Collective bargaining "rights"??

[jgarden]

Just about every headline I have read about the proposed budget changes in Wisconsin mentions Collective Bargaining "rights". I am NOT the sharpest tack in the box, and after extensive Google searches, can find no LAW that stipulates such rights. What am I missing?

Perhaps the Republican governors would prefer that every public sector employee in their state become a member of the Republican Party where they could also negotiate the governor's political future!

 

[ba1614]

The United States Constitution - The U.S. Constitution Online - USConstitution.net

Ware are the unions covered there ?

What does that have to do with anything? Collective bargaining may not be a Constitutional right, but it a Legislative right in WI. Now the governor is using an underhanded method to eliminate that right. He ran on fiscal responsibility, not the removal of long-held rights. If it was important to him, why didn't he run on that, instead of springing it on the citizens after the election?

Then next election run on reversing it, kinda like it's been done for better than 200yrs. It should be an easy win for the left if people are as supportive of keeping the current arrangement as the left/union leaders claim.

 

[konradv]

There is something you leave out though.

When it involves the "public sector", we (the taxpayers) get left out of the conversation.

Politicians and union bosses get together to see how much of "our" money is going to get divided up, and who gets how much.

This is why, until relatively recently, even people who thought unions were a spiffy idea didn't think that civil servants had any business having them: because in their case, both sides of the table are bargaining FOR the benefit of the employee and AGAINST the benefit of the people actually footing the bill.

http://www.usmessageboard.com/politics/155746-collective-bargaining-rights-38.html#post3365344

Still waiting.

THERE'S your problem!!! You should be reading! If the WI legislature gave public employees the right to bargain collectively, how is that not a "collective bargaining right"? Just because something isn't listed as a Constitutional right, doesn't mean such a right can't be granted legislatively. Of course it would be easier to abridge such a right, but it's a right nonetheless, until the enabling legislation is repealed.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Just about every headline I have read about the proposed budget changes in Wisconsin mentions Collective Bargaining "rights". I am NOT the sharpest tack in the box, and after extensive Google searches, can find no LAW that stipulates such rights. What am I missing?

Perhaps the Republican governors would prefer that every public sector employee in their state become a member of the Republican Party where they could also negotiate the governor's political future!

Assmunch, they're ALREADY part of the group of people that gets to negotiate the governor's political future. They're called "voters". If they really want to end Walker's political future, all they've got to do is convince a majority of the OTHER voters that it's a good thing to be sucked dry to keep them in cushy comfort forever.

Good luck with that.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Ware are the unions covered there ?

What does that have to do with anything? Collective bargaining may not be a Constitutional right, but it a Legislative right in WI. Now the governor is using an underhanded method to eliminate that right. He ran on fiscal responsibility, not the removal of long-held rights. If it was important to him, why didn't he run on that, instead of springing it on the citizens after the election?

Then next election run on reversing it, kinda like it's been done for better than 200yrs. It should be an easy win for the left if people are as supportive of keeping the current arrangement as the left/union leaders claim.

As I understand it, Walker DID run on this exact thing, among others. Of all the complaints I've heard on the news about what he's doing, the only one I HAVEN'T heard is that it was unexpected or a surprise.

 

[MikeK]

What does that tell you? It should tell you that there is no natural right to collective bargaining. Even St. Roosevelt didn't think it was a good idea for public sector employees to have collective bargaining rights. [...]

Presuming you're referring to FDR, can tell us where you learned that and provide a link to the documentation?

Thanks.

Also, please tell us what it is you have against collective bargaining. Are you an employer?

 

[MikeK]

Just about every headline I have read about the proposed budget changes in Wisconsin mentions Collective Bargaining "rights". I am NOT the sharpest tack in the box, and after extensive Google searches, can find no LAW that stipulates such rights. What am I missing?

You're not looking in the right places.

You need to search the laws of individual states to find the specific rulings. For example, in 1967 the New York state legislature passed the Taylor Law, which provided collective bargaining rights to public employees. Any state in which employees have such rights those rights are conferred by law.

 

[taichiliberal]

This is why, until relatively recently, even people who thought unions were a spiffy idea didn't think that civil servants had any business having them: because in their case, both sides of the table are bargaining FOR the benefit of the employee and AGAINST the benefit of the people actually footing the bill.

http://www.usmessageboard.com/politics/155746-collective-bargaining-rights-38.html#post3365344

Still waiting.

THERE'S your problem!!! You should be reading! If the WI legislature gave public employees the right to bargain collectively, how is that not a "collective bargaining right"? Just because something isn't listed as a Constitutional right, doesn't mean such a right can't be granted legislatively. Of course it would be easier to abridge such a right, but it's a right nonetheless, until the enabling legislation is repealed.

Just to clear things up....the link and the "still waiting" is my shot at Cecelie, who keeps prattling on with eyes closed and hands over her ears. Your explanation is on target!

 

[Cecilie1200]

What does that tell you? It should tell you that there is no natural right to collective bargaining. Even St. Roosevelt didn't think it was a good idea for public sector employees to have collective bargaining rights. [...]

Presuming you're referring to FDR, can tell us where you learned that and provide a link to the documentation?

Thanks.

Also, please tell us what it is you have against collective bargaining. Are you an employer?

I can give you documentation.

Franklin D. Roosevelt: Letter on the Resolution of Federation of Federal Employees Against Strikes in Federal Service

This is a letter from President Roosevelt to Luther Steward, the President of the National Federation of Federal Employees. And Roosevelt himself answers your question, "Are you an employer?" right in the letter: "The very nature and purposes of Government make it impossible for administrative officials to represent fully or to bind the employer in mutual discussions with Government employee organizations. The employer is the whole people, who speak by means of laws enacted by their representatives in Congress."

So yes, we are all employers, and right now, we are all getting screwed at the bargaining table, because we don't have a seat there. Our presumed representatives in these bargains, elected officials, are instead selling out our interests to get votes for themselves.