Do you believe Jesus???

HaShev · Aug 1, 2015

kjw47 said:
there is 0 doubt in all of creation the JW,s have it right.

About the Bible calling Michael the messiah yes, But Jesus (who isn't based on a singular historical character)wasn't Michael anymore then Daniel was Michael.
Throughout the NT This converged figure is talking about son of man (Dan calls Michael)to come in a third person tense as another person in his own name.
Try reading tenses properly.
LUKE 6:5, 9:26 , 9:55-56, 12:10 , 17:30 , 18:8, 22:69, John 3:13, Matthew 25:11-13, Mark 14:62 & Mathew20:28) including claiming he was emulating him (Rev 1:13)
and that son of man would come as another being in his own new name and that even he Theudas (the AD era christ) would see son of man with the others,truly wording that he's the spectator not the head of host everyone will finally see. Which agrees with Isaiah 66:19 about the time of the temple procession you the gentile have yet to see the face.
When Daniel is relaying a message from the head messenger Daniel is not confused for being the head of hosts he's speaking of, but Christianity turned Theudas into the son of man he spoke for and about (the one called father=a term we use for the head priest in the Temple to come). By making the father and spokesperson 1 is like making Daniel & Michael (the head of hosts as one). Christians recognizes this mistake everytime they bust on you Jehovah's Witnesses that Jesus isn't Michael, yet can't keep that logic to understand then Jesus isn't the head Priest head of Host Aka Michael who's name is in the Temple and who's the Moshiach ben David of the Bible. Christians have no understanding of the 2 cherubs (guardians) symbolized on the ark of the covenant, thus no idea about the 2 messiahs, Ben Joseph and Ben David.
Clueless about the 2 sticks coming to 1, and yet they tell the story of the 2 archs (morning star &Evening Star) and the battle between Lucifer the messenger of lies(darkness) & Michael the Messenger of truth (spiritual light)-Dan 10:21

LittleNipper · Aug 1, 2015

HaShev said:
careless fallacious quote"Jesus lives
24/7, 365 doing the Fathers will"

Wrong, wrong WRONG!
1)he never lived only the many figures used to create his story and image lived, read my Seinfeld analogy about discerning real figures from fictional ones.
2)the character is dead, if you say he isn't then it's your burden of proof to bring him here, so wake up your missing stick figure and make your case....no? Then you sre a liar, to yourself and to others.
3) A Holy Father in Heaven(time to come) is not God anymore then you'd consider a future Pope to Be God.
However in relations to an archaic age in the past, messaging, mediating, teaching, and leading it out of chaos and bringing order is reflecting that Essence we call God (Creation) and thus can be "mistaken as their God their Lord" (meaning king), but is a mistaken precept.
The creation is about life and progressing of Life, bringing order, Jesus was twaching death cultism saying in Matt & Thomas he did not come to bring Shalem or Shalom, he came to bring division and a melting away of the planet likexthe end of the earth from the scorch of the sun (sun worship symbolism).
Therefore Jesus is not doing the(holy father's) head of hosts will, he even claimed to be the nemesis of that holy Father therefore the father not named by Rome must be Baal.

Baal worshippers tossed their babies on the flaming alter of Baal idols. They represent the ancient version of modern abortionists! The Old Testament clearly states that when the Messiah comes, He will be rejected. So I do not understand how someone might imagine that Jesus would not be treated as He was and rejected by the Jews as He was. It was Prophesied! The Bible holds true.

A believer's duty is to present to those round about the Gospel message. Those who do not accept it, are condemned already. There are none that do good for all have sinned and fallen short of the Glory of God. God provided the ultimate sacrifice for sin. Those that reject that sacrifice must reap their chosen destiny, as they cannot perfectly follow the Commandments of God to the letter.

HaShev · Aug 1, 2015

Little Nipper, there's a problem with your statement.
1) your comment about Moshiach is from non messianic text about Israel used by the new converged religion to LIE in order to converge Jews into this masked Baal worship.
2)According to the NT Jesus was popular and accepted, so your rejected comment & christisn use of Isaiah 53 is fallacious & problematic.
As he is now otherwise you'd be calling The forum poster Jeremiah a liar for claiming Jews are accepting him.

LittleNipper · Aug 1, 2015

HaShev said:
Little Nipper, there's a problem with your statement.
1) your comment about Moshiach is from non messianic text about Israel used by the new converged religion to LIE in order to converge Jews into this masked Baal worship.
2)According to the NT Jesus was popular and accepted, so your rejected comment & christisn use of Isaiah 53 is fallacious & problematic.
As he is now otherwise you'd be calling The forum poster Jeremiah a liar for claiming Jews are accepting him.

Jesus was rejected by both the Jewish establishment (generally) and by His own family (step brothers and sisters).

LittleNipper · Aug 1, 2015

HaShev said:
Little Nipper, there's a problem with your statement.
1) your comment about Moshiach is from non messianic text about Israel used by the new converged religion to LIE in order to converge Jews into this masked Baal worship.
2)According to the NT Jesus was popular and accepted, so your rejected comment & christisn use of Isaiah 53 is fallacious & problematic.
As he is now otherwise you'd be calling The forum poster Jeremiah a liar for claiming Jews are accepting him.

HaShev · Aug 1, 2015

And you reject me therefore you are saying Me and 6 billion people are Moshiach.
Brilliant logic, but it doesn't address the other red elephants in the room that you conveniently ignore.
Includingcthe fact you are using non messianic past tense plurality verses to lie about Jesus being in text.
He's still Baal worship. Your oastors are still doing the same worn out seed harvest scam.

HaShev · Aug 1, 2015

Just glanced your nonsense verses they've all been refuted. Example: the christ stoned and hanged was Yeshu of 100bc not the Galilean Yehuda pierced & crucified in 6bc.
You mention Zech 12:10 1st off it's not messianic either and is speaking present or past tense none of the context was occuring in Jesus era. Try reading the Tanakh version there's 2 people mentioned You pierce me=1 but mourn for him=2. If you swore he was in Zech 12:10 then you'd be admitting I am right that Christians converge christs. Brilliant!

LittleNipper · Aug 1, 2015

HaShev said:
And you reject me therefore you are saying Me and 6 billion people are Moshiach.
Brilliant logic, but it doesn't address the other red elephants in the room that you conveniently ignore.
Including the fact you are using non messianic past tense plurality verses to lie about Jesus being in text.
He's still Baal worship. Your oastors are still doing the same worn out seed harvest scam.

Mathew 7:14 For the gate is narrow and the way is hard that leads to life, and those who find it are few.

There is no safety in numbers. Ancient Israel and even modern Israel should be VERY aware of this! I do pray for Jews that they discover their Messiah. However, you are rejecting HIM and HE is not the one rejecting YOU! Today, tomorrow and yesterday are all the same to GOD. With the LORD there is no past or present -----I AM! GOD sees all.

LittleNipper · Aug 1, 2015

HaShev said:
Just glanced your nonsense verses they've all been refuted. Example: the christ stoned and hanged was Yeshu of 100bc not the Galilean Yehuda pierced & crucified in 6bc.
You mention Zech 12:10 1st off it's not messianic either and is speaking present or past tense none of the context was occuring in Jesus era. Try reading the Tanakh version there's 2 people mentioned You pierce me=1 but mourn for him=2. If you swore he was in Zech 12:10 then you'd be admitting I am right that Christians converge christs. Brilliant!

Zechariah 12:10 Complete Jewish Bible (CJB)

10 and I will pour out on the house of David
and on those living in Yerushalayim
a spirit of grace and prayer;
and they will look to me, whom they pierced.”

They will mourn for him
as one mourns for an only son;
they will be in bitterness on his behalf
like the bitterness for a firstborn son.

HaShev · Aug 1, 2015

2 people. It's not messianic but even when they lie they expose a greater lie.
By the way always comoare the Tanakh version eith your verses, least you be deceived by the rewrites.

You mention Matthew yet ignore the fact a non Jew wrote Matthew and ignore where Matthew gives you a huge clue about Joseph wanting to divorce Mary (100bc character) in private. This is because she had Yeshu through a fling with the Roman Soldier Pantheras (Pandera). Once again proving my point you mourn for Mary's son who Roman's cherished but Rome Pierced Yehuda for gis tax revolt. =Converging christs.

LittleNipper · Aug 1, 2015

HaShev said:
2 people. It's not messianic but even when they lie they expose a greater lie.
By the way always comoare the Tanakh version eith your verses, least you be deceived by the rewrites.

You mention Matthew yet ignore the fact a non Jew wrote Matthew and ignore where Matthew gives you a huge clue about Joseph wanting to divorce Mary (100bc character) in private. This is because she had Yeshu through a fling with the Roman Soldier Pantheras (Pandera). Once again proving my point you mourn for Mary's son who Roman's cherished but Rome Pierced Yehuda for gis tax revolt. =Converging christs.

With the CHRIST there is no Jew or Gentile. Believers are ALL Chosen. s for your remark concerning Rome ----- Governor Pilate found no fault with Jesus. If Jesus was at he center of some tax revolt, I'm sure Pilate would have found just cause. However, as it is there is none.

John 19:4 ►
Parallel Verses
New International Version
Once more Pilate came out and said to the Jews gathered there, "Look, I am bringing him out to you to let you know that I find no basis for a charge against him."

kjw47 · Aug 1, 2015

HaShev said:
2 people. It's not messianic but even when they lie they expose a greater lie.
By the way always comoare the Tanakh version eith your verses, least you be deceived by the rewrites.

You mention Matthew yet ignore the fact a non Jew wrote Matthew and ignore where Matthew gives you a huge clue about Joseph wanting to divorce Mary (100bc character) in private. This is because she had Yeshu through a fling with the Roman Soldier Pantheras (Pandera). Once again proving my point you mourn for Mary's son who Roman's cherished but Rome Pierced Yehuda for gis tax revolt. =Converging christs.

I don't know where you are being taught this stuff, but it is not truth. Jesus taught one to pay ceasers things to ceaser,( taxes) so you are wrong there to. I would run from whoever is your teacher. time is short--Rev 13 has been going on awhile.

HaShev · Aug 1, 2015

it's called history, try researching .
When Rome writes about the converged christ seeking your money what do you expect them to say.
Actually it can be read many ways like in only paying Rome what is due them for roads and water systems but not as racketeering protection when it's them ypujeed protection from (age old racket still used today by their offspring).

I posted these sources before:
Josephus : on Yehuda:
Book 18 chapter 1 is where the heart of the info on the tax revolt and teaching of the crucified Yehuda of Galilee is mentioned.
Yet was there one Judas, a Gaulonite, HYPERLINK \l "EndNote_ANT_18.1b"(1) of a city whose name was Gamala, who, taking with him Sadduc, HYPERLINK \l "EndNote_ANT_18.2b"(2) a Pharisee, became zealous to draw them to a revolt, who both said that this taxation was no better than an introduction to slavery, and exhorted the nation to assert their liberty; as if they could procure them happiness and security for what they possessed, and an assured enjoyment of a still greater good, which was that of the honor and glory they would thereby acquire for magnanimity......
6. But of the fourth sect of Jewish philosophy, Judas the Galilean was the author. These men agree in all other things with the Pharisaic notions; but they have an inviolable attachment to liberty, and say that God is to be their only Ruler and Lord. They also do not value dying any kinds of death, nor indeed do they heed the deaths of their relations and friends, nor can any such fear make them call any man lord

NOTE: Luke once, Acts 5:37, and Josephus four several times, once here, sect. 6; and B. XX. ch. 5. sect. 2; Of the War, B. II. ch. 8. sect. 1; and ch. 17. sect. 8, calls this Judas, who was the pestilent author of that seditious doctrine and temper which brought the Jewish nation to utter destruction, a Galilean; but here (sect. 1) Josephus calls him a Gaulonite, of the city of Gamala; it is a great question where this Judas was born, whether in Galilee on the west side, or in Gaulonitis on the east side, of the river Jordan; while, in the place just now cited out of the Antiquities, B. XX. ch. 5. sect. 2, he is not only called a Galilean, but it is added to his story, "as I have signified in the books that go before these," as if he had still called him a Galilean in those Antiquities before, as well as in that particular place, as Dean Aldrich observes, Of the War, B. II. ch. 8. sect. 1.

LittleNipper · Aug 1, 2015

HaShev said:
it's called history, try researching .
When Rome writes about the converged christ seeking your money what do you expect them to say.
Actually it can be read many ways like in only paying Rome what is due them for roads and water systems but not as racketeering protection when it's them ypujeed protection from (age old racket still used today by their offspring).

I posted these sources before:
Josephus : on Yehuda:
Book 18 chapter 1 is where the heart of the info on the tax revolt and teaching of the crucified Yehuda of Galilee is mentioned.
Yet was there one Judas, a Gaulonite, HYPERLINK \l "EndNote_ANT_18.1b"(1) of a city whose name was Gamala, who, taking with him Sadduc, HYPERLINK \l "EndNote_ANT_18.2b"(2) a Pharisee, became zealous to draw them to a revolt, who both said that this taxation was no better than an introduction to slavery, and exhorted the nation to assert their liberty; as if they could procure them happiness and security for what they possessed, and an assured enjoyment of a still greater good, which was that of the honor and glory they would thereby acquire for magnanimity......
6. But of the fourth sect of Jewish philosophy, Judas the Galilean was the author. These men agree in all other things with the Pharisaic notions; but they have an inviolable attachment to liberty, and say that God is to be their only Ruler and Lord. They also do not value dying any kinds of death, nor indeed do they heed the deaths of their relations and friends, nor can any such fear make them call any man lord

NOTE: Luke once, Acts 5:37, and Josephus four several times, once here, sect. 6; and B. XX. ch. 5. sect. 2; Of the War, B. II. ch. 8. sect. 1; and ch. 17. sect. 8, calls this Judas, who was the pestilent author of that seditious doctrine and temper which brought the Jewish nation to utter destruction, a Galilean; but here (sect. 1) Josephus calls him a Gaulonite, of the city of Gamala; it is a great question where this Judas was born, whether in Galilee on the west side, or in Gaulonitis on the east side, of the river Jordan; while, in the place just now cited out of the Antiquities, B. XX. ch. 5. sect. 2, he is not only called a Galilean, but it is added to his story, "as I have signified in the books that go before these," as if he had still called him a Galilean in those Antiquities before, as well as in that particular place, as Dean Aldrich observes, Of the War, B. II. ch. 8. sect. 1.

One needs to ask GOD for a clearer understanding of His Word. God spoke to Noah. God spoke to Abraham. God spoke to Moses. God can speak to us through His Word, if one sincerely asks Him for guidance. God is not a respecter of one's religious affiliation. God seeks a PERSONAL RELATIONSHIP! He knocks at the door of our heart, but we must ask Him to come in.

HaShev · Aug 2, 2015

1) Pilate was an AD era percurser, the only Historical christ of that era was Theudas by the Jordan.
You are caught between Yeshu son of Mary of 100bc
and Yehuda of Galilee of 6bc and now Theudas who died in 45ad thus John said he was closer to fifty.
Your 33 y.o. christ was either Yeshu or Yehuda.
Learn History.

Fact: these are the only messianic figures in the time of Lysanias and King Herod.
1. Judas, son of Hezekiah (4 BCE)
2. Simon of Peraea (4 BCE)
3. Athronges, the shepherd (4 BCE)
4. Judas, the Galilean (6 CE)

emilynghiem · Aug 2, 2015

HaShev said:
emilynghiem said:

Dear kjw47 The Cross and Sacrifice/resurrection of Christ Jesus
represent the RETURN of JUSTICE as RESTORATIVE JUSTICE.

This is a symbolic PROCESS.
It is UNIVERSALLY TRUE.

You may reject the symbolism as man made mythology,
but the MESSAGE is true for all people, that Divine Forgiveness
through Christ breaks the cycle of evil repeating and sets humanity free.

So kjw47 even if you reject how things in the Bible is taught, wrong or right,
the TRUE message and meaning still lives on and passes on.

Click to expand...

The Judaic concept of resurrection regarding return back into life is the Just reward to see what your works/deeds created in the worod to come and not as you say restoring justice.

Also most Christians have not read closely the OT in context thus miss that the
Jesus character is plagiarized and borrowed from predated Rabbi Yehoshua Ben Chananiah of the OT and Talmud who taught about the resurrection and world to come-The Midrash (Koheles Rabba) .
Who also had a story about how he and his peers "didn't" sleep during the night of a Celebration as opposed to the Jesus story where they all fell asleep over watching him.-Succah 53a
Similarly Combatting a Sadducee regarding G0d's praise for the Jews, terming them "thorns": Eruvin 101a
Yehoshua ben Chananiah claimed that he had never been bested in a battle of words as was the claim of Jesus when battling the sages.- Eruvin 53b
Yehoshua was also known to have spoken in strange parables-Shabbat 152a.
This Rabbi in the OT taught the resurrection teachings that became the transhumanist Judaic concept of kingdom to come in life not the Jesuit teaching of kingdom in death.
The Jesus character even is said to visit Chana thought to be a place but could be the OT figures father's shortened nickname thus more proof of borrowing OT characters, teachings, and roles.

Dear HaShev The laws of justice have existed before Jesus, with or without the understanding in the Bible. Simply put each person gets the Justice we give.

If you teach Justice as works based, then equally shall you be judged by your words.

If you teach Restorative Justice then you will be held to those standards.

Buddhists call the Laws of cause and effect Karma, that you get what you give or reap what you sow.

The Bible says if we forgive trespasses ours are forgiven, if we do not forgive first then we will find we are not forgiven either.
Forgiveness often precedes correction and whatever else may be needed for restitution and healing.

The main key that Jesus represents is saving grace by divine forgiveness. Having faith that forgiveness brings healing, then al else follows.

Even secular humanists and atheists can understand this concept as bringing justice, and do not need the Bible to teach this. Iy is still the divine spirit of Justice whether recognized as Jesus or any other symbol. There is only one true justice that will unite humanity, anything less falls to political corruption and abuse if its man made.

Only truly universal justice will unite all ppl nations and tribes in full agreement and peace. Thanks for posting and may you be richly blessed with greater and greater wisdom knowledge understanding and love for truth justice and peace for all humanity to receive in full. Amen

HaShev · Aug 2, 2015

quote:The main key that Jesus represents is
saving grace by divine forgiveness

This free get away with sin card does not work, hence jails full of cross tattoos, cross necklaces, & cross earings.

quote:
Buddhists call the Laws of cause and effect

Judaism uses the term bestow & receive and good or bad reflections.

Do you believe Jesus???

HaShev

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HaShev

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Jacob's Ladder & the Stone of Destiny Secreted

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