Detroit...

[Trajan]

Sad to see the decline of a once great city

Detroit, at one time symbolized American greatness. With the decline in dominance of the American auto industry and the dispersion of auto manufacturing to less expensive areas, I doubt if Detroit will ever return to its former greatness

They have to downsize the city. Demolish what once was and concentrate on a manageable city center and try to attract new industries.

They need a powerful city planner to rescope their future...I wish them luck

It really is a shame. The auto makers started moving their in-country production plants away, into states like South Carolina and Georgia, thus hurting the proud city of Detroit. Wonder why they did that (Hint: non-union labor, low corporate taxes).

bingo- right to work states etc. , unlike Michigan as a state is a mess to boot, granholm didn't help a anything in her 8 years, bus. taxes etc etc ... ( I believes its 8, 2 terms ) as gov.

 

[bucs90]

Detroit = hope and change in microcosm. The liberal American dream.

Yes...the Liberals ran those car companies into the ground
The liberals mismanaged an industry we once dominated

Well, no, not exactly. The liberals didn't run the car industry into the ground.

They simply ran the car industry jobs into non-union, low tax areas like Georgia, South Carolina, Texas, Florida, where the jobs would be taken by those folks instead of Michigan residents.

OSHA eliminated the need for any unions. And low corporate tax rates attract business. It's not rocket surgery.

 

[Tank]

It's not rocket surgery.

And it's not brain science.

 

[gautama]

Sad to see the decline of a once great city

Detroit, at one time symbolized American greatness. With the decline in dominance of the American auto industry and the dispersion of auto manufacturing to less expensive areas, I doubt if Detroit will ever return to its former greatness

They have to downsize the city. Demolish what once was and concentrate on a manageable city center and try to attract new industries.

They need a powerful city planner to rescope their future...I wish them luck

Personally, I think a lot of the changes are going to have to come from the bottom up. There are some people doing very good work in that city, buying up cheap lots, repairing the houses that are worth saving while demolishing those that aren't (in order to make room for farming). In the process, they're creating more sustainable communities than their counterparts in other, healthier cities. There's a lot of bad news, but it isn't all bad, and even the bad can be seen as an opening for attempting new ways of doing things.

Scabee,

WHAT DOES IT TAKE FOR THE OBAMARRHOIDAL LIEBERRHOIDS TO REALIZE THAT THEIR AGENDA TURNS AMERICA INTO SHIT ?!?!

 

[JBeukema]

JB's ideas to fix Detroit:

1: Bulldoze the drug houses. They're unsightly, they're a breeding ground for pests, and they provide a base of operations for drug producers and dealers, as well as for other criminals

2. Crack down on crime. You must restore order in order to ensure that anyone who considers moving to Detroit feels safe.

3. Turn prisoners into a resource. You will still run in the red, but the use of chain gangs early on can help you repair roads, and make clothing and textiles, and other goods for use in public works' projects at minimal cost.

4. Incentivize businesses. Passing one of the lowest corporate tax rates cnd pursuing other business-friendly policies is the only way to bring business, money, and jobs back to the area. Sit down with the Big 5 and other businesses and ask them 'What policies would the city need to adopt in order for it top be worth your while to come here?' Remember, you need to attract as many businesses as possible and diversify to avoid being wholly dependent on a single industry.

5. Incentivize new Detroiters. Low income, real estate, and sales taxes provide a reason for people to move to Detroit. Combined with the business (read: jobs) attracted by the policies mentioned earlier, this will put the city on the road to recovery.

6. Don't dear the deficit. The key here is understanding the difference between spending and investment. A man who buys a new sports car because he wants one is spending. A man who buys a forklift for his business's warehouse in order to drastically increase productivity is investing. Parks, water fountains, and sports centers are spending money and are not going to fix the matter- they are projects to be undertaken only during prosperity and when the funds are guaranteed to be available. Repairing the city's crumbling bridges and roads, ensuring proper operation of sewer systems, and making the docks highly desirable (the city's access to the Great Lakes is another resource) are investments to make the city safer for citizens and make business easier, safer, and more efficient for the businesses you need to attract. properly run, projects to repair bridges and roads can also provide a source of work for those in need of employment while ensuring they now know a valued skill they can apply when the city recovers and private businesses, including paving companies, begin hiring in the future.




Thought?

 

[bucs90]

Sad to see the decline of a once great city

Detroit, at one time symbolized American greatness. With the decline in dominance of the American auto industry and the dispersion of auto manufacturing to less expensive areas, I doubt if Detroit will ever return to its former greatness

They have to downsize the city. Demolish what once was and concentrate on a manageable city center and try to attract new industries.

They need a powerful city planner to rescope their future...I wish them luck

Personally, I think a lot of the changes are going to have to come from the bottom up. There are some people doing very good work in that city, buying up cheap lots, repairing the houses that are worth saving while demolishing those that aren't (in order to make room for farming). In the process, they're creating more sustainable communities than their counterparts in other, healthier cities. There's a lot of bad news, but it isn't all bad, and even the bad can be seen as an opening for attempting new ways of doing things.

Scabee,

WHAT DOES IT TAKE FOR THE OBAMARRHOIDAL LIEBERRHOIDS TO REALIZE THAT THEIR AGENDA TURNS AMERICA INTO SHIT ?!?!

You must rethink your position in the perspective of a liberal.

A liberal hates to feel superior to anyone. When they sit around at Columbia U or UC Berkeley and sip organic grass dew with the foreign exchange students, they don't like feeling like the rich kid from the superpower country. They want to feel like a globalist, like they too can relate to what a 3rd world country is like.

But they can't, because they are American. So, knocking American down a few notches is a good thing. Make us absolutely equal in all areas with all other people of the world.

In that perspective, liberals are succeeding greatly. Just gonna suck for the rest of us though.

 

[The Rabbi]

JB's ideas to fix Detroit:

1: Bulldoze the drug houses. They're unsightly, they're a breeding ground for pests, and they provide a base of operations for drug producers and dealers, as well as for other criminals

2. Crack down on crime. You must restore order in order to ensure that anyone who considers moving to Detroit feels safe.

3. Turn prisoners into a resource. You will still run in the red, but the use of chain gangs early on can help you repair roads, and make clothing and textiles, and other goods for use in public works' projects at minimal cost.

4. Incentivize businesses. Passing one of the lowest corporate tax rates cnd pursuing other business-friendly policies is the only way to bring business, money, and jobs back to the area. Sit down with the Big 5 and other businesses and ask them 'What policies would the city need to adopt in order for it top be worth your while to come here?' Remember, you need to attract as many businesses as possible and diversify to avoid being wholly dependent on a single industry.

5. Incentivize new Detroiters. Low income, real estate, and sales taxes provide a reason for people to move to Detroit. Combined with the business (read: jobs) attracted by the policies mentioned earlier, this will put the city on the road to recovery.

6. Don't dear the deficit. The key here is understanding the difference between spending and investment. A man who buys a new sports car because he wants one is spending. A man who buys a forklift for his business's warehouse in order to drastically increase productivity is investing. Parks, water fountains, and sports centers are spending money and are not going to fix the matter- they are projects to be undertaken only during prosperity and when the funds are guaranteed to be available. Repairing the city's crumbling bridges and roads, ensuring proper operation of sewer systems, and making the docks highly desirable (the city's access to the Great Lakes is another resource) are investments to make the city safer for citizens and make business easier, safer, and more efficient for the businesses you need to attract. properly run, projects to repair bridges and roads can also provide a source of work for those in need of employment while ensuring they now know a valued skill they can apply when the city recovers and private businesses, including paving companies, begin hiring in the future.




Thought?

The city is bankrupt. They don't have the resources for any of that. When I say bankrupt, I don't just mean financially either. They have a bankruptcy of morals and intellectual resources as well. Every official is corrupt (maybe not the present mayor). Their solution to everything is beg the state and Washington for help.
Maybe they should allow homesteading. But I cannot see them moving beyond their current dynamic.

 

[bucs90]

JB's ideas to fix Detroit:
Thought?

The city is bankrupt. They don't have the resources for any of that. When I say bankrupt, I don't just mean financially either. They have a bankruptcy of morals and intellectual resources as well. Every official is corrupt (maybe not the present mayor). Their solution to everything is beg the state and Washington for help.
Maybe they should allow homesteading. But I cannot see them moving beyond their current dynamic.

Thats a key point left wingers don't grasp.

The state of New Jersey for example. Bankrupt. California. Bankrupt. Illinois. Bankrupt. Massive social spending plus insane union deals = a bankrupt state.

There is no answer but cruel, hard spending cuts. The people are gonna have to learn to survive with less gov't help. Thats just the totality of the situation.

Or as a great thinker once said: "The problem with socialism is eventually you run out of other people's money."

Truer words I've never heard.

 

[The Rabbi]

NJ seems to have closed its budget gap thanks to GOP governor Christie.

 

[JBeukema]

They're bankrupt because they spent.

If you want to recovery, (or if they didn't want to get into this mess int he first place), you have to invest. Nobody and no business wants to move to a city with a crumbling infrastructure.

The only way to get back in the black? Bring businesses back. The only way to to that? By putting into effect attractive policies such as low corporate taxes.

Most businesses run in the red for several years before breaking even and then move on to be profitable. A friend of mine runs a small shoppe downtown and is now reaching the point where most of the initial costs have been recouped and business loans paid off. The city of Detroit must do likewise and invest in turning itself into a city worth doing business in. It will be a long road back to the black, but putting it off multiplies the long-term damage- especially as they let their infrastructure worsen still.

 

[The Rabbi]

They're bankrupt because they spent.

If you want to recovery, (or if they didn't want to get into this mess int he first place), you have to invest. Nobody and no business wants to move to a city with a crumbling infrastructure.

The only way to get back in the black? Bring businesses back. The only way to to that? By putting into effect attractive policies such as low corporate taxes.

Most businesses run in the red for several years before breaking even and then move on to be profitable. A friend of mine runs a small shoppe downtown and is now reaching the point where most of the initial costs have been recouped and business loans paid off. The city of Detroit must do likewise and invest in turning itself into a city worth doing business in. It will be a long road back to the black, but putting it off multiplies the long-term damage- especially as they let their infrastructure worsen still.

That would involve changing the taxes in the entire state, which have increased in an effort to "close the budget gap" (where have weheard this before?).
I agree that making the state and city more business friendly is the way to go. But the culture there is so deeply rooted it will be next to impossible. Critics will just charge that Detroit is instituting "tax cuts for the rich". Like we hear every day on this board.

 

[bucs90]

They're bankrupt because they spent.

If you want to recovery, (or if they didn't want to get into this mess int he first place), you have to invest. Nobody and no business wants to move to a city with a crumbling infrastructure.

The only way to get back in the black? Bring businesses back. The only way to to that? By putting into effect attractive policies such as low corporate taxes.

Most businesses run in the red for several years before breaking even and then move on to be profitable. A friend of mine runs a small shoppe downtown and is now reaching the point where most of the initial costs have been recouped and business loans paid off. The city of Detroit must do likewise and invest in turning itself into a city worth doing business in. It will be a long road back to the black, but putting it off multiplies the long-term damage- especially as they let their infrastructure worsen still.

Well, I think the idea is to never go liberal to begin with. Once you go liberal, you can't go back.

South Carolina never went liberal. Now, car companies, airplane companies, shipping ports, etc, are flocking there for low taxes and non-union labor.

Once a state or city goes liberal, the damage gets to the Detroit level. A bad repuation, plus a bankrupt city, is hard to fix. They can get further and further in debt to invest, but who is coming back? The labor still wants unions. The gov't won't cut taxes while still spending to "invest" because the political damage of massive spending while going more bankrupt will get them voted out.

Lesson learned? Just don't go liberal. On a federal level, it's not too late yet, but we're getting there rapidly under Obama.

 

[JBeukema]

Well, I think the idea is to never go liberal to begin with. Once you go liberal, you can't go back.

The whole part about low taxes is actually quite Liberal...

South Carolina never went liberal. Now, car companies, airplane companies, shipping ports, etc, are flocking there for low taxes and non-union labor.

Both of those (low taxes, non-unionized labour) are Liberal....

 

[JBeukema]

That would involve changing the taxes in the entire state, which have increased in an effort to "close the budget gap" (where have weheard this before?).

Increasing taxes increases gov. income to an extent. Once you make it so it's cheaper to go elsewhere- business outsource or relocate.

They must attract businesses back if they're ever going to recover. Like I said, they should sit down with CEOs from a number of different industries and ask 'What can we do to make you want to move your business here?'

I agree that making the state and city more business friendly is the way to go. But the culture there is so deeply rooted it will be next to impossible.

Then we cut them off and let them starve. We can't afford to drag the rest of the nation down supporting a city/state that keeps doing the same stupid shit. If they all die from starvation, smarter people move in and make the ghosttown into a thriving city again.

Critics will just charge that Detroit is instituting "tax cuts for the rich". Like we hear every day on this board.

I'm all for progressive taxes and social safety nets- but those programs (TANF and education for the poor, for example) - are only possible if you make it worthwhile to do business and therefore pay the acceptable taxes which enable the State to enact such programs.

You have to strike a balance, and progressives don't seem to grasp that.

 

[Douger]

The " White House" 100%

I think you're on to something Tank.

 

[rightwinger]

Detroit = hope and change in microcosm. The liberal American dream.

Yes...the Liberals ran those car companies into the ground
The liberals mismanaged an industry we once dominated

Nice try. SInce 1923 they have had 2 GOP mayors. All the others have been Dems. And last I heard, mayors run cities, not car companies.
Of course, you can't help lying because you have nothing else.

Nice try

The conservatives ran the car companies that provided 80% of the employment in the region. Once they ran the companies into the ground, even Jesus Christ couldn't have saved that city

 

[rightwinger]

Sad to see the decline of a once great city

Detroit, at one time symbolized American greatness. With the decline in dominance of the American auto industry and the dispersion of auto manufacturing to less expensive areas, I doubt if Detroit will ever return to its former greatness

They have to downsize the city. Demolish what once was and concentrate on a manageable city center and try to attract new industries.

They need a powerful city planner to rescope their future...I wish them luck

It really is a shame. The auto makers started moving their in-country production plants away, into states like South Carolina and Georgia, thus hurting the proud city of Detroit. Wonder why they did that (Hint: non-union labor, low corporate taxes).

I never questioned the wisdom of moving to lower cost states. I used it as a justification for Detroit needing to reinvent themselves because those jobs aren't coming back.

 

[gautama]

Yes...the Liberals ran those car companies into the ground
The liberals mismanaged an industry we once dominated

Nice try. SInce 1923 they have had 2 GOP mayors. All the others have been Dems. And last I heard, mayors run cities, not car companies.
Of course, you can't help lying because you have nothing else.

Nice try

The conservatives ran the car companies that provided 80% of the employment in the region. Once they ran the companies into the ground, even Jesus Christ couldn't have saved that city

BogusWanker, are you still that STOOOOOOPID ??????

DONCHA GEDDIT ??????

Even if GOD was the CEO or MANAGER NUMERO UNO he couldn't do dick if the UNIONS were in charge of labour.

WHAT THE FUCK IS WRONG WITH YOU OBAMARRHOIDAL LIEBERRHOIDS ????????

WHAT THE FUCK DOES IT TAKE EVEN SO LATE IN THE GAME ??????

 

[The Rabbi]

Yes...the Liberals ran those car companies into the ground
The liberals mismanaged an industry we once dominated

Nice try. SInce 1923 they have had 2 GOP mayors. All the others have been Dems. And last I heard, mayors run cities, not car companies.
Of course, you can't help lying because you have nothing else.

Nice try

The conservatives ran the car companies that provided 80% of the employment in the region. Once they ran the companies into the ground, even Jesus Christ couldn't have saved that city

Ford is doing just fine. Blows your "theory" all to hell, I guess.
Auto companies never passed a tax. Auto companies never made regulations. Yet taxes and regulations are what have killed Detroit.
But thanks for spinning.

 

[The Rabbi]

Nice try. SInce 1923 they have had 2 GOP mayors. All the others have been Dems. And last I heard, mayors run cities, not car companies.
Of course, you can't help lying because you have nothing else.

Nice try

The conservatives ran the car companies that provided 80% of the employment in the region. Once they ran the companies into the ground, even Jesus Christ couldn't have saved that city

BogusWanker, are you still that STOOOOOOPID ??????

DONCHA GEDDIT ??????

Even if GOD was the CEO or MANAGER NUMERO UNO he couldn't do dick if the UNIONS were in charge of labour.

WHAT THE FUCK IS WRONG WITH YOU OBAMARRHOIDAL LIEBERRHOIDS ????????

WHAT THE FUCK DOES IT TAKE EVEN SO LATE IN THE GAME ??????

Yes, he is that stoopid.