Democrats Either Win or Win Big

[Orange_Juice]

McCain is basically Democrat light having opposed torture, Bush tax cuts, the religious right and supports stopping Global Warming etc. So even if he wins I'm not worried. I want Obama to win but won't cry if he loses to the guy who says his hero is the Progressive President Teddy Roosvelt.

Why didn't GOP nominate a Conservative?

 

[Chris]

McCain is basically Democrat light having opposed torture, Bush tax cuts, the religious right and supports stopping Global Warming etc. So even if he wins I'm not worried. I want Obama to win but won't cry if he loses to the guy who says his hero is the Progressive President Teddy Roosvelt.

Why didn't GOP nominate a Conservative?

Because the Republican party abandoned conservatism when Ronald Reagan was elected.

 

[Orange_Juice]

Because the Republican party abandoned conservatism when Ronald Reagan was elected.

Yup. That's true

 

[jillian]

Because the Republican party abandoned conservatism when Ronald Reagan was elected.

In favor of radical right wing extremism? Probably.

 

[Gunny]

McCain is basically Democrat light having opposed torture, Bush tax cuts, the religious right and supports stopping Global Warming etc. So even if he wins I'm not worried. I want Obama to win but won't cry if he loses to the guy who says his hero is the Progressive President Teddy Roosvelt.

Why didn't GOP nominate a Conservative?

Lord but you guys are bright. I can't do much but stare in amazement at such a statement.

No fukkin' shit, sherlock. WTF do you think conservatives have been bitching about? Yet every damned one of you loopy-left types has been on here mindlessly ascribing our support to McGrampa.

The concept that any one of us that vote for him will be the usual choosing the lesser of two evils doesn't seem to click, and it sure as Hell doesn't mean anyone likes the old coot. It just means he's more tolerable than Obama.

 

[Gunny]

Because the Republican party abandoned conservatism when Ronald Reagan was elected.

Yup. That's true

In favor of radical right wing extremism? Probably.

Kind of like the Democrats abandoned their minds when Jimmy Carter was elected.

 

[jillian]

Kind of like the Democrats abandoned their minds when Jimmy Carter was elected.

oh puleeze... Bill Clinton was part of the DLC... MODERATE DEMS... It was the repubs who got dragged to the right when the repub leadership moved from the northeast to the south and west.

As I've said, a democrat couldn't even get nominated now being as far to the left as Richard Nixon.

How's that for absurd?

Are there radical leftwingers? Yeppers... absolutely.. .positively... but none are running for president. Now if Kucinich or Dean (both of whom I can't stand) made it... another subject altogether.

And, frankly, as I've also repeatedly said.. if McCain now were McCain 2000 instead of McCain 2008, I'd vote for him myself. But he's not... and I'm not.

 

[Gunny]

oh puleeze... Bill Clinton was part of the DLC... MODERATE DEMS... It was the repubs who got dragged to the right when the repub leadership moved from the northeast to the south and west.

As I've said, a democrat couldn't even get nominated now being as far to the left as Richard Nixon.

How's that for absurd?

Are there radical leftwingers? Yeppers... absolutely.. .positively... but none are running for president. Now if Kucinich or Dean (both of whom I can't stand) made it... another subject altogether.

And, frankly, as I've also repeatedly said.. if McCain now were McCain 2000 instead of McCain 2008, I'd vote for him myself. But he's not... and I'm not.

You must have a BIG disconnect between your eyeballs and brain if you think "Jimmy Carter" says "Bill Clinton," or "Richard Nixon."

You are correct about repeating a few things ... that are bullshit. Carter redefined BOTH parties when he pulled the rug out from under the moderate liberals' feet.

Your idea of what a radical leftwinger is is based on your limited, partisan vision. Obama is a radical leftwinger, period. Although, I note with some satisfaction he is doing the same thing Clinton had to in 92 -- pretend to be a moderate and fall into the fold in order to pander to the moderates.

Your sticking to your story on Nixon just goes to show your unwillingness to learn. Nixon was hardly far-left. He'd easily be elected as a Republican nowadays, but y'all'd have him labelled as Satan.

 

[HoleInTheVoid]

McCain is basically Democrat light having opposed torture, Bush tax cuts, the religious right and supports stopping Global Warming etc. So even if he wins I'm not worried. I want Obama to win but won't cry if he loses to the guy who says his hero is the Progressive President Teddy Roosvelt.

Why didn't GOP nominate a Conservative?

Ah-h-h...

...the difference a VP announcement can make. Now OJ Simpleton sees McCain as the single biggest threat.

hee-hee! Good times.

 

[SwingVoter]

McCain is basically Democrat light having opposed torture, Bush tax cuts, the religious right and supports stopping Global Warming etc.

campaign finance reform, stem cell research etc

Mac is a lot like Harry Truman, a military conservative but very lib on everything else

 

[bigdaddygtr]

Your sticking to your story on Nixon just goes to show your unwillingness to learn. Nixon was hardly far-left. He'd easily be elected as a Republican nowadays, but y'all'd have him labelled as Satan.[/QUOTE]

And he was also the most racist Prez we ever had and yes, he was as close to Satan as anyone ever in politics except Dick Chaney

 

[AVG-JOE]

McCain is basically Democrat light having opposed torture, Bush tax cuts, the religious right and supports stopping Global Warming etc. So even if he wins I'm not worried. I want Obama to win but won't cry if he loses to the guy who says his hero is the Progressive President Teddy Roosvelt.

Why didn't GOP nominate a Conservative?

It was supposed to be Hillary. The money behind both parties was resigned to 4 or 8 years of Hillary as the cost of 8 profitable years with Georgie. McCain was supposed to be the sacrificial lamb this year and Obama upset the apple cart. Now the money behind both political parties is scrambling to make McCain electable.

You want proof? "Sarah Palin" and "Platform of 'Change'".

It is the unscripted nature of Obamas candidacy that has me excited about this election.

-Joe

 

[Richard-H]

McCain is basically Democrat light having opposed torture, Bush tax cuts, the religious right and supports stopping Global Warming etc. So even if he wins I'm not worried. I want Obama to win but won't cry if he loses to the guy who says his hero is the Progressive President Teddy Roosvelt.

Why didn't GOP nominate a Conservative?

McCain is a Democrat because he opposed TORTURE???

Wow, you are really off the deep end. I think that it would be hard to find another conservative that says that they are for torture.

The conservative argument about waterboarding was whether is was or was not torture.

But I guess you are either a bit more honest or just slipped up:

The Conservatives couldn't give a damn about inalienable rights or the freedoms of the Constitution when it doesn't serve them.

 

[frazzledgear]

McCain is basically Democrat light having opposed torture, Bush tax cuts, the religious right and supports stopping Global Warming etc. So even if he wins I'm not worried. I want Obama to win but won't cry if he loses to the guy who says his hero is the Progressive President Teddy Roosvelt.

Why didn't GOP nominate a Conservative?

Who actually ends up with the nomination of either party doesn't mean they had the strong support of the entire party all along unless one person is a runaway candidate from the start -which wasn't true in the Republican primaries. A party getting fully behind the ultimate winner of the primaries comes later after the primaries -and it either happens or it doesn't. McGovern won the primaries, but Democrats never got fully behind that guy -too far out of the mainstream and made a lot of Democrats uncomfortable. Beaten in a landslide with major party defections. Very same thing when Goldwater ran - only the other direction. Primaries make it difficult to have a runaway candidate with strong support right off the bat and more difficult for the entire party to immediately get behind just one candidate to the end -or Hillary would have been the Democrat nominee. It is whoever lasts the longest without getting bumped out of the race, runs out of money -and reaches that magic number first.

The other Republican nominees kept knocking each other out of the race, giving McCain a strong political advantage -but without much strong support behind it. Its why Republican support for McCain was not particularly enthusiastic before he chose Palin and such a significant percentage of the population remained undecided in the polls.

He has a HUGELY improved chance of winning now than before. Had he chosen ANY of the other former Republican candidates -he'd be dead in the water right now. No matter how the Democrats go after her, Palin was a brilliant choice. Not only is she more conservative than McCain which makes the base more comfortable with McCain when he can't afford to have Republicans just not vote at all, it made great headway into holding onto the rural and small town vote that gave Bush his victory in 2000 when McCain can't afford to lose that vote (had Gore won his own state he would have been President even while losing FL, but lost his own state because the rural vote gave the state to Bush) -and Palin totally nullified the historic nature of Obama's candidacy. No matter who is elected, an historic first will be made.

Given that fact, it means looking at substance now. And Obama is woefully short in that department. His VP pick was a dismal choice and added nothing to his ticket. Not even the guy's state which Obama will get anyway.

Yeah, McCain isn't the guy Republicans would have put up if all Republicans had been able to choose with just one vote. But for the overwhelming number of Republicans, he's made his ticket worth going to the voting booth instead of staying at home. And unfortunately for Obama, there is less crossover with Republicans who intend to vote for Obama, than Democrats who intend to vote for McCain.

 

[frazzledgear]

oh puleeze... Bill Clinton was part of the DLC... MODERATE DEMS... It was the repubs who got dragged to the right when the repub leadership moved from the northeast to the south and west.

As I've said, a democrat couldn't even get nominated now being as far to the left as Richard Nixon.

How's that for absurd?

Are there radical leftwingers? Yeppers... absolutely.. .positively... but none are running for president. Now if Kucinich or Dean (both of whom I can't stand) made it... another subject altogether.

And, frankly, as I've also repeatedly said.. if McCain now were McCain 2000 instead of McCain 2008, I'd vote for him myself. But he's not... and I'm not.

OMG -you are wearing some pretty heavy duty partisan glasses there. LOL Were it not for Watergate, Nixon could get the Republican nomination easily. After all, he got it twice before! At a time the entire country was significantly further to the right than it is today! Are you nuts?

No radicals running today? ROFLMAO! Sorry, but just because Obama had to tone it down for the general election or otherwise know he would lose, doesn't mean that guy isn't a radical leftwing extremist. The guy's entire history is about radical leftwing extremism. Ever bothered to look at the bills this guy voted in favor of while a state legislator? THAT is a record he cannot hide.

Jimmy Carter was not a moderate Democrat as he advertised himself to be -but turned out to be MUCH further to the left. And still nowhere as extreme as Obama is. And he got himself thrown out of office just after one term because of the horrific damage he inflicted on the entire nation with his FAILED, far leftwing policies.

Obama is holding out those identical economic policies and MORE of them, promising they won't result in the disastrous economic conditions Carter gave us all with them. No, he promises they will give us a Clinton economy although it was Reagan policies that gave us that -not only the exact opposite of Carter's policies, but the very reason voters threw Carter out in favor of Reagan!

I can always spot the general age of those who wax on about Obama -and can only lament the fact that our public schools teach ever less relevant history than it does to the previous generation.

Better go back and review some history -because these policies haven't worked well in ANY country, much less this one. Unless of course you think imitating France with its ROUTINE double digit unemployment and double digit interest rates and paying $8.20 a gallon for gas is an improvement!

 

[HoleInTheVoid]

No radicals running today? ROFLMAO! Sorry, but just because Obama had to tone it down for the general election or otherwise know he would lose, doesn't mean that guy isn't a radical leftwing extremist. The guy's entire history is about radical leftwing extremism. Ever bothered to look at the bills this guy voted in favor of while a state legislator? THAT is a record he cannot hide.

It's always fun to hear, "Obama's not a radical! Obama's not a radical! Obama's not a radical!" and then note how many radicals support him and only him.

Obama certainy has the Code: pinko vote sewn-up.

 

[chapstic]

It's always fun to hear, "Obama's not a radical! Obama's not a radical! Obama's not a radical!" and then note how many radicals support him and only him.

Obama certainy has the Code: pinko vote sewn-up.

3 reasons (they) support yo-bama.

1. skin tone.
2. income(or lack thereof).
3. hate bush that much.

 

[Chris]

3 reasons (they) support yo-bama.

1. skin tone.
2. income(or lack thereof).
3. hate bush that much.

Republicans want to make Obama the issue because they have no issues of their own.

Obama's priorities are getting out of Iraq, universal healthcare, and American energy independence. These happen to be the three greatest priorities for America right now.

Getting out of Iraq will save us $200 billion dollars a year and bring our brave troops home to their families. American troops should not be sent in harm's way unless their is a COMPELLING NATIONAL INTEREST. Which was not the case with Iraq.

Every other Western democracy has universal healthcare except the United States, and they pay HALF per capita what we pay for healthcare, and they cover everyone. Why? Because a single payer system has inherent cost savings.

America's dependence on foreign oil is the most important security issue America faces. Clean energy technology is already available and only requires the political will to develop it.

Making these three issues his top priorities shows the wisdom and judgement that Obama has. That is why I am voting for him.

 

[editec]

oh puleeze... Bill Clinton was part of the DLC... MODERATE DEMS... It was the repubs who got dragged to the right when the repub leadership moved from the northeast to the south and west.

I think what we're having now is a debate on political set theory.

Today's younger, self indentified conservatives basically seem to want to end government as we've known it our entire lives.

Most of them seem to believe that the only thing government should do is oversee police powers, courts and the military.

Today's younger liberals seem to want the NEW DEAL government of FDR. Really that's not so much of a change from what exists today.

I don't think the Democratic Party has really changed its stated positions all that much in the last thirty years. They are still basically New Dealers.

If you believe that the self identified Republicans on this board are any indication of that party's current thinking, the Republican Party's rank and file are much further to the right than they were when I was a kid.

If NiXXon ran today, he'd be considered a radical leftist by the standards of many self identified conservatives, today.

Many of the boards so called conservatives on this board indicate that they think McCain is a liberal by their standards.

Teddy Roosevelt, Herbert Hoover and Ike would also be leftists according to their political theories since theyd all done things that today's liberals approve of.

So the conservative movement has beome much more conservative than it once was, if history is our guide.

 

[greenpartyaz]

McCain is basically Democrat light having opposed torture, Bush tax cuts, the religious right and supports stopping Global Warming etc. So even if he wins I'm not worried. I want Obama to win but won't cry if he loses to the guy who says his hero is the Progressive President Teddy Roosvelt.

Why didn't GOP nominate a Conservative?

I don't think McCain will win in November. Once he and Palin hit the debates, he will get his ass handed to him; and Palin will be exposed as a trojan horse to carry on Bush/Cheney's policies!