Constitutional Republic and/or Representative Democracy?

[Procrustes Stretched]

The United States of America is both a constitutional republic and representative democracy (Dante claims this to be so, because some here deny this reality). What is it about this fact that some people do not understand, fail to grasp, seek to deny? Why do some engage in this denial? Is it an ideological stance/defense, a political tactic, a mental tic?

How is it that during Dante's visits here @ USMB through the years many a thread here have been hijacked with shouts and battles over as simple an issue of 'what from of government' or 'what form of political structure' do we have? This speaks to ignorance and denial in the general population of a supposed 'exceptional' people.

If we do not know and cannot agree on what form of government and political system we have, how the heck are we exceptional in the positive sense?

oh yeah, we are a federation too

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

In our system of government we have a constitution. The constitution guarantees and protects rights and freedoms while restricting the government from restricting and denying these same. Yet we have citizens and governments who would challenge what they profess to support here.

ex:

He is trying to make some gotcha point about it having to be a super majority.
Dante loves word games.

really? You're wrong again. Facts matter as do distinctions for without each, we get more dolts like you

I agree with facts and distinctions that is what I have done.
I am not the only one here that has not been taught by a lefty history professor, like you have that twists our history.
And you have a real problem with anyone who has a different point of view other than your own.
I put up part of an actual letter from Ben Franklin from 1766 in more of it's context since you said it was taken out of context and then you insult.
So who is really the dolt?

Crazy people always think they are the only ones who _____(fill in the blank)_____.

I actually caused quite a sensation and scandal in a Lefty history class when I told minorities they should fear popular democracy more than I should. You are a class A dolt if you think studying and spouting right wing versions of history is any different than lefties with a progressive axe to grind.

I wasn't referring to the context of THE LETTER. geeze, how can one not insult you at times?

I have seen your attempts to present facts as opposed to opinion and have enjoyed it, but you stray into partisanship with it while accusing others of same

I bring in progressivism which is changing our government into collectivism from individualism and being a republic into a social democracy. Freedom is a very precious thing to have and progressives think that they need to change that and rule Americans because they know what's best for us. Arrogance like that never wins. History has proven it.

One example of many things that is happening with progressive ideology is -

1) Gays should have their rights and freedoms because of our constitution, but gays should not impose their lifestyle onto others like they are trying to do.

2) Gays would have gotten their rights & freedom much sooner if they had not tried to force their lifestyle onto the majority of Americans.

3) Example - gays have the constitutional right to form their own boy scouts, not force themselves into straight boy scouts.

4) Gays have the right to open their own bakeries for wedding cakes. Not forcing straight bakeries to bake their cake's That is totally opposite of freedom.

5) This is what progressivism is doing to this country.
It's turning us into what we fought the Revolutionary War over where the elites ruled over the majority.

5) 'Progressivism?' Huh? The American Revolution was started by an elite group of Rebels. Your understanding of the American Revolution presented here is as ridiculous as it is sad and confusing.

Now onto your anti-gay rant(s):

1) To impose a lifestyle onto another is a concept you fail to grasp. Using a bumper sticker slogan is what you are doing. No one can impose a lifestyle onto another without the consent of the other. Just look up the definition of lifestyle. If gays want to live a certain way, how does that directly affect you or anyone not gay?

If you mean acceptance of the gay lifestyle (whatever that loaded phrase subjectively means ) instead of imposition -- or are you trying to say gays are imposing acceptance of their lifestyle on others? If the latter is the case you are so very wrong. It is the law and the US Constitution that is demanding others respect the rights and freedoms you claim to worship

2) Are you saying gays are being denied their constitutionally protected rights and freedoms out of anger and spite? It sure does sound that way.

3) There is a constitutional right to form Boy Scout troops? Where do you find this right in the constitution?

I was unaware the Boy Scouts were a 'straight' organization. Maybe we should read their charter and tax filings?

4) There are gay and straight bakeries? Nuts! The public accommodation laws -- do you disagree with them? Would you have supported separate but equal? You know, bathrooms and water fountains for blacks only and whites only?

 

[peach174]

In our system of government we have a constitution. The constitution guarantees and protects rights and freedoms while restricting the government from restricting and denying these same. Yet we have citizens and governments who would challenge what they profess to support here.

ex:

really? You're wrong again. Facts matter as do distinctions for without each, we get more dolts like you

I agree with facts and distinctions that is what I have done.
I am not the only one here that has not been taught by a lefty history professor, like you have that twists our history.
And you have a real problem with anyone who has a different point of view other than your own.
I put up part of an actual letter from Ben Franklin from 1766 in more of it's context since you said it was taken out of context and then you insult.
So who is really the dolt?

Crazy people always think they are the only ones who _____(fill in the blank)_____.

I actually caused quite a sensation and scandal in a Lefty history class when I told minorities they should fear popular democracy more than I should. You are a class A dolt if you think studying and spouting right wing versions of history is any different than lefties with a progressive axe to grind.

I wasn't referring to the context of THE LETTER. geeze, how can one not insult you at times?

I have seen your attempts to present facts as opposed to opinion and have enjoyed it, but you stray into partisanship with it while accusing others of same

I bring in progressivism which is changing our government into collectivism from individualism and being a republic into a social democracy. Freedom is a very precious thing to have and progressives think that they need to change that and rule Americans because they know what's best for us. Arrogance like that never wins. History has proven it.

One example of many things that is happening with progressive ideology is -

1) Gays should have their rights and freedoms because of our constitution, but gays should not impose their lifestyle onto others like they are trying to do.

2) Gays would have gotten their rights & freedom much sooner if they had not tried to force their lifestyle onto the majority of Americans.

3) Example - gays have the constitutional right to form their own boy scouts, not force themselves into straight boy scouts.

4) Gays have the right to open their own bakeries for wedding cakes. Not forcing straight bakeries to bake their cake's That is totally opposite of freedom.

5) This is what progressivism is doing to this country.
It's turning us into what we fought the Revolutionary War over where the elites ruled over the majority.

5) 'Progressivism?' Huh? The American Revolution was started by an elite group of Rebels. Your understanding of the American Revolution presented here is as ridiculous as it is sad and confusing.

Now onto your anti-gay rant(s):

1) To impose a lifestyle onto another is a concept you fail to grasp. Using a bumper sticker slogan is what you are doing. No one can impose a lifestyle onto another without the consent of the other. Just look up the definition of lifestyle. If gays want to live a certain way, how does that directly affect you or anyone not gay?

If you mean acceptance of the gay lifestyle (whatever that loaded phrase subjectively means ) instead of imposition -- or are you trying to say gays are imposing acceptance of their lifestyle on others? If the latter is the case you are so very wrong. It is the law and the US Constitution that is demanding others respect the rights and freedoms you claim to worship

2) Are you saying gays are being denied their constitutionally protected rights and freedoms out of anger and spite? It sure does sound that way.

3) There is a constitutional right to form Boy Scout troops? Where do you find this right in the constitution?

I was unaware the Boy Scouts were a 'straight' organization. Maybe we should read their charter and tax filings?

4) There are gay and straight bakeries? Nuts! The public accommodation laws -- do you disagree with them? Would you have supported separate but equal? You know, bathrooms and water fountains for blacks only and whites only?

It's sad and confusing to you because you are not reading what I said.
You are using assumptions and over analyzing.
Twisting it into what you think I said.
It is very direct what I said.
What you turned it into is nothing what I said.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

In our system of government we have a constitution. The constitution guarantees and protects rights and freedoms while restricting the government from restricting and denying these same. Yet we have citizens and governments who would challenge what they profess to support here.

ex:

I agree with facts and distinctions that is what I have done.
I am not the only one here that has not been taught by a lefty history professor, like you have that twists our history.
And you have a real problem with anyone who has a different point of view other than your own.
I put up part of an actual letter from Ben Franklin from 1766 in more of it's context since you said it was taken out of context and then you insult.
So who is really the dolt?

Crazy people always think they are the only ones who _____(fill in the blank)_____.

I actually caused quite a sensation and scandal in a Lefty history class when I told minorities they should fear popular democracy more than I should. You are a class A dolt if you think studying and spouting right wing versions of history is any different than lefties with a progressive axe to grind.

I wasn't referring to the context of THE LETTER. geeze, how can one not insult you at times?

I have seen your attempts to present facts as opposed to opinion and have enjoyed it, but you stray into partisanship with it while accusing others of same

I bring in progressivism which is changing our government into collectivism from individualism and being a republic into a social democracy. Freedom is a very precious thing to have and progressives think that they need to change that and rule Americans because they know what's best for us. Arrogance like that never wins. History has proven it.

One example of many things that is happening with progressive ideology is -

1) Gays should have their rights and freedoms because of our constitution, but gays should not impose their lifestyle onto others like they are trying to do.

2) Gays would have gotten their rights & freedom much sooner if they had not tried to force their lifestyle onto the majority of Americans.

3) Example - gays have the constitutional right to form their own boy scouts, not force themselves into straight boy scouts.

4) Gays have the right to open their own bakeries for wedding cakes. Not forcing straight bakeries to bake their cake's That is totally opposite of freedom.

5) This is what progressivism is doing to this country.
It's turning us into what we fought the Revolutionary War over where the elites ruled over the majority.

5) 'Progressivism?' Huh? The American Revolution was started by an elite group of Rebels. Your understanding of the American Revolution presented here is as ridiculous as it is sad and confusing.

Now onto your anti-gay rant(s):

1) To impose a lifestyle onto another is a concept you fail to grasp. Using a bumper sticker slogan is what you are doing. No one can impose a lifestyle onto another without the consent of the other. Just look up the definition of lifestyle. If gays want to live a certain way, how does that directly affect you or anyone not gay?

If you mean acceptance of the gay lifestyle (whatever that loaded phrase subjectively means ) instead of imposition -- or are you trying to say gays are imposing acceptance of their lifestyle on others? If the latter is the case you are so very wrong. It is the law and the US Constitution that is demanding others respect the rights and freedoms you claim to worship

2) Are you saying gays are being denied their constitutionally protected rights and freedoms out of anger and spite? It sure does sound that way.

3) There is a constitutional right to form Boy Scout troops? Where do you find this right in the constitution?

I was unaware the Boy Scouts were a 'straight' organization. Maybe we should read their charter and tax filings?

4) There are gay and straight bakeries? Nuts! The public accommodation laws -- do you disagree with them? Would you have supported separate but equal? You know, bathrooms and water fountains for blacks only and whites only?

You are using assumptions.
Twisting it into what you think I said.
It is very direct what I said.
What you turned it into is nothing what I said.

When you use doublespeak that is what happens? You get confused when confronted with your own words.

You've argue against public accommodation laws even going so far as to marginalize others while using anger and envy as a justifications for denying what you acknowledge are rights and freedoms due gays

 

[peach174]

In our system of government we have a constitution. The constitution guarantees and protects rights and freedoms while restricting the government from restricting and denying these same. Yet we have citizens and governments who would challenge what they profess to support here.

ex:

Crazy people always think they are the only ones who _____(fill in the blank)_____.

I actually caused quite a sensation and scandal in a Lefty history class when I told minorities they should fear popular democracy more than I should. You are a class A dolt if you think studying and spouting right wing versions of history is any different than lefties with a progressive axe to grind.

I wasn't referring to the context of THE LETTER. geeze, how can one not insult you at times?

I have seen your attempts to present facts as opposed to opinion and have enjoyed it, but you stray into partisanship with it while accusing others of same

I bring in progressivism which is changing our government into collectivism from individualism and being a republic into a social democracy. Freedom is a very precious thing to have and progressives think that they need to change that and rule Americans because they know what's best for us. Arrogance like that never wins. History has proven it.

One example of many things that is happening with progressive ideology is -

1) Gays should have their rights and freedoms because of our constitution, but gays should not impose their lifestyle onto others like they are trying to do.

2) Gays would have gotten their rights & freedom much sooner if they had not tried to force their lifestyle onto the majority of Americans.

3) Example - gays have the constitutional right to form their own boy scouts, not force themselves into straight boy scouts.

4) Gays have the right to open their own bakeries for wedding cakes. Not forcing straight bakeries to bake their cake's That is totally opposite of freedom.

5) This is what progressivism is doing to this country.
It's turning us into what we fought the Revolutionary War over where the elites ruled over the majority.

5) 'Progressivism?' Huh? The American Revolution was started by an elite group of Rebels. Your understanding of the American Revolution presented here is as ridiculous as it is sad and confusing.

Now onto your anti-gay rant(s):

1) To impose a lifestyle onto another is a concept you fail to grasp. Using a bumper sticker slogan is what you are doing. No one can impose a lifestyle onto another without the consent of the other. Just look up the definition of lifestyle. If gays want to live a certain way, how does that directly affect you or anyone not gay?

If you mean acceptance of the gay lifestyle (whatever that loaded phrase subjectively means ) instead of imposition -- or are you trying to say gays are imposing acceptance of their lifestyle on others? If the latter is the case you are so very wrong. It is the law and the US Constitution that is demanding others respect the rights and freedoms you claim to worship

2) Are you saying gays are being denied their constitutionally protected rights and freedoms out of anger and spite? It sure does sound that way.

3) There is a constitutional right to form Boy Scout troops? Where do you find this right in the constitution?

I was unaware the Boy Scouts were a 'straight' organization. Maybe we should read their charter and tax filings?

4) There are gay and straight bakeries? Nuts! The public accommodation laws -- do you disagree with them? Would you have supported separate but equal? You know, bathrooms and water fountains for blacks only and whites only?

You are using assumptions.
Twisting it into what you think I said.
It is very direct what I said.
What you turned it into is nothing what I said.

When you use doublespeak that is what happens? You get confused when confronted with your own words.

You've argue against public accommodation laws even going so far as to marginalize others while using anger and envy as a justifications for denying what you acknowledge are rights and freedoms due gays

Not even close to what I said.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

In our system of government we have a constitution. The constitution guarantees and protects rights and freedoms while restricting the government from restricting and denying these same. Yet we have citizens and governments who would challenge what they profess to support here.

ex:

I bring in progressivism which is changing our government into collectivism from individualism and being a republic into a social democracy. Freedom is a very precious thing to have and progressives think that they need to change that and rule Americans because they know what's best for us. Arrogance like that never wins. History has proven it.

One example of many things that is happening with progressive ideology is -

1) Gays should have their rights and freedoms because of our constitution, but gays should not impose their lifestyle onto others like they are trying to do.

2) Gays would have gotten their rights & freedom much sooner if they had not tried to force their lifestyle onto the majority of Americans.

3) Example - gays have the constitutional right to form their own boy scouts, not force themselves into straight boy scouts.

4) Gays have the right to open their own bakeries for wedding cakes. Not forcing straight bakeries to bake their cake's That is totally opposite of freedom.

5) This is what progressivism is doing to this country.
It's turning us into what we fought the Revolutionary War over where the elites ruled over the majority.

5) 'Progressivism?' Huh? The American Revolution was started by an elite group of Rebels. Your understanding of the American Revolution presented here is as ridiculous as it is sad and confusing.

Now onto your anti-gay rant(s):

1) To impose a lifestyle onto another is a concept you fail to grasp. Using a bumper sticker slogan is what you are doing. No one can impose a lifestyle onto another without the consent of the other. Just look up the definition of lifestyle. If gays want to live a certain way, how does that directly affect you or anyone not gay?

If you mean acceptance of the gay lifestyle (whatever that loaded phrase subjectively means ) instead of imposition -- or are you trying to say gays are imposing acceptance of their lifestyle on others? If the latter is the case you are so very wrong. It is the law and the US Constitution that is demanding others respect the rights and freedoms you claim to worship

2) Are you saying gays are being denied their constitutionally protected rights and freedoms out of anger and spite? It sure does sound that way.

3) There is a constitutional right to form Boy Scout troops? Where do you find this right in the constitution?

I was unaware the Boy Scouts were a 'straight' organization. Maybe we should read their charter and tax filings?

4) There are gay and straight bakeries? Nuts! The public accommodation laws -- do you disagree with them? Would you have supported separate but equal? You know, bathrooms and water fountains for blacks only and whites only?

You are using assumptions.
Twisting it into what you think I said.
It is very direct what I said.
What you turned it into is nothing what I said.

When you use doublespeak that is what happens? You get confused when confronted with your own words.

You've argue against public accommodation laws even going so far as to marginalize others while using anger and envy as a justifications for denying what you acknowledge are rights and freedoms due gays

Not even close to what I said.

I wonder -- what do others see?

 

[regent]

I see an argument based on how many angels can dance on the head of a pin.

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

I see an argument based on how many angels can dance on the head of a pin.

regent There is a definitive answer

 

[KokomoJojo]

The United States of America is both a constitutional republic and representative democracy (Dante claims this to be so, because some here deny this reality). What is it about this fact that some people do not understand, fail to grasp, seek to deny? Why do some engage in this denial? Is it an ideological stance/defense, a political tactic, a mental tic?

How is it that during Dante's visits here @ USMB through the years many a thread here have been hijacked with shouts and battles over as simple an issue of 'what from of government' or 'what form of political structure' do we have? This speaks to ignorance and denial in the general population of a supposed 'exceptional' people.

If we do not know and cannot agree on what form of government and political system we have, how the heck are we exceptional in the positive sense?

oh yeah, we are a federation too

Very simple, we have what is known in law as a 'Parliamentary Democracy' precisely the same as england, where the actual control is in the hands of elected attorneys who work for the corporation gvmnt that allegedly act on our behalf despite there are no referendums for us to vote on, and no laws preventing them or more typically the bureaucracies created under them from legislating or enforcing unconstitutional law, so its clear even to an idiot that they use the crystal ball to effect the will of the people.

Next if you look to history, Patrick Henry entered a complaint that they had no authority to use the name of "The People" instead and in place of 'The State'. It went ignored.

We have a gvmnt where attorney's who are not policed, are disconnected from the people, and they make laws that run contrary to the constitution to protect state interests precisely as the king did to extort money from the people.

A democratic parliament means only that 'THEY' get to vote, not you, if it meant you, there would be records of referendums for every law made, and you need to ask yourself which amendment did you or any other joe citizen ever get to vote on?

A republic only means we have a senate and house, just like englands house of commons and lords. Virtually every nation on the planet is a republic, nothing special about that.

What special is the bill of rights, but since the gvmnt has firmly established itself as the modern day religion good luck changing it, wont happen and the smarter you get about the more they will impose force, hence the patriot act. more to come....

 

[Procrustes Stretched]

Very simple, we have what is known in law as a 'Parliamentary Democracy' precisely the same as england, where the actual control is in the hands of elected attorneys who work for the corporation gvmnt that allegedly act on our behalf despite there are no referendums for us to vote on, and no laws preventing them or more typically the bureaucracies created under them from legislating or enforcing unconstitutional law, so its clear even to an idiot that they use the crystal ball to effect the will of the people.

Next if you look to history, Patrick Henry entered a complaint that they had no authority to use the name of "The People" instead and in place of 'The State'. It went ignored.

We have a gvmnt where attorney's who are not policed, are disconnected from the people, and they make laws that run contrary to the constitution to protect state interests precisely as the king did to extort money from the people.

A democratic parliament means only that 'THEY' get to vote, not you, if it meant you, there would be records of referendums for every law made, and you need to ask yourself which amendment did you or any other joe citizen ever get to vote on?

A republic only means we have a senate and house, just like englands house of commons and lords. Virtually every nation on the planet is a republic, nothing special about that.

What special is the bill of rights, but since the gvmnt has firmly established itself as the modern day religion good luck changing it, wont happen and the smarter you get about the more they will impose force, hence the patriot act. more to come....

There was no founding, there are no checks and balances, any more than walmart departments, personnel, the board, and the ceo.

They shut down everyones brain through their presumed schools of authority and sold you puppy chow and kool aid

All you got is corporate reconstruction.

you're trolling the thread and spamming it with nonsense.

you will offer no serious discussion and will get none in return.

good bye

same response