Car insurance vs health insurance

[American I Am]

I want to make it clear the I despise both political parties, I have never towed a party line nor ever will I. I do not believe they are for the American people, I believe they are out for their own best interests.

But,
One of the Repub's arguments was that Americans should not be forced to buy health insurance against their will by ObamaCare, that it's illegal and unconstitutional.

Now, where the hell were they when I was being forced to buy Car Insurance?

 

[Cecilie1200]

I want to make it clear the I despise both political parties, I have never towed a party line nor ever will I. I do not believe they are for the American people, I believe they are out for their own best interests.

But,
One of the Repub's arguments was that Americans should not be forced to buy health insurance against their will by ObamaCare, that it's illegal and unconstitutional.

Now, where the hell were they when I was being forced to buy Car Insurance?

First of all, it's "toed" the line, not "towed" the line. It refers to the practice in paramilitary groups of drawing a line on the ground, then expecting you to put your toes on it and stand at attention obediently until told otherwise.

Second, we've had this debate many, many times before. There is a difference between the federal government and state governments, and what each can and cannot do. There is also a difference between requiring you to have insurance to exercise the privilege of operating a motor vehicle on public property such as streets (which IS the only time insurance is required), and requiring you to have insurance to exercise the necessities of existing and breathing, which is what is basically being suggested. And finally, there is a difference between requiring you to protect other people from the direct consequences of your bad actions (ie. having liability insurance to cover other people if you cause an accident) and requiring you to protect yourself from . . . well, anything.

 

[skeptic]

I want to make it clear the I despise both political parties, I have never towed a party line nor ever will I. I do not believe they are for the American people, I believe they are out for their own best interests.

But,
One of the Repub's arguments was that Americans should not be forced to buy health insurance against their will by ObamaCare, that it's illegal and unconstitutional.

Now, where the hell were they when I was being forced to buy Car Insurance?

Because the states force you to buy auto insurance only if you choose to drive on roads that those states own.

The federal government has no right to force you buy health insurance from a private rip off firm merely because you have a pulse.

Is that clear enough or do I need to draw the flow charts?

 

[M14 Shooter]

I want to make it clear the I despise both political parties, I have never towed a party line nor ever will I. I do not believe they are for the American people, I believe they are out for their own best interests.

But,
One of the Repub's arguments was that Americans should not be forced to buy health insurance against their will by ObamaCare, that it's illegal and unconstitutional.

Now, where the hell were they when I was being forced to buy Car Insurance?

Apple v Orange

Mandatory car insurance is a condition placed by the state on your privilege to drive a car on public property, designed to protect people from any damageto their person/property that you may cause. When granting that, or any, privilege, the state has the power to lay whatever conditions it may choose, so long as it does not discriminate or violate due process.

That's not even close to the blanket federal requirement of every citizen, as a condition of their citizenship, to buy health insurance.

 

[whitehall]

You can drive a car without insurance as long as you are on private property. You can own a car and not be required to buy insurance as long as you don't drive it. If you don't own a car you don't need to buy insurance. Anyone who is breathing will be forced to buy a product (medical insurance) they might not want. That's the unconstitutional part. It's the law and with the law comes penalties, that's why the administration wants to hire hundreds of IRS agents. If you refuse to buy medical insurance the IRS will take the money out of you account. If you refuse again the IRS will confiscate your property. If you refuse violently ...well, you know what can happen

 

[Rozman]

I want to make it clear the I despise both political parties, I have never towed a party line nor ever will I. I do not believe they are for the American people, I believe they are out for their own best interests.

But,
One of the Repub's arguments was that Americans should not be forced to buy health insurance against their will by ObamaCare, that it's illegal and unconstitutional.

Now, where the hell were they when I was being forced to buy Car Insurance?

Take the Bus instead....you chose to buy and drive a car....you need insurance.
We now have 18-21 year olds being FORCED to buy insurance...

You don't see a difference.

 

[American I Am]

I stand corrected.

Sorry Cecilie1200, I could never get that word right, you know whether it be towed, toad, or toed. Thanks for the correction.

 

[Cecilie1200]

I stand corrected.

Sorry Cecilie1200, I could never get that word right, you know whether it be towed, toad, or toed. Thanks for the correction.

A toad is an amphibious animal, much like a frog.

You're welcome.

 

[Londoner]

A collection of very powerful corporations invested billions into Washington for the purpose of consolidating control over health insurance.

They divided the country into fixed no-compete territories where most states only provided 2 or 3 options, some only 1.

They agreed not to poach eachother's customers, which gave them power to raise rates without having to innovate.

They also fed money into a media machine (owned by another block of massive corporations) that convinced people that health care was a competitive market, and that any intervention was socialism.

Because they had a monopoly, health costs rose more in 5 years than in the preceding 20. The costs went to pay not for innovation but a bulging "administrative" layer of profit parasites and share holders.

When middle class consumers are pinched by health costs, they cannot consume.

Which is a problem, because...

The American economy is sustained by middle class consumption. When the middle class has money to spend, the capitalist must innovate and add jobs in order to capture that spending (demand). When the middle class is broke because they can't keep up with rising health costs, no amount of tax breaks is going to cause the capitalist to invest. The capitalist will not add workers and inventory if the consumer can't afford to consume. The capitalist will not risk speculative innovation if the consumer is bankrupt.

The postwar years saw America's greatest economic growth because the government made sure the middle class was solvent enough to consume. They did this not only by supporting unions, but making sure monopolies didn't form over necessary staples like food, energy, and health care. They also provided the middle class with affordable education, as well as Social Security, Medicare, and a safety net for severe market downturns. All combined, this meant the middle class had sufficient resources to drive consumption. The capitalist, who wasn't making billions like today, had to innovate and add jobs to capture all the extra money sitting in middle class pockets.

The money that the government used to divert to middle class pockets is no longer there -- it was taken away in favor of tax cuts for the ultra wealthy. The consumer is broke and his job security has been take away by people who are bringing 3rd world labor costs to America. Lastly, as long as we have consumer-fleecing-monopolies controlling health care, the consumer will never have enough money to spend -- and there will never be an incentive to add jobs.

FYI: when Reagan cut the middle class out of the loop (in order to give the wealthy tax cuts), he tried to sustain consumption with Master Card, American Express, and Visas. People received 3 credit card offers a week.

The middle class, having lost their wages, benefits, and government programs, was forced to borrow in order to maintain the living standard Reagan promised > Morning in America.

We covered up the failure of Voodoo Economics with credit cards.

(Until the banking system broke)

And now there is nothing to drive the economy.

And the high oil consumption that Carter warned about but Reagan said was fine has become a nightmare.

America swallowed poison in 1980.

 

[Obamerican]

I want to make it clear the I despise both political parties, I have never towed a party line nor ever will I. I do not believe they are for the American people, I believe they are out for their own best interests.

But,
One of the Repub's arguments was that Americans should not be forced to buy health insurance against their will by ObamaCare, that it's illegal and unconstitutional.

Now, where the hell were they when I was being forced to buy Car Insurance?

Take the Bus instead....you chose to buy and drive a car....you need insurance.
We now have 18-21 year olds being FORCED to buy insurance...

You don't see a difference.

You live in Brooklyn. The rest of the country is not like the 12 square block you idiots live in. Have you ever even driven a car?

 

[Care4all]

fyi...public roads ARE YOUR roads, they are not the State's roads but the citizen's within the State's roads....imo.

 

[Rozman]

I want to make it clear the I despise both political parties, I have never towed a party line nor ever will I. I do not believe they are for the American people, I believe they are out for their own best interests.

But,
One of the Repub's arguments was that Americans should not be forced to buy health insurance against their will by ObamaCare, that it's illegal and unconstitutional.

Now, where the hell were they when I was being forced to buy Car Insurance?

Take the Bus instead....you chose to buy and drive a car....you need insurance.
We now have 18-21 year olds being FORCED to buy insurance...

You don't see a difference.

You live in Brooklyn. The rest of the country is not like the 12 square block you idiots live in. Have you ever even driven a car?

Have you ever thought about maybe moving to an area where there is public transportation?

To my knowledge those that live in a rural area have low car insurance compared to the rates of those who live in bigger cities..

Driving is a choice really.Entering into the work force and being young and healthy and maybe not needing health insurance at this time and being FORCED into this sham called Obamacare is something different.

 

[KissMy]

fyi...public roads ARE YOUR roads, they are not the State's roads but the citizen's within the State's roads....imo.

They are only your roads when you pay the tax to drive on them. You are not forced to pay for them. Amish people & people who walk or ride bikes do not use roads so they pay no gas tax, license tax, automobile sales tax, title tax, personal property tax or liability insurance.

 

[Skull Pilot]

A collection of very powerful corporations invested billions into Washington for the purpose of consolidating control over health insurance.

They divided the country into fixed no-compete territories where most states only provided 2 or 3 options, some only 1.

They agreed not to poach eachother's customers, which gave them power to raise rates without having to innovate.

They also fed money into a media machine (owned by another block of massive corporations) that convinced people that health care was a competitive market, and that any intervention was socialism.

Because they had a monopoly, health costs rose more in 5 years than in the preceding 20. The costs went to pay not for innovation but a bulging "administrative" layer of profit parasites and share holders.

When middle class consumers are pinched by health costs, they cannot consume.

Which is a problem, because...

The American economy is sustained by middle class consumption. When the middle class has money to spend, the capitalist must innovate and add jobs in order to capture that spending (demand). When the middle class is broke because they can't keep up with rising health costs, no amount of tax breaks is going to cause the capitalist to invest. The capitalist will not add workers and inventory if the consumer can't afford to consume. The capitalist will not risk speculative innovation if the consumer is bankrupt.

The postwar years saw America's greatest economic growth because the government made sure the middle class was solvent enough to consume. They did this not only by supporting unions, but making sure monopolies didn't form over necessary staples like food, energy, and health care. They also provided the middle class with affordable education, as well as Social Security, Medicare, and a safety net for severe market downturns. All combined, this meant the middle class had sufficient resources to drive consumption. The capitalist, who wasn't making billions like today, had to innovate and add jobs to capture all the extra money sitting in middle class pockets.

The money that the government used to divert to middle class pockets is no longer there -- it was taken away in favor of tax cuts for the ultra wealthy. The consumer is broke and his job security has been take away by people who are bringing 3rd world labor costs to America. Lastly, as long as we have consumer-fleecing-monopolies controlling health care, the consumer will never have enough money to spend -- and there will never be an incentive to add jobs.

FYI: when Reagan cut the middle class out of the loop (in order to give the wealthy tax cuts), he tried to sustain consumption with Master Card, American Express, and Visas. People received 3 credit card offers a week.

The middle class, having lost their wages, benefits, and government programs, was forced to borrow in order to maintain the living standard Reagan promised > Morning in America.

We covered up the failure of Voodoo Economics with credit cards.

(Until the banking system broke)

And now there is nothing to drive the economy.

And the high oil consumption that Carter warned about but Reagan said was fine has become a nightmare.

America swallowed poison in 1980.

It's the federal government that won't allow health insurance companies to sell across state lines.

It's just another misuse of the commerce clause.

 

[M14 Shooter]

The postwar years saw America's greatest economic growth because the government made sure the middle class was solvent enough to consume.

Yes. The middle class cannot possibly survive w/o the government to assist it.

 

[M14 Shooter]

fyi...public roads ARE YOUR roads, they are not the State's roads but the citizen's within the State's roads....imo.

The state is a seperate legal and political entity from the people.
You could argue that you own the gun issued to that police officer over there, but if you try to take it from him, you;re going to get pounded, sent to jail, and should you try to argue the above, lose every appeal.

 

[asterism]

Car insurance is not mandatory. There are ways to own and drive a car on public roads without it, one of them is offering a cash bond. There is no such alternative route to the current healthcare mandate.

 

[rightwinger]

I want to make it clear the I despise both political parties, I have never towed a party line nor ever will I. I do not believe they are for the American people, I believe they are out for their own best interests.

But,
One of the Repub's arguments was that Americans should not be forced to buy health insurance against their will by ObamaCare, that it's illegal and unconstitutional.

Now, where the hell were they when I was being forced to buy Car Insurance?

Because the states force you to buy auto insurance only if you choose to drive on roads that those states own.

The federal government has no right to force you buy health insurance from a private rip off firm merely because you have a pulse.

Is that clear enough or do I need to draw the flow charts?

So you need to have health insurance if you want to use hospitals or other medical infrastructure?

Anyone who does not have health insurance is a moron and should be committed

 

[Skull Pilot]

I want to make it clear the I despise both political parties, I have never towed a party line nor ever will I. I do not believe they are for the American people, I believe they are out for their own best interests.

But,
One of the Repub's arguments was that Americans should not be forced to buy health insurance against their will by ObamaCare, that it's illegal and unconstitutional.

Now, where the hell were they when I was being forced to buy Car Insurance?

Because the states force you to buy auto insurance only if you choose to drive on roads that those states own.

The federal government has no right to force you buy health insurance from a private rip off firm merely because you have a pulse.

Is that clear enough or do I need to draw the flow charts?

So you need to have health insurance if you want to use hospitals or other medical infrastructure?

Anyone who does not have health insurance is a moron and should be committed

Yeah I bet that diagnosis will be in the next DSM if Obama has his way.

 

[B. Kidd]

I stand corrected.

Sorry Cecilie1200, I could never get that word right, you know whether it be towed, toad, or toed. Thanks for the correction.

A toad is an amphibious animal, much like a frog.

You're welcome.

A toad is also a slang term for a car being towed behind an RV.
You've now been told about a toad that is towed.