"Civil liberties aren't worth much if you're dead"

Discussion in 'Politics' started by bush lover, Mar 3, 2006.

  1. bush lover
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    bush lover Member

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    That's a quote from Sen. Jim Bunning, on why the Patriot Act is necessary. Please say it aint so. Our President is telling us we need to fight wars because the terrorists hate our freedoms. But a (Republican) senator is saying basically that our Constitution and Bill of Rights are worthless if we're dead, so we have to curb our liberty to stay safe. Is that the message we want to send to our dying WWII veterans who suffered through horrific battles to CONSERVE our Constitution and freedom? That it's no longer worth dying for? Please, President Bush, say it aint so!
     
  2. insein
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    insein Senior Member

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    I can't believe "bush lover" brought up an interesting conversation piece.

    This has been the argument since the formation of the constitution. You have freedom or you have security. They are at odds with one another. Thats why you need to find the balance.

    “Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both.” -Ben Franklin

    Im of Ben's mindset. Anytime you start handing the government arbitray reasons to "secure" the population it can be misused against the population. Thus freedom is lost in the name of security.

    I like parts of the Patriot Act. I dont like the whole thing. Thats why i think they need to vote on each individual part of a bill in congress rather then throw on extra crap that doesnt belong.
     
  3. dilloduck
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    dilloduck Diamond Member

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    Looks like they have a pretty decent compromise worked out to finally get it through.
     
  4. no1tovote4
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    no1tovote4 VIP Member

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    Don't Feed the Charicature Troll.

    :trolls:
     
  5. Mr. P
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    Mr. P Senior Member

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    I pretty much feel the same way. The only thing I’d add is NEVER allow it to become permanent; it should always be reviewed and updated until it’s no longer needed.
    *Fingers crossed*
     
  6. insein
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    insein Senior Member

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    gotta give credi when its due. Even if its from trolls. Im sure he didnt mean to make a good point. ITs just one of those things that happens.
     
  7. trobinett
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    trobinett Senior Member

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    Better cross your heart, leg`s, and eye`s Mr. P.

    I got a bad feeling about this, looks a lot like the temporary income tax deal, you know, just for the war.

    We`ve got more GD laws than a person can shake a stick at, we need MORE?

    The security of this nation DOESN`t need the Patriot act, it was only needed as a temporary stop gap measure.

    The executive branch of the government can do its job WITHOUT the Patriot act. :cool:
     
  8. sitarro
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    sitarro Gold Member Supporting Member

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    A friend of mine was stopped by a state cop the other day and ended up wasting 2 hours of his time because the cop smelled pipe tobacco. My friend does smoke a blend of pipe tobacco that is called honey clover, it doesn't in any way smell like pot. This idiot ended up handcuffing my friend and put him in the back of his car while he proceeded to take everything out of his car including the bottom half of the back seat. He didn't find anything so he called in a canine unit to do a search. The dog showed up 45 minutes later, sniffed the car and decided that he didn't smell anything illegal. They released my friend and took off. He was left on the side of the road to reassemble his car.
    Meanwhile 50 drunks probably drove by while this Barney was wasting everone involved time.

    I was driving in Ft. Meyers ,Florida one Saturday night when I came upon a detour. This "detour" was actually a random search roadblock that the police had decided to implement. I couldn't believe what I was seeing, I thought I was in a episode of The Twilight Zone. Here I am minding my own business when I get involved in a Nazi like search of my rental car, the cops even looked like Nazis with tall black boots and German Sheperds. I asked the cop that demanded my identification whether I was time traveling and had ended up in WW2 Germany, he didn't think I was funny.

    What gives these clowns the right to stop citizens for no reason???? The rediculous drug war. Forget the patriot act, we have something worse already. The Supreme Court has given the power to any high school dropout that somehow passed the police academy test to stop and detain you unapologetically. That is a travesty.
     
  9. trobinett
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    trobinett Senior Member

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    Yep, we need more laws`, can`t even enforce the ones` we have correctly.

    I can guarantee ya, that the cop`s wouldn`t pull that BS here in the Ozarks.

    People have a way of disappearing, permanent like. :usa:
     
  10. Mr. P
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    Mr. P Senior Member

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    Until they improve pay that’s what we’ll be faced with.

    I have a scanner and listen in on police, I'll tell ya, it’s a wonder some of them
    can even function, I have no clue how they even got the job.
    BTW…that goes for some of the dispatch people too.

    On the other hand I see many COPS here in my home having warrants signed,
    and many more are top notch vs buffoon.
     

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