Death Of Jesus

[RetiredGySgt]

Just celebrated the death of Jesus as our Savior. The date is set by the actual date it occurred. They compute the correct day every year. SO it is not always on the same day since the calendar in use back then was Lunar and ours is not.

 

[Artevelde]

I'm fairly old-fashioned and traditional. It's Good Friday here and that is the time I always attend Mass to remember the Passion of Christ.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

Just celebrated the death of Jesus as our Savior. The date is set by the actual date it occurred. They compute the correct day every year. SO it is not always on the same day since the calendar in use back then was Lunar and ours is not.

celebrate?

 

[eots]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSfa56tjBQo]King Missile- Jesus was way cool. - YouTube[/ame]

 

[eots]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ts3shz-n7lQ]The Jews Killed Jesus - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Dragon]

I have a little different take on the death of Christ, as you might imagine.

A wise, enlightened man once lived in Judea. He taught love, forgiveness, that we are all children of God, and that God lives within all of us. He taught that the downtrodden and despised could have greater virtue than the rich, the pretenders to righteousness, and the priests. He sharply pointed up the hypocrisy of the established religious leaders of his day, and associated with prostitutes, tribute-collectors, the poor and outcast. He pardoned a woman caught in adultery and meant to be stoned according to the law of the time, and condemned the kind of mindset that would have killed her. They say the presence of God was so great in him that he could walk on water and raise the dead; whether that's true or not, holiness flows from his words even today.

The religious right of the time condemned him, of course, and put him to a slow, painful death. He's said to have risen from the dead afterwards. Certainly we may have his spirit and his wisdom with us, and have need of it in the face of the hypocrites of the type who murdered him, who are also, alas, with us still -- many of them speaking in his name.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Just celebrated the death of Jesus as our Savior. The date is set by the actual date it occurred. They compute the correct day every year. SO it is not always on the same day since the calendar in use back then was Lunar and ours is not.

celebrate?

Ever read the bible? Jesus ordered his disciples to celebrate his death every year.

 

[laughinReaper]

I spend the weekend with family, reflect quietly and look forward to Sunday Morning.

 

[inALIENable]

And then three days and three nights later he became zombie, right?

 

[The Irish Ram]

I have a little different take on the death of Christ, as you might imagine.

A wise, enlightened man once lived in Judea. He taught love, forgiveness, that we are all children of God, and that God lives within all of us. He taught that the downtrodden and despised could have greater virtue than the rich, the pretenders to righteousness, and the priests. He sharply pointed up the hypocrisy of the established religious leaders of his day, and associated with prostitutes, tribute-collectors, the poor and outcast. He pardoned a woman caught in adultery and meant to be stoned according to the law of the time, and condemned the kind of mindset that would have killed her. They say the presence of God was so great in him that he could walk on water and raise the dead; whether that's true or not, holiness flows from his words even today.

The religious right of the time condemned him, of course, and put him to a slow, painful death. He's said to have risen from the dead afterwards. Certainly we may have his spirit and his wisdom with us, and have need of it in the face of the hypocrites of the type who murdered him, who are also, alas, with us still -- many of them speaking in his name.

I understand how you feel. It is very humane. But try to look at it from Jesus' point of view.
In the battle between Good and Evil, Satan was able to introduce sin into the blood of two of God's children. It is passed from the parent to the children. Satan thought he had won the battle AND severed forever the tie between us and our Father, because the rule is:
The punishment for sin is death, and, God can't look upon us or even hear us because of the sin that is in our blood. We can't work enough to remove it either. We were done for.
God and Jesus did an end around and in keeping with all of the guidelines, paid the penalty for sin with perfect sin free blood, hence paving the way for us to return to the penthouse where we belong. Re-pent means to return to the highest level.
God and Jesus won the battle for our souls. Had man not nailed Jesus to that cross, he would have climbed up there and nailed himself to it. And if He was capable of walking on water, He could have climbed down from a cross too. But He had a mission to accomplish. It was finished on that day. He loves us that much.

 

[eots]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SobrrdRiP6Y]Zombie Jesus - YouTube[/ame]

 

[inALIENable]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vdVwinoP18Y]Sam Kinison - Zombie Christ - YouTube[/ame]​

 

[Dragon]

I understand how you feel. It is very humane. But try to look at it from Jesus' point of view.

That's exactly what I was doing. In order to do that, you have to first strip away the accumulated Christian doctrine about him that has no bearing on his own point of view.

In the battle between Good and Evil, Satan was able to introduce sin into the blood of two of God's children. It is passed from the parent to the children. Satan thought he had won the battle AND severed forever the tie between us and our Father, because the rule is:
The punishment for sin is death, and, God can't look upon us or even hear us because of the sin that is in our blood. We can't work enough to remove it either. We were done for.
God and Jesus did an end around and in keeping with all of the guidelines, paid the penalty for sin with perfect sin free blood, hence paving the way for us to return to the penthouse where we belong. Re-pent means to return to the highest level.
God and Jesus won the battle for our souls. Had man not nailed Jesus to that cross, he would have climbed up there and nailed himself to it. And if He was capable of walking on water, He could have climbed down from a cross too. But He had a mission to accomplish. It was finished on that day. He loves us that much.

Yes, yes, yes, I've heard this argument before. It's absurd. The idea that there is anything in creation that God can't see or can't look through is nonsense. The idea that he had to send anyone to Hell is nonsense. God is the ground and being of everything; God IS everything, and without Him nothing was made that was made. There are no limits of that kind on God.

All of these philosophical explanations are after-the-fact justifications for what is, in origin, a truly bloodthirsty, primitive, and abominable idea of God as a punitive tyrant who demanded blood sacrifice for the offenses of mankind, and was appeased in his blood-lust by the willing sacrifice of his own son. That was the original idea, it made sense to people long ago who were barely out of savagery, but it makes no sense today, and whitewashing it with nonsensical ideas about the limitations on God will not cure its deficiencies.

Jesus was a wise and holy man who felt the presence of God within him and helped many to find the same presence within them. The religious authorities saw him as a threat and got the state to put him to death. That's all the meaning from his life and his crucifixion that we can be sure of.

 

[The Irish Ram]

And how can you be sure of that? Who said Jesus was a wise and holy man? If you strip away any Christian doctrine about him, then you can't make that statement. It's guesswork on your part.

 

[Dragon]

And how can you be sure of that?

Well, strictly speaking I can't be completely sure that he ever existed; I'm making that assumption because it's the most economical way to explain the existence of Christianity. Nor can I be 100% sure that the Gospels report his words accurately. Assuming that he lived, and assuming that they do, however, I stand by my statement.

Who said Jesus was a wise and holy man? If you strip away any Christian doctrine about him, then you can't make that statement. It's guesswork on your part.

I say Jesus (as depicted in the Gospels) was a wise and holy man, because I, having stood will-less and stripped of false identity in the presence of the divine, know a wise and holy man when I hear or read his words. I am in a position to judge this, and I say it is true.

It is not guesswork at all.

 

[The Irish Ram]

Apparently you pick and choose His words to suit your agenda. Do you ignore the, "I am the way"...... "You must be born again"........ "I am the king of the Jews"........ words He spoke? Do you assume He's holy and nuts?

 

[Dragon]

Apparently you pick and choose His words to suit your agenda. Do you ignore the, "I am the way"...... "You must be born again"........ "I am the king of the Jews"........ words He spoke? Do you assume He's holy and nuts?

Nope. I just see the Gospels as an account at secondhand by people who may or may not have been present, and may or may not have remembered correctly in every particular if they did. I'm under no obligation to accept every word in them as true, or to reject every word in them as false; picking and choosing is an absolute right and the most sensible way to approach matters. Also, most of the things Jesus is reported to have said don't mean what a superficial interpretation would indicate. And finally, although he was wise and holy, neither he nor anyone else who has ever lived was perfect.

As to the three things you mentioned, the second has a definite mystical meaning having nothing to do with the Christian religion, and the other two represent either evidence of flaws in the man's character or insertions by the authors of the Gospels. I lean towards the second explanation although the first is possible.

The bottom line here is that our own minds, our own experience of the holy, is in the end the ONLY reliable guide we have. It is impossible to communicate the truth in human language. All religions are true. All religions are false. And whether the truth or the falsehood emerges depends on whether one takes them at face value. A sure sign that one is in error, though, is the delusion that any one religion has unique possession of the truth. All religious doctrines POINT to the truth, and the truth they point to is always the SAME truth. But none of them IS the truth, and the pointers they use may vary. To think one of them is saying anything unique, you have t o have mistaken the pointer for the truth itself.

 

[ABikerSailor]

Just celebrated the death of Jesus as our Savior. The date is set by the actual date it occurred. They compute the correct day every year. SO it is not always on the same day since the calendar in use back then was Lunar and ours is not.

Hey stupid..........if that's true, then Passover (which is calculated according to lunar cycles of the Jewish calendar) would occur just before Easter every year.

It's actually lined up as the first Sunday after the Spring solstice, because the celebration of Easter is actually a mix of Judaic/Pagan/Christian belief systems.

Rome had to throw a bone to the pagans of their country in order to get them to accept the new religion.

Try again Retarded Grungy Shithead.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Just celebrated the death of Jesus as our Savior. The date is set by the actual date it occurred. They compute the correct day every year. SO it is not always on the same day since the calendar in use back then was Lunar and ours is not.

Hey stupid..........if that's true, then Passover (which is calculated according to lunar cycles of the Jewish calendar) would occur just before Easter every year.

It's actually lined up as the first Sunday after the Spring solstice, because the celebration of Easter is actually a mix of Judaic/Pagan/Christian belief systems.

Rome had to throw a bone to the pagans of their country in order to get them to accept the new religion.

Try again Retarded Grungy Shithead.

Go ahead you dumb ass do the math, based on the DATE Jesus was killed compute the proper date this year and you will find that Thursday last was the actual DATE he died. But don't let facts or truth get in the way of a good rant.

I do not celebrate Easter or the resurrection Jesus did not command those be remembered only his death. Just like I do not celebrate his birth which was probably in October or November. He did not command that be celebrated either.

 

[ABikerSailor]

Just celebrated the death of Jesus as our Savior. The date is set by the actual date it occurred. They compute the correct day every year. SO it is not always on the same day since the calendar in use back then was Lunar and ours is not.

Hey stupid..........if that's true, then Passover (which is calculated according to lunar cycles of the Jewish calendar) would occur just before Easter every year.

It's actually lined up as the first Sunday after the Spring solstice, because the celebration of Easter is actually a mix of Judaic/Pagan/Christian belief systems.

Rome had to throw a bone to the pagans of their country in order to get them to accept the new religion.

Try again Retarded Grungy Shithead.

Go ahead you dumb ass do the math, based on the DATE Jesus was killed compute the proper date this year and you will find that Thursday last was the actual DATE he died. But don't let facts or truth get in the way of a good rant.

I do not celebrate Easter or the resurrection Jesus did not command those be remembered only his death. Just like I do not celebrate his birth which was probably in October or November. He did not command that be celebrated either.

Wrong answer shithead. If you'd actually bother to read your Bible, you'd know that Jesus (a good Jewish man) was in Jerusalem to celebrate Passover (a Jewish holiday) and He was captured on the Friday it ended, and crucified a couple of days later.

Like I said you retarded moron, it's a Jewish holiday that is actually based on the lunar cycles.

If your date is so "accurate" why is it that Easter is tomorrow, but Passover doesn't end until next Friday?

Try again chumpsteak. The date of Easter is calculated as the first Sunday after Spring Solstice because Rome had to make concessions to the pagans when they adopted to their version of what they found in Jerusalem.

Also explains why His birthday is celebrated on the 25th (around the Winter Solstice) instead of when it actually occurred, which according to the stories in the Bible would have been around the end of October, because you don't do a census in the old days right in the middle of winter, it's too hard to get the people to come and be counted.

Try again chumpsteak.