DAMNED IF YOU DO, damned if you don't!

[Care4all]

there was a bill in congress several years ago that was supposed to(not sure if it would have or not) fix this mess, and the dems blocked it from even coming to a vote

dive?

this bill never even made it to the floor and brought up for a vote, WITH the republicans in power!!!

the dems didn't block it, it never even got out of Committee on to the chamber floor, where the republicans had the majority, for goodness sakes!!!!

TWO YEARS IN A ROW, the republicans did not bring it to the floor!!!

now, i don't know where you are getting your info from, but it is false....!!!!!

this is not to say one way or the other, on what dems would have done if it made it to the floor for a vote....? buttttt, it never made it there, the REPUBLICANS never brought the bill up!

A bill from the majority party that is never brought to the floor... is just intentionally USELESS... and ONLY DONE for some kind of partisan posturing!

care

 

[KittenKoder]

dive?

this bill never even made it to the floor and brought up for a vote, WITH the republicans in power!!!

the dems didn't block it, it never even got out of Committee on to the chamber floor, where the republicans had the majority, for goodness sakes!!!!

TWO YEARS IN A ROW, the republicans did not bring it to the floor!!!

now, i don't know where you are getting your info from, but it is false....!!!!!

this is not to say one way or the other, on what dems would have done if it made it to the floor for a vote....? buttttt, it never made it there, the REPUBLICANS never brought the bill up!

A bill from the majority party that is never brought to the floor... is just intentionally USELESS... and ONLY DONE for some kind of partisan posturing!

care

I am so tired of the blame game, but I must confess, the reps are to blame for this and many others. They block everything the dems try then say the dems are blocking them when the reps are really blocking themselves. Also, Bush (I know) has vetoed everything the dems manage to write up. So, even if the dems ideas were bad, we would never be able to find out. The fault here lies squarely on the reps this time, whether due to inaction or stupid action.

 

[DiveCon]

dive?

this bill never even made it to the floor and brought up for a vote, WITH the republicans in power!!!

the dems didn't block it, it never even got out of Committee on to the chamber floor, where the republicans had the majority, for goodness sakes!!!!

TWO YEARS IN A ROW, the republicans did not bring it to the floor!!!

now, i don't know where you are getting your info from, but it is false....!!!!!

this is not to say one way or the other, on what dems would have done if it made it to the floor for a vote....? buttttt, it never made it there, the REPUBLICANS never brought the bill up!

A bill from the majority party that is never brought to the floor... is just intentionally USELESS... and ONLY DONE for some kind of partisan posturing!

care

yeah, blocked by a democrat fillibuster

 

[DiveCon]

I am so tired of the blame game, but I must confess, the reps are to blame for this and many others. They block everything the dems try then say the dems are blocking them when the reps are really blocking themselves. Also, Bush (I know) has vetoed everything the dems manage to write up. So, even if the dems ideas were bad, we would never be able to find out. The fault here lies squarely on the reps this time, whether due to inaction or stupid action.

uh, the dems do that same damn thing

 

[Care4all]

well, "WE THE PEOPLE" need to get off our asses and get some local election reforms started
when they changed the senate to direct election it took the line of responsibility out of the equation
and the people that were supposed to put the senate in place, control how the elections are done
we need to have a 50% +1 system set up where if someone doesnt get 50%+1 they have a run off election between the top two candidates
that would allow people to take a chance on some 3rd party candidates and not have to risk electing the worse of the two by default

also all states really need to enact the same system that Maine and Nebraska have for dividing the EC votes by congressional district
(also with the 50%+1 system in each district)
then you will see some change

there isn't time for that dive!

We are being BAMBOOZLED right NOW....

and damnit to that!!!!!

the administration and both dems and repubs are in on it!!! not saying ALL, but many!!!!

we need more answers before this should even INCH FORWARD!

ALL OF US need to send an EMAIL NOW, right NOW to our senators and rep in congress and pelosi/reid, and minority leaders saying WHOA NELLIE to this....we need more info and oversight of what happened and why it happened before handing over our damn lives, burden to the taxman with no real benefit to us!!!!

 

[KittenKoder]

uh, the dems do that same damn thing

Not saying they don't, just saying this time around it is the reps fault. I don't like partisanship at all, if they'd stop siding with their own even when they make bad policies then maybe something good could get done.

 

[Care4all]

yeah, blocked by a democrat fillibuster

couldn't be filibustered if it never made it to the floor dive....?

i will see if i can find the link i read this on....it was yesterday, i will try to find it later on and post it...maybe i read it wrong, but don't believe soooo?

care

 

[KittenKoder]

there isn't time for that dive!

We are being BAMBOOZLED right NOW....

and damnit to that!!!!!

the administration and both dems and repubs are in on it!!! not saying ALL, but many!!!!

we need more answers before this should even INCH FORWARD!

ALL OF US need to send an EMAIL NOW, right NOW to our senators and rep in congress and pelosi/reid, and minority leaders saying WHOA NELLIE to this....we need more info and oversight of what happened and why it happened before handing over our damn lives, burden to the taxman with no real benefit to us!!!!

*smirk* A famous person once said: America needs an armed revolution every twenty years.

We missed at least two.

 

[DiveCon]

couldn't be filibustered if it never made it to the floor dive....?

i will see if i can find the link i read this on....it was yesterday, i will try to find it later on and post it...maybe i read it wrong, but don't believe soooo?

care

i wish i had saved the link i found earlier
because it DID make it to the floor and got fillibustered
all 44 dems did it
it was on party line votes for closure

 

[I Missthe North]

couldn't be filibustered if it never made it to the floor dive....?

i will see if i can find the link i read this on....it was yesterday, i will try to find it later on and post it...maybe i read it wrong, but don't believe soooo?

care

To be honest, I have read from numerous sources that the Dems managed to kill the bill before it ever made it to the floor, but at the same time, I don't see how is Republican controlled congress (I would not attest to the credibility of the sources). If the Reps really wanted to implement the bill, they had the means to. Honestly, I think it is just a way for Reps to feel better about the situation and push the blame back onto the Dems. Everyone wants to play the blame game right now; taking responsibility for failure is not acceptable in congress anymore. Our politicians are a bunch of cowards (on both sides).

 

[DiveCon]

there isn't time for that dive!

We are being BAMBOOZLED right NOW....

and damnit to that!!!!!

the administration and both dems and repubs are in on it!!! not saying ALL, but many!!!!

we need more answers before this should even INCH FORWARD!

ALL OF US need to send an EMAIL NOW, right NOW to our senators and rep in congress and pelosi/reid, and minority leaders saying WHOA NELLIE to this....we need more info and oversight of what happened and why it happened before handing over our damn lives, burden to the taxman with no real benefit to us!!!!

yeah, it wont get here soon enough

just like the dems kept saying about drilling in ANWR in the 90's
"it will take 10 years to get here"

well, you bunch of dumbasses(dems in congress), if you had approved it 15 years ago, we'd have it NOW

 

[KittenKoder]

To be honest, I have read from numerous sources that the Dems managed to kill the bill before it ever made it to the floor, but at the same time, I don't see how is Republican controlled congress (I would not attest to the credibility of the sources). If the Reps really wanted to implement the bill, they had the means to. Honestly, I think it is just a way for Reps to feel better about the situation and push the blame back onto the Dems. Everyone wants to play the blame game right now; taking responsibility for failure is not acceptable in congress anymore. Our politicians are a bunch of cowards (on both sides).

Not only taking responsibility but working toward an actual solution. As long as they keep playing the blame game nothing will get done.

 

[DiveCon]

Not only taking responsibility but working toward an actual solution. As long as they keep playing the blame game nothing will get done.

working together towards a solution hasnt happened since about the begining of 2002 and it was poor prior to that as well
that is why we need comprehensive election reforms and those need to be done by the state governments
you need to contact your local state reps and get them to work on it

 

[Care4all]

To be honest, I have read from numerous sources that the Dems managed to kill the bill before it ever made it to the floor, but at the same time, I don't see how is Republican controlled congress (I would not attest to the credibility of the sources). If the Reps really wanted to implement the bill, they had the means to. Honestly, I think it is just a way for Reps to feel better about the situation and push the blame back onto the Dems. Everyone wants to play the blame game right now; taking responsibility for failure is not acceptable in congress anymore. Our politicians are a bunch of cowards (on both sides).

FIND me anything that says that and i will accept it....i haven't seen that in print in my googles, but will continue to search...

i did find some things that shows otherwise which i will link up on my response with dive....

care

 

[ABikerSailor]

I am so tired of the blame game, but I must confess, the reps are to blame for this and many others. They block everything the dems try then say the dems are blocking them when the reps are really blocking themselves. Also, Bush (I know) has vetoed everything the dems manage to write up. So, even if the dems ideas were bad, we would never be able to find out. The fault here lies squarely on the reps this time, whether due to inaction or stupid action.

What you said Kitten is absolutely true. People say "it's not Bush Jr.'s fault, them dirty Dems are the ones in charge", but, they keep forgetting what it is the President does.....sign bills into LAW. Without his signature, it doesn't go anywhere.

But, I don't think it is that the Republicans are blocking themselves, it's more like they are blinded by greed, and don't know where they are going. A Taoist once said "if you cannot see it from where you are standing, then where will you go in search of it?" Which is to say, since they are blinded by PMS (Power, Money, Sex), they have absolutely no clue as to how the rest of the country is.

BTW y'all......Obama is not an elitist. McInsane is. I mean.....how many of you actually have 7 houses and 13 cars? You can only drive one at a time, and WTF do people need to have several houses for? Investments and rental properties, maybe, but to LIVE? You can't be in more than one place at a time, at least, not if you're human.

 

[KittenKoder]

Both have major flaws, we are screwed no matter which wins. I'd say vote for another but then, they never win.

 

[DiveCon]

Both have major flaws, we are screwed no matter which wins. I'd say vote for another but then, they never win.

thats why we need comprehensive election reforms, and those are done by the STATES

 

[Care4all]

i wish i had saved the link i found earlier
because it DID make it to the floor and got fillibustered
all 44 dems did it
it was on party line votes for closure

i think you are confusing this 2005 bill with the gram biley leach amendment of deregulation that was voted down by 44 dems in 1999?

here's what i found:

S. 190 [109th]: Federal Housing Enterprise Regulatory Reform Act of 2005 (GovTrack.us)

S. 190 [109th]: Federal Housing Enterprise Regulatory Reform Act of 2005
A bill to address the regulation of secondary mortgage market enterprises, and for other purposes.

Overview
Sponsor: Sen. Charles Hagel [R-NE]show cosponsors (3)
Cosponsors [as of 2007-01-08]
Sen. Elizabeth Dole [R-NC]
Sen. John McCain [R-AZ]
Sen. John Sununu [R-NH]

Status: Introduced Jan 26, 2005
Scheduled for Debate -
Voted on in Senate -
Voted on in House -
Signed by President -

This bill never became law. This bill was proposed in a previous session of Congress. Sessions of Congress last two years, and at the end of each session all proposed bills and resolutions that haven't passed are cleared from the books.

Last Action: Jul 28, 2005: Committee on Banking, Housing, and Urban Affairs. Ordered to be reported with an amendment in the nature of a substitute favorably.

explanation of term: ordered to be reported with an amendment in the nature of a substitute favorably:



What Does “Ordered to be reported with an amendment in the nature of a substitute favorably” mean? : GovTrack.us



So, from reading about all of this on s190, it appears that it was never brought up to be voted on, where the dems could have the opportunity to filibuster....look at the blanks in the status of it, which i highlighted above in bold....

It was never brought to a vote, though it does seem like it was introduced on the floor by hagel, it just may not have been submitted twice, which is what it takes to get a vote...and this is the duty of the majority party...

but as i said, who knows if the dems would have filibustered it if it made it to a vote, or not....we won't ever know because it never came up for a vote.

 

[I Missthe North]

thats why we need comprehensive election reforms, and those are done by the STATES

I concur with you on that point. I like the British system personally. At least there is a possibility of third parties having some sort of serious political clout. The current system has severely limited the voice of the American people and it is time things changed. Now if only we could get others to see things that way.

 

[DiveCon]

I concur with you on that point. I like the British system personally. At least there is a possibility of third parties having some sort of serious political clout. The current system has severely limited the voice of the American people and it is time things changed. Now if only we could get others to see things that way.

i wouldnt go with anything remotely like the system the brits use
that is utter chaos
look at how its going in Canada, they are having their 4 election in 3 years now
thats utter insannity
i'd rather we keep the basic system we have and make it easier for 3rd party candidates
thats why we need 50% +1 enacted and the EC votes divided by congressional district
with 50%+1, you have the option to vote 3rd party and as long as no one gets over 50%, you have another shot to keep the worst guy out
and sometimes the 3rd party candidate would be the #2 candidate for the runoff
that makes a whole lot more sense than to go with the nutty system the cunnucks have