Can a liberal be a Christian?

[Joan]

Lanyce - how could anyone call someone in your position a baby-killer or non-Christian. I had a sort of similar circumstance with my first pregnancy - but with happy results. Around my fourth month, I started bleeding quite heavily - I was put on bed rest, but that didn't help. My doctor then put me in the hospital where I was receiving vitamin K shots every 4 hours. One day the nurse happened to leave may chart on the table when she left. Being the nosey person I am, I took a look. Under diagnosis were the words "incomplete abortion" . I about freaked out. I was crying when the nurse returned. I told her what I had seen - and she told me that abortion was the proper terminology for a miscarriage. But for quite some time, I felt that the nurses in that hospital thought I had tried to have an abortion (which was illegal at that time). I did give birth to a 4lb 7oz baby boy about 4 months following. I feel your pain and completely understand your situation. I consider myself a decent Christian also, but I don't think its our place to judge others.

 

[Gop guy]

Originally posted by DKSuddeth
I'm well aware of what YOU think the liberal positions are. Again, you would be wrong.

I KNOW what liberal positions are, c'mon.

 

[5stringJeff]

Lanyce, I'm just now getting a chance to respond. First, I am very sorry to hear about what you had to go through. I can't imagine what that would feel like, but I know it must be very hard for you to talk about it.
Second, I am sure that people who know the details - and God, who knows not only the details, but the thoughts of the heart - would understand that you had no intention of aborting your healthly baby. I don't know how anyone could hold you accountable for that when the doctor made the decision to abort outside of your knowledge. If anyone is guilty of anything, it would be that doctor.
I pray - sincerely - that God will continue to heal and comfort you.

 

[Avatar4321]

Originally posted by DKSuddeth
its odd that with as many abortion clinics as there are in this country, I see more anti-abortion protesters calling for the death of the doctors than I do the pro-choice people calling for the death of the unborn.

Funny, ive seen alot of people claim that anti abortion protesters calling for the death of doctors but ive never actually seen any one call for the death of those who perform abortions.

But then your argument is alittle fallacious to begin with. Say an anti abortionist does call for the death of a doctor. Does that mean that the pro lifer is wrong about abortion being evil?

 

[NewGuy]

The paths this thread have taken are amazing given nobody (as far as I have so far read) has even defined "Christian".

As a "bowler" is not someone who has a bowling ball, nor one who watches the sport on tv, nor just KNOWS a bowling pro and drops names at parties, a Christian is one who trusts in Jesus Christ as his/her Lord and Savior with faith by grace.

There can be no other definition as that is how Christ Himself defined His followers.

The beliefs on anything else are of secondary importance and CANNOT change a person's salvation. Only a denial or turning away from the said trust in Christ can do that.

Any person in promotion of abortion or any other "liberal" teaching going against the Word would be going against Christ, yes, but these people if still keeping said faith, will be allowed entry into heaven, if only by the skin of their teeth.

-But the skin of their teeth is still WINNING THE GAME.

 

[leojoeyjoe]

Cristian is one who trusts in Jesus Christ as his/her Lord and Savior with faith by grace.

I disagree with you, semantically that is. The word "christ+ian" literally means "christ like"...so it is one who models him/herself after the example (which includes the teachings, which includes YOUR definition) of Christ...
practically, however, this distinction makes little difference....
So the question is how one can espouse certain liberal positions and use certain dishonest tactics and still claim the label "christlike"

 

[menewa]

Jesus Christ is probably one of the most liberal figures from all religious history.
He opened up the path to the one true God that had been previously closed the the Gentiles. He demonstrated compassion for what many in his time considered the scum of the earth.
He lived in a commune state with his brother and sisters. What was one's was everybody's.
He opposed the accumulation of material wealth.
I really can't think of a more liberal religious figure from history than Jesus.

 

[Avatar4321]

Originally posted by menewa
Jesus Christ is probably one of the most liberal figures from all religious history.
He opened up the path to the one true God that had been previously closed the the Gentiles. He demonstrated compassion for what many in his time considered the scum of the earth.
He lived in a commune state with his brother and sisters. What was one's was everybody's.
He opposed the accumulation of material wealth.
I really can't think of a more liberal religious figure from history than Jesus.

Well we are talking about liberal as in the political idealogy not the more exact meaning of liberal.

Also, the way to the Gentiles wasnt open up till Peter recieved the revelation to take it to them although Isaiah prophecied of it centuries before.

As for the commune state. Dont know where you are getting that. He didnt live anywhere. He was a wanderer. How can He live in a commune state if he was always wandering and preaching?

 

[DKSuddeth]

Originally posted by NewGuy
The paths this thread have taken are amazing given nobody (as far as I have so far read) has even defined "Christian".

As a "bowler" is not someone who has a bowling ball, nor one who watches the sport on tv, nor just KNOWS a bowling pro and drops names at parties, a Christian is one who trusts in Jesus Christ as his/her Lord and Savior with faith by grace.

There can be no other definition as that is how Christ Himself defined His followers.

The beliefs on anything else are of secondary importance and CANNOT change a person's salvation. Only a denial or turning away from the said trust in Christ can do that.

Any person in promotion of abortion or any other "liberal" teaching going against the Word would be going against Christ, yes, but these people if still keeping said faith, will be allowed entry into heaven, if only by the skin of their teeth.

-But the skin of their teeth is still WINNING THE GAME.

and that 'free will' of god only goes so far, right?

 

[leojoeyjoe]

He opposed the accumulation of material wealth.

(holds up a COIN) "render unto caesar what is caesar's..."

 

[NewGuy]

Originally posted by leojoeyjoe
I disagree with you, semantically that is. The word "christ+ian" literally means "christ like"...so it is one who models him/herself after the example (which includes the teachings, which includes YOUR definition) of Christ...

One who models himself after Christ and follows all of the teachings has to be one who is an example of the definition I REPEATED, not CREATED.

The definition was not mine.

Once again, you attempt to argue something you know nothing about.

English definitions of the day do not a religious term make.

If you want to play word games, we can have fun watching you squirm over Greek and Hebrew of original contextual wordings giving the exact descriptions of what a true follower of Christ is by HIS definition and how one is saved.

This is not "interpretqtion" and you cannot hide behined your false belief that anything can mean whatever one wishes by semantics. I have beaten better than you at this, and this thread is not the place to blaspheme which is exactly where you are headed.

Maybe since you are new, you ought to ask a few of the others on the board what you are up against in the constant badgering of me over stupid details that go nowhere.

practically, however, this distinction makes little difference....
So the question is how one can espouse certain liberal positions and use certain dishonest tactics and still claim the label "christlike"

Nice twist.

Since that wasn't even the idea, you have shown an ability to try to twist what people say to suit your needs. The original intent was to show a relationship or lack of one between politics, beliefs, and a faith.

Since you don't know what the faith is, don't try to undermine it and change the topic.

 

[NewGuy]

Originally posted by DKSuddeth
and that 'free will' of god only goes so far, right?

You mean the free will GIVEN by God. You had Adam with eternal life and free will.

He was told if he did the 1 thing told not to, that he would surely die.

This is no different.

Free will.

 

[leojoeyjoe]

could god give something that wasn't OF him if everything is of god....

and around and around we go.....
:

 

[Avatar4321]

Originally posted by NewGuy
Since you don't know what the faith is, don't try to undermine it and change the topic.

What is faith? Can you honestly say you have faith in Christ if you dont atleast try to follow His example and teachings? If you dont have faith in Christ to believe His doctrines Then in what way do you have faith?

Show me your faith without obedience, and i will show you mind with it. Faith without works is dead.

 

[NewGuy]

Originally posted by leojoeyjoe
could god give something that wasn't OF him if everything is of god....

and around and around we go.....
:

Your philosphical BS of taking statements out of context is stupid.

State the verse and we will go from there.

 

[NewGuy]

Originally posted by Avatar4321
What is faith? Can you honestly say you have faith in Christ if you dont atleast try to follow His example and teachings? If you dont have faith in Christ to believe His doctrines Then in what way do you have faith?

We both know works are a measure of faith. Weak faith can produce weak works not visible from a third person's perspective.

Show me your faith without obedience, and i will show you mind with it. Faith without works is dead.

Agreed.

Works without faith is too.

HOWEVER.....Obedience is not -as well as works are not-...a prerequisite for faith.

What obedience did that thief have and what works did he do hanging next to Jesus?

 

[leojoeyjoe]

first off, new guy, show me where I said you created your definition....secondly I was using the approach I took to expand on your original definition....thus the "at least semantically" part of the quote....the morpheme "christ" meaning the anointed one is added to the morpheme "ian" meaning like....like the anointed one...and you are right, the reasoning behind being christlike is faith...
that being said I want YOU to know that you are the truest example i've ever seen of the HUMILITY that christ preached about....

Maybe since you are new, you ought to ask a few of the others on the board what you are up against in the constant badgering of me over stupid details that go nowhere.

this is definitely what jesus would do....he would go into a message board and deride people with his second grade education and a grasp of the language that foreigners wouldn't even envy...
But its alright, I just love you right back brother, amen and amen...

 

[leojoeyjoe]

Nice twist.

Since that wasn't even the idea, you have shown an ability to try to twist what people say to suit your needs. The original intent was to show a relationship or lack of one between politics, beliefs, and a faith.

oh really....cause the original post upon which the thread is based said this:

Can a true blue sandal wearing liberal ever be a Christian? No way. The American Liberal by their unwaivering support of abortion and gay marriage can not claim Christianity as a faith. They can not defend the Gospels which have long been the moral foundation of our nation. For a liberal man and government is their God and therefore Liberals are Americas anti-God movement.

Whatthadeallyo?

 

[NewGuy]

Originally posted by leojoeyjoe
first off, new guy, show me where I said you created your definition

Nice try. Obviously by your point of stating it "YOUR definition" does exactly that.

....secondly I was using the approach I took to expand on your original definition....thus the "at least semantically" part of the quote....the morpheme "christ" meaning the anointed one is added to the morpheme "ian" meaning like....like the anointed one...and you are right, the reasoning behind being christlike is faith...

So....which is it? You just claimed both definitions to be right yet claimed them both wrong.

You cannot go back now.

that being said I want YOU to know that you are the truest example i've ever seen of the HUMILITY that christ preached about.... this is definitely what jesus would do....he would go into a message board and deride people with his second grade education and a grasp of the language that foreigners wouldn't even envy...

:cof:
Spoken like a socialist. Am I supposed to feel sad and "turn the other cheek"?

Maybe I ought to "Do unto others...."

Do you have any other Biblical passage you have no clue about and want to take out of context that I should follow while you insult me?

This rediculous cat and mouse game of trying to bait and attack, and then hide behined mommies skirt when defended against is pretty lame. Anyone here can do a look back at any discussion you have had with me and see who is out of whack with their discussion.

But its alright, I just love you right back brother, amen and amen...

Still waiting for your highness to quote the passage.

 

[NewGuy]

Originally posted by leojoeyjoe


oh really....cause the original post upon which the thread is based said this:


Whatthadeallyo?

Thanks for proving my point.