'Charleston Chad' Asks: Badass Internet Racist?

Discussion in 'Race Relations/Racism' started by William Joyce, Nov 6, 2007.

  1. Psychoblues
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    Psychoblues Senior Member

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    You wanna debate causation?


    Why were the National Guardsmen there in the first place? No plea for military assistance from anyone was ever established. There was no threat to state or national security. I think it was just another attack by right wingers to somehow nullify the voices of the opposition. It wasn't the first and it wasn't the last. How many examples of the willingness of right wingers to silence everyone but themselves do you need?
     
  2. Gunny
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    Gunny Gold Member

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    The order was never given to fire. No one has ever been identified to my knowledge as being he who fired first, nor as having given the order.

    But if you think it was for no reason, you obviously have never been hit in the head with a fist-sized rock or a bottle.

    The students disobedience of the rules is the root cause of the final result. The dean said no and they went on a rampage anyway. Theyu were ordered to disperse and refused. Everything that followed was because of THAT.

    I'm not downplaying the tragedy of four students losing their lives, but neither am I willing to completely negate the fact that they themselves were the cause of it.
     
  3. jillian
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    jillian Princess Supporting Member

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    No. They weren't. The people fired upon weren't a danger to the national guard. What happened was that untrained guardsmen with too much firepower got scared and fired their weapons on kids who had every right to protest.

    By the by, it appears that it wasn't rocks being thrown at the time of the shooting, but they were throwing back the gas canisters that were being fired at them.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kent_State_shootings
     
  4. RetiredGySgt
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    RetiredGySgt Diamond Member

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    Also rocks and bottles. The gas just made it worse. No one has the right to attack civil authorities or military authorities and expect no response. Throw shit at armed men, ya real bright. Further some believed they had been fired on.

    Poorly trained yes. Poorly lead, yes. Does not change the fact the protestors CAUSED the shootings. As for Psycobabbles post they were called in because the Mayor over reacted, BUT he ask for and received troops. National Guard troops do not don Uniforms arm themselves and draw live ammo with out an order. Further they do not just show up at some site without a mission or orders having been given for them to be there.
     
  5. Diuretic
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    Diuretic Permanently confused

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    I remember this clearly. I remember thinking, who was the bloody idiot who put soldiers (military mind-set) into a public order situation and gave them live ammunition.

    Soldiers aren't police officers. Cops are trained to do a job in a certain manner. The military are trained to do their job in a certain manner. The two jobs are totally different. These blokes were given live ammo. Live ammo. Hello?
     
  6. Gunny
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    Gunny Gold Member

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    The people who were hit may not have presented a danger to the national guard, but the rioting, violent students as a whole DID.

    As far as what was thrown goes, it depends on who you listen to. Not that it really matters. Have to use the common sense rule here ... who in their right mind throws ANYTHING and troops armed with rifles without understanding troops with rifles can shoot you dead as a result? And these are college kids? Kind of makes one wonder what exactly is taught to these "geniuses."

    IMO, I'd say they, and we as a Nation, were VERY lucky those were National Guardsmen and NOT Marines or Airborne out there. Four wouldn't come close.
     
  7. Gunny
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    Gunny Gold Member

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    The National Guard is the state militia. Its CinC is the Governor of the state. I don't recall whether it was the dean who called the governor, or he called the state police and the state police called the governor, but it is quite legal and not unprecedented for the Governor to deploy National Guardsmen to help restore order during periods or instances of unrest.
     
  8. Annie
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    Annie Diamond Member

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    I'm assuming this conversation has some ties to Kent State. Is there any connection with this?

    http://michellemalkin.com/2007/11/1...man-shield-as-anarchist-kiddie-shields-watch/

     
  9. jillian
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  10. jillian
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    jillian Princess Supporting Member

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    I don't think the military or para-military should be anywhere near political protesters. This isn't China. And I agree with Di, the police are trained to do things a certain way. It should have been their purview.

    If you think you are fighting tyrrany, you fight with all your soul. If you were a minuteman during the revolutionary war, you wouldn't say throwing things at the redcoats was stupid or misguided. And ultimately, they were right.
     

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