Collective bargaining at itsfinest

[Quantum Windbag]

Some of these are indefensible.

Calling in sick and getting overtime?

Correctional Officer collective bargaining agreements allow officers a practice known as “sick leave stacking.” Officers can call in sick for a shift, receiving 8 hours of sick pay, and then are allowed to work the very next shift, earning time-and-a-half for overtime. This results in the officer receiving 2.5 times his or her rate of pay, while still only working 8 hours.

Remember those teachers taking their students out of class to protest? Now I know why they like collective bargaining.

Due to a 1982 provision of their collective bargaining agreement, Milwaukee Public School teachers actually receive two pensions upon retirement instead of one. The contribution to the second pension is equal to 4.2% of a teacher’s salary, with the school district making 100% of the contribution, just like they do for the first pension. This extra benefit costs taxpayers more than $16 million per year.

I love this one.

Milwaukee Public Schools teacher Megan Sampson was laid off less than one week after being named Outstanding First Year Teacher by the Wisconsin Council of English Teachers. She lost her job because the collective bargaining agreement requires layoffs to be made based on seniority rather than merit. Informed that her union had rejected a lower-cost health care plan, that still would have required zero contribution from teachers, Sampson said, “Given the opportunity, of course I would switch to a different plan to save my job, or the jobs of 10 other teachers."

CARPE DIEM: Collective Bargaining Abuse Examples in Wisconsin

Guess what people, teachers might not be the problem, but their union is.

 

[Late2TheParty]

I heard from "Waiting For Superman" documentary, that tenure is indeed a major factor in killing quality in our public schools.

 

[gekaap]

You know, I have no problem with any of this, as far as the workers go. If the employer has agreed to such terms, then that's on the employer, plain and simple. If I sit down at the table with you and work out a business deal that ends up being foolish for me, then that is my fault for being foolish in my business deals. Same thing applies.

 

[Late2TheParty]

You know, I have no problem with any of this, as far as the workers go. If the employer has agreed to such terms, then that's on the employer, plain and simple. If I sit down at the table with you and work out a business deal that ends up being foolish for me, then that is my fault for being foolish in my business deals. Same thing applies.

But with collective bargaining with public workers, the ones opposing them on the bargaining table are often the very same people who promised them the most on the campaign trail.

This is why even FDR opposed collective bargaining for Public sector workers.

 

[Mini 14]

You know, I have no problem with any of this, as far as the workers go. If the employer has agreed to such terms, then that's on the employer, plain and simple. If I sit down at the table with you and work out a business deal that ends up being foolish for me, then that is my fault for being foolish in my business deals. Same thing applies.

I have to agree with gekaap here. It isn't illegal to sign a contract that is completely in favor of the other party.

That said, this is glaring evidence that Walker is doing the right thing, and whoever DID enter into that agreement is serving the People better by being out of office.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

You know, I have no problem with any of this, as far as the workers go. If the employer has agreed to such terms, then that's on the employer, plain and simple. If I sit down at the table with you and work out a business deal that ends up being foolish for me, then that is my fault for being foolish in my business deals. Same thing applies.

You have no problem with the fact that your community cannot afford to pay for basic services because some idiot in the past gave unions a sweetheart deal? My advice to you is not to expect anyone to fill potholes around you house because you think it is more important to pay a teacher two pensions than fill holes.

 

[gekaap]

But with collective bargaining with public workers, the ones opposing them on the bargaining table are often the very same people who promised them the most on the campaign trail.

This is why even FDR opposed collective bargaining for Public sector workers.

Then that is an issue to be dealt with via the democratic voting process. No need for people to throw a bitch fit about it.

 

[signelect]

I don't agree with Gekaap 99% of the time but this one time he is right on target.

 

[gekaap]

You have no problem with the fact that your community cannot afford to pay for basic services because some idiot in the past gave unions a sweetheart deal? My advice to you is not to expect anyone to fill potholes around you house because you think it is more important to pay a teacher two pensions than fill holes.

You're trying to twist the situation, and my words. Do I like my government to make bad business deals? Of course not. But I'm not throwing a bitch fit like so many people have been lately, and having wet dreams about states that don't concern me destroying unions, etc.

What I said is that there is no reason to complain about the employees taking these deals. And there is no reason to complain about any person laboring to exact for themselves the best deal they can. That is called business. It's the American way. If you think the deal was a mistake, fine. But once the deal has been made, nobody has a right to take it back just because they don't want to honor it anymore. If you and I sit down to the table to do business, and I agree to give you a certain amount of money for a certain service in return, then I'm obligated to pay. I might later on decide that it was foolish of me, but I'm already obligated. If the agreement does not make allowances for how I can unilaterally end the relationship, then that is my fault for not having protected myself. Nobody to blame but me.

 

[JFK_USA]

You know, I have no problem with any of this, as far as the workers go. If the employer has agreed to such terms, then that's on the employer, plain and simple. If I sit down at the table with you and work out a business deal that ends up being foolish for me, then that is my fault for being foolish in my business deals. Same thing applies.

I have to agree with gekaap here. It isn't illegal to sign a contract that is completely in favor of the other party.

That said, this is glaring evidence that Walker is doing the right thing, and whoever DID enter into that agreement is serving the People better by being out of office.

I agree with Mini and gekaap, their are two sides. The NFL owners bitched about the last CBA begin too player friendly. Well why the hell did you agree with it? Its called BARGAINING for a reason. If you can't bargain, get out of the game. Don't be a sore loser and take your ball home because you lost. Suck it up like a man and take it.

 

[JFK_USA]

You have no problem with the fact that your community cannot afford to pay for basic services because some idiot in the past gave unions a sweetheart deal? My advice to you is not to expect anyone to fill potholes around you house because you think it is more important to pay a teacher two pensions than fill holes.

You're trying to twist the situation, and my words. Do I like my government to make bad business deals? Of course not. But I'm not throwing a bitch fit like so many people have been lately, and having wet dreams about states that don't concern me destroying unions, etc.

What I said is that there is no reason to complain about the employees taking these deals. And there is no reason to complain about any person laboring to exact for themselves the best deal they can. That is called business. It's the American way. If you think the deal was a mistake, fine. But once the deal has been made, nobody has a right to take it back just because they don't want to honor it anymore. If you and I sit down to the table to do business, and I agree to give you a certain amount of money for a certain service in return, then I'm obligated to pay. I might later on decide that it was foolish of me, but I'm already obligated. If the agreement does not make allowances for how I can unilaterally end the relationship, then that is my fault for not having protected myself. Nobody to blame but me.

Republicans hate paying people. Didn't you figure that out by now.

 

[boedicca]

Some of these are indefensible.

Calling in sick and getting overtime?

Correctional Officer collective bargaining agreements allow officers a practice known as “sick leave stacking.” Officers can call in sick for a shift, receiving 8 hours of sick pay, and then are allowed to work the very next shift, earning time-and-a-half for overtime. This results in the officer receiving 2.5 times his or her rate of pay, while still only working 8 hours.

Remember those teachers taking their students out of class to protest? Now I know why they like collective bargaining.

Due to a 1982 provision of their collective bargaining agreement, Milwaukee Public School teachers actually receive two pensions upon retirement instead of one. The contribution to the second pension is equal to 4.2% of a teacher’s salary, with the school district making 100% of the contribution, just like they do for the first pension. This extra benefit costs taxpayers more than $16 million per year.

I love this one.

Milwaukee Public Schools teacher Megan Sampson was laid off less than one week after being named Outstanding First Year Teacher by the Wisconsin Council of English Teachers. She lost her job because the collective bargaining agreement requires layoffs to be made based on seniority rather than merit. Informed that her union had rejected a lower-cost health care plan, that still would have required zero contribution from teachers, Sampson said, “Given the opportunity, of course I would switch to a different plan to save my job, or the jobs of 10 other teachers."

CARPE DIEM: Collective Bargaining Abuse Examples in Wisconsin

Guess what people, teachers might not be the problem, but their union is.

Don't worry.

It's All For The Children and They're Just Stickin' It To Wall Street.

 

[gekaap]

Republicans hate paying people. Didn't you figure that out by now.

Which probably has alot more to do with the problems in our economy than anything from the government. But that is another topic.

 

[Mini 14]

I just want to be clear on this:

I would NEVER have signed that agreement, and I would be calling for the head of the guy who did IMMEDIATELY when I saw it.

But gekaap is right. I hold people to contracts they don't want to fulfill all the time. Occasionally, they get me.

If we stop honoring the contract, good or bad, then the next contract doesn't mean anything either.

It was a great deal for the union and a horrible deal for the government. The way you solve it is EXACTLY what Walker is doing in Wisconsin. You eliminate the bad stuff, and out in the good, and honor the contract until it is fulfilled.

Frequent business between the same two parties is very often a "your turn to win" scenario. Under that contract, it was the union's turn to win. Under the next one, it is the government's turn.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

Public sector unions should be abolished.. the only people at the table are the unions and the people they buy off.

 

[Mini 14]

Public sector unions should be abolished.. the only people at the table are the unions and the people they buy off.

We're getting there.

It will take a cycle or two, but the public unions will be gone, or the exception, by 2015.

 

[gekaap]

Public sector unions should be abolished.. the only people at the table are the unions and the people they buy off.

Basically, you're saying that public sector unions should be abolished because of government corruption. In that case, lobbyists should be abolished, as should campaign financing. Along similar lines, guns should be abolished because people misuse them.

I agree that government corruption is an issue always which people should resist. But saying that we should restrict the rights of people because the government is corrupt strikes me as one of the most dangerous things we could possibly ever think in a free society. We need to hold government more accountable so that it will not be bought off by corruption. Not limit people's rights because someone might misuse them.

 

[Late2TheParty]

Public sector unions should be abolished.. the only people at the table are the unions and the people they buy off.

We're getting there.

It will take a cycle or two, but the public unions will be gone, or the exception, by 2015.

Either abolished or prohibited from political activities.

 

[JFK_USA]

Public sector unions should be abolished.. the only people at the table are the unions and the people they buy off.

YEAH. Hey while we are at it:

Eliminate overtime pay

Eliminate minimum wage.

Eliminate worker safety.

Yeah totally with you!!! Whooooo!!!! Slavery. Boy I can't wait to work for free. Thanks Soggy, fighting for true colonial values.

 

[JFK_USA]

Public sector unions should be abolished.. the only people at the table are the unions and the people they buy off.

We're getting there.

It will take a cycle or two, but the public unions will be gone, or the exception, by 2015.

Either abolished or prohibited from political activities.

What about corporations? Should they be abolished? Because if a corporation can lobbying for their own interests, why can't unions? Because you disagree with them. Totally makes sense. Rights for people I agree with, the American way.