Current lies about Ebola.

[Zoom-boing]

Let me see if I can help you out.

In spite of the endless, overwhelmingly redundant stream of "news" coverage I remain utterly ignorant concerning the way this insidious bug is transmitted.

When the first identified case was announced we were told infection required physical contact with a carrier who is manifesting symptoms. So far I've read and heard about three infected individuals each of whom had relatively limited contact with the carrier. But I haven't heard anything about those who had the most intimate contact with him.

Thomas Duncan spent several days in the same apartment with a woman friend and her two daughters. These people were closely familiar with Duncan and presumably engaged in some level of physical contact (familial hugging and kissing) with him. He slept in that apartment, vomited and toileted in that apartment. His soiled clothing and bedding items remained in that apartment for days and were handled by the occupants. He vomited on a nearby sidewalk and that was cleaned up by a janitor.

Thus far I haven't heard a word about any of those most closely exposed individuals. Is it because the endless bombardment of redundant reportage has caused me to tune out? If so, has anyone else here heard anything about Duncan's host and her daughters?

Where are they? Have they manifested any symptoms? If not, that would suggest some natural immunity. Yet, no mention of them.

Infection does require intimate contact. Not only that but one must be in contact with bodily fluids.

The people who became infected from him had direct intimate contact with him as they were his nurses up until his death.

His family members, as you correctly pointed out, had VERY intimate contact with him but the difference is that it was early in his sickness. As the scientists, and virologists at the CDC point out that the disease becomes more contagious as it progresses. They aren't sick because it was early in his disease. That is why they are correct in saying that you can't get infected by being on an airplane or bus or in the same room as a patient who has it. At least until they are bleeding from everywhere anyway.

It isn't a natural immunity, it's just that the disease isn't infectious until the symptoms show and even then it's not that infectious until the patient is gravely I'll.

Did that help?

What if the sick person is running a temp, sweating profusely, not knowing they have it? Sweat is a bodily fluid.

 

[PredFan]

Lie #5:

Stopping travel to and from the affected countries will make the epidemic worse.

If you hear this, know that the person saying it is an idiot. The first rule of fighting an epidemic is containment. When we have people in the hospital with an infectious disease, we put them in isolation. We do not allow them to mingle with the other patient population. In most cases we don't even allow the caregivers to care for any other patient at the same time.

NO ONE is saying stop supplies and medical personnel from going to and from the affected countries. We mean commercial travel. Saying stopping commercial flights from those countries will make it worse is absurd in the extreme. That's like me saying if I don't let my isolation patient walk around the hospital, his infectious disease will get worse. It's nonsense.

The head of the CDC said this. The guy in charge, head honco.

Number one guy in charge of this is an idiot.

That he is and wait until the idiot Obama chose to be the Ebola Czar starts talking!

 

[percysunshine]

Ok...I am calling bullshit.

You claim that it is a lie that the CDC does not know what it's doing, and yet, in the same post, you claim that they fucked up royally.

Explain this.

.

You didn't read the whole thing did you?

Every word.

.

Well, you missed this part though:

"The fact that the statement is too broad is what makes it false. The CDC is correct about some things, but has certainly made mistakes."

Sooo... if they are total fuck ups half the time, but the smartest guys in the room the other half of the time, this means they know what they are doing?

Not really. It means they are dysfunctional.

We are talking about a 70% mortality rate virus.

.

.

If the world exists in absolutes in your mind, you will have a difficult time.

At a 70% mortality rate, my trust in people who fuck up is .... thin.

.

 

[PredFan]

Let me see if I can help you out.

In spite of the endless, overwhelmingly redundant stream of "news" coverage I remain utterly ignorant concerning the way this insidious bug is transmitted.

When the first identified case was announced we were told infection required physical contact with a carrier who is manifesting symptoms. So far I've read and heard about three infected individuals each of whom had relatively limited contact with the carrier. But I haven't heard anything about those who had the most intimate contact with him.

Thomas Duncan spent several days in the same apartment with a woman friend and her two daughters. These people were closely familiar with Duncan and presumably engaged in some level of physical contact (familial hugging and kissing) with him. He slept in that apartment, vomited and toileted in that apartment. His soiled clothing and bedding items remained in that apartment for days and were handled by the occupants. He vomited on a nearby sidewalk and that was cleaned up by a janitor.

Thus far I haven't heard a word about any of those most closely exposed individuals. Is it because the endless bombardment of redundant reportage has caused me to tune out? If so, has anyone else here heard anything about Duncan's host and her daughters?

Where are they? Have they manifested any symptoms? If not, that would suggest some natural immunity. Yet, no mention of them.

Infection does require intimate contact. Not only that but one must be in contact with bodily fluids.

The people who became infected from him had direct intimate contact with him as they were his nurses up until his death.

His family members, as you correctly pointed out, had VERY intimate contact with him but the difference is that it was early in his sickness. As the scientists, and virologists at the CDC point out that the disease becomes more contagious as it progresses. They aren't sick because it was early in his disease. That is why they are correct in saying that you can't get infected by being on an airplane or bus or in the same room as a patient who has it. At least until they are bleeding from everywhere anyway.

It isn't a natural immunity, it's just that the disease isn't infectious until the symptoms show and even then it's not that infectious until the patient is gravely I'll.

Did that help?

What if the sick person is running a temp, sweating profusely, not knowing they have it? Sweat is a bodily fluid.

Are they out in public? If they are ambulatory and have a fever and are sweating, they are early in their disease and thus not very contagious. That is why Duncan's family doesn't have it.

 

[PredFan]

You didn't read the whole thing did you?

Every word.

.

Well, you missed this part though:

"The fact that the statement is too broad is what makes it false. The CDC is correct about some things, but has certainly made mistakes."

Sooo... if they are total fuck ups half the time, but the smartest guys in the room the other half of the time, this means they know what they are doing?

Not really. It means they are dysfunctional.

We are talking about a 70% mortality rate virus.

.

.

If the world exists in absolutes in your mind, you will have a difficult time.

At a 70% mortality rate, my trust in people who fuck up is .... thin.

.

Understood, but are you just going to go with lies then?

 

[PredFan]

A good way to sift through the lies is to use common sense. You don't have to be a virologist. Allowing travel from affected countries makes no sense to anyone, that is obvious bull shit. The CDC's claim that Ebola isn't infectious until the symptoms appear fits exactly with the facts as we know them. Despite the fact that the CDC stupidly allowed a symptomatic person to fly, their claim about ebola's contagiousness makes sense and is true.

 

[percysunshine]

Every word.

.

Well, you missed this part though:

"The fact that the statement is too broad is what makes it false. The CDC is correct about some things, but has certainly made mistakes."

Sooo... if they are total fuck ups half the time, but the smartest guys in the room the other half of the time, this means they know what they are doing?

Not really. It means they are dysfunctional.

We are talking about a 70% mortality rate virus.

.

.

If the world exists in absolutes in your mind, you will have a difficult time.

At a 70% mortality rate, my trust in people who fuck up is .... thin.

.

Understood, but are you just going to go with lies then?

The statement you proposed as a lie, is not a lie, unless, of course, you can get Bill Clinton to parse the word 'it'. In which case, you may be able to get half of the US Senate on your side.

.

 

[PredFan]

Well, you missed this part though:

"The fact that the statement is too broad is what makes it false. The CDC is correct about some things, but has certainly made mistakes."

Sooo... if they are total fuck ups half the time, but the smartest guys in the room the other half of the time, this means they know what they are doing?

Not really. It means they are dysfunctional.

We are talking about a 70% mortality rate virus.

.

.

If the world exists in absolutes in your mind, you will have a difficult time.

At a 70% mortality rate, my trust in people who fuck up is .... thin.

.

Understood, but are you just going to go with lies then?

The statement you proposed as a lie, is not a lie, unless, of course, you can get Bill Clinton to parse the word 'it'. In which case, you may be able to get half of the US Senate on your side.

.

I pointed out to you exactly how it was a lie. You have not shown how it wasn't.

 

[PredFan]

Bumping this thread because apparently many people haven't seen it. Most of these lies are still being spread.

 

[PredFan]

Back to lie #3 since that one is being thrown around as I type this:

There were 70+ doctors, nurses, and ancillary staff that were involved in the care of Mr.Duncan before he died. It is a fact that when a person is in the most critical stages of the disease, he/she is the most infectious. All of the patients bodily fluids are teeming with the virus. The patient is a virtual Petri dish.

70+ people at a high risk of contracting the disease but only two get infected. This is not a result of poor or absent protocols, this is NOT the fault if the CDC, nor is it the hospital's fault. It was human error. It was sloppiness and carelessness of the two nurses.

Still don't want to believe it? Then take this into consideration: one of the nurses who knew that she was taking care of a patient who had Ebola, and knew that the patient was highly infectious, and also knew that she was coming down with a fever, boarded a plane anyway, knowing that she could possibly be exposing others to the disease. What kind of nurse would do that? A careless and likely clueless one. The kind that would be careless with isolation protocol.

 

[ClosedCaption]

I'm shocked that someone could make mistakes with a virus they havent dealt with before...I mean, its like, who doesnt know how to do something without mistakes the first time they encounter it.

 

[PredFan]

I'm shocked that someone could make mistakes with a virus they havent dealt with before...I mean, its like, who doesnt know how to do something without mistakes the first time they encounter it.

The problem is that you don't read. You respond according to the first sentence of a post and what you know of the poster's politics. This is why you are wrong on 99% of the posts you make.

If you have read this far let me explain something that you are missing: Ebola isn't the only virus that exists in the world, there have been viruses here in the US probably since there were humans here. Our hospital have been dealing with viruses forever. We have isolation procedures in all of our hospitals, many of them are for viruses more contagious than Ebola. To say that they didn't know how to protect themselves from Ebola is as stupid as saying that you can't drive a Buick, because you only drove Fords and Chevys before.

 

[ClosedCaption]

I'm shocked that someone could make mistakes with a virus they havent dealt with before...I mean, its like, who doesnt know how to do something without mistakes the first time they encounter it.

The problem is that you don't read. You respond according to the first sentence of a post and what you know of the poster's politics. This is why you are wrong on 99% of the posts you make.

This should be good, that was one hell of a intro

If you have read this far let me explain something that you are missing: Ebola isn't the only virus that exists in the world, there have been viruses here in the US probably since there were humans here.

Ok, I think you arent talking to me anymore unless you believe I said something about this being the first virus evar. I didnt...but continue

Our hospital have been dealing with viruses forever. We have isolation procedures in all of our hospitals, many of them are for viruses more contagious than Ebola. To say that they didn't know how to protect themselves from Ebola is as stupid as saying that you can't drive a Buick, because you only drove Fords and Chevys before.

Oh right, so hospitals know how to deal with all viruses past and future because they deal with viruses now.

Well thats a mighty huge assumption that I dont subscribe to. A better comparison is driving a car your whole life and then assuming you know how to ride a motorcycle just because they both have wheels.

Ebola is different and all I'm saying is that when you deal with something new...you're bound to make mistakes. Maybe you feel the opposite *shrug*

 

[PredFan]

I'm shocked that someone could make mistakes with a virus they havent dealt with before...I mean, its like, who doesnt know how to do something without mistakes the first time they encounter it.

The problem is that you don't read. You respond according to the first sentence of a post and what you know of the poster's politics. This is why you are wrong on 99% of the posts you make.

This should be good, that was one hell of a intro

If you have read this far let me explain something that you are missing: Ebola isn't the only virus that exists in the world, there have been viruses here in the US probably since there were humans here.

Ok, I think you arent talking to me anymore unless you believe I said something about this being the first virus evar. I didnt...but continue

Our hospital have been dealing with viruses forever. We have isolation procedures in all of our hospitals, many of them are for viruses more contagious than Ebola. To say that they didn't know how to protect themselves from Ebola is as stupid as saying that you can't drive a Buick, because you only drove Fords and Chevys before.

Oh right, so hospitals know how to deal with all viruses past and future because they deal with viruses now.

Well thats a mighty huge assumption that I dont subscribe to. A better comparison is driving a car your whole life and then assuming you know how to ride a motorcycle just because they both have wheels.

Ebola is different and all I'm saying is that when you deal with something new...you're bound to make mistakes. Maybe you feel the opposite *shrug*

Ebola is genetically very slightly different. The point is that Ebola isn't magical, it doesn't have super powers, it obeys the laws of physics and biology. Ebola kills quicker and more effectively than other viruses, but it isn't nearly as contagious as influenza or even Herpes. It cannot penetrate rubber, nylon, or latex, it cannot even penetrate human skin.

Your post is implying that I am wrong to blame the nurses for their infection. I would ask you a question then: there were 70+ people who took care of Duncan in one way or another until his death. How come only two were infected? If it was a procedural or equipment error, how come there arent' more infected? I'll answer that for you: the two nurses fucked up.

 

[ClosedCaption]

Your post is implying that I am wrong to blame the nurses for their infection. I would ask you a question then: there were 70+ people who took care of Duncan in one way or another until his death. How come only two were infected? If it was a procedural or equipment error, how come there arent' more infected? I'll answer that for you: the two nurses fucked up.

No I actually agree with you but just like with anything new mistakes will be made. I think the difference is that I call them mistakes and you call them fuck ups but I think we both agree that they didnt act properly

 

[Political Junky]

Darrell Issa confuses Guyana [which is in South America] with Guinea [which is in Africa]. There are lies and then there is ignorance.
Peter King says Ebola has mutated to an airborne virus.
The Rachel Maddow Show on msnbc

 

[PredFan]

Heard some new BS about Ebola just this morning. Someone on the radio was saying that the CDC has changed its mind and is saying that Ebola is in fact airborne. The is not true.

Where this person is confused is because they don't understand that droplets are not airborne. The Ebola virus can exist in water droplets, but water droplets cannot drift around in the air. They are too heavy. The very real fact that you can catch the virus if someone sneezes, does not make it airborne. This person would have to sneeze ON YOU. Particles, droplets, large enough to hold the virus, are too large to travel more than a few feet.

The Ebola virus does not have wings people.

 

[PredFan]

Something else that people who should know better keep saying. It's being said that hospitals in this country can't handle an Ebola patient.

I'm am assuming that most, if not all hospitals in the US are like the ones I work at here. You would likely not have heard of these hospitals because they are not famous. Yet, all if them have Ebola policies on board and are fully prepared for our first case.

Caring for an Ebola patient wouldn't be difficult. We have the proper masks, face shields, hazmat suits, boots and gloves. We even have rooms that have sealed ventilation systems for airborne viruses. That won't be necessary as Ebola is not airborne. We have had them for many years, even decades. We do not have the serums or blood if surviving patients here so in all likelihood we would prepare the patient for transport.

To answer the obvious question: yes, I would take care if an Ebola patient. No problem. I just would be very careful about my isolation protocol.

To say hospitals in the US are unprepared is wrong. It is an irresponsible lie.

 

[barryqwalsh]

Are You Being Served? Season 8 Episode 1 - Is It …:

 

[Rank Your Leader]

Let us just put it this way.. If you have Ebola.. We are not friends for the mean time..