CIA Agent: "The Government Has Lied To The American People Since 9/11"

[dvinman]

Revolutionary Politics::Revolutionary Politics : "The Government Has Lied To The American People Since 9/11" CIA Agent

 

[High_Gravity]

You've been lying to us every since you started posting here.

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

What a fucking whackjob.

 

[QUENTIN]

What a fucking whackjob.

He probably knows more about Osama bin Laden and the al-Qaeda network than any other American who has served as a government employee.

Some of the solutions he suggests to our problems combating terrorism I strongly disagree with, but in terms of his simple analysis and recitation of fact, there's probably not a more reliable and knowledgeable source on the subject willing to talk about it publicly.

What is it he said that you find so whackjob-y?

 

[QUENTIN]

If anyone didn't watch the video and is judging it on thread title alone, he's not by any means a "Truther" in the "inside job" sense which the title could mislead one to believe this is about. Instead Scheuer thinks (for quite good reason he has justified and sourced extensively including amply from his own personal experience as the head of Alec Station and as a key witness before the 9/11 Commission) that the government and intelligence community has attempted to sweep its incredible negligence and failure under the rug, misrepresented who al-Qaeda is and what they're after to the American people, and responded to Islamic terrorism in the most boneheaded and counterproductive way imaginable.

For anyone who doesn't know, this isn't just any former CIA agent, but the CIA's top bin Laden specialist. "Scheuer was formerly an intelligence officer at the Central Intelligence Agency. In his 22-year career, he served as the Chief of the Bin Laden Issue Station (aka "Alec Station"), from 1996 to 1999, the Osama bin Laden tracking unit at the Counterterrorist Center. He then worked again as Special Advisor to the Chief of the bin Laden unit from September 2001 to November 2004.

After leaving the CIA in 2004, Scheuer worked as a news analyst for CBS News and a terrorism analyst for The Jamestown Foundation's online publication Global Terrorism Analysis. He also makes radio and television appearances and teaches a graduate-level course on Al-Qaeda at Georgetown University. He also participates in conferences on terrorism and national security issues, such as the New America Foundation's December 2004 conference, "Al Qaeda 2.0: Transnational Terrorism After 9/11."

 

[Sunni Man]

This is an informative video that every American needs to see.

 

[candycorn]

If anyone didn't watch the video and is judging it on thread title alone, he's not by any means a "Truther" in the "inside job" sense which the title could mislead one to believe this is about. Instead Scheuer thinks (for quite good reason he has justified and sourced extensively including amply from his own personal experience as the head of Alec Station and as a key witness before the 9/11 Commission) that the government and intelligence community has attempted to sweep its incredible negligence and failure under the rug, misrepresented who al-Qaeda is and what they're after to the American people, and responded to Islamic terrorism in the most boneheaded and counterproductive way imaginable.

For anyone who doesn't know, this isn't just any former CIA agent, but the CIA's top bin Laden specialist. "Scheuer was formerly an intelligence officer at the Central Intelligence Agency. In his 22-year career, he served as the Chief of the Bin Laden Issue Station (aka "Alec Station"), from 1996 to 1999, the Osama bin Laden tracking unit at the Counterterrorist Center. He then worked again as Special Advisor to the Chief of the bin Laden unit from September 2001 to November 2004.

After leaving the CIA in 2004, Scheuer worked as a news analyst for CBS News and a terrorism analyst for The Jamestown Foundation's online publication Global Terrorism Analysis. He also makes radio and television appearances and teaches a graduate-level course on Al-Qaeda at Georgetown University. He also participates in conferences on terrorism and national security issues, such as the New America Foundation's December 2004 conference, "Al Qaeda 2.0: Transnational Terrorism After 9/11."

Gee according to the twoofers; no expert testified before the Commission so I'm guessing he's not an expert on this one narrow subject at all...or the twoofers are full of shit. I'm guessing he's an expert of this one narrow subject AND all twoofers are idiots.

Let us know when he blames the Jews again.

 

[QUENTIN]

"Twoofers" (Truthers?) are mostly full of shit. He is an expert on the rather broad and incredibly pertinent (is anything more pertinent to this matter) subject of Islamic terrorism, al-Qaeda, and Osama bin Laden.

I disagree with some of his proposed solutions to the problems he identifies (he's quite hawkish) but the problems he identifies are very real and his analysis is incredibly valuable, there's no good reason to dismiss it outright beyond putting your fingers in your ears at what you don't want to hear.

 

[candycorn]

"Twoofers" (Truthers?) are mostly full of shit. He is an expert on the rather broad and incredibly pertinent (is anything more pertinent to this matter) subject of Islamic terrorism, al-Qaeda, and Osama bin Laden.

I disagree with some of his proposed solutions to the problems he identifies (he's quite hawkish) but the problems he identifies are very real and his analysis is incredibly valuable, there's no good reason to dismiss it outright beyond putting your fingers in your ears at what you don't want to hear.

So how many Jews does he claim are behind it?

 

[QUENTIN]

"Twoofers" (Truthers?) are mostly full of shit. He is an expert on the rather broad and incredibly pertinent (is anything more pertinent to this matter) subject of Islamic terrorism, al-Qaeda, and Osama bin Laden.

I disagree with some of his proposed solutions to the problems he identifies (he's quite hawkish) but the problems he identifies are very real and his analysis is incredibly valuable, there's no good reason to dismiss it outright beyond putting your fingers in your ears at what you don't want to hear.

So how many Jews does he claim are behind it?

You have no idea who this guy is, do you?

He is not and has never been anything remotely resembling a Truther. He thinks Saudi hijackers with box-cutters took over planes and used them as kamikaze missiles. He thinks they were in al-Qaeda. He agrees about the standard official story. He doesn't think Jews or Israel or Cheney or whatever is behind it. You have zero reason to think that, you're making it up.

He just, in his capacity as the CIA's point man on bin Laden, knows the government fucked up big time and did a terrible job assessing the risk and then especially responding to what they did know in an appropriate manner. He knows how negligent and irresponsible they were in not preventing the attacks long before they happened, which is what their job entails, and he thinks the government did a lot of CYA in the Commission Report and has not truly addressed the faults in how the intelligence community operates since 9/11 in order to better protect ourselves.

What part of that makes him a whack job exactly or are you just spouting nonsense?

 

[candycorn]

"Twoofers" (Truthers?) are mostly full of shit. He is an expert on the rather broad and incredibly pertinent (is anything more pertinent to this matter) subject of Islamic terrorism, al-Qaeda, and Osama bin Laden.

I disagree with some of his proposed solutions to the problems he identifies (he's quite hawkish) but the problems he identifies are very real and his analysis is incredibly valuable, there's no good reason to dismiss it outright beyond putting your fingers in your ears at what you don't want to hear.

So how many Jews does he claim are behind it?

You have no idea who this guy is, do you?

Yes, I do. This post is very interesting.



He is not and has never been anything remotely resembling a Truther. He thinks Saudi hijackers with box-cutters took over planes and used them as kamikaze missiles. . He thinks they were in al-Qaeda. He agrees about the standard official story. He doesn't think Jews or Israel or Cheney or whatever is behind it. You have zero reason to think that, you're making it up.
He just, in his capacity as the CIA's point man on bin Laden, knows the government fucked up big time and did a terrible job assessing the risk and then especially responding to what they did know in an appropriate manner. He knows how negligent and irresponsible they were in not preventing the attacks long before they happened, which is what their job entails, and he thinks the government did a lot of CYA in the Commission Report and has not truly addressed the faults in how the intelligence community operates since 9/11 in order to better protect ourselves.
[/QUOTE]

Now that is something I can agree with...wow Columbo...you mean to tell me that "the government" lied? That hardly ever happens.. <sarcasm>

I enlarged your text to piss off the fellow twoofers; Since the OP is anti-American, they'll probably no bring up your post (they can't read very well) and challenge the validity. I don't know if it's true and could care less. I just like rolling up the virtual newspaper thumping their nose from time to time. Your post helps.

 

[Richard-H]

So, what's the big surprise?

Government people covering there asses by lying.

Do you think that only the government lies? Everybody in this soceity lies! Why should anyone expect any different from government employees?

We are a soceity of rip offs and thieves.

Above all no one is held accountable. If they were, the first people that would be hung for 9/11 would be the people that architected the world trade center.

 

[QUENTIN]

Now that is something I can agree with...wow Columbo...you mean to tell me that "the government" lied? That hardly ever happens.. <sarcasm>

I enlarged your text to piss off the fellow twoofers; Since the OP is anti-American, they'll probably no bring up your post (they can't read very well) and challenge the validity. I don't know if it's true and could care less. I just like rolling up the virtual newspaper thumping their nose from time to time. Your post helps.

Then, if you agree with his conclusions, why do you dismiss him and erroneously claim that he claims Jews perpetrated 9/11 (something he's never, ever even remotely suggested)?

Were you speaking purely out of ignorance or do you have something to contribute?

Your sarcastic response to the truism that governments lie diminishes the importance and significant distinction of their lying in this context. The point of why this lying, unlike much standard lying the government engages in to hide its own faults and shirk accountability, is that in this case their lying makes us considerably less safe and limits the degree to which we can adapt and reform our intelligence and security operations to prevent a future attack.

The 9/11 Commission Report fails to lay the considerable blame where it belongs in the interest of covering asses and avoiding public outcry so subsequent changes adopted based on their recommendations address mostly superficial rather than substantive matters. The way intelligence agencies gather, process, prioritize, and report information to the officials who can act on it has not truly been overhauled in the wake of the attacks. Their approach has largely been "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" despite Scheur's personal and comprehensive knowledge of the fact that the system is broken to its core and needs fundamental fixing.

According to Scheur, again based on his unparalleled firsthand experience, much of the reaction and changes in policy have actually been counterproductive and made it more difficult since 9/11 to recognize genuine threats as agencies are hampered by sorting through volumes of irrelevant collected data unknown since the days of the Stasi. Connecting the dots in order to take appropriate, life-saving action now amounts to "finding a needle in a haystack." We've seen evidence of this in so many future incidents like the Ford Hood shooting, underwear bomber, Times Square car bombing, and etc. where attacks succeeded or were foiled only by dumb luck or incompetence in the last moments despite the government having ample information long before they were carried out that should have led them to prevent the plots far in advance. We shouldn't have to rely primarily on luck, vigilant citizens, and the TSA when we have massive intelligence agencies tasked with eradicating these threats before they materialize. They can never guarantee total security of course, but they can do a much better job of it than they have and drastically minimize the degree of incompetence on display.

When the government isn't willing to admit any mistake, when no officials' heads roll even after as catastrophic a blunder on their part as 9/11 was, then they refuse to learn from their mistakes and the vicious and dangerous cycle of status quo operation that makes us such an easy target for attack continues - which has always been Scheur's message. It's a vital one more Americans need to hear and heed.

 

[editec]

that the government and intelligence community has attempted to sweep its incredible negligence and failure under the rug,

Ya think!?

Our INTEL and military community is a bloated bully.

 

[uscitizen]

Revolutionary Politics::Revolutionary Politics : "The Government Has Lied To The American People Since 9/11" CIA Agent

bullshit! the govt has lied to us since long before 911.

 

[QUENTIN]

that the government and intelligence community has attempted to sweep its incredible negligence and failure under the rug,

Ya think!?

Our INTEL and military community is a bloated bully.

Of course its obvious, and yet many here fight tooth and nail to deny it and suggest our only problem is Crazy, Evil Muslims &#8482; and the intelligence and military community are vigilantly and effectively combating the threat they pose. Quite a few of them even argue that to suggest otherwise is "Anti-American." See how many cheered Rudy Guiliani when he ignorantly made that formulation in response to Ron Paul citing the 9/11 Commission Report's own mildly critical findings and how readily they copy that behavior here.

 

[editec]

The CIA has been lying to our POTUSes since inception.

That's, in part, the reason why the NSA was invented

 

[candycorn]

Now that is something I can agree with...wow Columbo...you mean to tell me that "the government" lied? That hardly ever happens.. <sarcasm>

I enlarged your text to piss off the fellow twoofers; Since the OP is anti-American, they'll probably no bring up your post (they can't read very well) and challenge the validity. I don't know if it's true and could care less. I just like rolling up the virtual newspaper thumping their nose from time to time. Your post helps.

Then, if you agree with his conclusions, why do you dismiss him and erroneously claim that he claims Jews perpetrated 9/11 (something he's never, ever even remotely suggested)?

Were you speaking purely out of ignorance or do you have something to contribute?

Plenty to contribute...you're doing fine so far though so I'll let you run with the football.

Your sarcastic response to the truism that governments lie diminishes the importance and significant distinction of their lying in this context. The point of why this lying, unlike much standard lying the government engages in to hide its own faults and shirk accountability, is that in this case their lying makes us considerably less safe and limits the degree to which we can adapt and reform our intelligence and security operations to prevent a future attack.

Again, I agree. I don't think my response was espeically sarcastic considering the OP but to each their own. I apologize if I used a term that was offensive to you.

The 9/11 Commission Report fails to lay the considerable blame where it belongs in the interest of covering asses and avoiding public outcry so subsequent changes adopted based on their recommendations address mostly superficial rather than substantive matters. The way intelligence agencies gather, process, prioritize, and report information to the officials who can act on it has not truly been overhauled in the wake of the attacks. Their approach has largely been "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" despite Scheur's personal and comprehensive knowledge of the fact that the system is broken to its core and needs fundamental fixing.

No diasgreement there; we're stripping people at airports yet thousands of pounds (if not millions) of air freight go totally unchecked every single day based on a flimsy piece of paper that makes ACME Freight Forwarding Company a "trusted shipper". We're ripe for the picking right now.

Thats not all; here is a small contribution I made a month ago describing a nightmare that just may come true:

Fifteen minutes after leaving Manhattan, we arrived at the airport gate. A private security guard asked my friend for the tail number of our plane. He provided the number—or he provided a few digits of the number—and we were waved through, without an identification check. The plane, I should point out, didn’t belong to my friend; it belonged to a company with which my friend’s business does business. We drove to the terminal—operated by Signature Flight Support, a leading provider of general-aviation services—where we met our co-pilot, who escorted us to the plane.

“You’re Mr. Goldba?” the co-pilot said to me.

“It’s Goldberg,” I said.

“Okay, the e-mail must have gotten cut off or something.”

We continued to the plane. I asked my friend—let’s refer to him as “Osama bin La”—if there would be any security check whatsoever before we went wheels-up. He laughed. “I think the law says we have to pat each other down.”

“Do these pilots know you well?” I asked. “Is that why they trust you to bring me along?”

He first met them that morning, he said, when they flew him to Teterboro.
We climbed aboard the eight-seat twin-engine plane. The pilot greeted us, took my bag from me, and placed it on a seat. I noticed that no door separated the cabin from the cockpit.

We took off a few minutes later and headed south, in the direction of the Pentagon, the White House, and the United States Capitol complex.

“So let’s just say that I’m a terrorist pilot,” I said, “and I have a bag filled with handguns and I shoot these two pilots and then I take control of the plane and steer it into the headquarters of the CIA,” near which we would soon be flying. “What’s stopping me?”

“There’s nothing stopping you,” my friend said. “All you need is money to buy a plane, or a charter.”
Luckily for America, I am not a terrorist, I did not kill the pilots, and I did not steer the plane into the headquarters of the CIA. Nor did I pack my bag with Semtex or a dirty bomb. Instead, I occupied myself by taking free candy and bottles of Evian from the plane’s endless stock of free candy and Evian, which reminded me, as if I needed reminding, that it is better to be rich than poor.

We landed at Dulles International Airport about 40 minutes after we took off. We said good night to the pilots and walked across the tarmac. On the way, we passed far bigger planes than the one on which we had flown: 20- and 30-seat private jets, of obviously significant weight and fuel-storage capacity. Of course, one can charter 757s and 777s for private use as well.

I’ve been writing for years about the TSA, and about the uneven and unthinking methods it employs to secure our nation’s commercial airports. I had been under the impression that the TSA stationed personnel at many general-*aviation terminals, but it typically does not. The general-aviation industry is almost entirely “self-regulated.” The TSA has proposed that it be allowed to impose certain security measures on private jets, such as requiring operators to ensure that their passengers are not on the no-fly list, but for now the agency screens only those Americans who cannot afford to fly on private planes. The TSA administrator, John Pistole, suggested he sees a less substantial threat from general aviation than he does in the commercial realm, and the general- aviation “community” is not enthusiastic about government regulation. “Clearly the general-aviation community has a lot of equities and interest in our rules,” he told me, delicately. The TSA does, however, distribute helpful tips to those who work at private- aviation airports, including, “Always lock your aircraft.” And there is this warning: call 911 if you happen to notice “pilots appearing to be under the control of others.”

I am not a terrorist, but I do share one goal with al-Qaeda: I too would like to have a pilot under my control. But, like most Americans, and presumably unlike al-Qaeda, I am not quite rich enough to buy my way out of airport security.

Jeffrey Goldberg is a national correspondent for The Atlantic.

According to Scheur, again based on his unparalleled firsthand experience, much of the reaction and changes in policy have actually been counterproductive and made it more difficult since 9/11 to recognize genuine threats as agencies are hampered by sorting through volumes of irrelevant collected data unknown since the days of the Stasi. Connecting the dots in order to take appropriate, life-saving action now amounts to "finding a needle in a haystack." We've seen evidence of this in so many future incidents like the Ford Hood shooting, underwear bomber, Times Square car bombing, and etc. where attacks succeeded or were foiled only by dumb luck or incompetence in the last moments despite the government having ample information long before they were carried out that should have led them to prevent the plots far in advance. We shouldn't have to rely primarily on luck, vigilant citizens, and the TSA when we have massive intelligence agencies tasked with eradicating these threats before they materialize. They can never guarantee total security of course, but they can do a much better job of it than they have and drastically minimize the degree of incompetence on display.

Now I'll disagree; sort of.

Look, its easy to put the dots together after the attack and say "X should have known". Thats what we're doing in Pakistan right now but we have the extreme case of the worlds most wanted fugitive being the subject of what they should have known. At one place I worked, we had an employee who was embezzeling (sp?) what amounted to money every month. We found out about it about 3 years after it happened. The total was equiavalent
to $10K+. The employee's supervisor looked ignorant as hell because she didn't catch him doing it. Upon further review, however, the manager exonnerated the supervisor saying something to the effect that she had done exactly what she should have done in terms of follow up and that nobody could have forseen a rogue employee going to those lengths to skim a little off the top for three years.


He sounds like a disgruntled ex-employee who may have a planet sized ego. Doesn't make him wrong; just makes him sound like a blowhard which may or may not be the case. What he should do is convince a locality how to make their region safer and when TSHTF we will see how well he put the dots together.

When the government isn't willing to admit any mistake, when no officials' heads roll even after as catastrophic a blunder on their part as 9/11 was, then they refuse to learn from their mistakes and the vicious and dangerous cycle of status quo operation that makes us such an easy target for attack continues - which has always been Scheur's message. It's a vital one more Americans need to hear and heed.

Again, I agree.

 

[theHawk]

He is absolutely right - Bush, Clinton, and Obama are all full of shit when they say that AQ attacked us because of our values, our freedoms ect. They are attacking us because we aren't Muslims, and because we support the Zionist jews.

But, none of our esteemed leaders have the balls to acknowledge the fact that Islamists will always seek to destroy or conquer us because their religion dictates so. They continue to lie to us and tell us that Islam is a "religion of peace" and we can co-exist with them peacefully. Has Israel even been able to co-exist with Muslims around it?