Dems Growing Convinced That GOP Will Try To Force Shutdown Over Health Care Funds

[Soggy in NOLA]

The only pouting here is from you, sniveling about how awful it is that someone should actually *GAAAAAASSSSP* profit from devoting their life to medicine.

We're talking about health insurance providers. They have nothing to do with medicine other than taking your money and standing between you and your doctor, dictating what kind of care you can get (or if you can get it). That ain't dedicating your life to medicine. That's exploiting sick (and healthy) people to make a buck. Come on, now... call a spade a spade.

So... you'd prefer some government bureaucrat standing between you and your doctor?

Newsflash genius... unless YOU are footing the bill, somebody else will be making the decisions.

 

[Mr. Peepers]

Yet, she managed to live her working life on her pay. If she had saved roughly 10% from every paycheck, she should have been able to live the same life style throughout her retirement. I would have told her she retired too early.

She saved WAY more than 10% of her pay. Want to know her savings when she died? 15K and her house. She had to be moved to my mom's and then to a nursing home, as she was dying of ALS. My uncle, who was killed in service bought her her house in 1969 and she had no house payments ans few out of pocket expenses, so she did save everything she earned. She retired at 62 and never had a credit card or took out a loan in her life. If we did not have the money from the sale of her house, how would we have been able to pay the $4000 a month in constant care she needed? You are not thinking this through.

 

[Mr. Peepers]

So... you'd prefer some government bureaucrat standing between you and your doctor?

Newsflash genius... unless YOU are footing the bill, somebody else will be making the decisions.

When was I ever talking about a government bureaucracy handling insurance? Do you people even read before you post?

I AM talking about me footing the bill - along with a collective of 200 million other americans pooling our money THERE NEED BE NO GOVERNMENT INVOLVEMENT. Would I trust a not-for-profit co-op more... made up of people who have a direct say in their policies or a private insurance company? You bet your ass I would

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

Anyway, as I see it, there are three major causes of the increases in health care costs, in order:

1. Overuse of the system which happens when people aren't footing the bill (aka DEMAND)
2. Paperwork caused by the web of third party payers and efforts to control costs, and
3. Malpractice.

Funny, I don't recall any of this being discussed.

 

[Jarhead]

The only pouting here is from you, sniveling about how awful it is that someone should actually *GAAAAAASSSSP* profit from devoting their life to medicine.

We're talking about health insurance providers. They have nothing to do with medicine other than taking your money and standing between you and your doctor, dictating what kind of care you can get (or if you can get it). That ain't dedicating your life to medicine. That's exploiting sick (and healthy) people to make a buck. Come on, now... call a spade a spade.

So... you'd prefer some government bureaucrat standing between you and your doctor?

Newsflash genius... unless YOU are footing the bill, somebody else will be making the decisions.

That fact seems to have been forgotten by many.

And I am curious why the left blames the insurance companies for the cost of healthcare. Isnt it the doctors that bill and the insurance companies pay THEM?
Maybe if the doctor billed less the insurance companies would not question or deny paying?
Why do the doctors get a pass but the evil "businesses" dont?

I dont know....seems the reality of the medical industry, the insurance industry and the real reason for the need for healthcare reform has become so convoluted, no one knows what the hell is going on.

And I blame all of our greedy, selfish, party driven poiliticians for ir.

 

[saveliberty]

Yet, she managed to live her working life on her pay. If she had saved roughly 10% from every paycheck, she should have been able to live the same life style throughout her retirement. I would have told her she retired too early.

She saved WAY more than 10% of her pay. Want to know her savings when she died? 15K and her house. She had to be moved to my mom's and then to a nursing home, as she was dying of ALS. My uncle, who was killed in service bought her her house in 1969 and she had no house payments ans few out of pocket expenses, so she did save everything she earned. She retired at 62 and never had a credit card or took out a loan in her life. If we did not have the money from the sale of her house, how would we have been able to pay the $4000 a month in constant care she needed? You are not thinking this through.

So she didn't have a supplemental health insurance policy or nursing home insurance either? Sounds like grandma had one big entitlement program after another. Family, government and lastly US.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

So... you'd prefer some government bureaucrat standing between you and your doctor?

Newsflash genius... unless YOU are footing the bill, somebody else will be making the decisions.

When was I ever talking about a government bureaucracy handling insurance? Do you people even read before you post?

I AM talking about me footing the bill - along with a collective of 200 million other americans pooling our money THERE NEED BE NO GOVERNMENT INVOLVEMENT. Would I trust a not-for-profit co-op more made up by people who have a direct say in their policies or a private insurance company? You bet your ass I would

Ok, then you're against having the government force you by utilizing the IRS, to purchase health insurance?

BTW... government is "not for profit".. look at how efficient they are.

 

[Mr. Peepers]

1. Maybe you should take a long hard look at corn subsidies and the western diet before spouting off about demand.

2. What 3rd parties are you talking about... insurance companies?

3. Dear lord. Malpractice? Really? THIS is what you say is driving up cost? Could it not be price fixing and collusion of the insurance industry? No, that couldnt' be it... BTW, We live in a very litigious society... do you really think that could ever change? What is one of your legs worth to you... or your spine?

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

We're talking about health insurance providers. They have nothing to do with medicine other than taking your money and standing between you and your doctor, dictating what kind of care you can get (or if you can get it). That ain't dedicating your life to medicine. That's exploiting sick (and healthy) people to make a buck. Come on, now... call a spade a spade.

So... you'd prefer some government bureaucrat standing between you and your doctor?

Newsflash genius... unless YOU are footing the bill, somebody else will be making the decisions.

That fact seems to have been forgotten by many.

And I am curious why the left blames the insurance companies for the cost of healthcare. Isnt it the doctors that bill and the insurance companies pay THEM?
Maybe if the doctor billed less the insurance companies would not question or deny paying?
Why do the doctors get a pass but the evil "businesses" dont?

I dont know....seems the reality of the medical industry, the insurance industry and the real reason for the need for healthcare reform has become so convoluted, no one knows what the hell is going on.

And I blame all of our greedy, selfish, party driven poiliticians for ir.

It is primarily due to overuse of the system, which happens when the recipient just plunks down $10 and the rest gets billed to somebody else. I blame a lot of this on the HMO model which we all got sucked into.

 

[Mr. Peepers]

So she didn't have a supplemental health insurance policy or nursing home insurance either?

Yes, she had AARP supplemental insurance and she couldn't use any insurance money for the nursing home until all of the money from the sale of the house was gone. She ended up with nothing.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

1. Maybe you should take a long hard look at corn subsidies and the western diet before spouting off about demand.

2. What 3rd parties are you talking about... insurance companies?

3. Dear lord. Malpractice? Really? THIS is what you say is driving up cost? Could it not be price fixing and collusion of the insurance industry? No, that couldnt' be it... BTW, We live in a very litigious society... do you really think that could ever change? What is one of your legs worth to you... or your spine?

Corn subsidies?



Look, you go ahead and demonize the insurance industry while rooting for your collectivist model, I'll work toward sane market based reforms.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

So she didn't have a supplemental health insurance policy or nursing home insurance either?

Yes, she had AARP supplemental insurance and she couldn't use any insurance money for the nursing home until all of the money from the sale of the house was gone. She ended up with nothing.

You still haven't explained your position as to why others are obligated to foot her bills.

 

[Jarhead]

So... you'd prefer some government bureaucrat standing between you and your doctor?

Newsflash genius... unless YOU are footing the bill, somebody else will be making the decisions.

That fact seems to have been forgotten by many.

And I am curious why the left blames the insurance companies for the cost of healthcare. Isnt it the doctors that bill and the insurance companies pay THEM?
Maybe if the doctor billed less the insurance companies would not question or deny paying?
Why do the doctors get a pass but the evil "businesses" dont?

I dont know....seems the reality of the medical industry, the insurance industry and the real reason for the need for healthcare reform has become so convoluted, no one knows what the hell is going on.

And I blame all of our greedy, selfish, party driven poiliticians for ir.

It is primarily due to overuse of the system, which happens when the recipient just plunks down $10 and the rest gets billed to somebody else. I blame a lot of this on the HMO model which we all got sucked into.

My neighbor...and I love her dearly....she had her kids going to the pediatrician twice a week for years...for an earache, a 100 temperature, "not feeling well"....stubbed toe for an x-ray...

My kids? Like when I was a kid.....only if it really was something serious....maybe twice a year...and that included the annual.

It is not overuse...it is abuse of the system.

 

[Mr. Peepers]

Ok, then you're against having the government force you by utilizing the IRS, to purchase health insurance?

BTW... government is "not for profit".. look at how efficient they are.

OK. I will say it slow for you so *maybe* you'll get it.

If we had a public option like this, there would be no reason for a gov't mandate. That, I believe, was the work of the insurance industry's concessions. Notice that they do NOT want this aspect of the reform bill appealed. If everyone could pay $50 dollars (and 99% of people would be able to), there would be no need for a mandate.

OK, second of all I am talking about an INDEPENDENT non-profit insurance co-op. Has nothing to do with government, zero, zip, nada. Non-profits are not government bureaucracies.

 

[Mr. Peepers]

Corn subsidies?



Look, you go ahead and demonize the insurance industry while rooting for your collectivist model, I'll work toward sane market based reforms.

You do that. Do you deny that it has an affect on health care costs? And none of the market-based reforms will benefit anyone but the health insurance industry. Even you have to admit that. Besides, if 200 million of us want to collectivize and buy group insurance we can afford, that is a "wrong" to you? Shouldn't be allowed, but we should be forced to buy into an industry that is a scam whether we want to or not? How is that competition? So much for freedom.

 

[Jarhead]

Ok, then you're against having the government force you by utilizing the IRS, to purchase health insurance?

BTW... government is "not for profit".. look at how efficient they are.

OK. I will say it slow for you so *maybe* you'll get it.

If we had a public option like this, there would be no reason for a gov't mandate. That, I believe, was the work of the insurance industry's concessions. Notice that they do NOT want this aspect of the reform bill appealed. If everyone could pay $50 dollars (and 99% of people would be able to), there would be no need for a mandate.

OK, second of all I am talking about an INDEPENDENT non-profit insurance co-op. Has nothing to do with government, zero, zip, nada. Non-profits are not government bureaucracies.

Whoa....please explain...

50 bucks....for what....annual premium?

or did ZI miss something?

 

[saveliberty]

So she didn't have a supplemental health insurance policy or nursing home insurance either?

Yes, she had AARP supplemental insurance and she couldn't use any insurance money for the nursing home until all of the money from the sale of the house was gone. She ended up with nothing.

Patently false! Nursing home insurance is expressly for preserving your personal assets.

 

[Mr. Peepers]

You still haven't explained your position as to why others are obligated to foot her bills.

No one footed her bills. She paid into SS and Medicaid. But you're right, we should have just dumped her in the woods because she didn't earn enough to pay for ALS treatment on her own, right? I truly hope that none of you ever get the kind of country you are blindly reaching for...

So tell me, genius, what should have happened to her?

 

[saveliberty]

So... you'd prefer some government bureaucrat standing between you and your doctor?

Newsflash genius... unless YOU are footing the bill, somebody else will be making the decisions.

When was I ever talking about a government bureaucracy handling insurance? Do you people even read before you post?

I AM talking about me footing the bill - along with a collective of 200 million other americans pooling our money THERE NEED BE NO GOVERNMENT INVOLVEMENT. Would I trust a not-for-profit co-op more... made up of people who have a direct say in their policies or a private insurance company? You bet your ass I would

Problemos:

There are not 200 million Americans working or in a position to pay.
Government audits nonprofits, so there goes your no involvement.
Just wait until the CEO from your not for profit collects their $3,000,000 annual salary.
Who do you appeal to if the not for profit denies your care request? Remember, no government.

 

[Mr. Peepers]

50 bucks....for what....annual premium?

50 bucks a month, which would make an annual premium of 600 for each of the people in the collective. Say you get the 200,000,000 signed up that I'm talking about, that's a good chunk of change to take care of your basic health care. And if you want to (and can) buy a supplimental insurance policy that covers more treatment options, you can.