Can GOP win if Trump isn't nominee?

[bendog]

That's the base element of Trump. Whites are being "permanently disenfranchised." When did a race have a greater right to enfranchisement than any other race? The old truism was immigrants always vote dem, but in two generations the kids will be gopers. Blacks were different, but they weren't really immigrants. We are a nation of immigrants, and blacks never totally assimilated.

Hispanics aren't either.

RW knows, that is why he keeps gloating about the "next Republican President not being born yet".

But for some odd reason it never occurred to him that this would bother GOP voters, to have the system set up so they are permanently shut out.

Strange.

Hispanics are assimilating in US society. If that escaped you , you haven't you noticed the Castro brothers, or Cruz or Rubio, nor have you been in places like Colo, the SW and yes even Socal with middle class Hispanics, whose families have been here for generations, and in some cases longer than our own.

Now if RW's correctthat the next gop potus hasn't even been born yet, that's because for some reason these middle class Hispanic citizens won't vote gop. I have to say that imo this election is Rubio's to lose, and it's not impossible that Cruz could win the nomination, so I really don't agree on RW on that exact point.

But, the reality seems to be that most third generation and latter non-Cuban Hispanics don't care for the gop. Unless, you are a racist, and I'm explicitly NOT calling you one, the reason for the reality has to be some gop policy or combination of policies. So, it seems to me the question for the gop is why their policies aren't prevailing with these folks.

In one post you say Hispanics are assimilating, but then you point out they are NOT voting like American Whites.

SO, which is it? Are they becoming like US, or staying different?

IF they stay different, as RW and I expect, then you have the scenario RW has been gloating about, with the majority of American Whites completely marginalized for generations to come.

I just think it odd that you libs seem to think that this will be a happy ending.

IMO, the failure of democracy to serve the interests of the largest single ethnic group in the nation can only be a BAD THING.

No, RW goads you. I'm merely pointing out that Hispanics are assimilating economically and socially. Yet, for some reason the gop's policies appear to them to be less in their interests that the dems. Do, you attribute that to some nefarious race-wide agenda to take stuff from whitey? Or, might they be offended by things gopers say about illegal immigrants, or might they be offended by the 1%'s use of illegal immigrants to keep wages low and profit margins high, or might they see the gop's continuing dismantlement of public higher education as not in their own self interest?

In fact, I'm pretty damn hard pressed to seeing any reason to vote for any of these shrimps running for the gop nomination ... although I think Rubio has the potential to stand on two legs.

There is no reason to go over your partisan spin on the GOP positions.

They don't matter. Changes in policy and platforms do not change minority voting patterns.

One Party Rule is coming if it is not already here.

That is the purpose of importing the Third World.

"They don't matter. Changes in policy and platforms do not change minority voting patterns." Just wanted to make sure you were really a racist.

 

[Correll]

So the GOP should be come liberal democrats? WTF is wrong with you?

Why does everything exist in the extremes with conservatives?

You just claimed the reason that we republicans can't wine Hispanic votes is our platform.

Our platform has been all over the Right and the Middle over the last 30 years. What's left?

The Republican platform has abandoned the middle in the last 20 years and has left it to the Democrats

One of the reasons they are losing swing states

The Republican's have been ideologically wedded to the idea of Free Trade, and it has hurt the Middle Class.

Some conservatives, have and are moving against that, Trump for example. It is one of the major reasons I support him.

It has not and will NOT win them the HIspanic or Black vote.

That is why you gloat about "the next Republican President not being born yet". Because even major policy changes will not change minority voting patterns.

In that you are completely right.

I agree with you with what is and will happen.

I just don't understand how you can deny the obvious effects of such a Triumph of the Democratic Party, ie that it will lead to those who have had their agenda and interests represented by the GOP, when the GOP had the power to do so, will then, obviously,

NOT have their agenda or interests represented on a national level as their representatives will ALWAYS LOSE.

Completely Marginalization of the Republican voters is a unavoidable part of completely marginalizing the Republican Party.

Surely with this huge change barreling down on us, perhaps already here, it is time to discuss what it will mean for America.

You seem to think that American Whites will "embrace" always losing and being discriminated against and not having any legal or democratic recourse.

IMO, they/we will be angry and only growing angrier as time goes on.

But on the plus side for you, you will be able to advance your lib agenda without any resistance.


Would you like to share with us you vision of how this will be a good thing?

I am very seriously honestly curious about your answer.

Once again, I have a higher respect for white males in this country than you do

Like any other demographic, I would expect them to use free speech, their vote and political contributions to keep themselves from being marginalized

You act as though the Republican Party is the only recourse for white males. I think they will eventually figure out that Republicans are more interested in protecting the wealthy than they are in protecting white males

White males?

I said Whites, not white males.

Free Speech doesn't count for jack if the Power doesn't give a damn, and you libs have shown that you don't give a damn about the interests of Whites, why would that change as political power flows AWAY from Whites?

Votes won't cut it, for all the reasons you have been gloating these last few years. (how long have you been gloating about this?)

Political Donations? LOL! Once One Party Statehood has been demonstrated the Big Money will go to the Dems to buy political favors and it will stay there forever. Any countervailing trend in donations from Whites will be buried and irrelevant.

They will lose and be discriminated against and there will be no political or legal recourse.

 

[Correll]

Hispanics aren't either.

RW knows, that is why he keeps gloating about the "next Republican President not being born yet".

But for some odd reason it never occurred to him that this would bother GOP voters, to have the system set up so they are permanently shut out.

Strange.

Hispanics are assimilating in US society. If that escaped you , you haven't you noticed the Castro brothers, or Cruz or Rubio, nor have you been in places like Colo, the SW and yes even Socal with middle class Hispanics, whose families have been here for generations, and in some cases longer than our own.

Now if RW's correctthat the next gop potus hasn't even been born yet, that's because for some reason these middle class Hispanic citizens won't vote gop. I have to say that imo this election is Rubio's to lose, and it's not impossible that Cruz could win the nomination, so I really don't agree on RW on that exact point.

But, the reality seems to be that most third generation and latter non-Cuban Hispanics don't care for the gop. Unless, you are a racist, and I'm explicitly NOT calling you one, the reason for the reality has to be some gop policy or combination of policies. So, it seems to me the question for the gop is why their policies aren't prevailing with these folks.

In one post you say Hispanics are assimilating, but then you point out they are NOT voting like American Whites.

SO, which is it? Are they becoming like US, or staying different?

IF they stay different, as RW and I expect, then you have the scenario RW has been gloating about, with the majority of American Whites completely marginalized for generations to come.

I just think it odd that you libs seem to think that this will be a happy ending.

IMO, the failure of democracy to serve the interests of the largest single ethnic group in the nation can only be a BAD THING.

No, RW goads you. I'm merely pointing out that Hispanics are assimilating economically and socially. Yet, for some reason the gop's policies appear to them to be less in their interests that the dems. Do, you attribute that to some nefarious race-wide agenda to take stuff from whitey? Or, might they be offended by things gopers say about illegal immigrants, or might they be offended by the 1%'s use of illegal immigrants to keep wages low and profit margins high, or might they see the gop's continuing dismantlement of public higher education as not in their own self interest?

In fact, I'm pretty damn hard pressed to seeing any reason to vote for any of these shrimps running for the gop nomination ... although I think Rubio has the potential to stand on two legs.

There is no reason to go over your partisan spin on the GOP positions.

They don't matter. Changes in policy and platforms do not change minority voting patterns.

One Party Rule is coming if it is not already here.

That is the purpose of importing the Third World.

"They don't matter. Changes in policy and platforms do not change minority voting patterns." Just wanted to make sure you were really a racist.

You are welcome to cite historical examples to disprove my claim.

Or fuck off you asshole.

 

[rightwinger]

Why does everything exist in the extremes with conservatives?

You just claimed the reason that we republicans can't wine Hispanic votes is our platform.

Our platform has been all over the Right and the Middle over the last 30 years. What's left?

The Republican platform has abandoned the middle in the last 20 years and has left it to the Democrats

One of the reasons they are losing swing states

The Republican's have been ideologically wedded to the idea of Free Trade, and it has hurt the Middle Class.

Some conservatives, have and are moving against that, Trump for example. It is one of the major reasons I support him.

It has not and will NOT win them the HIspanic or Black vote.

That is why you gloat about "the next Republican President not being born yet". Because even major policy changes will not change minority voting patterns.

In that you are completely right.

I agree with you with what is and will happen.

I just don't understand how you can deny the obvious effects of such a Triumph of the Democratic Party, ie that it will lead to those who have had their agenda and interests represented by the GOP, when the GOP had the power to do so, will then, obviously,

NOT have their agenda or interests represented on a national level as their representatives will ALWAYS LOSE.

Completely Marginalization of the Republican voters is a unavoidable part of completely marginalizing the Republican Party.

Surely with this huge change barreling down on us, perhaps already here, it is time to discuss what it will mean for America.

You seem to think that American Whites will "embrace" always losing and being discriminated against and not having any legal or democratic recourse.

IMO, they/we will be angry and only growing angrier as time goes on.

But on the plus side for you, you will be able to advance your lib agenda without any resistance.


Would you like to share with us you vision of how this will be a good thing?

I am very seriously honestly curious about your answer.

Once again, I have a higher respect for white males in this country than you do

Like any other demographic, I would expect them to use free speech, their vote and political contributions to keep themselves from being marginalized

You act as though the Republican Party is the only recourse for white males. I think they will eventually figure out that Republicans are more interested in protecting the wealthy than they are in protecting white males

White males?

I said Whites, not white males.

Free Speech doesn't count for jack if the Power doesn't give a damn, and you libs have shown that you don't give a damn about the interests of Whites, why would that change as political power flows AWAY from Whites?

Votes won't cut it, for all the reasons you have been gloating these last few years. (how long have you been gloating about this?)

Political Donations? LOL! Once One Party Statehood has been demonstrated the Big Money will go to the Dems to buy political favors and it will stay there forever. Any countervailing trend in donations from Whites will be buried and irrelevant.

They will lose and be discriminated against and there will be no political or legal recourse.

If Democratic Presidents are elected, how will it affect the typical white male Republican?

They won't be able to discriminate against gays, minorities, Muslims or Mexicans
They may have to go through a background check to buy guns
They may have to bake wedding cakes for gay weddings

 

[bendog]

Well, asshole, as long as people like you say the Mexicans will never vote for us, they won't.

And, unless the gop nominates an Hispanic, I think it's doomed.

 

[bendog]

You just claimed the reason that we republicans can't wine Hispanic votes is our platform.

Our platform has been all over the Right and the Middle over the last 30 years. What's left?

The Republican platform has abandoned the middle in the last 20 years and has left it to the Democrats

One of the reasons they are losing swing states

The Republican's have been ideologically wedded to the idea of Free Trade, and it has hurt the Middle Class.

Some conservatives, have and are moving against that, Trump for example. It is one of the major reasons I support him.

It has not and will NOT win them the HIspanic or Black vote.

That is why you gloat about "the next Republican President not being born yet". Because even major policy changes will not change minority voting patterns.

In that you are completely right.

I agree with you with what is and will happen.

I just don't understand how you can deny the obvious effects of such a Triumph of the Democratic Party, ie that it will lead to those who have had their agenda and interests represented by the GOP, when the GOP had the power to do so, will then, obviously,

NOT have their agenda or interests represented on a national level as their representatives will ALWAYS LOSE.

Completely Marginalization of the Republican voters is a unavoidable part of completely marginalizing the Republican Party.

Surely with this huge change barreling down on us, perhaps already here, it is time to discuss what it will mean for America.

You seem to think that American Whites will "embrace" always losing and being discriminated against and not having any legal or democratic recourse.

IMO, they/we will be angry and only growing angrier as time goes on.

But on the plus side for you, you will be able to advance your lib agenda without any resistance.


Would you like to share with us you vision of how this will be a good thing?

I am very seriously honestly curious about your answer.

Once again, I have a higher respect for white males in this country than you do

Like any other demographic, I would expect them to use free speech, their vote and political contributions to keep themselves from being marginalized

You act as though the Republican Party is the only recourse for white males. I think they will eventually figure out that Republicans are more interested in protecting the wealthy than they are in protecting white males

White males?

I said Whites, not white males.

Free Speech doesn't count for jack if the Power doesn't give a damn, and you libs have shown that you don't give a damn about the interests of Whites, why would that change as political power flows AWAY from Whites?

Votes won't cut it, for all the reasons you have been gloating these last few years. (how long have you been gloating about this?)

Political Donations? LOL! Once One Party Statehood has been demonstrated the Big Money will go to the Dems to buy political favors and it will stay there forever. Any countervailing trend in donations from Whites will be buried and irrelevant.

They will lose and be discriminated against and there will be no political or legal recourse.

If Democratic Presidents are elected, how will it affect the typical white male Republican?

They won't be able to discriminate against gays, minorities, Muslims or Mexicans
They may have to go through a background check to buy guns
They may have to bake wedding cakes for gay weddings

That is imo the proverbial nail on the head. Or to put it a little differently, so long as "minority" groups perceive one group as not wanting them in the room, they will trend to the other group.

In 2008, Obama actually won the young white vote, but in 04 and 12, it went gop. Although in 12, Obama won half the white non-Hispanic female vote.

Young Voters in the 2008 Election

Survey | Diverse, Disillusioned, and Divided: Millennial Values and Voter Engagement in the 2012 Election

http://www.civicyouth.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/CIRCLE_2012Election_GenderRace_ForWeb1.pdf

However, they are not winning the white youth vote significantly enough to make up for the drubbing amongst immigrants ... who happen to be largely latino. But if any asshole things latinos are somehow different, the gop's getting it ass kicked with Asians too.

So, unless the gop can make inroads into the latino/immigrant vote, it is doomed, at least as we know it. There will always be a conservative party, because America is, and will remain, a centrist right country .... but we were centrist right even when we had economic policies that were progressive. We were not on the verge of anarchy when TR was potus, and we weren't going commie under the New of Fair deals.

 

[Correll]

You just claimed the reason that we republicans can't wine Hispanic votes is our platform.

Our platform has been all over the Right and the Middle over the last 30 years. What's left?

The Republican platform has abandoned the middle in the last 20 years and has left it to the Democrats

One of the reasons they are losing swing states

The Republican's have been ideologically wedded to the idea of Free Trade, and it has hurt the Middle Class.

Some conservatives, have and are moving against that, Trump for example. It is one of the major reasons I support him.

It has not and will NOT win them the HIspanic or Black vote.

That is why you gloat about "the next Republican President not being born yet". Because even major policy changes will not change minority voting patterns.

In that you are completely right.

I agree with you with what is and will happen.

I just don't understand how you can deny the obvious effects of such a Triumph of the Democratic Party, ie that it will lead to those who have had their agenda and interests represented by the GOP, when the GOP had the power to do so, will then, obviously,

NOT have their agenda or interests represented on a national level as their representatives will ALWAYS LOSE.

Completely Marginalization of the Republican voters is a unavoidable part of completely marginalizing the Republican Party.

Surely with this huge change barreling down on us, perhaps already here, it is time to discuss what it will mean for America.

You seem to think that American Whites will "embrace" always losing and being discriminated against and not having any legal or democratic recourse.

IMO, they/we will be angry and only growing angrier as time goes on.

But on the plus side for you, you will be able to advance your lib agenda without any resistance.


Would you like to share with us you vision of how this will be a good thing?

I am very seriously honestly curious about your answer.

Once again, I have a higher respect for white males in this country than you do

Like any other demographic, I would expect them to use free speech, their vote and political contributions to keep themselves from being marginalized

You act as though the Republican Party is the only recourse for white males. I think they will eventually figure out that Republicans are more interested in protecting the wealthy than they are in protecting white males

White males?

I said Whites, not white males.

Free Speech doesn't count for jack if the Power doesn't give a damn, and you libs have shown that you don't give a damn about the interests of Whites, why would that change as political power flows AWAY from Whites?

Votes won't cut it, for all the reasons you have been gloating these last few years. (how long have you been gloating about this?)

Political Donations? LOL! Once One Party Statehood has been demonstrated the Big Money will go to the Dems to buy political favors and it will stay there forever. Any countervailing trend in donations from Whites will be buried and irrelevant.

They will lose and be discriminated against and there will be no political or legal recourse.

If Democratic Presidents are elected, how will it affect the typical white male Republican?

They won't be able to discriminate against gays, minorities, Muslims or Mexicans
They may have to go through a background check to buy guns
They may have to bake wedding cakes for gay weddings

Drop the male stuff, please.

Why are you being so resistant?

Ricci v. DeStefano - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

ONe justice difference and the ruling would have been in favor of blatant anti-white discrimination and Disparate Impact Theory.

Assuming your scenario, that will happen the next time a conservative justice retires.

Across the board mandated by law discrimination against whites with NO political or legal recourse for whites.

Meanwhile libs like you will be telling upset discriminated against Whites that they are racist for wanting to discriminate against "gays, minorities, Muslims or Mexicans".

Oh, yeah. That will be different.

This is one obvious example. I am sure that Dems and libs given free reign, as they will have in your scenario, will come up with many more ways to abuse their unbridled power.

Have you really never considered that those who are represented by the GOP might not share you glee in their Permanent Marginalization?

Perhaps you should give it some thought.

Meanwhile, please tell us what good stuff you think of when you have been gloating about this? What benefits do you see?

I'm really quite curious about that.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Affirmative Action has been in place for 45 years. It has been hugely successful and almost every American has benefitted from it.

We had the same threats back then about what will happen if white males no longer get all the positions of responsibility

Hate to tell you, but most whites have already accepted it

No, they have not. THat is why there has been so much roll back as with

Ricci v. DeStefano - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Rollback which will be reversed as soon as the Court gets one more lib on it.


So, you have been living in a fantasy land where the majority of Whites will be Permanently Disenfranchised and being completely fine with that...

Dude.

Seriously.

The majority of WHites do NOT agree with you, that's why they vote GOP.

They are not going to be happy about being second class citizens for the rest of their lives.

All that gap you feel when you consider my words? That is what the majority of WHites will be feeling when they are told that they are not being discriminated against, they are just not calling the shots anymore.

But they will be just as certain as you are now, that they are right and they are not goin to be happy.

You need to start checking your assumptions.

I don't think you understand what disenfranchised means

When blacks were blocked from voting....they were disenfranchised
Just because the vote goes against you does not amount to disenfranchisement

IF the system has been gamed so that the vote ALWAYS goes against you, it does amount to disenfranchisement.

And that is what you have been gloating about, with your talk of Demographic Shift and "the next Republican President hasn't been born yet".

How angry would you be if my side had managed to game the system to shut you and yours out forever? So that every President and Congress and Court was, from your viewpoint, the Far Right?

Would you "embrace that"?

The vote goes against you because you cling to out of date policies and run candidates who offend large percentages of the electorate

You are not being cheated....you are being beaten

Your side is also gaming the system by controlling the statehouses and gerrymandering congressional districts

Its not fair, but it is politics

B

BUll, you gamed the system by importing tens of millions of Third World Voters.

Those "out of date polices" are plenty popular with one demographic of young people, so that's not the issue. Unless you are claiming young white people are behind the times? lol!


IF the system has been gamed so that the vote ALWAYS goes against you, it does amount to disenfranchisement.

And that is what you have been gloating about, with your talk of Demographic Shift and "the next Republican President hasn't been born yet".

How angry would you be if my side had managed to game the system to shut you and yours out forever? So that every President and Congress and Court was, from your viewpoint, the Far Right?

Would you "embrace that"?

Sigh. The national vote has gone against us in the GOP five of the six last times. Either the GOP changes to meet the demography of the voters, or it loses. Period.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Trump can appeal to around 30% of the Republican Party (low information bigots)
That would carry over to 15% of the general electorate

If he gets the GOP nod, I assume some Republicans would hold their nose and vote Republican (more would stay home) bringing him up to maybe 40% of the popualr vote

He would lose in a landslide

The national polls say otherwise, but continue the fantasy if it makes you sleep well.

NOTE: HILLARY CLINTON WILL NEVER BE PRESIDENT, BOOK IT.

Now you are lying. National polls say women, minorities, counter culture, and millennials don't like Trump, which means he loses.

 

[Correll]

No, they have not. THat is why there has been so much roll back as with

Ricci v. DeStefano - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Rollback which will be reversed as soon as the Court gets one more lib on it.


So, you have been living in a fantasy land where the majority of Whites will be Permanently Disenfranchised and being completely fine with that...

Dude.

Seriously.

The majority of WHites do NOT agree with you, that's why they vote GOP.

They are not going to be happy about being second class citizens for the rest of their lives.

All that gap you feel when you consider my words? That is what the majority of WHites will be feeling when they are told that they are not being discriminated against, they are just not calling the shots anymore.

But they will be just as certain as you are now, that they are right and they are not goin to be happy.

You need to start checking your assumptions.

I don't think you understand what disenfranchised means

When blacks were blocked from voting....they were disenfranchised
Just because the vote goes against you does not amount to disenfranchisement

IF the system has been gamed so that the vote ALWAYS goes against you, it does amount to disenfranchisement.

And that is what you have been gloating about, with your talk of Demographic Shift and "the next Republican President hasn't been born yet".

How angry would you be if my side had managed to game the system to shut you and yours out forever? So that every President and Congress and Court was, from your viewpoint, the Far Right?

Would you "embrace that"?

The vote goes against you because you cling to out of date policies and run candidates who offend large percentages of the electorate

You are not being cheated....you are being beaten

Your side is also gaming the system by controlling the statehouses and gerrymandering congressional districts

Its not fair, but it is politics

B

BUll, you gamed the system by importing tens of millions of Third World Voters.

Those "out of date polices" are plenty popular with one demographic of young people, so that's not the issue. Unless you are claiming young white people are behind the times? lol!


IF the system has been gamed so that the vote ALWAYS goes against you, it does amount to disenfranchisement.

And that is what you have been gloating about, with your talk of Demographic Shift and "the next Republican President hasn't been born yet".

How angry would you be if my side had managed to game the system to shut you and yours out forever? So that every President and Congress and Court was, from your viewpoint, the Far Right?

Would you "embrace that"?

Sigh. The national vote has gone against us in the GOP five of the six last times. Either the GOP changes to meet the demography of the voters, or it loses. Period.

Reagan granted amnesty. It got him nothing.

GWBush supported amnesty, so did McCain, it got them nothing.

WHat magic fix do you have in mind that decades of GOP strategists, leaders and activists not thought of?

Inquirering minds want to know.

 

[Correll]

Trump can appeal to around 30% of the Republican Party (low information bigots)
That would carry over to 15% of the general electorate

If he gets the GOP nod, I assume some Republicans would hold their nose and vote Republican (more would stay home) bringing him up to maybe 40% of the popualr vote

He would lose in a landslide

The national polls say otherwise, but continue the fantasy if it makes you sleep well.

NOTE: HILLARY CLINTON WILL NEVER BE PRESIDENT, BOOK IT.

Now you are lying. National polls say women, minorities, counter culture, and millennials don't like Trump, which means he loses.

Current polls show him trailing by only 4 and a half points. He has a real chance of overcoming that and winning.

 

[JakeStarkey]

The vote goes against you because you cling to out of date policies and run candidates who offend large percentages of the electorate

You are not being cheated....you are being beaten

Your side is also gaming the system by controlling the statehouses and gerrymandering congressional districts

Its not fair, but it is politics

B

BUll, you gamed the system by importing tens of millions of Third World Voters.

Those "out of date polices" are plenty popular with one demographic of young people, so that's not the issue. Unless you are claiming young white people are behind the times? lol!


IF the system has been gamed so that the vote ALWAYS goes against you, it does amount to disenfranchisement.

And that is what you have been gloating about, with your talk of Demographic Shift and "the next Republican President hasn't been born yet".

How angry would you be if my side had managed to game the system to shut you and yours out forever? So that every President and Congress and Court was, from your viewpoint, the Far Right?

Would you "embrace that"?

Only American citizens can vote
They came her for a better life not because Democrats brought them in

The next Republican President has not been born yet because Republicans have not evolved their policies to reflect current demographics. 1950s Republicans could have won in todays environment, todays Republicans can't

I said nothing about illegals. I'm talking legal Third World Immigration as per the 1964 Immigration Act lied about by Ted Kennedy.

"Current Demographics" are a result of that move to "game the system".

I can see that you are in a state of Denial over the long term results of your sides policies.

If you do not like the idea of Permanently Disenfranchising the largest single ethnic group in the US, then you should not be gloating about it.

I keep asking you how you think Whites will react, or how you would react to the situation you describe if it were reversed.

You never answer me.

That's the base element of Trump. Whites are being "permanently disenfranchised." When did a race have a greater right to enfranchisement than any other race? The old truism was immigrants always vote dem, but in two generations the kids will be gopers. Blacks were different, but they weren't really immigrants. We are a nation of immigrants, and blacks never totally assimilated.

Hispanics aren't either.

RW knows, that is why he keeps gloating about the "next Republican President not being born yet".

But for some odd reason it never occurred to him that this would bother GOP voters, to have the system set up so they are permanently shut out.

Strange.

The GOP is not shut out of the system. It can respond to the voters' wants and needs, which is how our system works. The party, when in the minority, cannot impose its principles. You understand that?

 

[JakeStarkey]

A devout muslim cannot swear loyalty to the US constitution without denouncing his/her faith.

When I swore loyalty to the US Constitution when I became a citizen, there were Muslims also there swearing loyalty to the US Constitution. No one was denouncing their faith.

Not openly they weren't. You also do not know what was in their minds when they said those words of loyalty, do you?

The Koran allows lying if it results in Islam becoming stronger. The ignorance of many about the teachings and philosophy of Islam is amazing.

You are a ding a ling, you know that. You have no idea what is in another person's mind. Yet you accuse Toro of not knowing while you say you know. You are a fucking fruit loop.

 

[bendog]

No, they have not. THat is why there has been so much roll back as with

Ricci v. DeStefano - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Rollback which will be reversed as soon as the Court gets one more lib on it.


So, you have been living in a fantasy land where the majority of Whites will be Permanently Disenfranchised and being completely fine with that...

Dude.

Seriously.

The majority of WHites do NOT agree with you, that's why they vote GOP.

They are not going to be happy about being second class citizens for the rest of their lives.

All that gap you feel when you consider my words? That is what the majority of WHites will be feeling when they are told that they are not being discriminated against, they are just not calling the shots anymore.

But they will be just as certain as you are now, that they are right and they are not goin to be happy.

You need to start checking your assumptions.

I don't think you understand what disenfranchised means

When blacks were blocked from voting....they were disenfranchised
Just because the vote goes against you does not amount to disenfranchisement

IF the system has been gamed so that the vote ALWAYS goes against you, it does amount to disenfranchisement.

And that is what you have been gloating about, with your talk of Demographic Shift and "the next Republican President hasn't been born yet".

How angry would you be if my side had managed to game the system to shut you and yours out forever? So that every President and Congress and Court was, from your viewpoint, the Far Right?

Would you "embrace that"?

The vote goes against you because you cling to out of date policies and run candidates who offend large percentages of the electorate

You are not being cheated....you are being beaten

Your side is also gaming the system by controlling the statehouses and gerrymandering congressional districts

Its not fair, but it is politics

B

BUll, you gamed the system by importing tens of millions of Third World Voters.

Those "out of date polices" are plenty popular with one demographic of young people, so that's not the issue. Unless you are claiming young white people are behind the times? lol!


IF the system has been gamed so that the vote ALWAYS goes against you, it does amount to disenfranchisement.

And that is what you have been gloating about, with your talk of Demographic Shift and "the next Republican President hasn't been born yet".

How angry would you be if my side had managed to game the system to shut you and yours out forever? So that every President and Congress and Court was, from your viewpoint, the Far Right?

Would you "embrace that"?

Sigh. The national vote has gone against us in the GOP five of the six last times. Either the GOP changes to meet the demography of the voters, or it loses. Period.

It's a funny thing. IF you really listen to what the Kochs say, it's true that taking impediments out of a market would allow more people to win. Yet, in practice, when the gop talks about simplifying the tax code, it ends up in making it LESS progressive. And people wonder why the gop loses natl elections.

 

[Correll]

B

BUll, you gamed the system by importing tens of millions of Third World Voters.

Those "out of date polices" are plenty popular with one demographic of young people, so that's not the issue. Unless you are claiming young white people are behind the times? lol!


IF the system has been gamed so that the vote ALWAYS goes against you, it does amount to disenfranchisement.

And that is what you have been gloating about, with your talk of Demographic Shift and "the next Republican President hasn't been born yet".

How angry would you be if my side had managed to game the system to shut you and yours out forever? So that every President and Congress and Court was, from your viewpoint, the Far Right?

Would you "embrace that"?

Only American citizens can vote
They came her for a better life not because Democrats brought them in

The next Republican President has not been born yet because Republicans have not evolved their policies to reflect current demographics. 1950s Republicans could have won in todays environment, todays Republicans can't

I said nothing about illegals. I'm talking legal Third World Immigration as per the 1964 Immigration Act lied about by Ted Kennedy.

"Current Demographics" are a result of that move to "game the system".

I can see that you are in a state of Denial over the long term results of your sides policies.

If you do not like the idea of Permanently Disenfranchising the largest single ethnic group in the US, then you should not be gloating about it.

I keep asking you how you think Whites will react, or how you would react to the situation you describe if it were reversed.

You never answer me.

That's the base element of Trump. Whites are being "permanently disenfranchised." When did a race have a greater right to enfranchisement than any other race? The old truism was immigrants always vote dem, but in two generations the kids will be gopers. Blacks were different, but they weren't really immigrants. We are a nation of immigrants, and blacks never totally assimilated.

Hispanics aren't either.

RW knows, that is why he keeps gloating about the "next Republican President not being born yet".

But for some odd reason it never occurred to him that this would bother GOP voters, to have the system set up so they are permanently shut out.

Strange.

The GOP is not shut out of the system. It can respond to the voters' wants and needs, which is how our system works. The party, when in the minority, cannot impose its principles. You understand that?

My post is in the context of RW scenario where demographic shift Permanently Marginalizes the GOP so that they are always in the minority and thus will NEVER be able to "impose it's principles".

All I was doing was pointing out that the people who the GOP represents their "wants and needs" will be much less happy about this development than him.

 

[oreo]

Does the GOP establishment really think it can win with a establishment candidate like Rubio or Bush or Christie? I mean they would have to have the vast majority of Trump supporters support the eventual nominee...I for one WILL NOT support anyone BUT Trump did same thing in 2012 and 2008. I was just reading an article that says Trump has given working class whites and blacks a voice and that the establishment would have to gain those if he is to lose the nomination. I just don't see it happening. Those working class whites DON'T support the GOP establishment for a REASON. What do yall think? Will the GOP cut off its nose to spite its face?

The problem you have is Trump can't win the White House. Historically the GOP nominee has to capture at least 40% of Hispanic vote to win the White House. Trump is polling at a Negative 75% with them. So he has successfully run off 17% of the population. This means he would have to capture about 95% of the white vote to win, and there's not a snowballs chance of that happening. Plus he is losing women by 2 to 1.
GOP Win Will Need More Than 40 Percent Of Latino 2016 Vote, Says Study
Poll: 75% of Latinos Have Negative View of Donald Trump
The GOP's woman problem goes beyond Trump

Republicans keep acting like they're the majority party in this country, they aren't. They are in fact the minority party at 41 million, Democrats are stronger at 46 million, and Independents are the majority today representing 40% of the electorate.

In 2012 Republicans were successful at chasing off women. They lost them by double digits, younger women by a whopping 36 points. In 2016, they have chased off Hispanics, making it impossible to win the White House. Ted Cruz, Mike Huckabee, & Bobby Jindal showing up for a Gay hate party a couple of weeks ago in Iowa aren't helping anything either. That's made the headlines.

But there is one very happy gal, that wants to give a shout-out to all you Trump supporters, and those that support far right candidates, that are great for getting a lot of negative news coverage.

Hillary Clinton will probably be the next POTUS because of YOU.

 

[bendog]

Does the GOP establishment really think it can win with a establishment candidate like Rubio or Bush or Christie? I mean they would have to have the vast majority of Trump supporters support the eventual nominee...I for one WILL NOT support anyone BUT Trump did same thing in 2012 and 2008. I was just reading an article that says Trump has given working class whites and blacks a voice and that the establishment would have to gain those if he is to lose the nomination. I just don't see it happening. Those working class whites DON'T support the GOP establishment for a REASON. What do yall think? Will the GOP cut off its nose to spite its face?

The problem you have is Trump can't win the White House. Historically the GOP nominee has to capture at least 40% of Hispanic vote to win the White House. Trump is polling at a Negative 75% with them, and he has successfully run off 17% of the population. This means he would have to capture about 95% of the white vote to win, and there's not a snowballs chance of that happening. Plus he is losing women by 2 to 1.
GOP Win Will Need More Than 40 Percent Of Latino 2016 Vote, Says Study
Poll: 75% of Latinos Have Negative View of Donald Trump
The GOP's woman problem goes beyond Trump

Republicans keep acting like they're the majority party in this country, they aren't. They are in fact the minority party at 41 million, Democrats are stronger at 46 million, and Independents are the majority today representing 40% of the electorate.

In 2012 Republicans were successful at chasing off women. They lost them by double digits, younger women by a whopping 36 points. In 2016, they have chased off Hispanics, making it impossible to win the White House. Ted Cruz, Mike Huckabee, & Bobby Jindal showing up for a Gay hate party a couple of weeks ago in Iowa aren't helping anything either. That's made the headlines.

But there is one very happy gal, that wants to give a shout-out to all you Trump supporters, and those that support far right candidates, that are great for getting a lot of negative news coverage.

Hillary Clinton will probably be the next POTUS because of YOU.

That post has Budweiser real men of genius potential. LOL

 

[JakeStarkey]

The far right of the GOP will elect HRC if the sane Republicans can't stop them.

 

[rightwinger]

The Republican platform has abandoned the middle in the last 20 years and has left it to the Democrats

One of the reasons they are losing swing states

The Republican's have been ideologically wedded to the idea of Free Trade, and it has hurt the Middle Class.

Some conservatives, have and are moving against that, Trump for example. It is one of the major reasons I support him.

It has not and will NOT win them the HIspanic or Black vote.

That is why you gloat about "the next Republican President not being born yet". Because even major policy changes will not change minority voting patterns.

In that you are completely right.

I agree with you with what is and will happen.

I just don't understand how you can deny the obvious effects of such a Triumph of the Democratic Party, ie that it will lead to those who have had their agenda and interests represented by the GOP, when the GOP had the power to do so, will then, obviously,

NOT have their agenda or interests represented on a national level as their representatives will ALWAYS LOSE.

Completely Marginalization of the Republican voters is a unavoidable part of completely marginalizing the Republican Party.

Surely with this huge change barreling down on us, perhaps already here, it is time to discuss what it will mean for America.

You seem to think that American Whites will "embrace" always losing and being discriminated against and not having any legal or democratic recourse.

IMO, they/we will be angry and only growing angrier as time goes on.

But on the plus side for you, you will be able to advance your lib agenda without any resistance.


Would you like to share with us you vision of how this will be a good thing?

I am very seriously honestly curious about your answer.

Once again, I have a higher respect for white males in this country than you do

Like any other demographic, I would expect them to use free speech, their vote and political contributions to keep themselves from being marginalized

You act as though the Republican Party is the only recourse for white males. I think they will eventually figure out that Republicans are more interested in protecting the wealthy than they are in protecting white males

White males?

I said Whites, not white males.

Free Speech doesn't count for jack if the Power doesn't give a damn, and you libs have shown that you don't give a damn about the interests of Whites, why would that change as political power flows AWAY from Whites?

Votes won't cut it, for all the reasons you have been gloating these last few years. (how long have you been gloating about this?)

Political Donations? LOL! Once One Party Statehood has been demonstrated the Big Money will go to the Dems to buy political favors and it will stay there forever. Any countervailing trend in donations from Whites will be buried and irrelevant.

They will lose and be discriminated against and there will be no political or legal recourse.

If Democratic Presidents are elected, how will it affect the typical white male Republican?

They won't be able to discriminate against gays, minorities, Muslims or Mexicans
They may have to go through a background check to buy guns
They may have to bake wedding cakes for gay weddings

That is imo the proverbial nail on the head. Or to put it a little differently, so long as "minority" groups perceive one group as not wanting them in the room, they will trend to the other group.

In 2008, Obama actually won the young white vote, but in 04 and 12, it went gop. Although in 12, Obama won half the white non-Hispanic female vote.

Young Voters in the 2008 Election

Survey | Diverse, Disillusioned, and Divided: Millennial Values and Voter Engagement in the 2012 Election

http://www.civicyouth.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/CIRCLE_2012Election_GenderRace_ForWeb1.pdf

However, they are not winning the white youth vote significantly enough to make up for the drubbing amongst immigrants ... who happen to be largely latino. But if any asshole things latinos are somehow different, the gop's getting it ass kicked with Asians too.

So, unless the gop can make inroads into the latino/immigrant vote, it is doomed, at least as we know it. There will always be a conservative party, because America is, and will remain, a centrist right country .... but we were centrist right even when we had economic policies that were progressive. We were not on the verge of anarchy when TR was potus, and we weren't going commie under the New of Fair deals.

Conservatives will remain a strong presence ...just not in the White House

 

[Redfish]

You just claimed the reason that we republicans can't wine Hispanic votes is our platform.

Our platform has been all over the Right and the Middle over the last 30 years. What's left?

The Republican platform has abandoned the middle in the last 20 years and has left it to the Democrats

One of the reasons they are losing swing states

The Republican's have been ideologically wedded to the idea of Free Trade, and it has hurt the Middle Class.

Some conservatives, have and are moving against that, Trump for example. It is one of the major reasons I support him.

It has not and will NOT win them the HIspanic or Black vote.

That is why you gloat about "the next Republican President not being born yet". Because even major policy changes will not change minority voting patterns.

In that you are completely right.

I agree with you with what is and will happen.

I just don't understand how you can deny the obvious effects of such a Triumph of the Democratic Party, ie that it will lead to those who have had their agenda and interests represented by the GOP, when the GOP had the power to do so, will then, obviously,

NOT have their agenda or interests represented on a national level as their representatives will ALWAYS LOSE.

Completely Marginalization of the Republican voters is a unavoidable part of completely marginalizing the Republican Party.

Surely with this huge change barreling down on us, perhaps already here, it is time to discuss what it will mean for America.

You seem to think that American Whites will "embrace" always losing and being discriminated against and not having any legal or democratic recourse.

IMO, they/we will be angry and only growing angrier as time goes on.

But on the plus side for you, you will be able to advance your lib agenda without any resistance.


Would you like to share with us you vision of how this will be a good thing?

I am very seriously honestly curious about your answer.

Once again, I have a higher respect for white males in this country than you do

Like any other demographic, I would expect them to use free speech, their vote and political contributions to keep themselves from being marginalized

You act as though the Republican Party is the only recourse for white males. I think they will eventually figure out that Republicans are more interested in protecting the wealthy than they are in protecting white males

White males?

I said Whites, not white males.

Free Speech doesn't count for jack if the Power doesn't give a damn, and you libs have shown that you don't give a damn about the interests of Whites, why would that change as political power flows AWAY from Whites?

Votes won't cut it, for all the reasons you have been gloating these last few years. (how long have you been gloating about this?)

Political Donations? LOL! Once One Party Statehood has been demonstrated the Big Money will go to the Dems to buy political favors and it will stay there forever. Any countervailing trend in donations from Whites will be buried and irrelevant.

They will lose and be discriminated against and there will be no political or legal recourse.

If Democratic Presidents are elected, how will it affect the typical white male Republican?

They won't be able to discriminate against gays, minorities, Muslims or Mexicans
They may have to go through a background check to buy guns
They may have to bake wedding cakes for gay weddings

total horseshit.

no one supports any kind of discrimination. Affirmative action is a form of discrimination. Equal opportunity is not discrimination even if some are more successful than others

Background checks are already required to buy guns, and that's a good thing.

So freedom only applies to gays? A baker doesn't have the freedom to do business with who he chooses? How about muslim bakers? Can they refuse service to gays?

the truth is that if a dem is elected president.

taxes will go up
freedoms will be taken away
the USA will be weaker militarily and fiscally
the national debt will continue to increase until the entire budget is required to pay the interest on it.