Darin's Reflections On Spousal Friendship

[misterblu]

No - D thinks words 'Mean Something'.

A "Best Friend" is not 'a close friend' - it's somebody's BEST, Most-Trusted Friend - perhaps a body who knows things even one's SPOUSE doesn't.

I guess I don't have a 'best friend' by your definition.

 

[Joz]

Best friends are almost never neutral. Sorry, we may try to be, but we aren't.

You can't be entirely neutral if you have a relationship with either of the parties involved. Last time I checked, a friendship is a type of relationship.

Would you stop. I can't point you again!

 

[misterblu]

And herein is where Darin and I had a ten-minute discussion about the terms "best friend," "close friend," and what not.

When Darin says "Best Friend," he means "neutral, trusted confidant."

Darin is describing a counselor or other third party. Nobody is 100% neutral. They may try, but they're not.

 

[misterblu]

No - D thinks words 'Mean Something'.

You and Merriam Webster both. : :duh3:

 

[The ClayTaurus]

No - D thinks words 'Mean Something'.

A "Best Friend" is not 'a close friend' - it's somebody's BEST, Most-Trusted Friend - perhaps a body who knows things even one's SPOUSE doesn't.

There is no quality a best friend has that I wouldn't want my spouse to have. The appropriate comparison would be a square and a rectangle.

A square is a rectangle, but it's more special than just a rectangle. It's a rectangle plus more.

 

[misterblu]

There is no quality a best friend has that I wouldn't want my spouse to have. The appropriate comparison would be a square and a rectangle.

A square is a rectangle, but it's more special than just a rectangle. It's a rectangle plus more.

Exactly. Objects of the same classification.

 

[5stringJeff]

There is no quality a best friend has that I wouldn't want my spouse to have. The appropriate comparison would be a square and a rectangle.

A square is a rectangle, but it's more special than just a rectangle. It's a rectangle plus more.

Word. (no pun intended...)

 

[dmp]

I understand fully that your definition of a wife in a good marriage = best friend + more. That means that your wife, by definition, is your best friend. She is also more than that. One doesn't preclude the other. Neat how that works eh? :duh3:

Either way, it's just a word game.

No - it means she's NOT my Best Friend...she's MORE THAN my best friend.

It 'could' be just a word game to those who don't want to have to face the idea that marriages don't have to have a foundation of bestfriendship to be successfull. It could be just a word game to those who can't wrap their minds around the concept of the importance of moving WAY BEYOND mere friendship with their spouse. It could be just a word game to those who can't stand to break from the cliche or advice to "Marry your BEST FRIEND!" Calling one's spouse their "Best Friend" removes from the title of Husband or Wife soemthing very special and meaningful - it equates all non-married relationships, in some sense.

"Marry your BEST friend!" - that's advice which will lead to frustration. That's advice which places the important aspects of Marriage on ground with mere friendship and companionship. Marriage is SO MUCH FUCKING DEEPER and better and amazing than those. I bet if one were to marry somebody based on their best-frienship they'd have not much more than a roommate with benefits.

That's NOT a marriage. That's different.

Mary is my closest friend. That's a true statement but context must be provided.

First and most important is what 'closest' really mean. I suppose in this context closest actually means 'one who has the most intimate knowledge of who Darin is, at his core. It's noteworthy to say that does NOT mean she knows EVERYTHING about me, as there are likely dozens of people who know something about me which Mary may not know.

Secondly I suppose we should define 'friend'. Could we have hundreds of definitions of 'how' a friend acts? Certainly. How somebody acts and 'who' or 'what' somebody is may differ, however. IMO, a friend IS (not 'does') a person with strength of character and loyalty of some degree towards another. Now, the motivating factors of what drives that loyalty is irrelevant to the discussion (examples would be things like 'similar likes or hobbies').

Course, by that definition (if similar likes/hobbies) were a major contributing factor in a friendship then Mary may NOT be a friend, as she and I have no joint-participation hobbies.

Is mary my "Best Friend". No. I'm unsure if I HAVE a Best Friend because there is nobody with whom I share my most intimate details on a consistant basis, as well as hobbies, drinks, dinner, etc. I'd also be hesitant to label or name that person because it's sorta 7th Grade-esque.

I do have a confidant - a person who 'gets me' like none-other. With whom I can share very intimate, personal, relationship and other issues. That person is Mary - most of the time - but when it's not appropriate, I go to another.

 

[dmp]

There is no quality a best friend has that I wouldn't want my spouse to have. The appropriate comparison would be a square and a rectangle.

A square is a rectangle, but it's more special than just a rectangle. It's a rectangle plus more.

Now you are just playing word games. We use 'square' because it means something MORE than rectangle. Just as 'wife' means something MORE than 'best friend'. Perhaps by your and others' standards we should call all squares rectangles - without specifying the signifgance of a square?

 

[5stringJeff]

Now you are just playing word games. We use 'square' because it means something MORE than rectangle. Just as 'wife' means something MORE than 'best friend'. Perhaps by your and others' standards we should call all squares rectangles - without specifying the signifgance of a square?

I think Clay's point is that all squares are rectangles, even though they are also more than rectangles. In the same way, our spouses are meant to be our closest friends (as you outlined two posts above), and they are also meant to be more than friends (i.e. lovers, intimate, etc.).

 

[dmp]

I think Clay's point is that all squares are rectangles, even though they are also more than rectangles. In the same way, our spouses are meant to be our closest friends (as you outlined two posts above), and they are also meant to be more than friends (i.e. lovers, intimate, etc.).

I understand Clay's point - I find that link kind of insulting, actually. People are having trouble seperating 'closest friend' with somebody's "Best Friend."

:-/

 

[Nienna]

My husband is not my best friend, although he has told me that I am his. We have never been best friends. We have no hobbies in common, although we support each other in our interests. We were not attracted to each other by friendship. We were attracted to each other by sex.

I don't chat with my husband or tell him every little thing (actually, I think it gives him a headache when I talk too much, and I CAN talk A LOT! ). He likes to try to solve his problems on his own, although he often asks my advice. I get my chattiness out of my system with my girlfriends, my mom, my sisters, message boards, random people in the grocery store.

What, then, makes our marriage successful? I admire him. I look up to him because he is smart and a hard worker, because he is generous and humble and good-hearted. He takes his job of providing for the family seriously. He is protective of us. I can trust him to be there if I need him. I give him support, encouragement, ego boosts, and more hugs and kisses than he probably really wants.

We have a family together. Our differences mesh to form a balanced environment for the kids, and to be examples to one another. I learn about myself and about God through him, and I think he could say the same thing of me.

My husband kisses me in the morning before I've brushed my teeth. He farts in bed, and does things in the bathroom that I won't even attempt to describe here. He has witnessed the horrendous hemorrhoids I attained while giving birth to our 2nd child, stayed faithful to me through bloating, temporary crippled-ness, hormonal hatred, and I have loved him through his tempers and moods, compulsive spending and too many nights out with the guys. We share our lives. But I don't really think of him as "a friend."

So, Darin, I think I know what you're talking about.

 

[Abbey Normal]

...
It could be just a word game to those who can't stand to break from the cliche or advice to "Marry your BEST FRIEND!" Calling one's spouse their "Best Friend" removes from the title of Husband or Wife soemthing very special and meaningful - it equates all non-married relationships, in some sense.

"Marry your BEST friend!" - that's advice which will lead to frustration. That's advice which places the important aspects of Marriage on ground with mere friendship and companionship. Marriage is SO MUCH FUCKING DEEPER and better and amazing than those. I bet if one were to marry somebody based on their best-frienship they'd have not much more than a roommate with benefits.
...

The advice you quote is backwards. Most people don't marry their best friend. But in a great marriage, the person you marry often becomes your best friend. It's a very natural thing.

 

[dmp]

The advice you quote is backwards. Most people don't marry their best friend. But in a great marriage, the person you marry often becomes your best friend. It's a very natural thing.

or your closest friend..

 

[The ClayTaurus]

Now you are just playing word games. We use 'square' because it means something MORE than rectangle. Just as 'wife' means something MORE than 'best friend'. Perhaps by your and others' standards we should call all squares rectangles - without specifying the signifgance of a square?

That's not it at all. You fail to understand that I can say someone is my best friend and more. When I say "she's my best friend" that's not a limiting statement. That's not saying she's ONLY my bestfriend. In no way does it prohibit her from being more than my best friend. It simply acknowledges that she has all the qualities i would demand of my best friend. My square is also my rectangle.

In fact, I think I'm going to try that. Hey baby, did you know you're like a square? Wait no... I'm not saying you're fat.... no I'm not saying you're boring... wait... no...that was supposed to be a....balls.

And it's not a "game." I prefer "scrimmage." thanks. :

 

[The ClayTaurus]

I understand Clay's point - I find that link kind of insulting, actually. People are having trouble seperating 'closest friend' with somebody's "Best Friend."

:-/

But for many of us, "closest friend" and "best friend" are interchangeable.

 

[Abbey Normal]

or your closest friend..

Or your bestest closest friend?

 

[dmp]

But for many of us, "closest friend" and "best friend" are interchangeable.

Many of you need to stop then. Many of you might want to consider you are fighting the notion that ideally, one's spouse should not be their best friend because you may not want to think your relationship is less than ideal?

Aren't you single??

 

[The ClayTaurus]

Many of you need to stop then. Many of you might want to consider you are fighting the notion that ideally, one's spouse should not be their best friend because you may not want to think your relationship is less than ideal?

Huh? Rephrase, por favor.

Aren't you single??

All sorts of

 

[misterblu]

Many of you need to stop then. Many of you might want to consider you are fighting the notion that ideally, one's spouse should not be their best friend because you may not want to think your relationship is less than ideal?

Aren't you single??

Seriously dood. Nobody needs to 'stop' doing anything. If your marriage is all hunky-dorey and you're not best friends with your wife then good for you. Plenty of us are best friends with our spouses and are perfectly content as well.

I suspect that you are in the minority in your thinking on this subject. However, I wouldn't dream of telling you to 'stop' simply because your way of thinking doesn't work for me.