Dear GOP, stop saying "Close loopholes, lower the rates and expand the tax base"

[DiamondDave]

Note how every time we discuss taxes people talk about closing loopholes?

Note also that every time I ask these folks "WHAT LOOPHOLE would you close?" nobody responds?


These morons think that changing the tax RATES = closing loopholes.

It doesn't.

Not remotely.

Rates have nothing to do with loopholes.

And no, if the rates change the US tax code is not going to be simplified.

It cannot be simplified because the US tax codes addresses issues surrounding compex questions about what is a justified deduction for each industry.

And it is in those CODES where the dreaded loopholes exist.

Those koopholes that all this boards self proclaiming TAX EXPERTS can't seem to indentify.


My poinht here?

Our fellow posters don't know what the fuck they are talking about.

They aren't not only not experts, they don't have fucking clue what they're talking about.

The pages and pages of deductions, shifting rates, tax shelters, etc.... eliminate loopholes (every single one of them), eliminate the possibility of loopholes with a simplified system, equalize the tax rate on every dollar earned

Simple enough??

YOu wrote a lot of words but not a plan.

What loopholes specifically would you eliminate?

Name ONE --- Just one! -- that Cains plan or any of the FLAT TAXERS have told YOU about.

What loophole, in the OIL industry, for example, will Cains plan close?

I'll tell you because I know you don't know.

It won't close a single loophole.

Jesus Christ are you dense...

Any and all deductions, tax shelters, etc.... By absolutely and completely simplifying the code to have it that every dollar is taxed the same rate, every time, with zero deductions, exceptions, etc... No deductions for political contributions... no reduced rates for capital gains... no delays in taxation... no 'rebates' for 'going green'... NONE OF THAT SHIT

I am not and have not supported Cain's plan... but nice try... stay on topic and focused, edit

ELIMINATE THE CURRENT TAX CODE... THROW IT OUT THE WINDOW..... AND REPLACE WITH THE IRON CLAD SIMPLIFIED SYSTEM AS STATED...

 

[Zoom-boing]

The poor, and a good portion of the middle class, pay NO federal income tax; it's nearly half the country that falls into this camp....this is what is being referred to when 'expanding the base' is advocated.

Secondly, the 'rich' have been paying an increasing share of the overall tax burden for some time. The effective tax burden (tax share in relation to income share) was 5.62 times higher for the rich than for the poor in 1980 and 9.0 times higher in 2008. Thus, the relative tax burden on the rich -- relative to income -- compared to the poor nearly doubled from 1980 to 2008.

But what to facts mean to you anyway? I suspect if the government confiscated 100% of income from the wealthy (which wouldn't even cover this year's deficit much less begin to chip away at the debt), you still would want more.

Everyone pays taxes. If you buy new shoes, you pay taxes.

Strange how right wingers want to saddle the poor with higher taxes. It's like the right wing won't be happy until they are really suffering. Then you look at corporations who have so much cash, they are buying back their stock. The top 12 largest corporations pay no taxes and get money back in the form of subsidies. As if they need it.

When did right wingers fall so hard in love with people who would "squish" them like bugs if given the chance?

What is strange is how you want to saddle everyone else with higher taxes, and eliminate more for yourself... all the while screaming in other aspects about equal treatment or equality... it is as hypocritical as you can get...

And you keep with your typical little ploy... when everyone else tells you more and more people pay no FEDERAL INCOME TAXES.... you keep mentioning other taxes that are payed, and not just by 'the poor' but by EVERYONE.... nice try, winger, but your little attempt at diversion is not going to be allowed to slide

Gotta cut weinnie some slack. After all, a herps gotta derp . . . they just can't help themselves.

 

[M14 Shooter]

We know what it means.
It means the wealthy should pay less taxes and the poor should pay more.

Where, exactly, is "the poor shoudl pay more" found in any of that?

Everybody pays taxes. It's a lie to say they don't.

A HUGE number of peoplem because of their low income, pay NO federal income tax.
Its a lie to say they don't

 

[eflatminor]

Everyone pays taxes. If you buy new shoes, you pay taxes

You're talking about state sales tax. Well, you're wrong again. EVERYONE does NOT pay sales tax. States in which there is no sales tax for clothing:
Alaska
Delaware
Minnesota
New Hampshire
New Jersey
Oregon
Pennsylvania
Rhode Island
Vermont

Seriously, are you retarded? Because I'll stop tearing apart your ridiculously false statements if you are.

 

[eflatminor]

Note how every time we discuss taxes people talk about closing loopholes?

Note also that every time I ask these folks "WHAT LOOPHOLE would you close?" nobody responds?


These morons think that changing the tax RATES = closing loopholes.

It doesn't.

Not remotely.

Rates have nothing to do with loopholes.

And no, if the rates change the US tax code is not going to be simplified.

It cannot be simplified because the US tax codes addresses issues surrounding compex questions about what is a justified deduction for each industry.

And it is in those CODES where the dreaded loopholes exist.

Those koopholes that all this boards self proclaiming TAX EXPERTS can't seem to indentify.


My poinht here?

Our fellow posters don't know what the fuck they are talking about.

They aren't not only not experts, they don't have fucking clue what they're talking about.

You are correct that simply changing the rate will do nothing to eliminate loopholes, be they deductions for a guy's mortgage payments to a special deal for oil producers. That said, a true flat tax (either personal and or corporate) need not contain ANY loopholes or deductions. Some that advocate a flat tax may also wish to see some loopholes/deductions remain. The point is, there are lots of ideas out there but none quite so fucked up as our current 70,000+ pages of IRS code.

 

[BillyV]

Note how every time we discuss taxes people talk about closing loopholes?
Note also that every time I ask these folks "WHAT LOOPHOLE would you close?" nobody responds?

These morons think that changing the tax RATES = closing loopholes.
It doesn't.
Not remotely.
Rates have nothing to do with loopholes.

And no, if the rates change the US tax code is not going to be simplified.

It cannot be simplified because the US tax codes addresses issues surrounding compex questions about what is a justified deduction for each industry.

And it is in those CODES where the dreaded loopholes exist.

Those loopholes that all this boards self proclaiming TAX EXPERTS can't seem to indentify.

My poinht here?

Our fellow posters don't know what the f**k they are talking about.

They aren't not only not experts, they don't have f**king clue what they're talking about.

The theory of tax breaks (loopholes is not a good description; it makes it sound somehow illegal or immoral) is a good one – give people incentive to do what the government would otherwise have to do (in the case of charitable contributions to support public welfare) or what the government is trying to encourage (like home ownership with the mortgage deduction, credits for conservation efforts/green energy/etc. or accelerated depreciation to encourage equipment purchases). Unfortunately, it gives the government power to dole out other breaks that are not so easily supportable. One scary example was a tax break given to Chrysler in 2008. The law was written to allow a cash payment to “An applicable partnership” defined as “a domestic partnership that (1) was formed effective on Aug. 3, 2007 and (2) produced in excess of 675,000 automobiles during the period beginning on Jan. 1, 2008 and ending on June 30, 2008.” The law allowed only Chrysler (no other entity could have fit such a narrow set of criteria) to “receive a cash payment of up to $30 million in exchange for forgoing (1) bonus depreciation and accelerated depreciation for “eligible qualified property” and (2) certain research credits” (Sec. 3081(b), PL 110-289). Since Chrysler had significant losses, depreciation and non-refundable credits were of no use to them, but the cash payment was. I’ll bet their lobbyist was well rewarded that year!
A gradual shift to lower (but still graduated) rates while eliminating the government’s ability to institute breaks to favored constituencies (which encourages corruption) is the only answer to this problem, and it should be gradual to avoid the inevitable “law of unintended consequences.” There are those who believe that the last major tax overhaul in 1987 was the proximate cause of the S&L crisis due to the passive activity rules which limited the deduction wealthy individuals could take on their real estate investments.

 

[whitehall]

We know what it means.

It means the wealthy should pay less taxes and the poor should pay more.

Everybody pays taxes. It's a lie to say they don't.

Next, they'll be shouting, "Let him die" or applauding executions. I know, that seems really far fetched with so many being Christian and all.

Should we "expand the base"?

Anybody notice how creepy rdean's posts are lately? Here's a sample: "Next they'll be shouting let nim die or applauding executions". Where did that come from?

 

[Vel]

Note how every time we discuss taxes people talk about closing loopholes?

Note also that every time I ask these folks "WHAT LOOPHOLE would you close?" nobody responds?


These morons think that changing the tax RATES = closing loopholes.

It doesn't.

Not remotely.

Rates have nothing to do with loopholes.

And no, if the rates change the US tax code is not going to be simplified.

It cannot be simplified because the US tax codes addresses issues surrounding compex questions about what is a justified deduction for each industry.

And it is in those CODES where the dreaded loopholes exist.

Those koopholes that all this boards self proclaiming TAX EXPERTS can't seem to indentify.


My poinht here?

Our fellow posters don't know what the fuck they are talking about.

They aren't not only not experts, they don't have fucking clue what they're talking about.

I'm sure there are a lot of changes to make to the tax code, but two that I would like to see are revoking the tax exempt status of so called "non-profits" and churches and putting a stop to all REFUNDABLE tax credits. If a tax credit gets someone down to zero, then so be it but stop sending them a refund.