Does everyone understand the tax issue?

[8537]

The middle class is squeezed all it can stand, and if you make 200,000 a year and give up 70,000 a year in income tax

Does everyone understand the tax issue?

It would seem the answer is no.

WHich part do you need explained to you?

The part where someone making 200K is paying 70K in income taxes.

 

[Greenbeard]

WHich part do you need explained to you?

The part where income is taxed at a flat rate equal to the highest marginal rate (despite the fact that the individual in question doesn't make enough to even reach that bracket).

Don't tell me you're unfamiliar with how tax brackets work, too?

 

[Nosmo King]

Yes, I understand the tax issue, FULLY. Every April 15 when I whip out the checkbook and write a large one to the U.S. Treasury!

These assholes calling for raising taxes truly irriate the shit out of me. I pay enough. They want more, let them stroke a fucking check.

So, you are among the "small" percentage of Americans who pay taxes! Congratulations! Listening to Conservatives, I was under the impression that so few Americans actually pay taxes that I believed I was one of the few, the proud, the taxpayers. I thought Conservatives were of the belief that only THEY paid taxes and the remaining Americans who enjoy deductions for mortgages and charitable contributions or who simply worked hard and never made enough to live on were all Liberal pan handlers.

And if you're irritated about having your taxes raised, you must be making more than a quarter million a year! Mozel tov! It would take me four or five years to make that much! You must have an important job. Too important to lounge around on a message board bloviating.

 

[NYcarbineer]

You can't be the most militarist nation in the world, the world's free of charge policeman and defender,

AND have a 21st century domestic socio-economic structure (a social safety net, modern infrastructure, etc.)

AND be a low tax nation, without going deeply into debt and eventually bankrupt. It is mathematically impossible.

But that is what we've been trying to do since 1980.

Your taxes are lower than they've ever been and our debt is higher than it's ever been because of the above.

taxes lower than ever?
Debt is to hi because we have so many not putting one dime back in the trough that are feeding from it
The stimulus
GM
and the way Obama used tarp is 1.4 trillion
we were within 162 billion of breaking even in 2007

Yes, taxes are lower than ever. You obviously know nothing about our current tax structure. Perhaps you should shut up about it until you DO know something.

 

[8537]

You can't be the most militarist nation in the world, the world's free of charge policeman and defender,

AND have a 21st century domestic socio-economic structure (a social safety net, modern infrastructure, etc.)

AND be a low tax nation, without going deeply into debt and eventually bankrupt. It is mathematically impossible.

But that is what we've been trying to do since 1980.

Your taxes are lower than they've ever been and our debt is higher than it's ever been because of the above.

taxes lower than ever?
Debt is to hi because we have so many not putting one dime back in the trough that are feeding from it
The stimulus
GM
and the way Obama used tarp is 1.4 trillion
we were within 162 billion of breaking even in 2007

Yes, taxes are lower than ever. You obviously know nothing about our current tax structure. Perhaps you should shut up about it until you DO know something.

Well, they're not lower for JRK - that fool is paying 12 grand on 65K of income.

 

[NYcarbineer]

How?

Certainly you cannot think that supporting either the GOP or the Dems is going to accomplish that, can you?

That's why you have to support candidates, Dem or Repub, who are anti war and anti-federal reserve.

The Fed printing money while we're involved in 5 wars is the recipe for economic disaster. And I can only assume it's being done intentionally.

The stimulus (failed ) cost as much in 3 as both wars did in 8
we are gtetting out of Iraq and have stopped combat sense end 08 as GWB had planned as well as the 2011 100% end
Little-known fact: Obama's failed stimulus program cost more than the Iraq war | Examiner Staff Writer | Beltway Confidential | Washington Examiner

Those numbers are bullshit, however, putting that aside,

you think that not paying for defense is justified by not having paid for the tax cuts and spending in the stimulus bill?

What sort of depraved logic is that?

 

[The Rabbi]

You need a better accountant.

He also needs one of them hybrid SUVs.

He could easily buy that hybrid SUV if he had a better accountant - as it stands, he's paying taxes on every dollar and not even claiming the standard deduction.

There's a new program for obama. Cash for Counters. We can help unemployment AND high taxes by giving every family their own accountant.
Brilliant!


Asshole.

 

[8537]

He also needs one of them hybrid SUVs.

He could easily buy that hybrid SUV if he had a better accountant - as it stands, he's paying taxes on every dollar and not even claiming the standard deduction.

There's a new program for obama. Cash for Counters. We can help unemployment AND high taxes by giving every family their own accountant.
Brilliant!


Asshole.

You should really stop supporting baldface lies. The man claims someone making 200K is paying 70K...

and the he pays 12K on 65K.

And you decide that people who call out such bullshit are the assholes. Perhaps you should check your premise.

To be fair, perhaps JRK is not a baldfaced liar - perhaps he's just an idiot in need of an accountant.

 

[The Rabbi]

WHich part do you need explained to you?

The part where income is taxed at a flat rate equal to the highest marginal rate (despite the fact that the individual in question doesn't make enough to even reach that bracket).

Don't tell me you're unfamiliar with how tax brackets work, too?

THe actual figure ought to be over $51,000, based on the tax worksheet.
That does not include state or local income taxes, property taxes, sales taxes, etc etc.
He could easily be paying $70k or more.

BUt the basic principle is the same.

 

[NYcarbineer]

and with almost half the country paying in nothing and taking from the pot doesn't help either. It has not helped - it will never help and needs to stop.

This makes my point
the system is broke
I make 65000 a year and pay in 12,000, just in income
federal
does not include Medicare and SS, state, etc....

We need a system like Florida and Texas has

The federal income tax on 65,000 TAXABLE (single filer) is $12,444. I'm looking at the 2009 tax tables right now.

So, unless you and your tax preparer are retarded, no, you did not MAKE 65,000 and pay 12,000 in federal income taxes on it.

 

[Greenbeard]

That does not include state or local income taxes, property taxes, sales taxes, etc etc.
He could easily be paying $70k or more.

Yes, by "give up 70,000 a year in income tax" he clearly was talking about property and sales taxes.

He multiplied a $200,000 income by 0.35 because he doesn't know how tax brackets work (or, apparently, where they begin). Spotting someone who doesn't know what the hell they're talking about isn't rocket science.

 

[8537]

That does not include state or local income taxes, property taxes, sales taxes, etc etc.

Nor did his comment. Quit defending liars.

 

[Moonglow]

tarp and GM loans were paid back with interest

 

[CatholicCrusadr]

Revenue?
Raising taxes on corporations whether it be Exxon or Ma and Pas Bakery only means the consumer will pay more for the product

We are at a point in this country in which we must curtail spending
The middle class is squeezed all it can stand, and if you make 200,000 a year and give up 70,000 a year in income tax

Your giving up enough

Who has heard of the Laffer Curve?

The Laffer Curve proves that the higher taxes go, the less incentive people & businesses have to make money, and the more incentive they have to move their funds out of country and thus avoid those taxes. The result is no revenue.

If you raise the taxes too much the result is that NOBODY pays those taxes. That is the Laffer Curve, the relationship between tax rates and people avoiding paying taxes. And this is why the Deomcrats are wrongheaded when they say they need to raise taxes to get more revenue. It does not work that way.


QUOTE:
It is very simple. If you tax at either 0% or 100% you will get nothing because either there is no tax OR the effort of making money is not worth it. You can increase taxes to some optimum point where you will continue to get more revenue up to the point where increased taxation becomes counterproductive because it causes people to reduce their effort. We observed this phenomenon actually occurring in the United States when we had ultra-high marginal tax rates. Various types of earners curtailed their effort once they hit the magic level at which they would begin to pay the highest rates. They preferred to put off additional activity until the next year. Famously, the detective novels about Nero Wolfe mentioned his tendency to take a few months off at the end of the year because of the top rates of taxation.

 

[8537]

Revenue?
Raising taxes on corporations whether it be Exxon or Ma and Pas Bakery only means the consumer will pay more for the product

We are at a point in this country in which we must curtail spending
The middle class is squeezed all it can stand, and if you make 200,000 a year and give up 70,000 a year in income tax

Your giving up enough

Who has heard of the Laffer Curve?

The Laffer Curve proves that the higher taxes go, the less incentive people & businesses have to make money, and the more incentive they have to move their funds out of country and thus avoid those taxes. The result is no revenue.

If you raise the taxes too much the result is that NOBODY pays those taxes. That is the Laffer Curve, the relationship between tax rates and people avoiding paying taxes. And this is why the Deomcrats are wrongheaded when they say they need to raise taxes to get more revenue. It does not work that way.


QUOTE:
It is very simple. If you tax at either 0% or 100% you will get nothing because either there is no tax OR the effort of making money is not worth it. You can increase taxes to some optimum point where you will continue to get more revenue up to the point where increased taxation becomes counterproductive because it causes people to reduce their effort. We observed this phenomenon actually occurring in the United States when we had ultra-high marginal tax rates. Various types of earners curtailed their effort once they hit the magic level at which they would begin to pay the highest rates. They preferred to put off additional activity until the next year. Famously, the detective novels about Nero Wolfe mentioned his tendency to take a few months off at the end of the year because of the top rates of taxation.

you think the apex of the laffer curve for US income taxes has an apex below top marginal rate of 35%?

Do you have any studies? Any evidence to support the idea that the apex is less than 35%?

 

[JRK]

That does not include state or local income taxes, property taxes, sales taxes, etc etc.
He could easily be paying $70k or more.

Yes, by "give up 70,000 a year in income tax" he clearly was talking about property and sales taxes.

He multiplied a $200,000 income by 0.35 because he doesn't know how tax brackets work (or, apparently, where they begin). Spotting someone who doesn't know what the hell they're talking about isn't rocket science.

I do not know how the tax bracket works?
so 33% vs 35% is what we need to be debating?
66,000 vs 70,000?
I am deeply sorry, but as usual you have nothing to offer in the debate
011 Federal Tax Tables
Federal Income Tax
SINGLE RATE JOINT RATE
$0 - $8,500

10.00%
$0 - $17,000

10.00%
$8,501- $34,500

15.00%
$17,001 - $69,000

15.00%
$34,501- $83,600

25.00%
$69,001- $139,350

25.00%
$83,601- $174,400

28.00%
$139,351- $212,300

28.00%
$174,401 - $379,150

33.00%
$212,301- $379,150

33.00%
$379,151 & OVER

35.00%
$379,151 & OVER

35.00%

I do not know what I am talking about?
then go away and leave us alone who know what we are talking about

 

[JRK]

That does not include state or local income taxes, property taxes, sales taxes, etc etc.
He could easily be paying $70k or more.

Yes, by "give up 70,000 a year in income tax" he clearly was talking about property and sales taxes.

He multiplied a $200,000 income by 0.35 because he doesn't know how tax brackets work (or, apparently, where they begin). Spotting someone who doesn't know what the hell they're talking about isn't rocket science.

Another item green beard
I may be clearly 2% off
I maybe 5% off
But I have more class in my little finger about the way I treat my fellow american than you have in your entire body

The thread is about taxes and who takes the brunt in this country
obviously you are one of the ones who are receiving free money from those of us who pay for you to judge instead of offering a solution or offering your opinion
To the liberal it is never about the subject matter, true debate is an item you cannot take art in, you lose every time

This country created less than 20,000 jobs last month green beard
Our president has spent 3 trillion dollars more than we had
and your concern is my tax table

speaks volumes

 

[8537]

That does not include state or local income taxes, property taxes, sales taxes, etc etc.
He could easily be paying $70k or more.

Yes, by "give up 70,000 a year in income tax" he clearly was talking about property and sales taxes.

He multiplied a $200,000 income by 0.35 because he doesn't know how tax brackets work (or, apparently, where they begin). Spotting someone who doesn't know what the hell they're talking about isn't rocket science.

I do not know how the tax bracket works?
so 33% vs 35% is what we need to be debating?
66,000 vs 70,000?
I am deeply sorry, but as usual you have nothing to offer in the debate
011 Federal Tax Tables
Federal Income Tax
SINGLE RATE JOINT RATE
$0 - $8,500

10.00%
$0 - $17,000

10.00%
$8,501- $34,500

15.00%
$17,001 - $69,000

15.00%
$34,501- $83,600

25.00%
$69,001- $139,350

25.00%
$83,601- $174,400

28.00%
$139,351- $212,300

28.00%
$174,401 - $379,150

33.00%
$212,301- $379,150

33.00%
$379,151 & OVER

35.00%
$379,151 & OVER

35.00%

I do not know what I am talking about?
then go away and leave us alone who know what we are talking about

You don't pay 33% on 200,000.

So yes, you don't know what you're talking about.

 

[DiamondDave]

You can't be the most militarist nation in the world, the world's free of charge policeman and defender,

AND have a 21st century domestic socio-economic structure (a social safety net, modern infrastructure, etc.)

AND be a low tax nation, without going deeply into debt and eventually bankrupt. It is mathematically impossible.

But that is what we've been trying to do since 1980.

Your taxes are lower than they've ever been and our debt is higher than it's ever been because of the above.

Yep.. get rid of the 'socio' part.. audit military spending (hell ALL of govt spending), reduce where it needs to be, stop paying for contracts that are not being fulfilled, etc.... and stop having groups of people who are not paying income tax... and simplify the tax code where loopholes, etc are eliminated

 

[DiamondDave]

tarp and GM loans were paid back with interest

With more funds given to them by the government.... it was a sneaky pete move