Danube Not Blue Now

[Baruch Menachem]

The area around the chernobyl plant has an exclusion zone of 30 miles. (50m)

You can do tours of the place, and the cities in the exclusion zone have been extensively vandalized.

The exclusion zone is forever.

There are four reactors at the plant, which mostly produced weapons materials in addition to electricity. The US only has one plant of this type, at Hanford, and it does not produce electricity.

Two of the Chernbyl reactors are still in use.

 

[zzzz]

Hungarian officials are saying the area should recover in a 3-5 years just like the cyanide conatmination in the Tisza area.

"Danube so blue,
so bright and blue,
through vale and field
you flow so calm,
our Vienna greets you,
your silver stream
through all the lands
you merry the heart
with your beautiful shores.
...
And in conclusion
brings even a greeting
to our love of the beautiful Danube River.
Whatever the day
may bring us,
Loyalty and unity
is to protect us all the time!" from the Blue Danube Waltz

 

[Baruch Menachem]

 

[westwall]

Folks should read accounts of the Chernobyl disaster. Very chilling. There is a bridge over the river and people stood in the middle to get a good view of the fire fighting. The problem was they were also looking directly at the reactor. They all died within days.

 

[boedicca]

I saw this a few days ago with a comment that it's like digging the Lincoln Tunnel with a teaspoon.

How awful for the people affected by this mess.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGfX6Eo5lsI]Danube[/ame]

 

[L.K.Eder]

big LOL on everyone who wants to blame socialism or soviets style socialism for this.

btw, mal, the companie's name is MAL, coinkidink?


the more i read the more i see it is CAPITALISM if any -ism which is to blame.

build big reservoirs for toxic shit unregulated, who cares how and where they are built (NIMBY), who makes inspections if the structure is still capable of containing said toxic shit?

shrug

tough shit for the surrounding villages if the levees are breached.

hey, at least they did not overflow.

 

[westwall]

big LOL on everyone who wants to blame socialism or soviets style socialism for this.

btw, mal, the companie's name is MAL, coinkidink?


the more i read the more i see it is CAPITALISM if any -ism which is to blame.

build big reservoirs for toxic shit unregulated, who cares how and where they are built (NIMBY), who makes inspections if the structure is still capable of containing said toxic shit?

shrug

tough shit for the surrounding villages if the levees are breached.

hey, at least they did not overflow.

The plant dates back to the 1960's. I think even you would have had a very hard time finding a capatalist there.

 

[L.K.Eder]

big LOL on everyone who wants to blame socialism or soviets style socialism for this.

btw, mal, the companie's name is MAL, coinkidink?


the more i read the more i see it is CAPITALISM if any -ism which is to blame.

build big reservoirs for toxic shit unregulated, who cares how and where they are built (NIMBY), who makes inspections if the structure is still capable of containing said toxic shit?

shrug

tough shit for the surrounding villages if the levees are breached.

hey, at least they did not overflow.

The plant dates back to the 1960's. I think even you would have had a very hard time finding a capatalist there.

what plant, are you in the right thread?

 

[L.K.Eder]

maybe westwall is now trying to find out what happened.

he won't find it on his denier-conspiracy-whacko-blogs.

but this topic certainly belongs to environment.

no wonder he had to comment on it.

 

[boedicca]

The company that owned the plant bought it from the failed Hungarian government. It was state operated before that.

 

[L.K.Eder]

what plant?

 

[Baruch Menachem]

We have been discussion the failure of a containment area at a Alumina processing plant. The tailings from the works, which date nearly 50 years, 30 of which were under socialist government with the plant owned by the government during that time, broke loose and left a tide of poison all over the surround ares and into the nearby rivers, which feed into the Danube, which explains Madeline's title.

Hungary was the first Soviet Client state to extensively privatize its industry, and you might argue that the failure was due to privatization. I won't agree, but it might be a valid argument. But the governments of Eastern europe were infamous for environmental damage.

Government usually is the worst polluter. There is a lot of worry about the way things are stored at Hanford even now.

 

[L.K.Eder]

We have been discussion the failure of a containment area at a Alumina processing plant. The tailings from the works, which date nearly 50 years, 30 of which were under socialist government with the plant owned by the government during that time, broke loose and left a tide of poison all over the surround ares and into the nearby rivers, which feed into the Danube, which explains Madeline's title.

Hungary was the first Soviet Client state to extensively privatize its industry, and you might argue that the failure was due to privatization. I won't agree, but it might be a valid argument. But the governments of Eastern europe were infamous for environmental damage.

Government usually is the worst polluter. There is a lot of worry about the way things are stored at Hanford even now.

thanks baruch for having the patience to spell all this out.

we have a private company that is responsible for the "plant", especially the reservoir.

responsible for this reservoir to reserve the matter it is designed to reserve. aka contain.

imagine the levees of lake pontchartrain, built who knows when. but no one is monitoring the condition of the levees.

do you blame it on clinton or on obama?

shit strike that.


do you blame it on the socialist system in which the plant was built, which put all its shit into the reservoir, or is the company that buys this thing liable.

how can anyone blame the socialist system that folded (it started in hungary in the summer of 89) for the state of a reservoir two decades later?

how?

just check into a US messageboard.

 

[L.K.Eder]

Apparently large levels of arsenic and mercury are in the sludge. It is the size of the gulf oil spill, some 35,-000,000 cubic feet. 150 people hospitalized and 5 dead so far. But this could go on for generations - these chemicals cause illnesses such as cancer so the long term effects on the region could be substantial. They re worried about it getting into the water supply.

This is horrifying. I am so angry...how could the Hungarian government permit such a hazard to accumulate?

The sludge is coming from an alumina processing plant that I believe is long defunct and a relic of the Warsaw Pact days of the Cold War. The Marcal river is dead. Utterly devoid of life. At last count over 2000 acres of farmland have been rendered unusable by the highly alkaline slurry. The death toll has also risen to 7.

This is a significant event and many more will happen I am afraid. This is one of those things that need to be cleaned up but won't because the money keeps being redirected to those who don't do anything with it but line their pockets.

Also this is not the fault of capatalism but socialism. Under the socialist system there were no pollution controls and no incentive to clean up toxic dumps, so they just accumulated. The same is true all over the Balkans.

super-retarded toxic post by wailing wall.

"this is not the fault of capatalism but socialism"

"i believe is long defunct"

 

[Baruch Menachem]

The levees that failed in LA were the responsibility of the US corps of engineers, a government agency. Happened on Bush's watch, so he gets the credit/blame.

Worst Levee failure here in Oregon was when an embankment owned by the Union Pacific RR failed.

You tried to blame the Capitalist system, which maybe had a failure in one company that was formerly government owned. (As was the case with the oil well in LA.) I would argue that management practices continue on unless noticed and changed. Eastern Europe has a miserable environmental record. Mostly damage caused by government managers.

Publicly owned Chinese plants are the worst environmental offenders in Asia as well.

I am pointing out a consistant pattern, which challenges your assumptions.

As bad as private industry gets, and they are only responsible when compelled to be so, to really mess things up requires the power of government.

It really is a matter of who is policing the polluter. If the polluter is private, the government can be a good cop, when the polluter is the government, the government has other agenda items that are more important.

 

[L.K.Eder]

The levees that failed in LA were the responsibility of the US corps of engineers, a government agency. Happened on Bush's watch, so he gets the credit/blame.

Worst Levee failure here in Oregon was when an embankment owned by the Union Pacific RR failed.

You tried to blame the Capitalist system, which maybe had a failure in one company that was formerly government owned. (As was the case with the oil well in LA.) I would argue that management practices continue on unless noticed and changed. Eastern Europe has a miserable environmental record. Mostly damage caused by government managers.

Publicly owned Chinese plants are the worst environmental offenders in Asia as well.

I am pointing out a consistant pattern, which challenges your assumptions.

As bad as private industry gets, and they are only responsible when compelled to be so, to really mess things up requires the power of government.

It really is a matter of who is policing the polluter. If the polluter is private, the government can be a good cop, when the polluter is the government, the government has other agenda items that are more important.

initially, when i wrote "my guess is capitalism", that was cynicism. fueled by the stereotypical excuses presented by the spokesman of the company (natural disaster).

my actual guess is that the reason for the breach is material fatigue. or overloading.

why?

to save money.

why save money?

in the aluminum business?

why at all?


phenol rivers in china are also not a sign of communism, btw.

 

[westwall]

maybe westwall is now trying to find out what happened.

he won't find it on his denier-conspiracy-whacko-blogs.

but this topic certainly belongs to environment.

no wonder he had to comment on it.

Of course it belongs in the environment section. I have been following it from the very beginning. And it is a far more damaging event then the Gulf oil spill. And as I said before it is the tip of the iceberg. There are hundreds of relics just like this that date back to the socialist era all over the Balkans. They all need to be rectified before more of this occurs. The private companies that have taken them over are for the most part incpable of dealing with the pollution left over from the socialist era. The US has issues like this as well where coal companies strip mined vast tracts of land and then abandoned the hole in the ground. Those people should have been prosecuted way back then but 6-70 years ago there was no recourse, they just declared bankruptcy and disappeared.

That is wrong but no one now has the funds to deal with those scars either.

 

[uscitizen]

This is all Obama's fault. Him and the damned EPA types.


Deregulation

 

[elvis]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SpvOUnz4T7Q[/ame]

 

[syrenn]

This is so sad.