Censorship

[RetiredGySgt]

Being banned from a privately owned forum board isn't censorship. It's being excluded from private property at the whim of the owner(s). The person is still free to move on to any number of the billions of forum boards out there. He's even free to create his own. So, he's not been censored in any real sense.

Are you insane, read the definitions. If a person with authority BANS speech or the written word it is censorship. It is completely legal and acceptable on private property BUT it is still censorship.

It's not censorship in any real sense.

Semantics, gotta love it. If you'll look back, you'll see I didn't initially address censorship, because I fully well know what the book definition is. Even the word filter on vBulletin forum board software is called a "censor." That doesn't mean it's in any way REAL censorship.

Only the government can violate your free speech. Networks can and do censor, because the government tells them they must. Owners of private property are doing neither when they kick someone out.

An example of a loon trying to change the meaning of words to suit his own delusional belief system. That is why we now claim blowing smoke in a terrorists face is torture. Or legally caring a gun in public is somehow intimidation. Words have meanings. YOU do not get to decide the level of when the meaning is unimportant. Censorship is censorship whether legal or not, whether right or wrong, whether done by the Government or a private individual on a message board. And it is censorship whether it effects anyone or not.

 

[Midnight Marauder]

Are you insane, read the definitions. If a person with authority BANS speech or the written word it is censorship. It is completely legal and acceptable on private property BUT it is still censorship.

It's not censorship in any real sense.

Semantics, gotta love it. If you'll look back, you'll see I didn't initially address censorship, because I fully well know what the book definition is. Even the word filter on vBulletin forum board software is called a "censor." That doesn't mean it's in any way REAL censorship.

Only the government can violate your free speech. Networks can and do censor, because the government tells them they must. Owners of private property are doing neither when they kick someone out.

An example of a loon trying to change the meaning of words to suit his own delusional belief system. That is why we now claim blowing smoke in a terrorists face is torture. Or legally caring a gun in public is somehow intimidation. Words have meanings. YOU do not get to decide the level of when the meaning is unimportant. Censorship is censorship whether legal or not, whether right or wrong, whether done by the Government or a private individual on a message board. And it is censorship whether it effects anyone or not.

Please... Educate thyself.

Censorship - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Dictionary definitions are often too literal.

(Get the joke there?)

 

[JW Frogen]

And freedom isn't a "tender seed" it is a rock.

The appropriate metaphor for those who believe freedom does not grow, evolve, change, that freedom is petrified, terrified, static.

 

[Midnight Marauder]

And freedom isn't a "tender seed" it is a rock.

The appropriate metaphor for those who believe freedom does not grow, evolve, change, that freedom is petrified, terrified, static.

Rocks can grow, shrink, be eroded, but it's a slow process. It's anything but "tender" however.

A "tender seed" sounds really petrified, terrified.......

 

[RetiredGySgt]

It's not censorship in any real sense.

Semantics, gotta love it. If you'll look back, you'll see I didn't initially address censorship, because I fully well know what the book definition is. Even the word filter on vBulletin forum board software is called a "censor." That doesn't mean it's in any way REAL censorship.

Only the government can violate your free speech. Networks can and do censor, because the government tells them they must. Owners of private property are doing neither when they kick someone out.

An example of a loon trying to change the meaning of words to suit his own delusional belief system. That is why we now claim blowing smoke in a terrorists face is torture. Or legally caring a gun in public is somehow intimidation. Words have meanings. YOU do not get to decide the level of when the meaning is unimportant. Censorship is censorship whether legal or not, whether right or wrong, whether done by the Government or a private individual on a message board. And it is censorship whether it effects anyone or not.

Please... Educate thyself.

Censorship - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Dictionary definitions are often too literal.

(Get the joke there?)

Ya a site that anyone can say what they want. Once again anyone of Authority that stops speech or the written word is censoring and it is censorship. It does not have to be a recognized Government at all. In fact one could argue that on your private property YOU are the defacto government.

The level of censorship does not somehow change censorship or make it not censorship. The simple act of prevention of the spoken word or the written word by someone of authority is censorship. One can also censor themselves and most people do just that.

 

[Midnight Marauder]

An example of a loon trying to change the meaning of words to suit his own delusional belief system. That is why we now claim blowing smoke in a terrorists face is torture. Or legally caring a gun in public is somehow intimidation. Words have meanings. YOU do not get to decide the level of when the meaning is unimportant. Censorship is censorship whether legal or not, whether right or wrong, whether done by the Government or a private individual on a message board. And it is censorship whether it effects anyone or not.

Please... Educate thyself.

Censorship - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Dictionary definitions are often too literal.

(Get the joke there?)

Ya a site that anyone can say what they want.

They cannot. Have you ever tried it there? I've been an editor there for years. You should sign up and help with the articles, engage in the discussions, it's quite educational.

 

[Midnight Marauder]

From your post RGS:

Once again anyone of Authority that stops speech or the written word can be considered censoring and it could be considered censorship. It does not have to be a recognized Government at all. In fact one could argue that on your private property YOU are the defacto government.

The level of censorship does not somehow change censorship or make it not censorship. The simple act of prevention of the spoken word or the written word by someone of authority could be considered censorship. One can also censor themselves and most people do just that.

The difference between literal meanings and useful ones. If you think you're censored, you are? Sure, I'll go with that.

 

[Midnight Marauder]

From the discussion pages of the Wiki article I linked. Take your pick on the ever-changing book definition of censorship:


DEFINITIONS FOR CENSORSHIP
Wictionary - The use of state or group power to control freedom of expression, such as passing laws to prevent media from being published or propagated.


Funk & Wagnalls New Encyclopedia - Supervision and control of the content in periodicals, books, theatrical productions, motion pictures, and other media of communication before or after they are produced and for the purpose of preventing the publication or production of material deemed by the censoring group to be immoral or against the interest of the public. In a broader sense, censorship denotes the attempt to limit the circulation of ideas in any setting.


Webster - 1 a: the institution, system, or practice of censoring b: the actions or practices of censors; especially: censorial control exercised repressively 2: the office, power, or term of a Roman censor 3: exclusion from consciousness by the psychic censor Censor - : to examine in order to suppress or delete anything considered objectionable <censor the news>; also : to suppress or delete as objectionable <censor out indecent passages>


American Heritage Dictionary - 1. The act, process, or practice of censoring. 2. The office or authority of a Roman censor. 3. Psychology Prevention of disturbing or painful thoughts or feelings from reaching consciousness except in a disguised form. Censor - 1. A person authorized to examine books, films, or other material and to remove or suppress what is considered morally, politically, or otherwise objectionable. 2. An official, as in the armed forces, who examines personal mail and official dispatches to remove information considered secret or a risk to security. 3. One that condemns or censures. 4. One of two officials in ancient Rome responsible for taking the public census and supervising public behavior and morals. 5. Psychology The agent in the unconscious that is responsible for censorship.


Broader terms.

 

[Sidestreamer]

Free speech does not exist on private property, and really the 1st Amendment only protects your free speech rights from the government, not private entities..

Free speech exists everywhere a tounge or keyboard taps, now you may have a legal (if cowardly) right to censor it, but do not pretend you are not censoring.

If you are going to be an authoritarian, have the balls to be one.

Free speech actually includes the right to alter things as you see fit on your own medium, including a message board... unless it becomes libelous of someone else. If a private message board owner is forced to let everyone say anything they want without the choice to block such communication on his or her private network, what you refer to as free speech is actually a form of communism to the property owner. I'm not arguing either/or is good or bad but that's just how it is.

I rarely agree with the pink marauder but here, he is at least accurate.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

From the discussion pages of the Wiki article I linked. Take your pick on the ever-changing book definition of censorship:


DEFINITIONS FOR CENSORSHIP
Wictionary - The use of state or group power to control freedom of expression, such as passing laws to prevent media from being published or propagated.


Funk & Wagnalls New Encyclopedia - Supervision and control of the content in periodicals, books, theatrical productions, motion pictures, and other media of communication before or after they are produced and for the purpose of preventing the publication or production of material deemed by the censoring group to be immoral or against the interest of the public. In a broader sense, censorship denotes the attempt to limit the circulation of ideas in any setting.


Webster - 1 a: the institution, system, or practice of censoring b: the actions or practices of censors; especially: censorial control exercised repressively 2: the office, power, or term of a Roman censor 3: exclusion from consciousness by the psychic censor Censor - : to examine in order to suppress or delete anything considered objectionable <censor the news>; also : to suppress or delete as objectionable <censor out indecent passages>


American Heritage Dictionary - 1. The act, process, or practice of censoring. 2. The office or authority of a Roman censor. 3. Psychology Prevention of disturbing or painful thoughts or feelings from reaching consciousness except in a disguised form. Censor - 1. A person authorized to examine books, films, or other material and to remove or suppress what is considered morally, politically, or otherwise objectionable. 2. An official, as in the armed forces, who examines personal mail and official dispatches to remove information considered secret or a risk to security. 3. One that condemns or censures. 4. One of two officials in ancient Rome responsible for taking the public census and supervising public behavior and morals. 5. Psychology The agent in the unconscious that is responsible for censorship.


Broader terms.

Your definitions apply to what we are talking about. They do not support your claim that it is not censorship. Once again you have gotten all wrapped up in LEGAL. Legal has nothing to do with the act of being censored. I have explained it, you simply refuse to understand a very simple concept.

 

[Care4all]

Being banned from private property, that's not censorship. Nor is it a violation of your free speech rights.

Welcome to USMB.

Yes it is, you can say you are violating free speech because you own the venue, the media, but a violation, censorship is censorship, regardless of the legality of the act.

If you are going to shut other people down, admit it, and know you will get some back.

:yawn:

Free speech does not exist on private property, and really the 1st Amendment only protects your free speech rights from the government, not private entities.

Just like in your own home, you may exclude anyone you wish for any reason. Same with privately owned internet entities.

Except on your OWN front porch, if it is in boston, and your name is Gates.

 

[Midnight Marauder]

From the discussion pages of the Wiki article I linked. Take your pick on the ever-changing book definition of censorship:


DEFINITIONS FOR CENSORSHIP
Wictionary - The use of state or group power to control freedom of expression, such as passing laws to prevent media from being published or propagated.


Funk & Wagnalls New Encyclopedia - Supervision and control of the content in periodicals, books, theatrical productions, motion pictures, and other media of communication before or after they are produced and for the purpose of preventing the publication or production of material deemed by the censoring group to be immoral or against the interest of the public. In a broader sense, censorship denotes the attempt to limit the circulation of ideas in any setting.


Webster - 1 a: the institution, system, or practice of censoring b: the actions or practices of censors; especially: censorial control exercised repressively 2: the office, power, or term of a Roman censor 3: exclusion from consciousness by the psychic censor Censor - : to examine in order to suppress or delete anything considered objectionable <censor the news>; also : to suppress or delete as objectionable <censor out indecent passages>


American Heritage Dictionary - 1. The act, process, or practice of censoring. 2. The office or authority of a Roman censor. 3. Psychology Prevention of disturbing or painful thoughts or feelings from reaching consciousness except in a disguised form. Censor - 1. A person authorized to examine books, films, or other material and to remove or suppress what is considered morally, politically, or otherwise objectionable. 2. An official, as in the armed forces, who examines personal mail and official dispatches to remove information considered secret or a risk to security. 3. One that condemns or censures. 4. One of two officials in ancient Rome responsible for taking the public census and supervising public behavior and morals. 5. Psychology The agent in the unconscious that is responsible for censorship.


Broader terms.

Your definitions apply to what we are talking about. They do not support your claim that it is not censorship. Once again you have gotten all wrapped up in LEGAL. Legal has nothing to do with the act of being censored. I have explained it, you simply refuse to understand a very simple concept.

You have married yourself to a strict, narrow definition that I have documented has changed over time. I stick to the broader definitions.

You are NOT censored if you are banned from a message board. You are free to continue posting your garbage on any of the billions of other boards, or start your own blog or message board and run it your way. You're not inhibited at all, just not welcome in that one piece of virtual private property. It's not censorship in any real sense.

Calling it censorship might make one feel better, however. And that's perfectly okay with me.

 

[Midnight Marauder]

Yes it is, you can say you are violating free speech because you own the venue, the media, but a violation, censorship is censorship, regardless of the legality of the act.

If you are going to shut other people down, admit it, and know you will get some back.

:yawn:

Free speech does not exist on private property, and really the 1st Amendment only protects your free speech rights from the government, not private entities.

Just like in your own home, you may exclude anyone you wish for any reason. Same with privately owned internet entities.

Except on your OWN front porch, if it is in boston, and your name is Gates.

It's documented, the cops were walking away. Leaving. The perp continued shouting profanity and racial slurs at the top of his lungs. His free speech was limited by the rights of others not to be disturbed unnecessarily. His speech wasn't censored, his disturbing of the peace was. And Gates well knows that.

 

[Care4all]

:yawn:

Free speech does not exist on private property, and really the 1st Amendment only protects your free speech rights from the government, not private entities.

Just like in your own home, you may exclude anyone you wish for any reason. Same with privately owned internet entities.

Except on your OWN front porch, if it is in boston, and your name is Gates.

It's documented, the cops were walking away. Leaving. The perp continued shouting profanity and racial slurs at the top of his lungs. His free speech was limited by the rights of others not to be disturbed unnecessarily. His speech wasn't censored, his disturbing of the peace was. And Gates well knows that.

IT'S DOCUMENTED, the cop asked and told mr gates IF he wanted his police identification card, (which was required by massachusetts law that the cop SHOW and GIVE mr gates his state police identification card) then mr gates would have to come OUTSIDE with him to get it.

gates followed him outside on to HIS OWN PORCH of HIS OWN HOUSE because the cop TOLD HIM TO, 2-3 times.

so, i am uncertain what your comment really means MM, KNOWING that gates was told by the cop to do such....?