Coup Government Strikes Out: The Warlords Of Kiev...

[Dschrute3]

Just thought i would present a different perspective on Ukraine. I know most Americans have been conditioned to believe that the chaos there is all Putin and Russia's fault, but there's actually two sides to the story. The US/Western-backed illegal Coup in Kiev has unleashed bloody chaos.

The warlords of Kiev are going on the offensive, violating the terms of the Minsk peace accords, and attacking separatist rebels in the eastern part of the country in a desperate bid to provoke open conflict with Russia. What motivates them is fear of President Donald Trump, who has often expressed a desire to “get along with Russia” and who has openly said Ukraine is not a vital US national security interest. What motivates their new aggression is the possibility that the US subsidies that have kept their vicious war on their own people going – 10,000 killed so far – will dry up.

Ever since US and European Union-backed shock troops overthrew the democratically elected government of President Viktor Yanukovych, the coup leaders in Kiev have waged a relentless war against their rebellious subjects in the east. As “President” Petro Poroshenko put it: We will have jobs, they won’t! We will have pensions, they won’t! We will have benefits for retirees and children, they won’t! Our kids will go to schools and daycares, their kids will sit in the basements! They can’t do anything about it… And only this is how we will win this war!..

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The Warlords of Kiev

 

[Dschrute3]

These violent cretins are our 'Good Friends' now. What a foreign policy. Will we ever end this endless intervention foreign policy?

 

[busybee01]

A Putin propagandist. The Ukraine has the right to get it's territory back. There is no such thing as separatists. The so-called separatists are Russians masquerading as separatists. The fact is that Putin is expanding his sphere of influence as we speak. He is backing violent coups in Eastern Europe, allying with Iran in the middle east, and backing Russia sympathetic movements in France and Germany just as he did in the US. The top commander in Afghanistan testified
that Russia and Iran are working to undermine the US mission in Afghanistan.

 

[Dschrute3]

A Putin propagandist. The Ukraine has the right to get it's territory back. There is no such thing as separatists. The so-called separatists are Russians masquerading as separatists. The fact is that Putin is expanding his sphere of influence as we speak. He is backing violent coups in Eastern Europe, allying with Iran in the middle east, and backing Russia sympathetic movements in France and Germany just as he did in the US. The top commander in Afghanistan testified
that Russia and Iran are working to undermine the US mission in Afghanistan.

Not really taking either side. I'm just pointing out that the US/Western-backed illegal Coup in Kiev was what set the chaos off. There are two sides to the story.

 

[Tehon]

A Putin propagandist. The Ukraine has the right to get it's territory back. There is no such thing as separatists. The so-called separatists are Russians masquerading as separatists. The fact is that Putin is expanding his sphere of influence as we speak. He is backing violent coups in Eastern Europe, allying with Iran in the middle east, and backing Russia sympathetic movements in France and Germany just as he did in the US. The top commander in Afghanistan testified
that Russia and Iran are working to undermine the US mission in Afghanistan.

How can you bitch about what Putin may or may not be doing in a country on Russia's border that you destabilized? And why are we even still in Afghanistan?

 

[busybee01]

Putin is the one destabilizing Ukraine. His goal is to replace governments in Eastern Europe with Moscow sympathetic leaders. Hacked e-mails from one of Putin's top aides show that the movement is controlled entirely by Putin.

 

[Tehon]

Putin is the one destabilizing Ukraine. His goal is to replace governments in Eastern Europe with Moscow sympathetic leaders. Hacked e-mails from one of Putin's top aides show that the movement is controlled entirely by Putin.

Does "Fuck the EU" mean anything to you?

 

[Dschrute3]

A Putin propagandist. The Ukraine has the right to get it's territory back. There is no such thing as separatists. The so-called separatists are Russians masquerading as separatists. The fact is that Putin is expanding his sphere of influence as we speak. He is backing violent coups in Eastern Europe, allying with Iran in the middle east, and backing Russia sympathetic movements in France and Germany just as he did in the US. The top commander in Afghanistan testified
that Russia and Iran are working to undermine the US mission in Afghanistan.

How can you bitch about what Putin may or may not be doing in a country on Russia's border that you destabilized? And why are we even still in Afghanistan?

Yes, the US/Western-backed illegal Coup in Kiev set off this chaos. But most Americans don't realize that. They've been so propagandized to believe it was all Putin and Russia's fault.

 

[Dschrute3]

Putin is the one destabilizing Ukraine. His goal is to replace governments in Eastern Europe with Moscow sympathetic leaders. Hacked e-mails from one of Putin's top aides show that the movement is controlled entirely by Putin.

Does "Fuck the EU" mean anything to you?

Means a lot to me. Here, i'll be more blunt... FUCK THE EU!!!

 

[Stratford57]

Even Western Media starts paying some attention now:

It’s not just Russian aggression that the Trump presidency has stirred up, analysts say. Kiev, too, has become less inclined to compromise as it has grown more uncertain about Washington’s policy toward the conflict.

Now, one week on, Ukrainian forces have solidified their defenses and moved forward the sort of heavy weaponry, including battle tanks, that was supposed to be removed from the front lines as part of the Minsk II Agreement.

Since last abandoning its policy of disengagement last fall, Ukraine has been making increasingly frequent incursions into the “gray zone” — the no man’s land between government and separatist forces along the front line that the two sides have fought over since the signing of the first failed peace agreement in September 2014.

Ukraine, Putin said, “needs money right now and you can best get money from the EU … the U.S., and financial institutions if you portray yourself as a victim of aggression.”

Before Trump’s election, Kiev’s terms had been clear: Ukraine would not make political concessions in areas like local elections for the separatist regions until Russia and the separatists had removed heavy weapons from the front and given Kiev back control of the eastern border with Russia.

Making Minsk work has always been easier said than done. Despite Trump’s election — and with it, the potential of reduced support from Washington — the Ukrainian public and political elite remain reluctant to make any kind of deal in eastern Ukraine.

On Dec. 29, influential Ukrainian oligarch Viktor Pinchuk set off a firestorm in Kiev by arguing in the op-ed section of the Wall Street Journal that Ukraine needed to make “painful compromises for peace” with Russian-backed separatists, including not letting Crimea “get in the way” of a peace deal, holding elections in the occupied territories, and abandoning Ukraine’s aspirations to become a member of the European Union. The article provoked a backlash from Ukrainian elected officials and pundits who called Pinchuk “pro-Putin” and quickly turned the businessman and his associates into political pariahs.

Nadiya Savchenko, a Ukrainian pilot who was held in prison for two years in Russia on politically motivated charges and championed as a Ukrainian hero during her detention, was denounced as a traitor by hard-liners in January for suggesting that the “only peaceful solution” to the conflict in the east would involve Ukraine putting Crimea “on the back burner” in order to regain the separatist-controlled areas of eastern Ukraine.

“By the winter of 2015-16, there was no longer a group that would speak in support of a peaceful resolution,” said Mikhail Minakov, president of the Foundation for Good Politics and a professor at Kyiv-Mohyla Academy.

All of this presents a troubling picture of what the war in eastern Ukraine may become without Washington — and the Ukraine coalition it has led — involved in the peace process. Former Vice President Joe Biden, who handled the Ukraine portfolio for the White House and communicated regularly with Poroshenko,

But the fighting in eastern Ukraine is complex and as much driven by domestic as international factors. “Right now,” Minakov said, “there is no party of peace in Ukraine.”

Foreign Policy Journal
Kiev Is Fueling the War in Eastern Ukraine, Too

And Pinchuk was the one, donating a lot of money to Hillary's campaign:

Between 2009 and 2013, including when Mrs. Clinton was secretary of state, the Clinton Foundation received at least $8.6 million from the Victor Pinchuk Foundation, according to that foundation, which is based in Kiev, Ukraine. It was created by Mr. Pinchuk, whose fortune stems from a pipe-making company. He served two terms as an elected member of the Ukrainian Parliament and is a proponent of closer ties between Ukraine and the European Union.
UKRAINE

 

[montelatici]

The U.S. orchestrated and supported the coup against the democratically elected government of Ukraine. This phone conversation between U.S. State Department coup leader Victoria Nuland and the U.S. ambassador to Ukraine deciding on who they will put in as prime minister for the unelected anti-Russian/pro-U.S. revolutionary government.

 

[Dschrute3]

Even Western Media starts paying some attention now:

It’s not just Russian aggression that the Trump presidency has stirred up, analysts say. Kiev, too, has become less inclined to compromise as it has grown more uncertain about Washington’s policy toward the conflict.

Now, one week on, Ukrainian forces have solidified their defenses and moved forward the sort of heavy weaponry, including battle tanks, that was supposed to be removed from the front lines as part of the Minsk II Agreement.

Since last abandoning its policy of disengagement last fall, Ukraine has been making increasingly frequent incursions into the “gray zone” — the no man’s land between government and separatist forces along the front line that the two sides have fought over since the signing of the first failed peace agreement in September 2014.

Ukraine, Putin said, “needs money right now and you can best get money from the EU … the U.S., and financial institutions if you portray yourself as a victim of aggression.”

Before Trump’s election, Kiev’s terms had been clear: Ukraine would not make political concessions in areas like local elections for the separatist regions until Russia and the separatists had removed heavy weapons from the front and given Kiev back control of the eastern border with Russia.

Making Minsk work has always been easier said than done. Despite Trump’s election — and with it, the potential of reduced support from Washington — the Ukrainian public and political elite remain reluctant to make any kind of deal in eastern Ukraine.

On Dec. 29, influential Ukrainian oligarch Viktor Pinchuk set off a firestorm in Kiev by arguing in the op-ed section of the Wall Street Journal that Ukraine needed to make “painful compromises for peace” with Russian-backed separatists, including not letting Crimea “get in the way” of a peace deal, holding elections in the occupied territories, and abandoning Ukraine’s aspirations to become a member of the European Union. The article provoked a backlash from Ukrainian elected officials and pundits who called Pinchuk “pro-Putin” and quickly turned the businessman and his associates into political pariahs.

Nadiya Savchenko, a Ukrainian pilot who was held in prison for two years in Russia on politically motivated charges and championed as a Ukrainian hero during her detention, was denounced as a traitor by hard-liners in January for suggesting that the “only peaceful solution” to the conflict in the east would involve Ukraine putting Crimea “on the back burner” in order to regain the separatist-controlled areas of eastern Ukraine.

“By the winter of 2015-16, there was no longer a group that would speak in support of a peaceful resolution,” said Mikhail Minakov, president of the Foundation for Good Politics and a professor at Kyiv-Mohyla Academy.

All of this presents a troubling picture of what the war in eastern Ukraine may become without Washington — and the Ukraine coalition it has led — involved in the peace process. Former Vice President Joe Biden, who handled the Ukraine portfolio for the White House and communicated regularly with Poroshenko,

But the fighting in eastern Ukraine is complex and as much driven by domestic as international factors. “Right now,” Minakov said, “there is no party of peace in Ukraine.”

Foreign Policy Journal
Kiev Is Fueling the War in Eastern Ukraine, Too

And Pinchuk was the one, donating a lot of money to Hillary's campaign:

Between 2009 and 2013, including when Mrs. Clinton was secretary of state, the Clinton Foundation received at least $8.6 million from the Victor Pinchuk Foundation, according to that foundation, which is based in Kiev, Ukraine. It was created by Mr. Pinchuk, whose fortune stems from a pipe-making company. He served two terms as an elected member of the Ukrainian Parliament and is a proponent of closer ties between Ukraine and the European Union.
UKRAINE

I disagree with the opening of the article. Trump isn't 'stirring' anything up. This mess was created before he became President. Ukraine was a peaceful stable nation before the US/Western-backed illegal Coup in Kiev. That's when all the chaos started.

Obviously the US/West has blamed Putin and Russia, but there's two sides to this story. Unfortunately, most Americans only receive one side of stories. And that's done intentionally by the corrupt American Government/Corporate Media.

 

[Dschrute3]

The U.S. orchestrated and supported the coup against the democratically elected government of Ukraine. This phone conversation between U.S. State Department coup leader Victoria Nuland and the U.S. ambassador to Ukraine deciding on who they will put in as prime minister for the unelected anti-Russian/pro-U.S. revolutionary government.

Most Americans don't know that it was the US/Western-backed illegal Coup in Kiev that set off the chaos in Ukraine. They're told it's all Putin and Russia's fault, and they eat it up like good little Sheeple.

 

[Tehon]

Trump isn't 'stirring' anything up. This mess was created before he became President.

But he is President now. What is his policy regarding the mess in Ukraine?

 

[Dschrute3]

Trump isn't 'stirring' anything up. This mess was created before he became President.

But he is President now. What is his policy regarding the mess in Ukraine?

I would hope it's 'Disengagement.' But i know that ain't gonna happen. The US/West created chaos over there with their illegal Coup in Kiev. Ukraine was peaceful and stable before the Coup. Just another country the US/West has destabilized. Another mess. I don't know what Trump can do about it. I don't see any 'Good' options.

 

[Tehon]

Trump isn't 'stirring' anything up. This mess was created before he became President.

But he is President now. What is his policy regarding the mess in Ukraine?

I would hope it's 'Disengagement.' But i know that ain't gonna happen. The US/West created chaos over there with their illegal Coup in Kiev. Ukraine was peaceful and stable before the Coup. Just another country the US/West has destabilized. Another mess. I don't know what Trump can do about it. I don't see any 'Good' options.

Okay, so his failure to articulate a clear message is a problem, he is stirring it up. Ukraine is his puppet, he can make them obey if it is his will.

 

[Dschrute3]

Trump isn't 'stirring' anything up. This mess was created before he became President.

But he is President now. What is his policy regarding the mess in Ukraine?

I would hope it's 'Disengagement.' But i know that ain't gonna happen. The US/West created chaos over there with their illegal Coup in Kiev. Ukraine was peaceful and stable before the Coup. Just another country the US/West has destabilized. Another mess. I don't know what Trump can do about it. I don't see any 'Good' options.

Okay, so his failure to articulate a clear message is a problem, he is stirring it up. Ukraine is his puppet, he can make them obey if it is his will.

I don't see any 'Good' options in this for Trump. It's yet another country the US/West has destabilized. But i'm sure there will be more. Stay tuned.

 

[Tehon]

Trump isn't 'stirring' anything up. This mess was created before he became President.

But he is President now. What is his policy regarding the mess in Ukraine?

I would hope it's 'Disengagement.' But i know that ain't gonna happen. The US/West created chaos over there with their illegal Coup in Kiev. Ukraine was peaceful and stable before the Coup. Just another country the US/West has destabilized. Another mess. I don't know what Trump can do about it. I don't see any 'Good' options.

Okay, so his failure to articulate a clear message is a problem, he is stirring it up. Ukraine is his puppet, he can make them obey if it is his will.

I don't see any 'Good' options in this for Trump. It's yet another country the US/West has destabilized. But i'm sure there will be more. Stay tuned.

There is a good option for Trump. Force Ukraine to negotiate a settlement with Eastern Ukraine. Easy peasy.

 

[Dschrute3]

Trump isn't 'stirring' anything up. This mess was created before he became President.

But he is President now. What is his policy regarding the mess in Ukraine?

I would hope it's 'Disengagement.' But i know that ain't gonna happen. The US/West created chaos over there with their illegal Coup in Kiev. Ukraine was peaceful and stable before the Coup. Just another country the US/West has destabilized. Another mess. I don't know what Trump can do about it. I don't see any 'Good' options.

Okay, so his failure to articulate a clear message is a problem, he is stirring it up. Ukraine is his puppet, he can make them obey if it is his will.

I don't see any 'Good' options in this for Trump. It's yet another country the US/West has destabilized. But i'm sure there will be more. Stay tuned.

There is a good option for Trump. Force Ukraine to negotiate a settlement with Eastern Ukraine. Easy peasy.

That won't be 'easy.' The Government currently in power in Kiev, is an illegal regime. It seized power by way of Coup. It then set out to oppress Russia-aligned citizens. They've killed many.

The clock can't be turned back. Russian speaking Ukrainians don't want reconciliation or reunification. They fully support separation. So there's no going back. The US/West destabilized Ukraine. And it'll never be the same again.

 

[Stratford57]

Trump isn't 'stirring' anything up. This mess was created before he became President.

But he is President now. What is his policy regarding the mess in Ukraine?

I would hope it's 'Disengagement.' But i know that ain't gonna happen. The US/West created chaos over there with their illegal Coup in Kiev. Ukraine was peaceful and stable before the Coup. Just another country the US/West has destabilized. Another mess. I don't know what Trump can do about it. I don't see any 'Good' options.

Okay, so his failure to articulate a clear message is a problem, he is stirring it up. Ukraine is his puppet, he can make them obey if it is his will.

I don't see any 'Good' options in this for Trump. It's yet another country the US/West has destabilized. But i'm sure there will be more. Stay tuned.

There is a good option for Trump. Force Ukraine to negotiate a settlement with Eastern Ukraine. Easy peasy.

Ukraine didn't do any steps required by Minsk agreements, a road map for peace and negotiations between Kiev and Donbass (SE Ukraine).

Putin: we will not be able to achieve this [Minsk agreements] unilaterally. We cannot, for example, amend the Ukrainian Constitution – only Ukraine can do this, only the Ukrainian leadership. We cannot sign an amnesty law instead of the Ukrainian President, and we cannot adopt a law on elections. We can do almost nothing, only the Ukrainian people and their representatives are able to do it.
Answers to media questions
----
CIS-EMO political analyst of an International Monitoring Organization, Stanislav Byshok, Aug 21, 2016 :
Honestly, I don’t understand why Ukraine needs Donbass. Let’s suggest tomorrow all the rebels will put their weapons aside and Ukraine will have its border with Russia back, what will Ukraine gain? Four million people, who have a lot of reasons to hate Ukraine, all those people will have to be supplied with jobs and food. That’s why I think, Poroshenko is the last person in the world, who wants Donbass back. Actually, I think comeback of Donbass is his worst nightmare.
-----
“The office of the Russian State Investigative Committee, dealing with crimes involving the use of prohibited means and methods of warfare, has discovered and procedurally documented irrefutable evidence that the Armed Forces of Ukraine have been using weapons of mass destruction, namely the Tochka-U tactical missile complexes [SS-21 Scarab in NATO classification] against civilians in the armed conflict in the south-east of Ukraine,” the investigative committee said.

“The use of such weapons shows that authorities in Kiev pursues the goal of total annihilation of the population and infrastructure in the country’s south-east,” the committee concluded.
‘Irrefutable evidence Kiev used WMDs’ against E. Ukraine civilians – Russian investigators

So, Donbass has been suffered so darn much form Kiev Junta, it will never be back to Ukraine.