Don't Ask, Don't Tell

[mattskramer]

No discalimer required. It is not illegal to be homosexual and be in the military. It is illegal to live a homosexual lifestyle and commit homosexual acts while in the military. Therefore, discovery doesn't necessarily lead to anything. That it does is an assumption on your part.

Okay. I did not know that. I thought that if someone, somehow, found out that a soldier was a homosexual, then that would be enough to have the homosexual removed from the military. I guess that I stand corrected. Also, gays don’t go into the military to promote their homosexuality any more than do straight people go into the military to promote their heterosexuality.

The gays that do not go into the military to promote their homosexuality already are, and always have been in the military. They keep their sexual behavior to themselves, as it should be.

Okay. What happens if a soldier finds a male soldier writing a love letter another male “back home”? He is keeping his homosexuality to himself. It just happens that someone else unintentionally finds a letter. Is it okay for the gay soldier to remain?

So, yes, those gay activists DO want to go into the military for the sole purpose of forcing their aberrant sexual lifestyle on others. There can be no other LOGICAL reason to explain it.

Certainly there is a logical reason. Some individuals who just happen to be gay want to serve in the military.

It's a crying shame that morons like you have managed to make it politically incorrect for men to act like men. You may prefer your more lady-like behavior, but then, that just makes you a pussy.

Oh, come on. Name-calling is not warranted but then I expected no better. No. There are plenty of men who know how to treat women – with respect, class, and character. Real men don’t act like those creeps at Tailhook.

When I go into combat, I want alpha-males who aren't afraid to be backing me up, not some PC dimwit sitting in the rear weighing the political consequences of his possible actions in providing close air support to some Marines or Soldiers that NEED it.

It is too bad that you prefer to limit the military. I don’t care what the soldier’s sexual orientation is. As long as he is not afraid to “back me up”, he can be gay or straight. As long as he can do his job as a soldier – kill people and destroy things.

 

[mattskramer]

NOTHING is EVER that simple with Matt around. It has to be twisted out of context and a bunch of unrealistic parameters introduced.

LOL. Isn’t that the pot calling the kettle black. You and your name-calling and the implication that gays would be too frightened to cover your back. Ha ha ha.

No. It is that you use simpleton thinking and old emotion laden rhetoric instead of real critical logical thinking that complex socio-political issues call for.

By the way, pegwinn, I owe you an apology. It looks as though I was unintentionally developing a straw man when I brought up the issue of testosterone. (If you don’t know the “straw man” fallacy, look in up in practically any book on logic). Again, it was my mistake.

 

[Gunny]

LOL. Isn’t that the pot calling the kettle black. You and your name-calling and the implication that gays would be too frightened to cover your back. Ha ha ha.

Did you feel you just HAD to provide an example of your taling things out of context and attempting to dishoenstly literalize? Anyone with half a brain cell took the comment for what it was. That would NOT include you, apparently.

No. It is that you use simpleton thinking and old emotion laden rhetoric instead of real critical logical thinking that complex socio-political issues call for.

The crux of Matt's major malfunction: thinking you need to overcomplicate things that are quite simple.

But then, THAT isn't it either, is it? What it truly equates to is removing the context, logic and or common sense of any issue in lameass attempts to push your childlike idealism on everyone else.

By the way, pegwinn, I owe you an apology. It looks as though I was unintentionally developing a straw man when I brought up the issue of testosterone. (If you don’t know the “straw man” fallacy, look in up in practically any book on logic). Again, it was my mistake.

Your last paragraph is very becomming of you, as usual, assuming you are on some higher plane of intelligence than anyone else. Your continual intellectual dishonesty actually places you on a LOWER plane than most morons. At least they are trying.

 

[mattskramer]

Okay GunnyL – You said

“It is not illegal to be homosexual and be in the military. It is illegal to live a homosexual lifestyle and commit homosexual acts while in the military. Therefore, discovery doesn't necessarily lead to anything. That it does is an assumption on your part.”

I think that your comment was quick and not carefully though out or checked, so how about a straight answer to my question:

What happens if a soldier finds a male soldier writing a love letter another male “back home”? He is keeping his homosexuality to himself. It just happens that someone else unintentionally finds a letter. Is it okay for the gay soldier to remain?

The situation fits the criteria that you gave. He is a homosexual in the military. Your term “Homosexual lifestyle” is vague and subjective but I think that we can agree that he is not living a homosexual lifestyle. He is not committing homosexual acts while in the military. Again, is it okay for him to remain?

 

[Gunny]

Okay GunnyL – You said

I think that your comment was quick and not carefully though out or checked, so how about a straight answer to my question:

What happens if a soldier finds a male soldier writing a love letter another male “back home”? He is keeping his homosexuality to himself. It just happens that someone else unintentionally finds a letter. Is it okay for the gay soldier to remain?

The situation fits the criteria that you gave. He is a homosexual in the military. Your term “Homosexual lifestyle” is vague and subjective but I think that we can agree that he is not living a homosexual lifestyle. He is not committing homosexual acts while in the military. Again, is it okay for him to remain?

I think the problem here is rather than my comment being quick and not carefully thought or checked, your inability to comprehend. You followed this little diatribe by asking the same question I ALREADY provided you an answer to.

Unlike you, who base your argument on nothing but your uneducated opinion, my comment is based on actual observation and understanding the law as it petains to military personnel.

So let me try this again, and maybe you'll get it this time around.

Being homosexual in the military is NOT illegal.

Engaging in homosexual acts and/or leading a homosexual lifestyle IS illegal. Whether or not YOU think "homosexual lifestyle" is vague and subjective is irrelevant.

Your question has more than one or two legal problems with it; the first being illegally obtained information through censorship of the US mail. No doubt that would be labelled inadmissable. However, such evidence legally obtained IS evidence of the member engaging in a homosexual relationship for which he could be prosecuted and discharged from the military.

 

[CrimsonWhite]

Fuck what YOU want. Get back to us after you've called in your first close air support mission. I want the best at what they do, and their manners be damned.

Smarmy little PC people like you should have to NEED some close air support sometime, or ANY combat support for that matter. Being PC doesn't qualify you to do shit but work at the Headquarters in the military.

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to GunnyL again.