Civil Disobedience and the Individual Mandate

[dblack]

Call me a pessimist, but I have very little confidence that the Supreme Court will protect us. Furthermore, the seemingly inevitable 'alternative' offered up by the Republicans is perhaps the only politician who's done more for the cause of mandated insurance than Obama. I think we have to admit, the insurance companies have won this one.

The question is, how can we fight back? How can we, as disgruntled citizens, resist the corporatism and legal plunder that will be forced on us once PPACA 'has its way' with us? Seriously, I'm looking for ideas. I'm interested in forming some kind of grassroots, deliberate scofflaw movement dedicated to resisting the corporate/government takeover of health care.

 

[occupied]

You fight back by making this work instead of sending politicians to sabotage it and leave us with an empty hole full of wreckage where we had an unsatisfactory plan but a plan all the same.

 

[dblack]

You fight back by making this work instead of sending politicians to sabotage it and leave us with an empty hole full of wreckage where we had an unsatisfactory plan but a plan all the same.

uh... what?

I'm not interesting in lining up for an insurance industry fleecing. Is that what you're suggesting?

 

[Greenbeard]

Drop your current insurance and continue to live your life. Problem solved.

 

[Avatar4321]

That's a pretty good question. Ill have to ponder that.

 

[occupied]

You fight back by making this work instead of sending politicians to sabotage it and leave us with an empty hole full of wreckage where we had an unsatisfactory plan but a plan all the same.

uh... what?

I'm not interesting in lining up for an insurance industry fleecing. Is that what you're suggesting?

I mean it, just what do you think will take it's place if these maniac politicians manage to kill health reform? Nothing but a horrible round of insurance company profiteering to teach us to never make the mistake of screwing with their health care racket again.

 

[dblack]

Drop your current insurance and continue to live your life. Problem solved.

Sure, and pay ever increasing penalties for not toeing the line.

 

[whitehall]

Call me a pessimist, but I have very little confidence that the Supreme Court will protect us. Furthermore, the seemingly inevitable 'alternative' offered up by the Republicans is perhaps the only politician who's done more for the cause of mandated insurance than Obama. I think we have to admit, the insurance companies have won this one.

The question is, how can we fight back? How can we, as disgruntled citizens, resist the corporatism and legal plunder that will be forced on us once PPACA 'has its way' with us? Seriously, I'm looking for ideas. I'm interested in forming some kind of grassroots, deliberate scofflaw movement dedicated to resisting the corporate/government takeover of health care.

Wait a minute blackie. You libs thought the Supreme decision forty years ago that found a "right to privacy" that didn't exist in the Constitution and translated it to a right to kill the unborn was the absolute law of the land at the time and anyone who objected should be prosecuted. Now you tell us that a simple Supreme Court decision that reaffirmed money is speech should be ignored and protested.

 

[Avatar4321]

You fight back by making this work instead of sending politicians to sabotage it and leave us with an empty hole full of wreckage where we had an unsatisfactory plan but a plan all the same.

uh... what?

I'm not interesting in lining up for an insurance industry fleecing. Is that what you're suggesting?

I mean it, just what do you think will take it's place if these maniac politicians manage to kill health reform? Nothing but a horrible round of insurance company profiteering to teach us to never make the mistake of screwing with their health care racket again.

The insurance companies were for Obamacare. Why? Because the Federal Government will force people to buy insurance when this bill is in full force. Which is conveniently after the election.

The insurance companies you hate support a bill you love that will make them rich and screw the rest of us and you're still happy with the bill. Does that reaction make sense to anyone else?

 

[dblack]

I mean it, just what do you think will take it's place if these maniac politicians manage to kill health reform? Nothing but a horrible round of insurance company profiteering to teach us to never make the mistake of screwing with their health care racket again.

The insurance companies can't profit from us if we refuse to do business with them. This is the writing on the wall that prompted the to push for the mandate.

 

[dblack]

Wait a minute blackie. You libs thought the Supreme decision forty years ago that found a "right to privacy" that didn't exist in the Constitution and translated it to a right to kill the unborn was the absolute law of the land at the time and anyone who objected should be prosecuted. Now you tell us that a simple Supreme Court decision that reaffirmed money is speech should be ignored and protested.

Thank you for playing.

 

[occupied]

I mean it, just what do you think will take it's place if these maniac politicians manage to kill health reform? Nothing but a horrible round of insurance company profiteering to teach us to never make the mistake of screwing with their health care racket again.

The insurance companies can't profit from us if we refuse to do business with them. This is the writing on the wall that prompted the to push for the mandate.

You do that, me I think I would rather be able to keep my house if I get hurt or sick.

 

[dblack]

For the first few years, it makes sense to game the system. Drop any insurance you're currently paying for, and wait until you get sick. The initial penalties won't be near as much as insurance premiums. Pay out of pocket until you get really sick.

But this will only work for awhile. Like the push for mandated auto insurance, eventually, they'll be sending us to jail for refusing to give the insurance companies our "pound of flesh". What then?

 

[Sundial]

Call me a pessimist, but I have very little confidence that the Supreme Court will protect us. Furthermore, the seemingly inevitable 'alternative' offered up by the Republicans is perhaps the only politician who's done more for the cause of mandated insurance than Obama. I think we have to admit, the insurance companies have won this one.

The question is, how can we fight back? How can we, as disgruntled citizens, resist the corporatism and legal plunder that will be forced on us once PPACA 'has its way' with us? Seriously, I'm looking for ideas. I'm interested in forming some kind of grassroots, deliberate scofflaw movement dedicated to resisting the corporate/government takeover of health care.

Here's what I don't get. You pay taxes, right? And some of those taxes go to Medicare. Isn't the Medicare part of the payroll tax just a mandated health insurance premium? What's the difference?

 

[dblack]

Here's what I don't get. You pay taxes, right? And some of those taxes go to Medicare. Isn't the Medicare part of the payroll tax just a mandated health insurance premium? What's the difference?

Medicare is a safety net for those who have no choice other than dependency on government. PPACA seeks to make all of us dependent on government for our very health. This is a power that will be used.

 

[Avatar4321]

There are a few ways to oppose it off the top of my head:

1) Refuse to buy the insurance they are requiring to do in protest.
2) Refuse to pay taxes

Both of which can be done non-violently. Of course, when you are doing non-cooperation, you have to accept the penalties. You win people over to support your point through self-suffering. You show them what oppressive government does to people.

Personally, I think number 1 would be more effective.

 

[whitehall]

Wait a minute blackie. You libs thought the Supreme decision forty years ago that found a "right to privacy" that didn't exist in the Constitution and translated it to a right to kill the unborn was the absolute law of the land at the time and anyone who objected should be prosecuted. Now you tell us that a simple Supreme Court decision that reaffirmed money is speech should be ignored and protested.

Thank you for playing.

What am I playing? The right to abortion was affirmed by the Supreme Court and the left guards that decision with the might of the federal government. Now we have a simple decision that corporations have the same right to free speech as individuals and the neo-socialist left is hysterical about it. I smell a rat.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Call me a pessimist, but I have very little confidence that the Supreme Court will protect us.

From what?

The question is, how can we fight back? How can we, as disgruntled citizens, resist the corporatism and legal plunder that will be forced on us once PPACA 'has its way' with us? Seriously, I'm looking for ideas. I'm interested in forming some kind of grassroots, deliberate scofflaw movement dedicated to resisting the corporate/government takeover of health care.

'Fight back' so no one has any insurance? That’s only an option if one is very wealthy. For the great majority of Americans, no health insurance, no healthcare. If one is going to have health insurance, it’s going to come from only one of two places: a corporation or the government.

Drop your current insurance and continue to live your life. Problem solved.

Or, better yet, keep your current insurance and live your life. Problem solved.

Otherwise, the ACA is compromise, a consequence of the right’s refusal to even discuss a single payer program. And millions of Americans with no insurance is not an option – it’s bad and irresponsible public and fiscal policy.

 

[dblack]

What am I playing? The right to abortion was affirmed by the Supreme Court and the left guards that decision with the might of the federal government. Now we have a simple decision that corporations have the same right to free speech as individuals and the neo-socialist left is hysterical about it. I smell a rat.

I'm not sure what you're going on about. But it has nothing to do with the PPACA fiasco.

 

[dblack]

Call me a pessimist, but I have very little confidence that the Supreme Court will protect us.

From what?

From a corporatist takeover of health care.

'Fight back' so no one has any insurance? That’s only an option if one is very wealthy. For the great majority of Americans, no health insurance, no healthcare.

That's what they want us to believe, but it's bullshit. Health insurance does not equal health care.

Otherwise, the ACA is compromise, a consequence of the right’s refusal to even discuss a single payer program. And millions of Americans with no insurance is not an option – it’s bad and irresponsible public and fiscal policy.

ACA is a sellout. It grants the vested interests in the insurance industry a health care cartel that we will be force to participate in.