Follow along with the video below to see how to install our site as a web app on your home screen.
Note: This feature currently requires accessing the site using the built-in Safari browser.
In my opinion, yes. He forgave King David. We see God's forgiveness all over the Old Testament. Remember, however, the Jews were not interested in spreading the Kingdom of God. He was their God, they were His people.I am talking about forgiveness from God. Had Jesus not been crucified, would God offer forgiveness of sin just as God does now?
So not a sacrifice at all. Simply a refusal to back down from a principle. This is a different approach than I have heard. Thank you.
I wouldn't go that far. Any life is too complicated to insist it's only this and not any of that.
Name a Christian denomination that does not fly the cross.
Those that do are embracing barbaric human sacrifice and you know it.
not that complicated.....Jesus was God....God did not sacrifice some human for our sins......he sacrificed himself.....SELF sacrifice.....(from a Calvinist, by the way, we don't teach it either)......
I would be interested in better understanding Calvinist teaching on this. Can you give me a quick summary?
You forget that Jesus said, I do my fathers will and not my own.
But Jesus did have to die did he not?
Forgave King David!
Was the torture of King David's baby for 6 days before God finally had enough of torturing it not enough punishment for God?
Is that a good way for a God to forgive? By the murder of the sinners baby?
You mean sacrifice. I never understood that concept in any religion. If God wanted us to repent from sins he gave us the free will to choose, even though this is all foretold and foreseen, what is the point of God creating a man to be slain as a symbol of immortality when God could just as well have made humans immortal and incapable of committing sins? It just sounds like hogwash, all religions seem so contrived and phony. I am sorry to offend anyone.
Understood. My question really dealt with the belief of what God was looking for, as opposed to what Jesus thought was happening. I see those as two different things. I understand you may not, and that is fine.
Understood. My question really dealt with the belief of what God was looking for, as opposed to what Jesus thought was happening. I see those as two different things. I understand you may not, and that is fine.
My take is that God wanted us to know that as ironic as it might sound, obedience provides us with the more abundant life and a greater freedom. I think Jesus saw that he was angering some very wealthy, very powerful people--and that it had two possible outcomes: He shut up and went away. Or, he believed in what he was doing and stuck with it until the end.
Yes, he stood by his principles. I don't agree with this idea of obedience. I don't think Jesus was talking about obedience. Doing what is right just because you are told to is not morality, it is conformity. I don't think we are here to obey, we are here to grow. I think what Jesus was teaching was an examination of life and behavior, and to live that life with a moral base. The problem with morality is that it will sometimes take you where you do not want to go.
You mean sacrifice. I never understood that concept in any religion. If God wanted us to repent from sins he gave us the free will to choose, even though this is all foretold and foreseen, what is the point of God creating a man to be slain as a symbol of immortality when God could just as well have made humans immortal and incapable of committing sins? It just sounds like hogwash, all religions seem so contrived and phony. I am sorry to offend anyone.
Name a Christian denomination that does not fly the cross.
Those that do are embracing barbaric human sacrifice and you know it.
No love is greater than giving one's life for a friend.
not that complicated.....Jesus was God....God did not sacrifice some human for our sins......he sacrificed himself.....SELF sacrifice.....(from a Calvinist, by the way, we don't teach it either)......
I would be interested in better understanding Calvinist teaching on this. Can you give me a quick summary?
You forget that Jesus said, I do my fathers will and not my own.
It was Jesus' choice to do the Father's will. However, there were a great more elements in play here than you mention.
But Jesus did have to die did he not?
Things being as they were, the handwriting was certainly on the wall. But, what if things had been different? What if people had accepted that he was the Word Incarnate, and all began to live a life of obedience to God? People could have made this choice...but they did not.
Forgave King David!
Was the torture of King David's baby for 6 days before God finally had enough of torturing it not enough punishment for God?
Is that a good way for a God to forgive? By the murder of the sinners baby?
I have found when people get so much of the story wrong, it's best to pass as there is no common ground with which to work.
won't work, as I recall you don't accept the New Testament.....therefore you will remain unconvinced.....not that complicated.....Jesus was God....God did not sacrifice some human for our sins......he sacrificed himself.....SELF sacrifice.....(from a Calvinist, by the way, we don't teach it either)......
I would be interested in better understanding Calvinist teaching on this. Can you give me a quick summary?
Get the quote that says God can die please.
Regards
DL
Yes, he stood by his principles. I don't agree with this idea of obedience. I don't think Jesus was talking about obedience. Doing what is right just because you are told to is not morality, it is conformity. I don't think we are here to obey, we are here to grow. I think what Jesus was teaching was an examination of life and behavior, and to live that life with a moral base. The problem with morality is that it will sometimes take you where you do not want to go.
Jesus was adamant that people should learn to discern the will of the Father and follow it. That is what I meant by obedience (just in case you were envisioning obedience to the law, the boss, or whatever).
