Democrats Can't Argue In Support Of Obama On The Arizona Law Because Of This

[mudwhistle]

I've noticed that Democrat supporters have been pretty quiet about this issue lately...because they know they are on shaky ground.

Nobody in the Obama Administration has read the Arizona Immigration law...yet they continued up till yesterday to imply that it was racist.

Now Obama has changed his rhetoric to making assumptions rather then saying that the law contains racist passages. Now he claims that it has the potential for abuse...not that the law itself is unfair or racist.

The potential for abuse??

Excuse me??

Doesn't any law have the potential for abuse by law-enforcement offcials?

How dishonest can this guy get?

I dare anyone on the left to prove to me that what Obama is saying now makes any sense. I dare any of you to show me that he isn't just patronizing a large special interest group by lying through his teeth.

Notice the difference between the way Obama treated Israel's Prime-Minister and the way he treated the President of Mexico. He threw a fancy ball for the Mexican Prez yesterday but on the other hand showed Israel the door in short order. He even ushered the Dali Lama out a back door so he would have to walk past a stinking pile of garbage earlier this year. I'm amazed at the nastiness of this guy and his people. The people he likes he treats them like royalty.....bows to them....kisses their asses. But the people he doesn't care for he shows nothing but outright contempt.

Also, how can Obama be such a hypocrite...bad-mouthing Arizona knowing full well that Mexico's immigration laws are Draconian in comparison. Mexico's laws are indeed racist....at the same time he knows full well that Arizona's laws aren't. Doesn't he know that most of America can see this and doesn't he know that this will be reflected in his party's lack of success in the coming election this November?

 

[Sinatra]

Obama and his liberal Dems are so out of touch with the mainstream on this issue - and they have been remarkably slow to correct the their near-incoherent and ignorant message regarding the matter.

 

[mudwhistle]

Obama and his liberal Dems are so out of touch with the mainstream on this issue - and they have been remarkably slow to correct the their near-incoherent and ignorant message regarding the matter.

At first he said it was unfair...now he's changed that and says it has the potential to be so.

That's a retraction yet not an admission.

 

[Nonelitist]

Facts? Liberals dont' need facts with which to argue. All feelings and emotion.... not to mention alot of guilt.

 

[bodecea]

You know...I have no problem with the AZ law as written....where is where my arguments have been:

1) people going on and on about drivers licenses being required already....forgetting that MORE than drivers may be stopped. And now the absolutely ridiculousness of comparing the AZ law with high school students going to the WH.

2) the inflammatory actions of people tearing down Mexican flags, etc. during a Mexican American holiday

3) the SUDDEN insistance on dropping cultural connections (i.e. Mexican-American)...when we heard not a peep during St. Patricks Day (Irish-Americans) or Columbus Day (Italian-Americans)

Can anyone wonder why it looks like this is racially/culturally triggered? (When it isn't really)

 

[VaYank5150]

Facts? Liberals dont' need facts with which to argue. All feelings and emotion.... not to mention alot of guilt.

In my humble opinion, Obama is being hypcoritical. While he cannot write the laws, or even enforce them, the fact that Arizona felt the need to do SOMETHING to combat the illegal immigrant problem, shows a complete failure of our Federal government to do THIER job. Is this all Obama's fault? No. This problem has lingered for decades. However, to have him show up against this law WITH the President of Mexico was simply wrong. Are we a country of laws or not?

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

Facts? Liberals dont' need facts with which to argue. All feelings and emotion.... not to mention alot of guilt.

In my humble opinion, Obama is being hypcoritical. While he cannot write the laws, or even enforce them, the fact that Arizona felt the need to do SOMETHING to combat the illegla immigrant problem, shows a complet failure of our Federal government to do THIER job. Is this all Obama's fault? No. This problem has lingered for decades. However, to have him show up against this law WITH the President of Mexico was simply wrong. Are we a country of laws or not?

Indeed!

 

[DiamondDave]

You know...I have no problem with the AZ law as written....where is where my arguments have been:

1) people going on and on about drivers licenses being required already....forgetting that MORE than drivers may be stopped. And now the absolutely ridiculousness of comparing the AZ law with high school students going to the WH.

2) the inflammatory actions of people tearing down Mexican flags, etc. during a Mexican American holiday

3) the SUDDEN insistance on dropping cultural connections (i.e. Mexican-American)...when we heard not a peep during St. Patricks Day (Irish-Americans) or Columbus Day (Italian-Americans)

Can anyone wonder why it looks like this is racially/culturally triggered? (When it isn't really)

Yep.. more than drivers may be stopped.. and there are other forms of government ID that can be obtained... the problem only starts to be with states that issue licenses to illegals and whether that is taken into account by the officers... although the proper solution would be to ensure illegals do not obtain drivers licenses in ANY state, I don't think we'll see much call for that from the opponents to the law

#2 has nothing to do with the law

#3 many have never supported anyway... whether it be mexican-Americans or african-Americans or irish-Americans or polish-Americans or whatever else.. many have always been against such silly designations

 

[bucs90]

You know...I have no problem with the AZ law as written....where is where my arguments have been:

1) people going on and on about drivers licenses being required already....forgetting that MORE than drivers may be stopped. And now the absolutely ridiculousness of comparing the AZ law with high school students going to the WH.

2) the inflammatory actions of people tearing down Mexican flags, etc. during a Mexican American holiday

3) the SUDDEN insistance on dropping cultural connections (i.e. Mexican-American)...when we heard not a peep during St. Patricks Day (Irish-Americans) or Columbus Day (Italian-Americans)

Can anyone wonder why it looks like this is racially/culturally triggered? (When it isn't really)

Common arguments, but mostly incorrect.

Yes, a non-driver may be stopped. But ONLY after the commission of another, non-related criminal offense. As major as murder, as minor as littering. But there must be a seperate, non-related offense that falls under a lawful "Terry Stop" for the cop to initiate contact. THEN during the investigation, if probable cause exists that the person is an illegal, the law kicks in.

A cop cannot stop a person, by law, without probable cause or reasonable suspicion of a law violation. Drivers and non-drivers included.

And, by CURRENT law in all 50 states, if a cop stops you for a violation of any law, you are required to present identification. That may be in the form of a DL, a passport, social security card, or now thanks to technology, a simple name and date of birth, which all cops can check through dispatch or computers to verify ID. But "show me your papers" exists for all persons within our borders, illegal or legal, if they are lawfully stopped by a cop.

As for tearing down flags, I find that reactionary in reaction to Mexicans, hispanics and illegal immigration supporters trashing the American flag, refusing to assimilate, and demanding their "rights" and demands be met although they committed a crime by sneaking in. I just don't see a lot of St. Patricks day parades that involve trashing the American flag, and on St. P's day, I haven't heard of any school telling students they cannot display the American flag on that particular day because it is an Irish day. Thats why the backlash against the Mexican flag. Remember the law of physics: Every action has an equal and opposite reaction.

As for abolishing slashed ethnicity and nationality titles, I'm all for it. I don't know why a black person who has never stepped foot on African soil calls himself "African-American". Racial identity politics is killing this country.

But then again, liberals are using that as a tactic. They need the victim mentality. And what better way to create victims than seperate all people into smaller sub-groups, and convince each sub-group that they are oppressed by the larger masses who are different than them. Disgusting.

 

[bucs90]

You know...I have no problem with the AZ law as written....where is where my arguments have been:

1) people going on and on about drivers licenses being required already....forgetting that MORE than drivers may be stopped. And now the absolutely ridiculousness of comparing the AZ law with high school students going to the WH.

2) the inflammatory actions of people tearing down Mexican flags, etc. during a Mexican American holiday

3) the SUDDEN insistance on dropping cultural connections (i.e. Mexican-American)...when we heard not a peep during St. Patricks Day (Irish-Americans) or Columbus Day (Italian-Americans)

Can anyone wonder why it looks like this is racially/culturally triggered? (When it isn't really)

Yep.. more than drivers may be stopped.. and there are other forms of government ID that can be obtained... the problem only starts to be with states that issue licenses to illegals and whether that is taken into account by the officers... although the proper solution would be to ensure illegals do not obtain drivers licenses in ANY state, I don't think we'll see much call for that from the opponents to the law

#2 has nothing to do with the law

#3 many have never supported anyway... whether it be mexican-Americans or african-Americans or irish-Americans or polish-Americans or whatever else.. many have always been against such silly designations

You are 100% right on #1. For example, the state of North Carolina issues valid driver's licenses to anyone who can pass the tests. Anyone, illegal or not. And guess what? The NC DMV offers all lessons and tests in multiple languages. Now, street signs aren't in multiple languages, but the tests are. During 8 years of police work in Georgia, I saw countless NC driver's licenses on guys that spoke only Spanish. Figure what you may, but thats the fact. NC DMV's often get buses of Spanish only immigrants brought in from various states, private rented buses, in order to obtain valid DL's. Once they get a valid NC DL, they can legally drive anywhere in the USA.

And, in Arizona, if a cop stops an illegal, but he provides a valid NC DL, well, reasonable suspicion that he is an illegal is gone. Since legal US citizens are only required to prove their identity to a cop, thats all any person must do if reasonable suspicion doesn't exist that they are illegal. So, in Phoenix, if an illegal has a NC license, and shoplifts, and the cop stops him, and he presents a valid NC license, the cop WILL NOT deport him. He can't. He has met the standard required of all US citizens when stopped by a cop. His skin color can't matter. His language can't matter.

So what do I expect in reaction to this law? Buses of illegals making road trips to North Carolina. In 10 years, we'll still be facing the illegal issue, but only as an even more bankrupt country.

 

[Sinatra]

And just this morning, once again, Obama apologizes to the Mexican President regarding a state law he has not read...

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

You know...I have no problem with the AZ law as written....where is where my arguments have been:

1) people going on and on about drivers licenses being required already....forgetting that MORE than drivers may be stopped. And now the absolutely ridiculousness of comparing the AZ law with high school students going to the WH.

2) the inflammatory actions of people tearing down Mexican flags, etc. during a Mexican American holiday

3) the SUDDEN insistance on dropping cultural connections (i.e. Mexican-American)...when we heard not a peep during St. Patricks Day (Irish-Americans) or Columbus Day (Italian-Americans)

Can anyone wonder why it looks like this is racially/culturally triggered? (When it isn't really)

1) You CAN NOT be asked to prove citizenship unless you break a law. The bill calls for jail time for officers who use profiling.

2) This has NOTHING to do with the AZ law but with individual behavior

3) More Red herrings like #2.

Do you have anything substantial about the law you would like to comment on? What you are focused on is all smoke and mirrors.

 

[Dr Gregg]

mudwhistle, you really can't be that dumb can you? It does have the potential for misuse with such vague wording, along with the nature of human beings and the history of racism and profiling in this country. Common sense.

Man, the anti-Obama threads just get dumber and dumber

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

Facts? Liberals dont' need facts with which to argue. All feelings and emotion.... not to mention alot of guilt.

In my humble opinion, Obama is being hypcoritical. While he cannot write the laws, or even enforce them, the fact that Arizona felt the need to do SOMETHING to combat the illegal immigrant problem, shows a complete failure of our Federal government to do THIER job. Is this all Obama's fault? No. This problem has lingered for decades. However, to have him show up against this law WITH the President of Mexico was simply wrong. Are we a country of laws or not?

An honest assesment...rep for you.

 

[boedicca]

Anyone who criticizes AZ's law (which I believe is a mere 17 pages) as being vulnerable to abuse should think about what that means for 2,700 page bills which nobody has bothered to read before voting or signing.

 

[Sinatra]

Anyone who criticizes AZ's law (which I believe is a mere 17 pages) as being vulnerable to abuse should think about what that means for 2,700 page bills which nobody has bothered to read before voting or signing.

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

Anyone who criticizes AZ's law (which I believe is a mere 17 pages) as being vulnerable to abuse should think about what that means for 2,700 page bills which nobody has bothered to read before voting or signing.

EXCELLENT Point ma'am.

 

[mudwhistle]

mudwhistle, you really can't be that dumb can you? It does have the potential for misuse with such vague wording, along with the nature of human beings and the history of racism and profiling in this country. Common sense.

Man, the anti-Obama threads just get dumber and dumber

That is not only a stereotype but a racist attitude on your part and Obama's.

Glenn Beck read the damned thing on the air yesterday. There's nothing vague about the law.

Also I think if we felt the potential of abuse should be an impediment to any law then no law would ever be written.

There is always a potential of abuse in any law.

His argument is a backtrack on his original statement that the law itself was unfair....that was before it was admitted that nobody in his administration ever read the thing.

So he's changing his stance to this ridiculous Potential argument..not that the law is unfair.

The simple fact is....this argument is designed to make it impossible for law enforcement officials to enforce immigration laws plain and simple.

The President of Mexico himself admitted today that he uses racial profiling to enforce immigration laws in his country. To him it is next to impossible to enforce them if he doesn't.