CAIR Director Claims Muslims Are “Above The Law Of The Land.”

[emilynghiem]

Which laws are he pushing above the laws of our land?

Sharia, you twit!

Dear longknife
This is a trick answer you have given.

What SHARIA refers to is ALL practices in Islam, including
PRAYER
GIVING ALMS TO THE POOR
and even the aforementioned practice of
OBEDIENCE to Biblical Scripture, Civil laws/authority, along with Quran and Mohammad's teachings on the interpretations of them

Since the laws of the land do not require following the Bible,
then you can argue Christians, Muslims and others who adhere to this principle
are putting their Bibles first, and following the laws of the land as a requirement of following the Bible.

NOTE: Because of the Scriptural teaching on Civil Obedience to Civil Laws and Authority,
the Christians and Muslims who commit to this can thus be CHECKED by CONSTITUTIONAL LAWS
similar to Constitutionalists who swear allegiance to uphold the Constitution.

So this would PREVENT either Christians or Muslims from violating Constitutional laws
by holding them to their own commitments to CIVIL OBEDIENCE.

Muslims, Christians or Constitutionalists -- just like any other human beings --
include in their populations community members who commit violations of Civil, Criminal or Constitutional laws as any other group of people will have its abusers and criminals.

If you want to get into CAUSES of criminal or abusive behavior,
the same causes apply to Muslims, Christians, Atheists or any other group or identity.

The problem with Muslims and Christians who MIX Government with their Religious beliefs
to start following or imposing POLITICAL RELIGIONS
is where they FAIL TO ENFORCE CIVIL OBEDIENCE TO CONSTITUTIONAL
CHECKS AND BALANCES, LIMITS, and SEPARATION OF POWERS ON GOVT AUTHORITY.

That's when you get abusive, oppressive or militant violent POLITICAL RELIGIONS.
This applies to both Muslims OR Christians who don't put Constitutional laws first (as even Obama was caught putting Partisan Beliefs over the Constitutional duty to represent ALL people of all creeds).

But as long as Christians, Muslims and other religious adherents
RESPECT Constitutional laws against establishing or imposing religious beliefs on others,
this part of CIVIL OBEDIENCE
CHECKS AND PREVENTS collective abuse of authority for oppressing individuals.

longknife We in America actually have a WORSE prevalent problems of
Democratic Party members and SOCIALIST Democrats violating
Constitutional principles of Limits, checks and balances, Separation of Powers
by imposing THEIR "political beliefs" through Govt especially depending on Judicial Rule to act as legislative or executive authority.

If you are going to call a group out on pushing a Political Religion through Govt
against the beliefs of other citizens and in violation of Constitutional laws,
I'd point to the DEMOCRATS for pushing
* ACA and its mandates without acknowledging Constitutional violations or taking responsibility for restitution or correction
* same sex marriage policies and transgender beliefs "above" the equal rights of others to their beliefs against these practices
* right to health care through federal govt without following Constitutional process of an AMENDMENT ratified by States
* and in general "taxation without representation" and "discrimination by creed"

As for Mustafaa Carroll's explanation of lawsuits attempting to ban SHARIA,
he explained since this term is too broad, and banning SHARIA would mean banning ALL the expressions of Muslim faith,
then it would essential BAN MUSLIMS from practicing their RELIGION, clearly against the First Amendment.

My clarification to this:
If the point is to ban the abuse of political religions that violate Constitutional laws, process,
beliefs, principles and protections for all citizens, that needs to be stated specifically
rather than use an overly broad terms such as SHARIA that "targets Muslims instead of applying to ALL POLITICAL RELIGIONS" and doesn't distinguish the RELIGIOUS ABUSE or the unconstitutional POLITICAL RELIGION from the Constitutional free exercise of religion of individuals or groups practicing LAWFULLY.

Let me help you reduce your verbaige a little.

If Mustafa takes exception to the American flag flying on my front porch and orders me to take it down I tell him to fuck off. if Mustafa sets foot on my lawn with the intentions of taking the flag down I break his legs. If Mustafa comes back with help in order to take the flag down and he's on crutches .... Well let's just say it's time for the undertaker to start measuring caskets.

Jo

Dear justoffal
Then if Mustafaa would never do any of that you would never accuse or react to him as such.
And if ANYONE did those things to you against your Constitutional rights, beliefs and protections,
you would react in defense of the law REGARDLESS if such person were Muslim or not, or of any affiliation.

The issue is NOT whether Mustafaa is Muslim,
it's whether you are being forced by any person or group to compromise your rights, beliefs
and free exercise of religion or speech protected equally under law.

Before any of us "judges or condemns" Mustafaa or any other Muslim,
let us first prove that person GUILTY of abuse or other unlawful threat or action that
CALLS for depriving liberty according to the law. That's called DUE PROCESS of laws
before depriving a fellow citizen of liberty.

If someone is so abusive or oppressive they do not believe in respecting due process of laws and CANNOT COMPLY,
if they are so mentally disordered or criminally sick as to disrespect the laws and rights of others that they cause UNLAWFUL
breaches and threats to health and safety, then their mental and legal incompetence is the problem regardless which religion they are.

You are quite correct.
The same holds for Mostafa, leeroy, Mr. Chang, Pablo or Johnny the next door neighbor..... They all have breakable legs;
Equally and without prejudice.

Jo

Dear justoffal Regardless of creed, as long as they are under US or States jurisdiction,
unless "Mostafa, leeroy, Mr. Chang, Pablo or Johnny" goes through DUE PROCESS of LAW
then the LAW OF THE LAND applies to them equally against DEPRIVING them of LIBERTY without due process.

You cannot break their legs as a form of punishment if they did nothing unlawful.
If they threatened you so that you feared for your life, safety etc,
and you did so in self-defense, you can argue this was within your rights, especially if the castle doctrine applies.

The same laws protecting you from them, protect them from you as well.

 

[Picaro]

MISSTATEMENT ALREADY CORRECTED:
CORRECTION: Muslim practice means going "above and beyond" not against the law

The goal of Islam is not in question. Nor are those organizations that follow it. At every level, their dedication to the Koran and the teachings of their religious leaders call for subjugating the US Constitution for Sharia.

According to Herman Mustafa Carroll, leader of CAIR in Dallas-Fort Worth, Muslims are not bound to US law because they are Muslims.

“If we are practicing Muslims, we are above the law of the land,” he says.

Well, he’s not lying about what Muslims actually believe. Sure, there may be law-abiding, patriotic American Muslims, but plenty of adherents to the faith of Islam in this country feel exactly the same way as Carroll does.

And why wouldn’t they? They pledge allegiance to the political system of Sharia, which is fundamentally opposed to our American constitution.

Carroll made this statement at an Austin, Texas rally as part of an effort to hold “Muslim Capitol Day” events. According to the website for the event, Muslims traveled to the Texas capitol to “promote civic and political activism throughout the wider Muslim community.”

“We tried to downplay Sharia, because we didn’t want to give the other side any excitement for being here,” he said.

Much more @ CAIR Director Claims Muslims Are “Above The Law Of The Land.” This Is Treason. - Tea Party News

Hi longknife
I happen to know Mustafaa personally, and called and asked him about this
when I first saw it publicized online.

He explained very clearly that his words and meanings were taken out of context.
I was relieved to hear this rational explanation because I know he couldn't have meant what it sounded like!

He explained that the context was that Muslims are called to higher standards
"above and beyond" what the law requires.

The example he gave: even though the law allows people to drink legally,
Muslims are not supposed to partake in alcohol and drunkenness.
So that is going BEYOND what the law requires. The Muslims have a stricter standard.

NOTE: I did tell him that the correct wording is "above and beyond"

So if he misstated it, I could see how that could miscommunicate his actual meaning.

Thank you for posting this but to be fair,
can you please amend your message to reflect this correction.

Thanks longknife
Mustafaa is a well honored community leader, who works with Christians and other Peace and Justice volunteers
with nonprofit outreach, including Christian Pastors among his own family members.

=============
PREVIOUS CORRECTION POSTED on USMB DEC 2016:

I saw clips and posts online, claiming that Mustafaa Carroll of CAIR
stated that "Muslims are above the law." Knowing him personally,
I KNEW that this had to be taken out of context. But what context?

In my greatest imagination, I could not think up what this could be.
My best guess was not even close!

I called him up and he answered me personally:

He explained the full context of his statement was
1. Muslim duty to Sharia or practice INCLUDES following the law of the land.
That's a given.

I already understand this concept because Muslims are to follow the same Bible as Christians which call for "civil obedience" to authority, so that they witness to what is right, while following civil authority standards and process of secular laws and govt. They respect that if they are truly faithful and obedient to God.

2. And his statement taken out of this context was that
if Muslims are faithful in practice, those standards go ABOVE what the law requires.
They will go ABOVE AND BEYOND.
so the laws will not affect them BECAUSE THEY ARE MEETING THEM
NOT BECAUSE THEY ARE VIOLATING THEM AS THIS WAS MISCONSTRUED.

The problem I saw with his wording, is in his video he used the terms
"above the law" but THE SPIRIT of what he meant, and how he explained more clearly
over the phone, is that Muslims would go 'above and beyond' what the law requires.
He even gave me an example:
a. the law prohibits drinking while driving, but does not forbid drinking
b. by Islam, followers would not drink either!
So of course they will not break laws against drinking and driving, but go BEYOND that standard
and not drink to the point of drunkenness in the first place!

HERE IS THE VIDEO CLIP that Mustafaa sent me:

Mustafa_MediaResponse.mp4

The only argument I have with him, I sense the video still does not explain as clearly
as he did personally over the phone. Communication, especially with a topic that has
multiple levels of meaning as in this case, is much better one-on-one as a conversation
to CONFIRM the meaning is conveyed. It is VERY HARD to describe this concept
in "one blanket statement" linearly, and be sure that it is understand by different
audiences from different contexts and perspectives.

The term "above the law" means something very negative,
and my friend Mustafaa did better when explaining it as "going above and beyond"
what the law requires.

I told him I would post this correction.
=============================

cc: night_son Rambunctious Picaro

Ancient lion 's reply above making this same clarification is the correct meaning
of Musafaa Carroll's statement, not the OP which is incorrect. May I please request
that this be corrected so that it does not slander, defame or misrepresent what he said.
Thank you longknife if you can please make this correction!

It is pointless Emily.

Folks NEED an enemy.

The programing and propaganda of around the clock indoctrination is stronger than what you are trying to do.

It doesn't matter that reason and logic tell us that normal human beings want to have peace and tranquility. Mothers, fathers, sons, daughters, of billions of people do not seek conflict.

It is giant multinational corporations and governments that seek to keep folks afraid of one another.

Obviously.

Fear pushes us to blame someone for the few, very few incidents we see on our corporate TEE VEE. IN the past it would have been the Germans and the Japanese. Perhaps it would have been the Jew or the Chinese.

Now? The corporate media has focused on the immigrant and the Muslim. Folks that get the reality from the TEE VEE and the CFR press won't be reasoned with.

Folks that think this way, actually believe, that the small folks, and the poor that follow the Quran, all of them, there is no distinction, they are all the same, all 1.8 billion of them. They cannot conceive of Islam having as much variety as Christianity, which has a spectrum of difference between, say, a strict pious Amish practitioner, and someone who follows a Televangelist. Naturally, to folks associated with Christianity, the two couldn't be more different, and to claim the two are the same? Would be foolishness.

Yet, that is what we have to read from folks that are afraid of Islam. One Muslim is that same as the next. All 1.8 billion are the same.

IOW, GOD MAKES MISTAKES. These Christians think Jews are all right, but clearly, God is wrong when he allowed a religion to spread like Islam has . . . God didn't know what he was doing, and these Christian folks know better.

If that is the case, how can mankind be sure of the divinity of the bible, of the divinity of anything in creation after all?


. . . it must be hopeless. No wonder the nihilists and atheists are on the rise. Divinity and Faith is being squandered. The Lucifarians that are in control are playing them all like a fiddle to destroy the poor, powerless, homeless, and hungry of the world. Instead of warring with each other, these great repositories of faith should be finding common ground.


Because we play into their hands. . . someday in the future, the whole world will hate America and seek to destroy her as she keeps playing into this hatred.

Dear MisterBeale thank you for your honest assessment of the plight of humanity.
Yes and no, I agree we have these flaws, so that COLLECTIVELY when forming
CORPORATE groups, institutions, PARTIES and Govt (and also media conglomerates)
YES unfortunately the worst flaws of humanity are MULTIPLIED and become oppressive and abusive.

However, this is not to say it is hopeless.
By treating the people making up these Govts, parties and Corporate interests
as INDIVIDUALS, that's where we have every opportunity to connect
as you and I do here.

You and I could treat each other as just another member of an anonymous mob of mindsets on the internet.
But instead we hear each other as individuals.

When I address longknife, this isn't as a mindless group, but addressing
an individual who believes in Constitutional laws as I do, and we respect those principles.

Each person has their own language for the laws, and when we address
each other by common laws we commit to follow, we have this chance
to connect on common principles.

I do believe it is inherent in our human nature and process of development
to "break down" the mob mentality and work toward one-on-one connections.

Then apply that back to COLLECTIVELY influencing our media and corporate hierarchies in turn.

So the ripple effect, the law of attraction or laws of "cause and effect" play in our favor.

The same PROCESS
by which NEGATIVE perceptions and FEARS that bias individuals and create a whole MOB of people of that mindset
also works the OTHER WAY
when POSITIVE changes that expand our perception and ways of dealing with conflict
start with INDIVIDUALS and replicate to affect RELATIONS around us
(and that in turn multiples to affect INSTITUTIONS around us).

So bad news is YES the groups and individuals co-influence each other when it comes to NEGATIVE and FEAR BASED perceptions.
And GOOD NEWS is YES this dynamic also works with POSITIVE change and growth in relations and understanding to correct wrongs.

. . . but the government indoctrination of these individuals, and the corporate propaganda all say "such and such" about the topic at hand.

With the caveat that; "you may hear otherwise out there, but that is an intentional strategy to lie to you by 1.8 million evil people," and anyone that would use rational, logical thought.. . . .

IOW, the bogey many is much more compelling.

Thus, what is the point?

P.S., I find your boundless optimism for solutions and cooperative change against oppressive forces that oppose all people refreshing.

I think the good news is, well meaning people of the world, be they Jew, Christian, or Muslim, never initiate force or violence.

So the entire conversation is sort of moot. It is the nefarious forces we need to be concerned about, and these, more often than not, are associated with the very same institutions that are warning us about the enemy we should be concerned about.

lol it's the corporate media that is promoting Islam and all sort sof other inane 'diversity' over Christianity, so now we have liars peddling yet another fake narrative aimed at marginalizing facts in favor of promoting continued social degeneracy in the U.S.. Soon every show on TV will have to have a 'moderate Muslim' character, just like they all now have to have 'witty and funny' faggots running around doing pretty much nothing at all that shows what faggot 'culture' actually does and promotes in real life. that gets hidden by censorship laws.

 

[emilynghiem]

The quotation, however, comes at the end of a longer passage that places it in full context, and indicates that Carroll’s intent was to express the opposite of what [was] alleged.

“Following the law of the land is part of Sharia,” Carroll said, according to the video. “And we follow the law of the land. In fact, Muslims, if we’re practicing Muslims, we are above the law of the land. The law doesn’t affect us at all.”

Speaking on Monday, Carroll said he could understand why his words may have been misconstrued. But "it's definitely not intended to mean we don't have to follow the law," he said. By saying Muslims were "above the law," he said, he meant that true, practicing Muslims should behave in a way that would put them above any possibility of breaking the law. "If you're a practicing Muslim, then you should be above all of that," he said.

Rep. White Explains Her Views on Muslims

Is female genital mutilation the law of the land in the U.S.? How about marrying of 10 year old girls? How about honor killings? How about slaughtering Jews as dogs?

Dear boedicca
Those are all against local, civil or criminal laws and/or natural laws
that Muslims are called to follow as well.

If the Muslim is truly obedient, none of what you list is a choice but all are barred.

If the Muslim is one of the abusive type that will put political religion above the rights and protections of others,
such person should either be contained or detained for screening for mental health or criminal disorder,
or be counseled to correct the conflict with law (as I also recommend for other groups including
POLITICAL PARTIES that preach and teach that it is "acceptable" or "morally necessary"
to enforce and impose THEIR political beliefs on others against their will, beliefs and Constitutional protections of law).

 

[boedicca]

The quotation, however, comes at the end of a longer passage that places it in full context, and indicates that Carroll’s intent was to express the opposite of what [was] alleged.

“Following the law of the land is part of Sharia,” Carroll said, according to the video. “And we follow the law of the land. In fact, Muslims, if we’re practicing Muslims, we are above the law of the land. The law doesn’t affect us at all.”

Speaking on Monday, Carroll said he could understand why his words may have been misconstrued. But "it's definitely not intended to mean we don't have to follow the law," he said. By saying Muslims were "above the law," he said, he meant that true, practicing Muslims should behave in a way that would put them above any possibility of breaking the law. "If you're a practicing Muslim, then you should be above all of that," he said.

Rep. White Explains Her Views on Muslims

Is female genital mutilation the law of the land in the U.S.? How about marrying of 10 year old girls? How about honor killings? How about slaughtering Jews as dogs?

Dear boedicca
Those are all against local, civil or criminal laws and/or natural laws
that Muslims are called to follow as well.

If the Muslim is truly obedient, none of what you list is a choice but all are barred.

If the Muslim is one of the abusive type that will put political religion above the rights and protections of others,
such person should either be contained or detained for screening for mental health or criminal disorder,
or be counseled to correct the conflict with law (as I also recommend for other groups including
POLITICAL PARTIES that preach and teach that it is "acceptable" or "morally necessary"
to enforce and impose THEIR political beliefs on others against their will, beliefs and Constitutional protections of law).

B'loney. Sharia law is in conflict with the Rule of Law in the U.S.

Period.

End of story.

 

[justoffal]

The quotation, however, comes at the end of a longer passage that places it in full context, and indicates that Carroll’s intent was to express the opposite of what [was] alleged.

“Following the law of the land is part of Sharia,” Carroll said, according to the video. “And we follow the law of the land. In fact, Muslims, if we’re practicing Muslims, we are above the law of the land. The law doesn’t affect us at all.”

Speaking on Monday, Carroll said he could understand why his words may have been misconstrued. But "it's definitely not intended to mean we don't have to follow the law," he said. By saying Muslims were "above the law," he said, he meant that true, practicing Muslims should behave in a way that would put them above any possibility of breaking the law. "If you're a practicing Muslim, then you should be above all of that," he said.

Rep. White Explains Her Views on Muslims

Is female genital mutilation the law of the land in the U.S.? How about marrying of 10 year old girls? How about honor killings? How about slaughtering Jews as dogs?

Dear boedicca
Those are all against local, civil or criminal laws and/or natural laws
that Muslims are called to follow as well.

If the Muslim is truly obedient, none of what you list is a choice but all are barred.

If the Muslim is one of the abusive type that will put political religion above the rights and protections of others,
such person should either be contained or detained for screening for mental health or criminal disorder,
or be counseled to correct the conflict with law (as I also recommend for other groups including
POLITICAL PARTIES that preach and teach that it is "acceptable" or "morally necessary"
to enforce and impose THEIR political beliefs on others against their will, beliefs and Constitutional protections of law).

B'loney. Sharia law is in conflict with the Rule of Law in the U.S.

Period.

End of story.

Unfaithful Muslim wives know it damn well.

Jo

 

[emilynghiem]

If an of you are not aware of the practice of taqiyya, you need to look it up. It's a Muslim practice to lie to non-believers and even each other whenever they think it furthers their goals, which of course is to murder or enslave all non-Muslims. No country has ever survived who welcomed Muslims into their country and allowed them to become a large demographic.

????

Dear Picaro
are YOU aware that Muslims are also called to follow the Bible as Holy Scriptures and prophets sent by God?

So by the Ten Commandments, believers are NOT to engage in
BEARING FALSE WITNESS, but to SPEAK THE TRUTH WITH LOVE
which are Biblical teachings.

This applies equally to Christians as to Muslims who are called
to respect all sent by God, all prophets and people "of the Book"
including Jews Christians and Muslims. Islam recognizes
all three as under the one same God of Abraham and that lineage.

So the Bible applies to Muslims who are called to obey
God's laws as well as civil laws of government and society in the land they live in.
=======================================================
NOTE: the only sense I can make of this misscited concept
of "lying to nonbelievers" -- if people are liars, if you are self-deluded,
deceitful and your judgment and perception are clouded by selfish dishonest intent,
then you will not be able to see clearly when people are deceitful to you either.
You would attract the same deceitful type of people and interactions
and set yourself up to fail if you engage in these very tactics.
That's just karma or how the laws of justice or attraction work with people.

People tend to respond as transparently as the people they interact with.
The Golden Rule applies, where you get the honesty you give.
This is a natural law, that if you are open and honest with others,
you will be able to see openly and honestly where they are coming from.

This is not about "justifying lying" to anyone.
And it's not about Muslims. ANYONE can manipulate
someone else who is manipulating others.
That is more like a warning, not something you would advise someone to DO
but strongly advise them to AVOID!

I see you want to deflect from the fact that lying to infidels is encouraged by Islam, and of course nobody is going to fall for the 'Muslims are just like Christians' rubbish either. That's okay, people can look it up fo themselves, as they can all tnose wonderful hadiths and Surahs you want to gloss over.

Thank you Picaro for sharing your honest feedback and criticisms here.
As long as we can discuss transparently, this will allow us to resolve any and all conflicts related.
Thanks for your intellectual honesty which is the key to fixing this and other problems
with POLITICAL RELIGIONS that Parties are guilty of pushing through govt at the expense of Constitutional protections.

As to points you make above
1. It is against Muslim teachings to bear false witness which is against the Biblical Scriptures,
and to commit violations of civil laws including misrepresentation, fraud, slander libel defamation,
and to violate Christian teachings in general that emphasize to SPEAK THE TRUTH WITH LOVE.

I will attest to my experience and witness that Mustafaa Carroll does adhere to speaking the truth with love,
and not deliberately misspeaking so as to deceive or lie. If he makes an omission or mistake it is out of error
and he is honest about correcting any errors or unfair/untrue statements or perceptions. I can attest to that,
or can ask him to speak for himself if that helps.

2. I did not say "Muslims are just like Christians" as in ALL THE SAME.
It depends on the Muslim or Christian how obedient they are to civil, natural and Constitutional laws.

For example, Obama claims to respect both Christian and Muslim faith.
But his insistence on passing signing and enforcing ACA mandates that clearly violated
Constitutional beliefs and process show that he does NOT respect Constitutional limits and process of govt
to the same degree that other Christians and Constitutionalists do. So this is NOT THE SAME.

I would say Mustafaa is a better example of civil obedience.
And so are my friends at work who are Muslim and more respectful of ethics and authority
than I am where I can be "lax or lazy" and they are more diligent, punctual, courteous, wise and respectful.

If you prefer, I can ask all 3 friends to state how they talk about the responsibility to
speak the truth with love. And you can judge their answers for yourself.

NOTE: As for people who are "lying sociopaths" or pathological liars who believe in getting away with whatever they can,
that's a separate disorder or pathology. That can be cured by Christian spiritual healing, so as long as a
Muslim is open to receiving spiritual therapy, this works to heal people REGARDLESS of faith, including atheists,
so the same natural healing should work on Muslims as well. If people reject the forgiveness therapy, then it doesn't matter
if they are Christian, the factor that makes a difference is the degree of forgiveness or unforgiveness they practice.

 

[emilynghiem]

The quotation, however, comes at the end of a longer passage that places it in full context, and indicates that Carroll’s intent was to express the opposite of what [was] alleged.

“Following the law of the land is part of Sharia,” Carroll said, according to the video. “And we follow the law of the land. In fact, Muslims, if we’re practicing Muslims, we are above the law of the land. The law doesn’t affect us at all.”

Speaking on Monday, Carroll said he could understand why his words may have been misconstrued. But "it's definitely not intended to mean we don't have to follow the law," he said. By saying Muslims were "above the law," he said, he meant that true, practicing Muslims should behave in a way that would put them above any possibility of breaking the law. "If you're a practicing Muslim, then you should be above all of that," he said.

Rep. White Explains Her Views on Muslims

Is female genital mutilation the law of the land in the U.S.? How about marrying of 10 year old girls? How about honor killings? How about slaughtering Jews as dogs?

Dear boedicca
Those are all against local, civil or criminal laws and/or natural laws
that Muslims are called to follow as well.

If the Muslim is truly obedient, none of what you list is a choice but all are barred.

If the Muslim is one of the abusive type that will put political religion above the rights and protections of others,
such person should either be contained or detained for screening for mental health or criminal disorder,
or be counseled to correct the conflict with law (as I also recommend for other groups including
POLITICAL PARTIES that preach and teach that it is "acceptable" or "morally necessary"
to enforce and impose THEIR political beliefs on others against their will, beliefs and Constitutional protections of law).

B'loney. Sharia law is in conflict with the Rule of Law in the U.S.

Period.

End of story.

Yes and no bodecea
the term "SHARIA" in itself does not specify between
the lawful exercise and expression of Muslims in private
from the oppressive/abuse of Islamic RELIGION through govt.

The lawful PRACTICE of Islam such as praying five times a day,
giving alms to the poor, not charging usurious interest, etc.
is well within "free exercise of religion" THAT CAN NEITHER
BE ESTABLISHED NOR PROHIBITED BY GOVT AUTHORITY.

Any attempts or acts to "abuse govt to establish Muslim or other religion"
would be unconstitutional and discrimination by creed, so you are right
THAT IS contradictory to impose or abuse ANY religion as to violate US laws.

 

[MisterBeale]

MISSTATEMENT ALREADY CORRECTED:
CORRECTION: Muslim practice means going "above and beyond" not against the law

The goal of Islam is not in question. Nor are those organizations that follow it. At every level, their dedication to the Koran and the teachings of their religious leaders call for subjugating the US Constitution for Sharia.

According to Herman Mustafa Carroll, leader of CAIR in Dallas-Fort Worth, Muslims are not bound to US law because they are Muslims.

“If we are practicing Muslims, we are above the law of the land,” he says.

Well, he’s not lying about what Muslims actually believe. Sure, there may be law-abiding, patriotic American Muslims, but plenty of adherents to the faith of Islam in this country feel exactly the same way as Carroll does.

And why wouldn’t they? They pledge allegiance to the political system of Sharia, which is fundamentally opposed to our American constitution.

Carroll made this statement at an Austin, Texas rally as part of an effort to hold “Muslim Capitol Day” events. According to the website for the event, Muslims traveled to the Texas capitol to “promote civic and political activism throughout the wider Muslim community.”

“We tried to downplay Sharia, because we didn’t want to give the other side any excitement for being here,” he said.

Much more @ CAIR Director Claims Muslims Are “Above The Law Of The Land.” This Is Treason. - Tea Party News

Hi longknife
I happen to know Mustafaa personally, and called and asked him about this
when I first saw it publicized online.

He explained very clearly that his words and meanings were taken out of context.
I was relieved to hear this rational explanation because I know he couldn't have meant what it sounded like!

He explained that the context was that Muslims are called to higher standards
"above and beyond" what the law requires.

The example he gave: even though the law allows people to drink legally,
Muslims are not supposed to partake in alcohol and drunkenness.
So that is going BEYOND what the law requires. The Muslims have a stricter standard.

NOTE: I did tell him that the correct wording is "above and beyond"

So if he misstated it, I could see how that could miscommunicate his actual meaning.

Thank you for posting this but to be fair,
can you please amend your message to reflect this correction.

Thanks longknife
Mustafaa is a well honored community leader, who works with Christians and other Peace and Justice volunteers
with nonprofit outreach, including Christian Pastors among his own family members.

=============
PREVIOUS CORRECTION POSTED on USMB DEC 2016:

I saw clips and posts online, claiming that Mustafaa Carroll of CAIR
stated that "Muslims are above the law." Knowing him personally,
I KNEW that this had to be taken out of context. But what context?

In my greatest imagination, I could not think up what this could be.
My best guess was not even close!

I called him up and he answered me personally:

He explained the full context of his statement was
1. Muslim duty to Sharia or practice INCLUDES following the law of the land.
That's a given.

I already understand this concept because Muslims are to follow the same Bible as Christians which call for "civil obedience" to authority, so that they witness to what is right, while following civil authority standards and process of secular laws and govt. They respect that if they are truly faithful and obedient to God.

2. And his statement taken out of this context was that
if Muslims are faithful in practice, those standards go ABOVE what the law requires.
They will go ABOVE AND BEYOND.
so the laws will not affect them BECAUSE THEY ARE MEETING THEM
NOT BECAUSE THEY ARE VIOLATING THEM AS THIS WAS MISCONSTRUED.

The problem I saw with his wording, is in his video he used the terms
"above the law" but THE SPIRIT of what he meant, and how he explained more clearly
over the phone, is that Muslims would go 'above and beyond' what the law requires.
He even gave me an example:
a. the law prohibits drinking while driving, but does not forbid drinking
b. by Islam, followers would not drink either!
So of course they will not break laws against drinking and driving, but go BEYOND that standard
and not drink to the point of drunkenness in the first place!

HERE IS THE VIDEO CLIP that Mustafaa sent me:

Mustafa_MediaResponse.mp4

The only argument I have with him, I sense the video still does not explain as clearly
as he did personally over the phone. Communication, especially with a topic that has
multiple levels of meaning as in this case, is much better one-on-one as a conversation
to CONFIRM the meaning is conveyed. It is VERY HARD to describe this concept
in "one blanket statement" linearly, and be sure that it is understand by different
audiences from different contexts and perspectives.

The term "above the law" means something very negative,
and my friend Mustafaa did better when explaining it as "going above and beyond"
what the law requires.

I told him I would post this correction.
=============================

cc: night_son Rambunctious Picaro

Ancient lion 's reply above making this same clarification is the correct meaning
of Musafaa Carroll's statement, not the OP which is incorrect. May I please request
that this be corrected so that it does not slander, defame or misrepresent what he said.
Thank you longknife if you can please make this correction!

It is pointless Emily.

Folks NEED an enemy.

The programing and propaganda of around the clock indoctrination is stronger than what you are trying to do.

It doesn't matter that reason and logic tell us that normal human beings want to have peace and tranquility. Mothers, fathers, sons, daughters, of billions of people do not seek conflict.

It is giant multinational corporations and governments that seek to keep folks afraid of one another.

Obviously.

Fear pushes us to blame someone for the few, very few incidents we see on our corporate TEE VEE. IN the past it would have been the Germans and the Japanese. Perhaps it would have been the Jew or the Chinese.

Now? The corporate media has focused on the immigrant and the Muslim. Folks that get the reality from the TEE VEE and the CFR press won't be reasoned with.

Folks that think this way, actually believe, that the small folks, and the poor that follow the Quran, all of them, there is no distinction, they are all the same, all 1.8 billion of them. They cannot conceive of Islam having as much variety as Christianity, which has a spectrum of difference between, say, a strict pious Amish practitioner, and someone who follows a Televangelist. Naturally, to folks associated with Christianity, the two couldn't be more different, and to claim the two are the same? Would be foolishness.

Yet, that is what we have to read from folks that are afraid of Islam. One Muslim is that same as the next. All 1.8 billion are the same.

IOW, GOD MAKES MISTAKES. These Christians think Jews are all right, but clearly, God is wrong when he allowed a religion to spread like Islam has . . . God didn't know what he was doing, and these Christian folks know better.

If that is the case, how can mankind be sure of the divinity of the bible, of the divinity of anything in creation after all?


. . . it must be hopeless. No wonder the nihilists and atheists are on the rise. Divinity and Faith is being squandered. The Lucifarians that are in control are playing them all like a fiddle to destroy the poor, powerless, homeless, and hungry of the world. Instead of warring with each other, these great repositories of faith should be finding common ground.


Because we play into their hands. . . someday in the future, the whole world will hate America and seek to destroy her as she keeps playing into this hatred.

Dear MisterBeale thank you for your honest assessment of the plight of humanity.
Yes and no, I agree we have these flaws, so that COLLECTIVELY when forming
CORPORATE groups, institutions, PARTIES and Govt (and also media conglomerates)
YES unfortunately the worst flaws of humanity are MULTIPLIED and become oppressive and abusive.

However, this is not to say it is hopeless.
By treating the people making up these Govts, parties and Corporate interests
as INDIVIDUALS, that's where we have every opportunity to connect
as you and I do here.

You and I could treat each other as just another member of an anonymous mob of mindsets on the internet.
But instead we hear each other as individuals.

When I address longknife, this isn't as a mindless group, but addressing
an individual who believes in Constitutional laws as I do, and we respect those principles.

Each person has their own language for the laws, and when we address
each other by common laws we commit to follow, we have this chance
to connect on common principles.

I do believe it is inherent in our human nature and process of development
to "break down" the mob mentality and work toward one-on-one connections.

Then apply that back to COLLECTIVELY influencing our media and corporate hierarchies in turn.

So the ripple effect, the law of attraction or laws of "cause and effect" play in our favor.

The same PROCESS
by which NEGATIVE perceptions and FEARS that bias individuals and create a whole MOB of people of that mindset
also works the OTHER WAY
when POSITIVE changes that expand our perception and ways of dealing with conflict
start with INDIVIDUALS and replicate to affect RELATIONS around us
(and that in turn multiples to affect INSTITUTIONS around us).

So bad news is YES the groups and individuals co-influence each other when it comes to NEGATIVE and FEAR BASED perceptions.
And GOOD NEWS is YES this dynamic also works with POSITIVE change and growth in relations and understanding to correct wrongs.

. . . but the government indoctrination of these individuals, and the corporate propaganda all say "such and such" about the topic at hand.

With the caveat that; "you may hear otherwise out there, but that is an intentional strategy to lie to you by 1.8 million evil people," and anyone that would use rational, logical thought.. . . .

IOW, the bogey many is much more compelling.

Thus, what is the point?

P.S., I find your boundless optimism for solutions and cooperative change against oppressive forces that oppose all people refreshing.

I think the good news is, well meaning people of the world, be they Jew, Christian, or Muslim, never initiate force or violence.

So the entire conversation is sort of moot. It is the nefarious forces we need to be concerned about, and these, more often than not, are associated with the very same institutions that are warning us about the enemy we should be concerned about.

lol it's the corporate media that is promoting Islam and all sort sof other inane 'diversity' over Christianity, so now we have liars peddling yet another fake narrative aimed at marginalizing facts in favor of promoting continued social degeneracy in the U.S.. Soon every show on TV will have to have a 'moderate Muslim' character, just like they all now have to have 'witty and funny' faggots running around doing pretty much nothing at all that shows what faggot 'culture' actually does and promotes in real life. that gets hidden by censorship laws.

You may, or may not have a point about the propaganda.

Personally? I think there are more moderate Muslims than there are extremists. OTH, I do think the representation of Muslims in both popular culture and the body politic is probably over represented.

The cultural and intellectual elites ALWAYS have an agenda, I too find it transparent and disappointing.


The question we need to ask, is it proportional to their numbers in American society? My guess? Probably not.


But then, we are constantly, and I mean, unendingly bombarded with Jewish cultural references in our TEE VEE shows, in our movies, and on public radio. Do you know what proportion of the public is Jewish? Just under 5 percent. That is about the same proportion that is Native American. So, reasonably, folks should be exposed to just as much cultural references of Native Americans. Over 50 percent of our cities and states are named after Native Americans. The Constitution is based on the Great Law of the Peace. . . .yet? No where near the cultural education and exposure is given to our own home grown reference as to the Jewish culture . . . . Why?

Money, Power, and international Influence I'm guessing?

So yeah, clearly the cultural elites manipulate folks. Society in MSM is not evenly represented. Folks need to think for themselves.

 

[emilynghiem]

MISSTATEMENT ALREADY CORRECTED:
CORRECTION: Muslim practice means going "above and beyond" not against the law



Hi longknife
I happen to know Mustafaa personally, and called and asked him about this
when I first saw it publicized online.

He explained very clearly that his words and meanings were taken out of context.
I was relieved to hear this rational explanation because I know he couldn't have meant what it sounded like!

He explained that the context was that Muslims are called to higher standards
"above and beyond" what the law requires.

The example he gave: even though the law allows people to drink legally,
Muslims are not supposed to partake in alcohol and drunkenness.
So that is going BEYOND what the law requires. The Muslims have a stricter standard.

NOTE: I did tell him that the correct wording is "above and beyond"

So if he misstated it, I could see how that could miscommunicate his actual meaning.

Thank you for posting this but to be fair,
can you please amend your message to reflect this correction.

Thanks longknife
Mustafaa is a well honored community leader, who works with Christians and other Peace and Justice volunteers
with nonprofit outreach, including Christian Pastors among his own family members.

=============
PREVIOUS CORRECTION POSTED on USMB DEC 2016:

I saw clips and posts online, claiming that Mustafaa Carroll of CAIR
stated that "Muslims are above the law." Knowing him personally,
I KNEW that this had to be taken out of context. But what context?

In my greatest imagination, I could not think up what this could be.
My best guess was not even close!

I called him up and he answered me personally:

He explained the full context of his statement was
1. Muslim duty to Sharia or practice INCLUDES following the law of the land.
That's a given.

I already understand this concept because Muslims are to follow the same Bible as Christians which call for "civil obedience" to authority, so that they witness to what is right, while following civil authority standards and process of secular laws and govt. They respect that if they are truly faithful and obedient to God.

2. And his statement taken out of this context was that
if Muslims are faithful in practice, those standards go ABOVE what the law requires.
They will go ABOVE AND BEYOND.
so the laws will not affect them BECAUSE THEY ARE MEETING THEM
NOT BECAUSE THEY ARE VIOLATING THEM AS THIS WAS MISCONSTRUED.

The problem I saw with his wording, is in his video he used the terms
"above the law" but THE SPIRIT of what he meant, and how he explained more clearly
over the phone, is that Muslims would go 'above and beyond' what the law requires.
He even gave me an example:
a. the law prohibits drinking while driving, but does not forbid drinking
b. by Islam, followers would not drink either!
So of course they will not break laws against drinking and driving, but go BEYOND that standard
and not drink to the point of drunkenness in the first place!

HERE IS THE VIDEO CLIP that Mustafaa sent me:

Mustafa_MediaResponse.mp4

The only argument I have with him, I sense the video still does not explain as clearly
as he did personally over the phone. Communication, especially with a topic that has
multiple levels of meaning as in this case, is much better one-on-one as a conversation
to CONFIRM the meaning is conveyed. It is VERY HARD to describe this concept
in "one blanket statement" linearly, and be sure that it is understand by different
audiences from different contexts and perspectives.

The term "above the law" means something very negative,
and my friend Mustafaa did better when explaining it as "going above and beyond"
what the law requires.

I told him I would post this correction.
=============================

cc: night_son Rambunctious Picaro

Ancient lion 's reply above making this same clarification is the correct meaning
of Musafaa Carroll's statement, not the OP which is incorrect. May I please request
that this be corrected so that it does not slander, defame or misrepresent what he said.
Thank you longknife if you can please make this correction!

It is pointless Emily.

Folks NEED an enemy.

The programing and propaganda of around the clock indoctrination is stronger than what you are trying to do.

It doesn't matter that reason and logic tell us that normal human beings want to have peace and tranquility. Mothers, fathers, sons, daughters, of billions of people do not seek conflict.

It is giant multinational corporations and governments that seek to keep folks afraid of one another.

Obviously.

Fear pushes us to blame someone for the few, very few incidents we see on our corporate TEE VEE. IN the past it would have been the Germans and the Japanese. Perhaps it would have been the Jew or the Chinese.

Now? The corporate media has focused on the immigrant and the Muslim. Folks that get the reality from the TEE VEE and the CFR press won't be reasoned with.

Folks that think this way, actually believe, that the small folks, and the poor that follow the Quran, all of them, there is no distinction, they are all the same, all 1.8 billion of them. They cannot conceive of Islam having as much variety as Christianity, which has a spectrum of difference between, say, a strict pious Amish practitioner, and someone who follows a Televangelist. Naturally, to folks associated with Christianity, the two couldn't be more different, and to claim the two are the same? Would be foolishness.

Yet, that is what we have to read from folks that are afraid of Islam. One Muslim is that same as the next. All 1.8 billion are the same.

IOW, GOD MAKES MISTAKES. These Christians think Jews are all right, but clearly, God is wrong when he allowed a religion to spread like Islam has . . . God didn't know what he was doing, and these Christian folks know better.

If that is the case, how can mankind be sure of the divinity of the bible, of the divinity of anything in creation after all?


. . . it must be hopeless. No wonder the nihilists and atheists are on the rise. Divinity and Faith is being squandered. The Lucifarians that are in control are playing them all like a fiddle to destroy the poor, powerless, homeless, and hungry of the world. Instead of warring with each other, these great repositories of faith should be finding common ground.


Because we play into their hands. . . someday in the future, the whole world will hate America and seek to destroy her as she keeps playing into this hatred.

Dear MisterBeale thank you for your honest assessment of the plight of humanity.
Yes and no, I agree we have these flaws, so that COLLECTIVELY when forming
CORPORATE groups, institutions, PARTIES and Govt (and also media conglomerates)
YES unfortunately the worst flaws of humanity are MULTIPLIED and become oppressive and abusive.

However, this is not to say it is hopeless.
By treating the people making up these Govts, parties and Corporate interests
as INDIVIDUALS, that's where we have every opportunity to connect
as you and I do here.

You and I could treat each other as just another member of an anonymous mob of mindsets on the internet.
But instead we hear each other as individuals.

When I address longknife, this isn't as a mindless group, but addressing
an individual who believes in Constitutional laws as I do, and we respect those principles.

Each person has their own language for the laws, and when we address
each other by common laws we commit to follow, we have this chance
to connect on common principles.

I do believe it is inherent in our human nature and process of development
to "break down" the mob mentality and work toward one-on-one connections.

Then apply that back to COLLECTIVELY influencing our media and corporate hierarchies in turn.

So the ripple effect, the law of attraction or laws of "cause and effect" play in our favor.

The same PROCESS
by which NEGATIVE perceptions and FEARS that bias individuals and create a whole MOB of people of that mindset
also works the OTHER WAY
when POSITIVE changes that expand our perception and ways of dealing with conflict
start with INDIVIDUALS and replicate to affect RELATIONS around us
(and that in turn multiples to affect INSTITUTIONS around us).

So bad news is YES the groups and individuals co-influence each other when it comes to NEGATIVE and FEAR BASED perceptions.
And GOOD NEWS is YES this dynamic also works with POSITIVE change and growth in relations and understanding to correct wrongs.

. . . but the government indoctrination of these individuals, and the corporate propaganda all say "such and such" about the topic at hand.

With the caveat that; "you may hear otherwise out there, but that is an intentional strategy to lie to you by 1.8 million evil people," and anyone that would use rational, logical thought.. . . .

IOW, the bogey many is much more compelling.

Thus, what is the point?

P.S., I find your boundless optimism for solutions and cooperative change against oppressive forces that oppose all people refreshing.

I think the good news is, well meaning people of the world, be they Jew, Christian, or Muslim, never initiate force or violence.

So the entire conversation is sort of moot. It is the nefarious forces we need to be concerned about, and these, more often than not, are associated with the very same institutions that are warning us about the enemy we should be concerned about.

lol it's the corporate media that is promoting Islam and all sort sof other inane 'diversity' over Christianity, so now we have liars peddling yet another fake narrative aimed at marginalizing facts in favor of promoting continued social degeneracy in the U.S.. Soon every show on TV will have to have a 'moderate Muslim' character, just like they all now have to have 'witty and funny' faggots running around doing pretty much nothing at all that shows what faggot 'culture' actually does and promotes in real life. that gets hidden by censorship laws.

You may, or may not have a point about the propaganda.

Personally? I think there are more moderate Muslims than there are extremists. OTH, I do think the representation of Muslims in both popular culture and the body politic is probably over represented.

The cultural and intellectual elites ALWAYS have an agenda, I too find it transparent and disappointing.


The question we need to ask, is it proportional to their numbers in American society? My guess? Probably not.


But then, we are constantly, and I mean, unendingly bombarded with Jewish cultural references in our TEE VEE shows, in our movies, and on public radio. Do you know what proportion of the public is Jewish? Just under 5 percent. That is about the same proportion that is Native American. So, reasonably, folks should be exposed to just as much cultural references of Native Americans. Over 50 percent of our cities and states are named after Native Americans. The Constitution is based on the Great Law of the Peace. . . .yet? No where near the cultural education and exposure is given to our own home grown reference as to the Jewish culture . . . . Why?

Money, Power, and international Influence I'm guessing?

So yeah, clearly the cultural elites manipulate folks. Society in MSM is not evenly represented. Folks need to think for themselves.

Maybe it's by spiritual laws and process MisterBeale
"the first shall be last and the last shall be first"

that way, by the time we come full circle,
all groups come out even where we all have taken turns being last and being first,
being the top of the totem pole and being at the bottom,
being right in as many ways as we prove to be wrong.
Where strengths prove to be weaknesses, and weaknesses can serve as strengths.

So all people are equal relatively speaking and
when justice comes for all, we all answer for our contributions to the good of the whole,
both good and bad, both offering and receiving corrections given one to another as equals.

 

[Monk-Eye]

" Turning Corners "

* What Two Sew He Row *

NOTE: Because of the Scriptural teaching on Civil Obedience to Civil Laws and Authority,
the Christians and Muslims who commit to this can thus be CHECKED by CONSTITUTIONAL LAWS
similar to Constitutionalists who swear allegiance to uphold the Constitution.
. . .
The problem with Muslims and Christians who MIX Government with their Religious beliefs
to start following or imposing POLITICAL RELIGIONS
is where they FAIL TO ENFORCE CIVIL OBEDIENCE TO CONSTITUTIONAL
CHECKS AND BALANCES, LIMITS, and SEPARATION OF POWERS ON GOVT AUTHORITY.
. . .
But as long as Christians, Muslims and other religious adherents
RESPECT Constitutional laws against establishing or imposing religious beliefs on others,
this part of CIVIL OBEDIENCE CHECKS AND PREVENTS collective abuse of authority for oppressing individuals.

Numbers translate into votes and into political policy .

Thus , check the left wing immigration propensities at the door , as such pleadings pander exceedingly to a directive for adherents of fictional ishmaelism to emigrate and proselytize , as such pleadings distract from the bottom line that statistics through occupation are being leveraged , that should include a risk base analysis of its sponsors and issue challenges for necessity .

Remain stern against those lauding democracy for its tyranny by majority while those also deride individual liberty ; and , while cultural exchange should be greatly valued , access to voting booths through citizenship should be guarded - especially against those with tenets of creed to implement illegitimate aggression .


* Policies Enforce *

My clarification to this:
If the point is to ban the abuse of political religions that violate Constitutional laws, process,
beliefs, principles and protections for all citizens, that needs to be stated specifically
rather than use an overly broad terms such as SHARIA that "targets Muslims instead of applying to ALL POLITICAL RELIGIONS" and doesn't distinguish the RELIGIOUS ABUSE or the unconstitutional POLITICAL RELIGION from the Constitutional free exercise of religion of individuals or groups practicing LAWFULLY.

Step one is make a distinction between nomianism and antinomianism .

Step two is make a distinction between qurayshism and fictional ishmaelism .

Step three is determine whether tenets of creed violate non violence principles and issue self defense against risks that are valid .

Non Nomian Truth Or Consequences Constructed Qurayshism Crossed Logic

National Security Agency Violating US First Amendment Establishment Clause

Does Non Violence Principles Correct Non Aggression Principles Lexicon ?

Political Science Terminology : Negative / Positive : Wrights / Liberties : Protections / Endowments

 

[Magnificat]

The goal of Islam is not in question. Nor are those organizations that follow it. At every level, their dedication to the Koran and the teachings of their religious leaders call for subjugating the US Constitution for Sharia.

According to Herman Mustafa Carroll, leader of CAIR in Dallas-Fort Worth, Muslims are not bound to US law because they are Muslims.

“If we are practicing Muslims, we are above the law of the land,” he says.

Well, he’s not lying about what Muslims actually believe. Sure, there may be law-abiding, patriotic American Muslims, but plenty of adherents to the faith of Islam in this country feel exactly the same way as Carroll does.

And why wouldn’t they? They pledge allegiance to the political system of Sharia, which is fundamentally opposed to our American constitution.

Carroll made this statement at an Austin, Texas rally as part of an effort to hold “Muslim Capitol Day” events. According to the website for the event, Muslims traveled to the Texas capitol to “promote civic and political activism throughout the wider Muslim community.”

“We tried to downplay Sharia, because we didn’t want to give the other side any excitement for being here,” he said.

Much more

And this is why they all need to die.

 

[longknife]

My ideal solution would seeing every Muslim in the USA not born here returned to the countries of their birth. Every one of them!