CDZ Can America function like this?

[Mac1958]

If you disagree with the premise, please pipe up, I'd like to hear that too.

It seems to me that national politics have essentially decayed into an ongoing contest of smears, innuendo, accusation, condemnation and conspiracy theories. Not to mention, outright lies. And obviously, if the Democrats gain back control, that certainly is not going to change.

Yes, it has "always been like this". But in the age of the internet, instant news, and fake news, the noise is like nothing ever seen.

So I guess I have two questions:

1. Can the government function properly, can it move the country forward, when so little attention is paid to issues? And when debate of the issues amounts to little more than simplistic bumper sticker sloganeering, wedged in between smears and attacks?

2. Do we not think that many of our Best & Brightest are going to stay away from politics because of this trend?
.

 

[G.T.]

In the top ten richest Countries per-capita in the world, out of 195.
Strongest Military in the world, out of 195.
#18 in quality of life, out of 195.
#53 for life expectancy, out of 195 - - - (isn't as bad as it seems because there's no statistical difference in giant clusters in the top 100)

“The children now love luxury. They have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise.” - Socrates

 

[gipper]

Politics has always sucked. You might check quotes from Mark Twain. That said because the DNCMSM so hates Trump, they are making it even worse.

No one really successful and smart goes into politics. Only criminals go into politics.

It was said long ago, the worst among us go into politics.

 

[TNHarley]

Can the government function properly, can it move the country forward
Obviously not. Not even when "times like these" isnt a problem apparently..
Answer to number 2 is probably IMO. That just makes sense..

Our problem isnt just the politicians, the internet, the media etc. It is also our voting block.
WE THE PEOPLE give ourselves shitty options that strive in environments built on fear and stupidity. "we MUST vote for the duopoly even though its evil versus complete fucking stupidity"

Notice the first few people to drop out of their campaigns last year were the sane ones? Specifically jim webb and rand paul. They didnt have a chance. Werent extreme enough. Sought solutions instead of band-aids and redundancy

 

[OldLady]

If you disagree with the premise, please pipe up, I'd like to hear that too.

It seems to me that national politics have essentially decayed into an ongoing contest of smears, innuendo, accusation, condemnation and conspiracy theories. Not to mention, outright lies. And obviously, if the Democrats gain back control, that certainly is not going to change.

Yes, it has "always been like this". But in the age of the internet, instant news, and fake news, the noise is like nothing ever seen.

So I guess I have two questions:

1. Can the government function properly, can it move the country forward, when so little attention is paid to issues? And when debate of the issues amounts to little more than simplistic bumper sticker sloganeering, wedged in between smears and attacks?

2. Do we not think that many of our Best & Brightest are going to stay away from politics because of this trend?
.

What do you propose, Mac, to get us on a better track? Continually harping on how bad our system is doesn't actually fix it, does it?
I'd love to see Super PACS outlawed. I'd love to see all campaigners allotted a specific amount of money and they can't spend more than that. It will never happen, though, because the exact same people who depend on all that money are the ones who would have to vote in those rules, aren't they?

 

[G.T.]

"Pessimism leads to weakness, optimism to power." ~ William James

 

[TNHarley]

If you disagree with the premise, please pipe up, I'd like to hear that too.

It seems to me that national politics have essentially decayed into an ongoing contest of smears, innuendo, accusation, condemnation and conspiracy theories. Not to mention, outright lies. And obviously, if the Democrats gain back control, that certainly is not going to change.

Yes, it has "always been like this". But in the age of the internet, instant news, and fake news, the noise is like nothing ever seen.

So I guess I have two questions:

1. Can the government function properly, can it move the country forward, when so little attention is paid to issues? And when debate of the issues amounts to little more than simplistic bumper sticker sloganeering, wedged in between smears and attacks?

2. Do we not think that many of our Best & Brightest are going to stay away from politics because of this trend?
.

What do you propose, Mac, to get us on a better track? Continually harping on how bad our system is doesn't actually fix it, does it?
I'd love to see Super PACS outlawed. I'd love to see all campaigners allotted a specific amount of money and they can't spend more than that. It will never happen, though, because the exact same people who depend on all that money are the ones who would have to vote in those rules, aren't they?

It cant just happen with one person.
Im with you on the spending. I would prefer all federal campaigns be paid for by the tax payers with a small set amount. No need to spend a million dollars on nothing more than saying your opponent wants to run over children with their vehicles.

 

[Mac1958]

If you disagree with the premise, please pipe up, I'd like to hear that too.

It seems to me that national politics have essentially decayed into an ongoing contest of smears, innuendo, accusation, condemnation and conspiracy theories. Not to mention, outright lies. And obviously, if the Democrats gain back control, that certainly is not going to change.

Yes, it has "always been like this". But in the age of the internet, instant news, and fake news, the noise is like nothing ever seen.

So I guess I have two questions:

1. Can the government function properly, can it move the country forward, when so little attention is paid to issues? And when debate of the issues amounts to little more than simplistic bumper sticker sloganeering, wedged in between smears and attacks?

2. Do we not think that many of our Best & Brightest are going to stay away from politics because of this trend?
.

What do you propose, Mac, to get us on a better track? Continually harping on how bad our system is doesn't actually fix it, does it?
I'd love to see Super PACS outlawed. I'd love to see all campaigners allotted a specific amount of money and they can't spend more than that. It will never happen, though, because the exact same people who depend on all that money are the ones who would have to vote in those rules, aren't they?

In terms of process, I make the same proposal to change DC regularly, my apologies that you have clearly not seen it:

1. Short Term Limits
2. Publicly-funded elections
3. Balanced Budget Amendment

Unfortunately, that does not address the behaviors I listed. I don't have answers for that. I'll try not to continually harp on them in the future.
.

 

[Auld Phart]

In the top ten richest Countries per-capita in the world, out of 195.
Strongest Military in the world, out of 195.
#18 in quality of life, out of 195.
#53 for life expectancy, out of 195 - - - (isn't as bad as it seems because there's no statistical difference in giant clusters in the top 100)

“The children now love luxury. They have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise.” - Socrates

Was that before, or after the fall of the Roman Empire?

 

[jon_berzerk]

If you disagree with the premise, please pipe up, I'd like to hear that too.

It seems to me that national politics have essentially decayed into an ongoing contest of smears, innuendo, accusation, condemnation and conspiracy theories. Not to mention, outright lies. And obviously, if the Democrats gain back control, that certainly is not going to change.

Yes, it has "always been like this". But in the age of the internet, instant news, and fake news, the noise is like nothing ever seen.

So I guess I have two questions:

1. Can the government function properly, can it move the country forward, when so little attention is paid to issues? And when debate of the issues amounts to little more than simplistic bumper sticker sloganeering, wedged in between smears and attacks?

2. Do we not think that many of our Best & Brightest are going to stay away from politics because of this trend?
.

people are fed up

that is why outside the box guys like Trump are winning

expect to see more

if that fails whats left

states calling for a Constitutional Convention

which throws the whole hill out of the game

 

[TNHarley]

If you disagree with the premise, please pipe up, I'd like to hear that too.

It seems to me that national politics have essentially decayed into an ongoing contest of smears, innuendo, accusation, condemnation and conspiracy theories. Not to mention, outright lies. And obviously, if the Democrats gain back control, that certainly is not going to change.

Yes, it has "always been like this". But in the age of the internet, instant news, and fake news, the noise is like nothing ever seen.

So I guess I have two questions:

1. Can the government function properly, can it move the country forward, when so little attention is paid to issues? And when debate of the issues amounts to little more than simplistic bumper sticker sloganeering, wedged in between smears and attacks?

2. Do we not think that many of our Best & Brightest are going to stay away from politics because of this trend?
.

What do you propose, Mac, to get us on a better track? Continually harping on how bad our system is doesn't actually fix it, does it?
I'd love to see Super PACS outlawed. I'd love to see all campaigners allotted a specific amount of money and they can't spend more than that. It will never happen, though, because the exact same people who depend on all that money are the ones who would have to vote in those rules, aren't they?

In terms of process, I make the same proposal to change DC regularly, my apologies that you have clearly not seen it:

1. Short Term Limits
2. Publicly-funded elections
3. Balanced Budget Amendment

Unfortunately, that does not address the behaviors I listed. I don't have answers for that. I'll try not to continually harp on them in the future.
.

term limits? Why? So we can replace one jallopy with another?
No term limits arent the problem. The voters are.
11% satisfaction rate 95% re-election rate

 

[JoeB131]

If you disagree with the premise, please pipe up, I'd like to hear that too.

It seems to me that national politics have essentially decayed into an ongoing contest of smears, innuendo, accusation, condemnation and conspiracy theories. Not to mention, outright lies. And obviously, if the Democrats gain back control, that certainly is not going to change.

Yes, it has "always been like this". But in the age of the internet, instant news, and fake news, the noise is like nothing ever seen.

So I guess I have two questions:

1. Can the government function properly, can it move the country forward, when so little attention is paid to issues? And when debate of the issues amounts to little more than simplistic bumper sticker sloganeering, wedged in between smears and attacks?

2. Do we not think that many of our Best & Brightest are going to stay away from politics because of this trend?
.

As usual, you start out with a faulty premise and argue it.

sorry, it has always been like this, I remember when Clinton was accused of killing Vince Foster and Reagan was going to Blow Up the World. I'm sure even crazier stuff was said before that.

I do think there is an issue with how news is delivered. Back in the day, you only had a few sources who made an effort to be even-handed. (Yes, the media had a liberal bias, but so does reality). Today, media is niche marketed. Liberal- tune into MSNBC, Trump is going to be impeached any day no. Conservative, tune into Fox, there's soooo much winning!!!! Whatever gets people to tune in, that's what we'll say.

The movie Network predicted this 40 years ago, except that compared to our Media Celebrities, Howard Beale looks relatively restrained.

So to answer your questions-

1) We can move the country forward when we have leaders who know what they are doing, and people willing to make the effort. The real problem isn't that people are "uninformed", it's that they don't want to make the effort. They want government to do all this stuff for them and they don't want to pay for it.

2) We don't want the "best and the brightest", even when they do run. We've never been a country that elects "the smartest guy in the room". We elect the guy who makes us feel good- Reagan, Clinton, Bush, Obama, Trump. The successful ones are the ones who surround themselves with people who actually can run the country.

 

[Mac1958]

If you disagree with the premise, please pipe up, I'd like to hear that too.

It seems to me that national politics have essentially decayed into an ongoing contest of smears, innuendo, accusation, condemnation and conspiracy theories. Not to mention, outright lies. And obviously, if the Democrats gain back control, that certainly is not going to change.

Yes, it has "always been like this". But in the age of the internet, instant news, and fake news, the noise is like nothing ever seen.

So I guess I have two questions:

1. Can the government function properly, can it move the country forward, when so little attention is paid to issues? And when debate of the issues amounts to little more than simplistic bumper sticker sloganeering, wedged in between smears and attacks?

2. Do we not think that many of our Best & Brightest are going to stay away from politics because of this trend?
.

What do you propose, Mac, to get us on a better track? Continually harping on how bad our system is doesn't actually fix it, does it?
I'd love to see Super PACS outlawed. I'd love to see all campaigners allotted a specific amount of money and they can't spend more than that. It will never happen, though, because the exact same people who depend on all that money are the ones who would have to vote in those rules, aren't they?

In terms of process, I make the same proposal to change DC regularly, my apologies that you have clearly not seen it:

1. Short Term Limits
2. Publicly-funded elections
3. Balanced Budget Amendment

Unfortunately, that does not address the behaviors I listed. I don't have answers for that. I'll try not to continually harp on them in the future.
.

term limits? Why? So we can replace one jallopy with another?
No term limits arent the problem. The voters are.
11% satisfaction rate 95% re-election rate

It's easier to change systems than humans.
.

 

[TNHarley]

If you disagree with the premise, please pipe up, I'd like to hear that too.

It seems to me that national politics have essentially decayed into an ongoing contest of smears, innuendo, accusation, condemnation and conspiracy theories. Not to mention, outright lies. And obviously, if the Democrats gain back control, that certainly is not going to change.

Yes, it has "always been like this". But in the age of the internet, instant news, and fake news, the noise is like nothing ever seen.

So I guess I have two questions:

1. Can the government function properly, can it move the country forward, when so little attention is paid to issues? And when debate of the issues amounts to little more than simplistic bumper sticker sloganeering, wedged in between smears and attacks?

2. Do we not think that many of our Best & Brightest are going to stay away from politics because of this trend?
.

people are fed up

that is why outside the box guys like Trump are winning

expect to see more

if that fails whats left

states calling for a Constitutional Convention

which throws the whole hill out of the game

Good point.
Trump shows complete desperation.

 

[TNHarley]

If you disagree with the premise, please pipe up, I'd like to hear that too.

It seems to me that national politics have essentially decayed into an ongoing contest of smears, innuendo, accusation, condemnation and conspiracy theories. Not to mention, outright lies. And obviously, if the Democrats gain back control, that certainly is not going to change.

Yes, it has "always been like this". But in the age of the internet, instant news, and fake news, the noise is like nothing ever seen.

So I guess I have two questions:

1. Can the government function properly, can it move the country forward, when so little attention is paid to issues? And when debate of the issues amounts to little more than simplistic bumper sticker sloganeering, wedged in between smears and attacks?

2. Do we not think that many of our Best & Brightest are going to stay away from politics because of this trend?
.

What do you propose, Mac, to get us on a better track? Continually harping on how bad our system is doesn't actually fix it, does it?
I'd love to see Super PACS outlawed. I'd love to see all campaigners allotted a specific amount of money and they can't spend more than that. It will never happen, though, because the exact same people who depend on all that money are the ones who would have to vote in those rules, aren't they?

In terms of process, I make the same proposal to change DC regularly, my apologies that you have clearly not seen it:

1. Short Term Limits
2. Publicly-funded elections
3. Balanced Budget Amendment

Unfortunately, that does not address the behaviors I listed. I don't have answers for that. I'll try not to continually harp on them in the future.
.

term limits? Why? So we can replace one jallopy with another?
No term limits arent the problem. The voters are.
11% satisfaction rate 95% re-election rate

It's easier to change systems than humans.
.

So we will replace one jallopy with another... Doesnt sound like much of a solution.. Sounds like a lazy band-aid..
Do you work in Washington? lol

 

[Mac1958]

If you disagree with the premise, please pipe up, I'd like to hear that too.

It seems to me that national politics have essentially decayed into an ongoing contest of smears, innuendo, accusation, condemnation and conspiracy theories. Not to mention, outright lies. And obviously, if the Democrats gain back control, that certainly is not going to change.

Yes, it has "always been like this". But in the age of the internet, instant news, and fake news, the noise is like nothing ever seen.

So I guess I have two questions:

1. Can the government function properly, can it move the country forward, when so little attention is paid to issues? And when debate of the issues amounts to little more than simplistic bumper sticker sloganeering, wedged in between smears and attacks?

2. Do we not think that many of our Best & Brightest are going to stay away from politics because of this trend?
.

What do you propose, Mac, to get us on a better track? Continually harping on how bad our system is doesn't actually fix it, does it?
I'd love to see Super PACS outlawed. I'd love to see all campaigners allotted a specific amount of money and they can't spend more than that. It will never happen, though, because the exact same people who depend on all that money are the ones who would have to vote in those rules, aren't they?

In terms of process, I make the same proposal to change DC regularly, my apologies that you have clearly not seen it:

1. Short Term Limits
2. Publicly-funded elections
3. Balanced Budget Amendment

Unfortunately, that does not address the behaviors I listed. I don't have answers for that. I'll try not to continually harp on them in the future.
.

term limits? Why? So we can replace one jallopy with another?
No term limits arent the problem. The voters are.
11% satisfaction rate 95% re-election rate

It's easier to change systems than humans.
.

So we will replace one jallopy with another... Doesnt sound like much of a solution.. Sounds like a lazy band-aid..
Do you work in Washington? lol

Well, we can get serious and work to change things, or just keep them the way they are.

Personally, I don't see the rapidly-decaying status quo as a smart option.
.

 

[TNHarley]

What do you propose, Mac, to get us on a better track? Continually harping on how bad our system is doesn't actually fix it, does it?
I'd love to see Super PACS outlawed. I'd love to see all campaigners allotted a specific amount of money and they can't spend more than that. It will never happen, though, because the exact same people who depend on all that money are the ones who would have to vote in those rules, aren't they?

In terms of process, I make the same proposal to change DC regularly, my apologies that you have clearly not seen it:

1. Short Term Limits
2. Publicly-funded elections
3. Balanced Budget Amendment

Unfortunately, that does not address the behaviors I listed. I don't have answers for that. I'll try not to continually harp on them in the future.
.

term limits? Why? So we can replace one jallopy with another?
No term limits arent the problem. The voters are.
11% satisfaction rate 95% re-election rate

It's easier to change systems than humans.
.

So we will replace one jallopy with another... Doesnt sound like much of a solution.. Sounds like a lazy band-aid..
Do you work in Washington? lol

Well, we can get serious and work to change things, or just keep them the way they are.

Personally, I don't see the rapidly-decaying status quo as a smart option.
.

Better than continuing the same failed ideas and radicalism over and over IMO
I would rather work on the people than the system. The system is fine. They let it get abused.

 

[G.T.]

Can the government function properly, can it move the country forward
Obviously not. Not even when "times like these" isnt a problem apparently..
Answer to number 2 is probably IMO. That just makes sense..

Our problem isnt just the politicians, the internet, the media etc. It is also our voting block.
WE THE PEOPLE give ourselves shitty options that strive in environments built on fear and stupidity. "we MUST vote for the duopoly even though its evil versus complete fucking stupidity"

Notice the first few people to drop out of their campaigns last year were the sane ones? Specifically jim webb and rand paul. They didnt have a chance. Werent extreme enough. Sought solutions instead of band-aids and redundancy

But even them, I mean they're douchebags -

I used to like Rand, but then I saw him in real-time join as a regular Hannity caller back when I would listen each day, and he'd allow Hannity to basically puppeteer him and even join his side on issues ALREADY debunked. They''re all fucking weasels.

They're just about 100% douche, Politicians. Our issue that'll come to a head is that a Government so Centralized is not diverse enough to Manage 320 MILLION folks' infrastructures, views, etc. This works for Countries like China and such, because their culture is more homogeneous - ours isn't, and never will be the more that it grows. We are diverse, yet, our Centralized Government is still designed as though we're our initial culture of Europeans. This makes Social Conservatives pessimistic (Cultural shift), it makes Social Progressives consider any Republican fascist, and quite frankly it's just inefficient(stupid).

Luckily, Power-wise - Capitalism has diseased our focus on our families and cultures...... and made us money-centric instead, and so these cultural differences are ultimately mitigated by the unifying force of the greenbacks and we maintain our position in the global economy.

 

[Mac1958]

In terms of process, I make the same proposal to change DC regularly, my apologies that you have clearly not seen it:

1. Short Term Limits
2. Publicly-funded elections
3. Balanced Budget Amendment

Unfortunately, that does not address the behaviors I listed. I don't have answers for that. I'll try not to continually harp on them in the future.
.

term limits? Why? So we can replace one jallopy with another?
No term limits arent the problem. The voters are.
11% satisfaction rate 95% re-election rate

It's easier to change systems than humans.
.

So we will replace one jallopy with another... Doesnt sound like much of a solution.. Sounds like a lazy band-aid..
Do you work in Washington? lol

Well, we can get serious and work to change things, or just keep them the way they are.

Personally, I don't see the rapidly-decaying status quo as a smart option.
.

Better than continuing the same failed ideas and radicalism over and over IMO
I would rather work on the people than the system. The system is fine. They let it get abused.

Well, if you're confident you can change human nature, by all means, have a go at it.

I can't even get my wife to turn the bathroom light off when she's done.

 

[G.T.]

What do you propose, Mac, to get us on a better track? Continually harping on how bad our system is doesn't actually fix it, does it?
I'd love to see Super PACS outlawed. I'd love to see all campaigners allotted a specific amount of money and they can't spend more than that. It will never happen, though, because the exact same people who depend on all that money are the ones who would have to vote in those rules, aren't they?

In terms of process, I make the same proposal to change DC regularly, my apologies that you have clearly not seen it:

1. Short Term Limits
2. Publicly-funded elections
3. Balanced Budget Amendment

Unfortunately, that does not address the behaviors I listed. I don't have answers for that. I'll try not to continually harp on them in the future.
.

term limits? Why? So we can replace one jallopy with another?
No term limits arent the problem. The voters are.
11% satisfaction rate 95% re-election rate

It's easier to change systems than humans.
.

So we will replace one jallopy with another... Doesnt sound like much of a solution.. Sounds like a lazy band-aid..
Do you work in Washington? lol

Well, we can get serious and work to change things, or just keep them the way they are.

Personally, I don't see the rapidly-decaying status quo as a smart option.
.

"Rapidly decaying" is a matter of perspective, and it's subjective - it's not supported by many metrics either. Pessimism isn't a decent replacement for being the standard which you seek. My quality of life is Governed by the intimate details which I control. Me, myself and I. Yours seems predicated on subjective opinions regarding Nationalism and wanting an efficient Centralized Government.

My Daughters eyes make me roll mine at you, and think "pfft, 1st world problems."

A lot of overly privileged folks would be best served by an influx of controversy. This would adjust your character and make you appreciate instead of folding your arms and complaining how everything and everyone sucks, all of the time.