Bush Uses First Veto To Restrict Scientific Research

[manu1959]

Because in their warped way, the Christian fundies who are so vehemently against this have two arguments: 1) They hate abortion and this is where the majority of embryos come from; and 2) it has been mooted that some people might even become pregnant on purpose in order to have an abortion so the embryo can be used in said research...

yea so....are they not entitled to their beliefs in your tollerant liberal world?

 

[jillian]

Because in their warped way, the Christian fundies who are so vehemently against this have two arguments: 1) They hate abortion and this is where the majority of embryos come from; and 2) it has been mooted that some people might even become pregnant on purpose in order to have an abortion so the embryo can be used in said research...

While some of the stem cells come from aborted fetuses, many more come from frozen embryos created during the in vitro fertilization process. These zygotes just get frozen and eventually are disposed of if they're not used.

 

[Dr Grump]

yea so....are they not entitled to their beliefs in your tollerant liberal world?

Of course they are...Am I allowed mine in your neocon facist tolerant world?

 

[manu1959]

While some of the stem cells come from aborted fetuses, many more come from frozen embryos created during the in vitro fertilization process. These zygotes just get frozen and eventually are disposed of if they're not used.

actually they need you signature to destroy them....at that point you get to donate them or kill them

 

[Hagbard Celine]

That's not exactly true, but the way libs prefer to look at and spin it. In no way does President Bush's veto preclude adult stem cell research, which has a far better record of actually producing results in the research field than embryonic research--and is produced from far more sources than embryonic research. The embryonic stem cells that were frozen and being used for research at the time President Bush became president can continue to be used in research labs. It is only embryonic stem cell materials produced since President Bush took office that can no longer be used for research purposes. There are tons of adult stem cells available for research, so I don't really get what the squabble is about--except what political points can be scored with the uneducated on the topic.

Thanks for the under-handed insult oh supreme intellectual. The reason that the majority of therapies have been from adult stem-cells is because until 1998, that's all there was to work with. Since 1998, when the first embryonic stem-cells were first isolated and grown at the University of Wisconsin, it has been theorized that embryonic stem-cells, which have characteristics different from adult stem-cells, could be used for many different types of therapies, including growing whole new transplant organs and other body parts. You can't fault a brand new (only 8 years old) technology for not having been as beneficial as an older one. It's ridiculous.

 

[manu1959]

Of course they are...Am I allowed mine in your neocon facist tolerant world?

i don't live in a necon facist world i live in california....anyway.....if you are allowed your view is not pres bush....and why condem him for his view.....when you win an election....or figure out how to stop having them stolen from you .... pres clinton will get to fund all the embryo death she wants.....

 

[Dr Grump]

i don't live in a necon facist world i live in california....anyway.....if you are allowed your view is not pres bush....and why condem him for his view.....when you win an election....or figure out how to stop having them stolen from you .... pres clinton will get to fund all the embryo death she wants.....

Hey, I don't live in a liberal world! I thought you were bandying around empty rhetoric and decided to join in the fun...

President Clinton? Yikes!

 

[jillian]

yea so....are they not entitled to their beliefs in your tollerant liberal world?

Yes, they are. They can choose not to avail themselves of the science resulting from the research same as I can choose not to use cosmetics which are tested on animals.

What this eensy minority *shouldn't* be allowed to do is keep the rest of us from using the results of this research to treat horrible illness and save EXISTING lives.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Yes, they are. They can choose not to avail themselves of the science resulting from the research same as I can choose not to use cosmetics which are tested on animals.

What this eensy minority *shouldn't* be allowed to do is keep the rest of us from using the results of this research to treat horrible illness and save EXISTING lives.

We are not an unhinged mob democracy. We're a constitutional republic, with limits on what even the selfish mob may do to the powerless and voiceless.

Are lives in the present more valuable than lives in the future?

 

[Otter_Creek]

Why doesn't George Soros and the “Democracy Alliance” step up to the plate and privately fund it? ... oh yeah ... nevermind.:duh3:

 

[Hobbit]

Correct me if I am wrong but hasn't the best results of stem cell research come from adults rather than embroys?


And does vetoing the bill prevent embrionic stem cell research from being done? Or it just means it will not get my tax dollars to pay for it?

Yes
No
Yes

 

[Avatar4321]

Yeah, it is amazing how people will twist things. Embryonic stem-cell research wasn't even an option until the time President Bush was in office, so it's ridiculous to say that he's "the first President to allow stem cell research." Of course he is! It didn't exist until he was in office!

The bottom line is that he will use his first veto to stifle research that could lead to cures for diseases and improve the quality of life for millions all so he can continue to court his religious conservative voter base. Meanwhile, the embryos in question are frozen and will be destroyed anyway, without ever having been used for good, so the moral "killing human life" argument is moot anyway.

Also, restrictions in the US will lead to scientific breakthroughs abroad, so foreign nations will benefit from stell-cell therapies before we do.

President Bush's decision to veto this bill sucks. But why am I surprised?

Um yeah. Thats what I said He was the First President to allow it. Which is quite the opposite picture then his opponents are trying to paint. They want people to think he wont allow it. But he has. Which is why I said its amazing how people twist things.

 

[Avatar4321]

people do want it....you just have a president that does not want the government to fund it .... patience...when the dems gain control of the whitehouse in two years yall can kill every emryo on the planet and cure all diseases and we can live forever....al gore should do a movie on this

If they kill all the embryos who is going to be left living?

 

[Mr.Conley]

If they kill all the embryos who is going to be left living?

 

[Stephanie]

Why doesn't George Soros and the “Democracy Alliance” step up to the plate and privately fund it? ... oh yeah ... nevermind.:duh3:

If they did that, they wouldn't have something else to bash President Bush with...

 

[Mr.Conley]

Um yeah. Thats what I said He was the First President to allow it. Which is quite the opposite picture then his opponents are trying to paint. They want people to think he wont allow it. But he has. Which is why I said its amazing how people twist things.

It's kind of like letting a baby eat but not giving it any food. Sure, you're not forbiding it from eating, but the kid's still going to die of starvation.

 

[Avatar4321]

Correct me if I am wrong but hasn't the best results of stem cell research come from adults rather than embroys?


And does vetoing the bill prevent embrionic stem cell research from being done? Or it just means it will not get my tax dollars to pay for it?

It just means that tax dollars wont go to pay for it.

Which is why this whole argument is incredibly stupid. The government shouldnt be spending money on alot of things. This is one of many of those things the government has no business spending money on.

Also, I am sick and tired of all this bs about all these cures being found through it. Sure you might find cures. But you dont know you will. So trying to argue that somehow not funding this type of stem cell research (While funding other types) is preventing us from finding cures which dont exist is ridiculous. Especially when we have no clue what cures can be found.

You want to argue for science. Stick with the science. Dont demoguage the issue with nonsense. I could argue that we need conduct studies in which we kill virgins and eat there hearts because it might cure cancer. Sure I have absolutely no evidence of this because the research hasnt been done but i could make the argument and its just as strong as the bull your feeding us.

If you want to support embryonic stem cell research, thats your choice. but the government doesnt need to support it for the research to be done. Heck if Thomas Edison waited around for the government to support his experiments with light we would all be living in the dark.

 

[Little-Acorn]

Bush Uses First Veto To Restrict Scientific Research

I was wondering when the usual leftists would start lying about what Bush did with this veto.

Looks like this title was written a little less than 30 mintues after he issued the veto.

Probably not a record, but still pretty quick. Have you been practicing your fibs? :read:

.

 

[Avatar4321]

Yes, they are. They can choose not to avail themselves of the science resulting from the research same as I can choose not to use cosmetics which are tested on animals.

What this eensy minority *shouldn't* be allowed to do is keep the rest of us from using the results of this research to treat horrible illness and save EXISTING lives.

No one is preventing the rest of us from this research. Nothing the President has done has stopped Stem Cell research, whether adult or Embryonic.

All that this has done is prevent further government financing of Embryonic stem cell.

Which is why your argument is incredibly stupid, so I either have to conclude that you are a dishonest person refusing to acknowledge what this actually does, or you are just stupid.

Either way it doesnt speak much for you.

 

[Mr.Conley]

What's that thing called when you prohibit someone or some group from doing something? I forget the word.