are not REQUIRED to adopt these standards. They can have textbooks any way they want. But custom orders do cost extra.

Example: Texas NEVER adopted the CA standards. Ever.

No, they are not required to adopt them any more than they were required to adopt California standards. But the problem is budgetary concerns will practically force them to. And yes, some of it needed to be done. Hip hop music in textbooks is as absurd as chest thumping nationalism in the form of indoctrination in "American exceptionalism", IMO. The problem is they're going too far in the opposite direction. Education needs a good ideological neutering, not a tilt to the opposite extreme.
 
a pass to fail
Great alliteration! Gonna suggest it in next rap song I do with GT!

Alliteration is the repetition of a consonant sound at the beginning of words.
Examples:
do or die safe and sound
now or never sweet smell of success
ALLITERATION IN PROSE
Alliteration is fun to say and enjoyable to hear. Without knowing it, you probably use alliteration to call attention to certain words. Many familiar phrases and expressions use alliteration. These include "down in the dumps," "hale and hearty," and "turn the tables." Tongue twisters rely on alliteration.: "rubber baby buggy bumpers. Many sayings such as these use alliteration:

He who laughs last laughs first.
Time and tide wait for no man.
I stand corrected!

Whatever it is, I like it and gonna give it to GT!
 
And you're fine with that effect? I'm not. No more than I was with the far left setting de facto nationwide standards regardless of the reason. Propaganda is propaganda and wrong is wrong. If anything, Texas having a greater nationwide impact - and knowing it - means they have a much higher standard of responsibility. California failed when it was their turn, it doesn't give Texas a pass to fail just as badly knowing what the result will be.
You're also either forgetting or not realizing, other states are not REQUIRED to adopt these standards. They can have textbooks any way they want. But custom orders do cost extra.

Example: Texas NEVER adopted the CA standards. Ever.

No, they are not required to adopt them any more than they were required to adopt California standards. But the problem is budgetary concerns will practically force them to. And yes, some of it needed to be done. Hip hop music in textbooks is as absurd as chest thumping nationalism in the form of indoctrination in "American exceptionalism", IMO. The problem is they're going too far in the opposite direction. Education needs a good ideological neutering, not a tilt to the opposite extreme.
I think if you'll really look at this, you'll agree the "tilt" was more to the center, not to any extreme.
 
You're also either forgetting or not realizing, other states are not REQUIRED to adopt these standards. They can have textbooks any way they want. But custom orders do cost extra.

Example: Texas NEVER adopted the CA standards. Ever.

No, they are not required to adopt them any more than they were required to adopt California standards. But the problem is budgetary concerns will practically force them to. And yes, some of it needed to be done. Hip hop music in textbooks is as absurd as chest thumping nationalism in the form of indoctrination in "American exceptionalism", IMO. The problem is they're going too far in the opposite direction. Education needs a good ideological neutering, not a tilt to the opposite extreme.
I think if you'll really look at this, you'll agree the "tilt" was more to the center, not to any extreme.

I have looked at it, and in large part you're right. But there are concepts here that creep over the line into ideology and/or values, and that's what concerns me. Teaching American accomplishments is the job of the history teacher, teaching patriotism or nationalism is creeping into values and that should be taught at home. Taking out progressive multiculturalism is one thing, replacing it with conservative nationalism is another.
 
No, they are not required to adopt them any more than they were required to adopt California standards. But the problem is budgetary concerns will practically force them to. And yes, some of it needed to be done. Hip hop music in textbooks is as absurd as chest thumping nationalism in the form of indoctrination in "American exceptionalism", IMO. The problem is they're going too far in the opposite direction. Education needs a good ideological neutering, not a tilt to the opposite extreme.
I think if you'll really look at this, you'll agree the "tilt" was more to the center, not to any extreme.

I have looked at it, and in large part you're right. But there are concepts here that creep over the line into ideology and/or values, and that's what concerns me. Teaching American accomplishments is the job of the history teacher, teaching patriotism or nationalism is creeping into values and that should be taught at home. Taking out progressive multiculturalism is one thing, replacing it with conservative nationalism is another.
I didn't see any strictly "conservative nationalism."

Again, states which don't like it don't have to adopt it. But the earlier point made about Texans being more literate, articulate, knowledgeable and etc. than expected? It's because Texas NEVER adopted California's standards. It's not a coinky-dink.
 
I think if you'll really look at this, you'll agree the "tilt" was more to the center, not to any extreme.

I have looked at it, and in large part you're right. But there are concepts here that creep over the line into ideology and/or values, and that's what concerns me. Teaching American accomplishments is the job of the history teacher, teaching patriotism or nationalism is creeping into values and that should be taught at home. Taking out progressive multiculturalism is one thing, replacing it with conservative nationalism is another.
I didn't see any strictly "conservative nationalism."

Again, states which don't like it don't have to adopt it. But the earlier point made about Texans being more literate, articulate, knowledgeable and etc. than expected? It's because Texas NEVER adopted California's standards. It's not a coinky-dink.

Requiring the doctrine of American exceptionalism doesn't concern you? It does me. I teach my children to be patriotic, not nationalistic. Just as I teach them to be tolerant, not apologetic.
 
I have looked at it, and in large part you're right. But there are concepts here that creep over the line into ideology and/or values, and that's what concerns me. Teaching American accomplishments is the job of the history teacher, teaching patriotism or nationalism is creeping into values and that should be taught at home. Taking out progressive multiculturalism is one thing, replacing it with conservative nationalism is another.
I didn't see any strictly "conservative nationalism."

Again, states which don't like it don't have to adopt it. But the earlier point made about Texans being more literate, articulate, knowledgeable and etc. than expected? It's because Texas NEVER adopted California's standards. It's not a coinky-dink.

Requiring the doctrine of American exceptionalism doesn't concern you? It does me. I teach my children to be patriotic, not nationalistic. Just as I teach them to be tolerant, not apologetic.
When a fact is a fact, it's not a "doctrine."

See?

America IS exceptional, there's no way around that. There's no denying that. And it's not a political view. It's not nationalism per se. It's a fact.

Sometimes, it just is what it is.
 
I didn't see any strictly "conservative nationalism."

Again, states which don't like it don't have to adopt it. But the earlier point made about Texans being more literate, articulate, knowledgeable and etc. than expected? It's because Texas NEVER adopted California's standards. It's not a coinky-dink.

Requiring the doctrine of American exceptionalism doesn't concern you? It does me. I teach my children to be patriotic, not nationalistic. Just as I teach them to be tolerant, not apologetic.
When a fact is a fact, it's not a "doctrine."

See?

America IS exceptional, there's no way around that. There's no denying that. And it's not a political view. It's not nationalism per se. It's a fact.

Sometimes, it just is what it is.

Then you've pinpointed where we disagree. American exceptionalism as used in this context is a very specific doctrine of not just American uniqueness but American superiority, and a controversial one that crosses the line between education and propaganda IMO.

An article that gives a decent overview and lays out the basic framework of both arguments:

Online Encyclopedia and Dictionary - American exceptionalism

Many people don't believe that America is morally inferior, but also do not believe we should be indoctrinating children that we are morally superior or have a duty or obligation to convert, police and "save" our benighted bretheren across the globe.

If you're using the term "exceptional" as "unique", I would agree with you. But once we start down the road into an organized doctrine of nationalism and jingoism we're talking indoctrination into neoconservative ideology - and that is what I disagree with.

It's been fun, the real world beckons.
 
Requiring the doctrine of American exceptionalism doesn't concern you? It does me. I teach my children to be patriotic, not nationalistic. Just as I teach them to be tolerant, not apologetic.
When a fact is a fact, it's not a "doctrine."

See?

America IS exceptional, there's no way around that. There's no denying that. And it's not a political view. It's not nationalism per se. It's a fact.

Sometimes, it just is what it is.

Then you've pinpointed where we disagree. American exceptionalism as used in this context is a very specific doctrine of not just American uniqueness but American superiority
Again, not a doctrine, just facts.

We built a "more perfect union" exactly like the founders and framers intended. That is one of our founding principles.

It's NOT perfect, nothing is. But it is demonstrably BETTER and yes, SUPERIOR to any other union of mankind anywhere in the world. It IS exceptional.

That's not a "doctrine" and it's not nationalism, it's just the facts. Facts which would be excluded and never taught, were certain parties to get their way.
 
Good news: Back to Basics?

March 12, 10

A conservative-stacked panel of Texas Board of Education members endorsed a draft proposal of the state's social studies curriculum on Friday. The curriculum, if approved, will be used to create content for textbooks in the Lone Star State.


Conservative members had their way in the 11-4 vote, which came one day after several Democratic board members walked out, claiming the proposed standards dilute the contribution of minorities to American history and culture. The debate, which picked up again Friday morning, ended with only a single Democrat voting to support the new standards.


The draft will go on line for public comment for one month, and then the full Board of Education will meet in May for more debate and a final vote.


The proposed curriculum updates social studies standards used for courses, and by extension, textbooks that eventually may end up in classrooms across the country.

Members worked late into the night to pass amendments on everything from removing references to hip hop music to requiring students to study the concept of American exceptionalism.

The new standards, when approved, will be used in textbooks designed to be in Texas classrooms in the fall of 2013 -- but as a practical matter, administrators say it may be later than that.

The debate has spurred national interest, since Texas is such a huge purchaser of books for its 4.7 million students. Textbook publishers often take books that conform to Texas' curriculum and sell them to schools and districts in states across the country.



TX Board of Ed Passes Draft Curriculum Liveshots...

So in other words, these folks on the right want to do exactly what they've pissed and moaned about the left doing.

I have a novel idea. How about we just go back to teaching kids the facts and leave all of these leftovers of the culture wars on the playground where they belong?

Whose facts?

One man's 'truth' is another woman's attempt to deceive a population of sentient beings about impending climate doom.

Why don't we let the parents of any given school district decide how to create the curriculum for their little tikes?

Should the children growing up in the shadow of Microsoft be educated differently from the children growing up in the shadow of Dow Chemical or those raised tending the Amber Waves of Grain in the heartland? :eusa_think:

While every child should have every opportunity here in America, would it be wrong to offer more opportunities close to home? :eusa_think:
 
Why don't we let the parents of any given school district decide how to create the curriculum for their little tikes?
The public at large has input on textbook standards, at all levels.

True.

And as soon as the state gives the money to the districts to purchase what ever books the district chooses, the parents will have influence instead of input.
 
Why don't we let the parents of any given school district decide how to create the curriculum for their little tikes?
The public at large has input on textbook standards, at all levels.

True.

And as soon as the state gives the money to the districts to purchase what ever books the district chooses, the parents will have influence instead of input.
Why should the state give them anything?

Here in Texas, school districts for the most part get their funds via property taxes from their area, not from the state or the feds.

Parents don't have influence? How silly. PARENTS made up this board. And make up all the school boards as well, and also all the state education boards.
 
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Tonight, we introduced you to Don McLeroy, pictured above, a Texas dentist, self-described "Christian fundamentalist" and elected Board of Education member.


He is pushing for more focus on conservative leaders and issues -- and less of what he calls liberal bias in school textbooks.

No doubt some in the educational establishment will criticize the efforts, but that won't necessarily keep those lessons from textbooks that will be taught at schools across the country.

So tonight, we ask: Do you think America's textbooks are too liberal? Or is this wrongly politicizing the classroom?

Tell us what you think.

Nothing more than a bullshit pretext to impose their theocratic views. The so-called conservatives correctly state that the US is a Constitutional Republic. I would like to see their explanation for the gazillion state laws which transgress upon our right to life, liberty, property and to pursue happiness.



.

So these clowns now believe that liberal bias has even entered high school? As if it weren't enough that college academia is accused of liberal-itis. For some odd reason, textbook publishers typically write them to Texas standards, so are these revisionist Texas conservatives now suggesting that what they have been teaching in the past is wrong too? Or just not "conservative" enough.

I do wish Texas would just secede and get it over with.
 
I fly Delta, and generally hold my 'rest stop' until we cross the boarder over Texas air space. Then I relieve myself. I know, it's only symbolic, but shitting on Tom Delay and the rest of the RW assholes feels really good.

The irony of your misspelled word in a post about education is priceless.
Yes. It's also interesting that he puts more planning, thought and preparation on where and when he shits than he does on whether to bother spelling 4th grade-level words correctly.

This is why his posts are shit too, because he uses about the same planning, thought and preparation in his ideas as he does on where/when to shit.

Some people, like me, have been typing for so long that we no longer type characters, but words. Our fingers have minds of their own.

Never made a typo or used an inaccurate homonym? My my, it must be so comforting to be so perfect.
 

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