Followers of Jesus-Listen to Jesus. What Jesus really teaches is not taught in any building called-church. So how can they in reality be Christian? The religion that came out of Rome was not Jesus' religion. Nor have any of her branches fixed it.
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Catholicism & Christianity - The Shocking Difference
- Thread starter ninja007
- Start date
Terri4Trump
Gold Member
- Banned
- #143
Source: "Pillar of Fire, Pillar of Truth"
Free booklet online. Brief excerpt:
QUOTE:
Among the Christian churches, only the Catholic Church has existed since the time of Jesus. Every other Christian church is an offshoot of the Catholic Church. The Eastern Orthodox churches broke away from unity with the pope in 1054. The Protestant churches were established during the Reformation, which began in 1517. (Most of today’s Protestant churches are actually offshoots of the original Protestant offshoots.)
Only the Catholic Church existed in the tenth century, in the fifth century, and in the first century, faithfully teaching the doctrines given by Christ to the apostles, omitting nothing. The line of popes can be traced back, in unbroken succession, to Peter himself. This is unequaled by any institution in history.
Even the oldest government is new compared to the papacy, and the churches that send out door-to-door missionaries are young compared to the Catholic Church. Many of these churches began as recently as the nineteenth or twentieth centuries. Some even began during your own lifetime. None of them can claim to be the Church Jesus established.
The Catholic Church has existed for nearly 2,000 years, despite constant opposition from the world. This is testimony to the Church’s divine origin. It must be more than a merely human organization, especially considering that its human members— even some of its leaders—have been unwise, corrupt, or prone to heresy.
Any merely human organization with such members would have collapsed early on. The Catholic Church is today the most vigorous church in the world (and the largest, with a billion members: one sixth of the human race), and that is testimony not to the cleverness of the Church’s leaders, but to the protection of the Holy Spirit.
FOUR MARKS OF THE TRUE CHURCH
If we wish to locate the Church founded by Jesus, we need to locate the one that has the four chief marks or qualities of his Church. The Church we seek must be one, holy, catholic, and apostolic.
The Church Is One (Rom. 12:5, 1 Cor. 10:17, 12:13)
Jesus established only one Church, not a collection of differing churches. The Bible says the Church is the bride of Christ (Eph. 5:23–32). Jesus can have but one spouse, and his spouse is the Catholic Church. His Church also teaches just one set of doctrines, which must be the same as those taught by the apostles (Jude 3). This is the unity of belief to which Scripture calls us (Phil. 1:27, 2:2). Over the centuries, as doctrines are examined more fully, the Church comes to understand them more deeply (John 16:12–13), but it never understands them to mean the opposite of what they once meant.
The Church Is Holy (Eph. 5:25–27, Rev. 19:7–8)
By his grace Jesus makes the Church holy, just as he is holy. This doesn’t mean that each member is always holy. Jesus said there would be both good and bad members in the Church (John 6:70), and not all the members would go to heaven (Matt. 7:21–23). But the Church itself is holy because it is the source of holiness and is the guardian of the special means of grace Jesus established, the sacraments (cf. Eph. 5:26).
The Church Is Catholic (Matt. 28:19–20, Rev. 5:9–10)
Jesus’ Church is called catholic ("universal" in Greek) because it is his gift to all people. He told his apostles to go throughout the world and make disciples of "all nations" (Matt. 28:19–20). For 2,000 years the Catholic Church has carried out this mission, preaching the good news that Christ died for all men and that he wants all of us to be members of his universal family (Gal. 3:28). Nowadays the Catholic Church is found in every country of the world and is still sending out missionaries to "make disciples of all nations" (Matt. 28:19). The Church Jesus established was known by its most common title, "the Catholic Church," at least as early as the year 107, when Ignatius of Antioch used that title to describe the one Church Jesus founded. The title apparently was old in Ignatius’s time, which means it probably went all the way back to the time of the apostles.
The Church Is Apostolic (Eph. 2:19–20)
The Church Jesus founded is apostolic because he appointed the apostles to be the first leaders of the Church, and their successors were to be its future leaders. The apostles were the first bishops, and, since the first century, there has been an unbroken line of Catholic bishops faithfully handing on what the apostles taught the first Christians in Scripture and oral Tradition (2 Tim. 2:2). These beliefs include the bodily Resurrection of Jesus, the Real Presence of Jesus in the Eucharist, the sacrificial nature of the Mass, the forgiveness of sins through a priest, baptismal regeneration, the existence of purgatory, Mary’s special role, and much more —even the doctrine of apostolic succession itself. Early Christian writings prove the first Christians were thoroughly Catholic in belief and practice and looked to the successors of the apostles as their leaders. What these first Christians believed is still believed by the Catholic Church. No other Church can make that claim.
Pillar of Fire, Pillar of Truth
Man’s ingenuity cannot account for this. The Church has remained one, holy, catholic, and apostolic—not through man’s effort, but because God preserves the Church he established (Matt. 16:18, 28:20). He guided the Israelites on their escape from Egypt by giving them a pillar of fire to light their way across the dark wilderness (Exod. 13:21). Today he guides us through his Catholic Church.
The Bible, sacred Tradition, and the writings of the earliest Christians testify that the Church teaches with Jesus’ authority. In this age of countless competing religions, each clamoring for attention, one voice rises above the din: the Catholic Church, which the Bible calls "the pillar and foundation of truth" (1 Tim. 3:15).
Jesus assured the apostles and their successors, the popes and the bishops, "He who listens to you listens to me, and he who rejects you rejects me" (Luke 10:16). Jesus promised to guide his Church into all truth (John 16:12–13). We can have confidence that his Church teaches only the truth.
END EXCERPT QUOTE
Free booklet online. Brief excerpt:
QUOTE:
Among the Christian churches, only the Catholic Church has existed since the time of Jesus. Every other Christian church is an offshoot of the Catholic Church. The Eastern Orthodox churches broke away from unity with the pope in 1054. The Protestant churches were established during the Reformation, which began in 1517. (Most of today’s Protestant churches are actually offshoots of the original Protestant offshoots.)
Only the Catholic Church existed in the tenth century, in the fifth century, and in the first century, faithfully teaching the doctrines given by Christ to the apostles, omitting nothing. The line of popes can be traced back, in unbroken succession, to Peter himself. This is unequaled by any institution in history.
Even the oldest government is new compared to the papacy, and the churches that send out door-to-door missionaries are young compared to the Catholic Church. Many of these churches began as recently as the nineteenth or twentieth centuries. Some even began during your own lifetime. None of them can claim to be the Church Jesus established.
The Catholic Church has existed for nearly 2,000 years, despite constant opposition from the world. This is testimony to the Church’s divine origin. It must be more than a merely human organization, especially considering that its human members— even some of its leaders—have been unwise, corrupt, or prone to heresy.
Any merely human organization with such members would have collapsed early on. The Catholic Church is today the most vigorous church in the world (and the largest, with a billion members: one sixth of the human race), and that is testimony not to the cleverness of the Church’s leaders, but to the protection of the Holy Spirit.
FOUR MARKS OF THE TRUE CHURCH
If we wish to locate the Church founded by Jesus, we need to locate the one that has the four chief marks or qualities of his Church. The Church we seek must be one, holy, catholic, and apostolic.
The Church Is One (Rom. 12:5, 1 Cor. 10:17, 12:13)
Jesus established only one Church, not a collection of differing churches. The Bible says the Church is the bride of Christ (Eph. 5:23–32). Jesus can have but one spouse, and his spouse is the Catholic Church. His Church also teaches just one set of doctrines, which must be the same as those taught by the apostles (Jude 3). This is the unity of belief to which Scripture calls us (Phil. 1:27, 2:2). Over the centuries, as doctrines are examined more fully, the Church comes to understand them more deeply (John 16:12–13), but it never understands them to mean the opposite of what they once meant.
The Church Is Holy (Eph. 5:25–27, Rev. 19:7–8)
By his grace Jesus makes the Church holy, just as he is holy. This doesn’t mean that each member is always holy. Jesus said there would be both good and bad members in the Church (John 6:70), and not all the members would go to heaven (Matt. 7:21–23). But the Church itself is holy because it is the source of holiness and is the guardian of the special means of grace Jesus established, the sacraments (cf. Eph. 5:26).
The Church Is Catholic (Matt. 28:19–20, Rev. 5:9–10)
Jesus’ Church is called catholic ("universal" in Greek) because it is his gift to all people. He told his apostles to go throughout the world and make disciples of "all nations" (Matt. 28:19–20). For 2,000 years the Catholic Church has carried out this mission, preaching the good news that Christ died for all men and that he wants all of us to be members of his universal family (Gal. 3:28). Nowadays the Catholic Church is found in every country of the world and is still sending out missionaries to "make disciples of all nations" (Matt. 28:19). The Church Jesus established was known by its most common title, "the Catholic Church," at least as early as the year 107, when Ignatius of Antioch used that title to describe the one Church Jesus founded. The title apparently was old in Ignatius’s time, which means it probably went all the way back to the time of the apostles.
The Church Is Apostolic (Eph. 2:19–20)
The Church Jesus founded is apostolic because he appointed the apostles to be the first leaders of the Church, and their successors were to be its future leaders. The apostles were the first bishops, and, since the first century, there has been an unbroken line of Catholic bishops faithfully handing on what the apostles taught the first Christians in Scripture and oral Tradition (2 Tim. 2:2). These beliefs include the bodily Resurrection of Jesus, the Real Presence of Jesus in the Eucharist, the sacrificial nature of the Mass, the forgiveness of sins through a priest, baptismal regeneration, the existence of purgatory, Mary’s special role, and much more —even the doctrine of apostolic succession itself. Early Christian writings prove the first Christians were thoroughly Catholic in belief and practice and looked to the successors of the apostles as their leaders. What these first Christians believed is still believed by the Catholic Church. No other Church can make that claim.
Pillar of Fire, Pillar of Truth
Man’s ingenuity cannot account for this. The Church has remained one, holy, catholic, and apostolic—not through man’s effort, but because God preserves the Church he established (Matt. 16:18, 28:20). He guided the Israelites on their escape from Egypt by giving them a pillar of fire to light their way across the dark wilderness (Exod. 13:21). Today he guides us through his Catholic Church.
The Bible, sacred Tradition, and the writings of the earliest Christians testify that the Church teaches with Jesus’ authority. In this age of countless competing religions, each clamoring for attention, one voice rises above the din: the Catholic Church, which the Bible calls "the pillar and foundation of truth" (1 Tim. 3:15).
Jesus assured the apostles and their successors, the popes and the bishops, "He who listens to you listens to me, and he who rejects you rejects me" (Luke 10:16). Jesus promised to guide his Church into all truth (John 16:12–13). We can have confidence that his Church teaches only the truth.
END EXCERPT QUOTE
DOTR
Gold Member
- Oct 24, 2016
- 14,270
- 3,522
- 290
Catholics, Protestants, Coptics, Mormons.... they are all xtian.
Except for Mormons. They recognizably branched off from Christianity but they left it behind long ago. Same for the other Millerite/Cambleites/such as Jehovas Witnesses, Christian Science etc etc.
you know what isn't Christianity, EVANGELICALS and everything they represent.
Dear Penelope
I agree with what you are saying about Christians who defeat
and contradict the very message about Christianity.
What I learned from experience over time:
Different people including Christians play different ROLES.
Some serve as JUDGES and just vote YES or NO if something is consistent or not.
Some serve a teachers, and others mediators/correctors
or facilitators/interpreters.
Not everyone does the charity outreach in serving others physically.
The ones who do that generally are too busy to do organized institutional reforms
as the people who focus on "debates, dialectics and apologetics"
Penelope these are different roles like
judicial, legislative and executive.
I don't like it when people who do nothing but play the Judge
end up obstructing anything from getting corrected and done.
Any ROLE can be used for good purpose, or become overreaching and fail.
But even you come across as doing this, so am I going
to criticize you for doing your job? What if that is the
role you are called to serve and work with other "judges"
to sort out history and what happened and HOW it should be taught?
If that is your role Penelope, so are others called to play a
similar role you do. So we should work together and organize
which people serve which role, not criticize each other for it!
Penelope
Diamond Member
- Jul 15, 2014
- 60,260
- 15,767
- 2,210
you know what isn't Christianity, EVANGELICALS and everything they represent.
Dear Penelope
I agree with what you are saying about Christians who defeat
and contradict the very message about Christianity.
What I learned from experience over time:
Different people including Christians play different ROLES.
Some serve as JUDGES and just vote YES or NO if something is consistent or not.
Some serve a teachers, and others mediators/correctors
or facilitators/interpreters.
Not everyone does the charity outreach in serving others physically.
The ones who do that generally are too busy to do organized institutional reforms
as the people who focus on "debates, dialectics and apologetics"
Penelope these are different roles like
judicial, legislative and executive.
I don't like it when people who do nothing but play the Judge
end up obstructing anything from getting corrected and done.
Any ROLE can be used for good purpose, or become overreaching and fail.
But even you come across as doing this, so am I going
to criticize you for doing your job? What if that is the
role you are called to serve and work with other "judges"
to sort out history and what happened and HOW it should be taught?
If that is your role Penelope, so are others called to play a
similar role you do. So we should work together and organize
which people serve which role, not criticize each other for it!
Evangelicals are the worst as far as judging others. I judge rightly.
DOTR
Gold Member
- Oct 24, 2016
- 14,270
- 3,522
- 290
ANOTHER GREAT VIDEO BY Ray. Street preaching/witnessing.
If the Catholic Church is so bad then why is it the focus of hatred and attacks from the various satanic forces from ISIS to feminists to homosexuals to abortionists to Democrats.
it's all fake stuff made up by humans anyway
Not at all. The whole world has been watching revelation pass them by for many years. This sick world cannot go on much longer.( 2Timothy 3)
harmonica
Diamond Member
- Sep 1, 2017
- 43,841
- 20,010
- 2,300
hahahhahahahahah--sure they haveit's all fake stuff made up by humans anyway
Not at all. The whole world has been watching revelation pass them by for many years. This sick world cannot go on much longer.( 2Timothy 3)
it's man made
we've been over this before --there is no god/etc which YOU claim there is
hahahhahahahahah--sure they haveit's all fake stuff made up by humans anyway
Not at all. The whole world has been watching revelation pass them by for many years. This sick world cannot go on much longer.( 2Timothy 3)
it's man made
we've been over this before --there is no god/etc which YOU claim there is
Sorry you don't know him.
harmonica
Diamond Member
- Sep 1, 2017
- 43,841
- 20,010
- 2,300
know who?hahahhahahahahah--sure they haveit's all fake stuff made up by humans anyway
Not at all. The whole world has been watching revelation pass them by for many years. This sick world cannot go on much longer.( 2Timothy 3)
it's man made
we've been over this before --there is no god/etc which YOU claim there is
Sorry you don't know him.
zaangalewa
Gold Member
- Jan 24, 2015
- 21,094
- 2,135
- 140
ANOTHER GREAT VIDEO BY Ray. Street preaching/witnessing.
If the Catholic Church is so bad then why is it the focus of hatred and attacks from the various satanic forces from ISIS to feminists to homosexuals to abortionists to Democrats.
View attachment 265970
Ah - Susanne Witt. Even her name is not her real name. A girl from Hamburg which interrupted the christmas celebrations in the cathedral of Cologne. She never had anything to do with Cologne and I never understood why she used the English language for her appearance. The german translation for this what she had done is: "Ich bin ein ganz außergewöhnlicher Idiot" (=I am a very extraordinary idiot).
Last edited:
know who?hahahhahahahahah--sure they haveit's all fake stuff made up by humans anyway
Not at all. The whole world has been watching revelation pass them by for many years. This sick world cannot go on much longer.( 2Timothy 3)
it's man made
we've been over this before --there is no god/etc which YOU claim there is
Sorry you don't know him.
Your creator.
harmonica
Diamond Member
- Sep 1, 2017
- 43,841
- 20,010
- 2,300
can't know something that is not thereknow who?hahahhahahahahah--sure they haveit's all fake stuff made up by humans anyway
Not at all. The whole world has been watching revelation pass them by for many years. This sick world cannot go on much longer.( 2Timothy 3)
it's man made
we've been over this before --there is no god/etc which YOU claim there is
Sorry you don't know him.
Your creator.
ninja007
Gold Member
- Thread starter
- #155
can't know something that is not thereknow who?hahahhahahahahah--sure they haveNot at all. The whole world has been watching revelation pass them by for many years. This sick world cannot go on much longer.( 2Timothy 3)
it's man made
we've been over this before --there is no god/etc which YOU claim there is
Sorry you don't know him.
Your creator.
King James Bible (Romans 1:21-22.)
For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
harmonica
Diamond Member
- Sep 1, 2017
- 43,841
- 20,010
- 2,300
no proof -not even closecan't know something that is not thereknow who?hahahhahahahahah--sure they have
it's man made
we've been over this before --there is no god/etc which YOU claim there is
Sorry you don't know him.
Your creator.
King James Bible (Romans 1:21-22.)
For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
no proof means not true
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