Blame game...

[Meister]

Of course he will blame the previous administration. That said, he should. He inherited an economy in shambles, and troops on two fronts. Sure he has tried to make changes to correct these issues (yes, imo these changes failed). But he should remind people that he started off in a hole.

I just wish he would correct the direction we are headed before it's too late. Unfortunately, I don't think he has the means to do it.

-TSO

Why would a person run for an office if they don't want to accept the challenge of existing issues? Unfortunately, he has had opportunities to change directions, but like you said, hasn't had the means (experience and knowledge) to choose a better direction to go in. His advisors have been focused on their own agenda for this country. It's very hard to rebuild an engine when you don't know what you're doing and even harder when your team of advisors wants to rebuild that engine to run in reverse.

Exactly. There is certainly enough blame to go around, but it's been a year now with his regime in place along with super majorities in the house and senate to help him expedite his plans. He can't expect to keep getting by on "well, look at what i inherited." For one, the many people in the nation unemployed or in danger of being unemployed aren't going to want to hear it, and most of the nation is getting sick of it except for the far lefty Obama nut huggers. Second; he knew exactly what he was getting into and won mostly because people genuinely thought he could "fix" things... it's what he campaigned on.

It has been over a year now, and it's time for barry to "man up" and start taking responsiblity for his own policies to ease the problems. The stimulus bill promised dividends, and has been a bust so far, we are still in two wars, Gitmo is still detaining terroists, the deficit is still rising, and unemployment is sitting at 10% when we were promised it wouldn't go over 8%. Yes, barry is not owning up to his own policies, and still playing the blame game. Fact of the matter is that Americans have grown weary of his excuses, they aren't as naive as he and his administration would like to think. Obama's poll numbers have fallen, and all of his celebrity appearances haven't helped him one iota.
Americans see barry's policies, as politics as usual, no hope and change here...move along.

 

[DiamondDave]

In order to correct the situation, he needs support from the Republican Party, which they are not going to give him on a single solitary thing. That was clear from the outset, and it has been the spoken mantra for over a year now. Republicans (or whatever they prefer to call themselves now that they've all decided George W. Bush was just a figment of someone's imagination) that their goal is the bring down this administration, no matter how it might hurt the nation as a whole.

That was driven home quite clearly yesterday by the defeat of the Deficit Reduction Panel, a bill sponsored by Senators Conrad (D) and Gregg (R) and widely seen as a good starting point at one time but when it came up for vote, was defeated by many of those same Republicans whose idea it was in the first place.

And there is a whole thread on this.. where I have already pointed out that the measure/bill was amended and changed no fewer than 10 times from the original bill that was supported by some who did not end up supporting the end product

The real question that answers this is who ammended and changed the bill and why.

As to why, you will have to determine for yourself.. as we don't really know what is the motivation behind many political decisions...

as to who... that is why when you look up a bill, it lists the amendments, the sponsors, etc.... all that information is available

 

[American Horse]

That was driven home quite clearly yesterday by the defeat of the Deficit Reduction Panel, a bill sponsored by Senators Conrad (D) and Gregg (R) and widely seen as a good starting point at one time but when it came up for vote, was defeated by many of those same Republicans whose idea it was in the first place.

A so called "deficit reduction panel" or commission, would give tracit approval to a base-line of spending 24% higher this year than last, and tax cuts which would spur small and large business would always be off the table since Democrats do no believe in dynamic scoring of taxing legislation and see them as adding to deficits.

 

[MaggieMae]

Of course he will blame the previous administration. That said, he should. He inherited an economy in shambles, and troops on two fronts. Sure he has tried to make changes to correct these issues (yes, imo these changes failed). But he should remind people that he started off in a hole.

I just wish he would correct the direction we are headed before it's too late. Unfortunately, I don't think he has the means to do it.

-TSO

Why would a person run for an office if they don't want to accept the challenge of existing issues? Unfortunately, he has had opportunities to change directions, but like you said, hasn't had the means (experience and knowledge) to choose a better direction to go in. His advisors have been focused on their own agenda for this country. It's very hard to rebuild an engine when you don't know what you're doing and even harder when your team of advisors wants to rebuild that engine to run in reverse.

Exactly. There is certainly enough blame to go around, but it's been a year now with his regime in place along with super majorities in the house and senate to help him expedite his plans. He can't expect to keep getting by on "well, look at what i inherited." For one, the many people in the nation unemployed or in danger of being unemployed aren't going to want to hear it, and most of the nation is getting sick of it except for the far lefty Obama nut huggers. Second; he knew exactly what he was getting into and won mostly because people genuinely thought he could "fix" things... it's what he campaigned on.

Once again, I ask any right-winger how you would create immediate jobs. There is never, ever an answer. Obama can't just wave a magic wand, and neither can you. People that expect him to "do something" ironically are the same people who trash any government assistance to help them get a job AND subsidize their lives until they do.

 

[Meister]

Why would a person run for an office if they don't want to accept the challenge of existing issues? Unfortunately, he has had opportunities to change directions, but like you said, hasn't had the means (experience and knowledge) to choose a better direction to go in. His advisors have been focused on their own agenda for this country. It's very hard to rebuild an engine when you don't know what you're doing and even harder when your team of advisors wants to rebuild that engine to run in reverse.

Exactly. There is certainly enough blame to go around, but it's been a year now with his regime in place along with super majorities in the house and senate to help him expedite his plans. He can't expect to keep getting by on "well, look at what i inherited." For one, the many people in the nation unemployed or in danger of being unemployed aren't going to want to hear it, and most of the nation is getting sick of it except for the far lefty Obama nut huggers. Second; he knew exactly what he was getting into and won mostly because people genuinely thought he could "fix" things... it's what he campaigned on.

Once again, I ask any right-winger how you would create immediate jobs. There is never, ever an answer. Obama can't just wave a magic wand, and neither can you. People that expect him to "do something" ironically are the same people who trash any government assistance to help them get a job AND subsidize their lives until they do.

Stop the corporation bashing, would be a good start. Nothing like instablility with all the rhetoric from the administration and democrats. Stop with the cap and trade tax rhetoric. Businesses don't do well with uncertainty, this might get the economy off the floor. Then start adding some pro business incentives.
The government isn't the answer, it IS part of the solution.

 

[American Horse]

Once again, I ask any right-winger how you would create immediate jobs. There is never, ever an answer. Obama can't just wave a magic wand, and neither can you.

Immediate jobs would be created with some very friendly taxing legislation to small businesses. Since historically 70% of all new jobs come from that sector,... that is the place to concentrate effort. Certain tax reductions aimed to make new business ventures there less risky and problematic would cause people who are holding back to go ahead and make a move.

One time tax credits will not do that. You cannot buy a job with $7k. It can be said that a large proportion of new small businesses fail within a year, but they stiill create new jobs which don't entirely disappear. Much of the time the employees of these failed businesses see another way forward because they have taken note of the reasons for the failure; and the business education they get is invaluable.

The healthcare debacle has actually deterred those small business jobs.

 

[MaggieMae]

Let's take a beat here to recall the other "Blame Games" in recent history. Conservatives blame Barney Frank for the banking collapse, in spite of the presence of the derivative market (caused by Phil Gramm (R) Texas and his penchant for deregulation).

Conservatives blamed Bill Clinton for the attacks on September 11 because he failed to kill bin Laden. This, in spite of the fact that George W. Bush also failed to kill bin Laden in eight years of trying.

Conservatives blame everyone else for hyping environmental concerns even as the environment is deteriorating. This is to provide cover for the big donors like energy and chemical manufacturers.

Seems there is still plenty of blame to go around! I wonder when someone on either side is going to step up and actually accept some of it!

If you're waiting on politicians to take on any negativity and point it at themselves, bring me one of those ice cubes you find in hell.

Obama has already admitted that in hindsight he probably shouldn't have taken on health care immediately. He made that confession at some point in his recent interview with Dianne Sawyer. You can find the transcript and also watch the video.

 

[MaggieMae]

Fools?? We're not the ones who voted for the current megalomaniac that is currently President

It's one thing to argue over the actual issues, but quite another to bitch about how many times he says "I" -- that's where the fucking fools part comes in. But I digress. I forget that with certain people, everything needs to be clearly spelled out.

 

[MaggieMae]

Why would a person run for an office if they don't want to accept the challenge of existing issues? Unfortunately, he has had opportunities to change directions, but like you said, hasn't had the means (experience and knowledge) to choose a better direction to go in. His advisors have been focused on their own agenda for this country. It's very hard to rebuild an engine when you don't know what you're doing and even harder when your team of advisors wants to rebuild that engine to run in reverse.

Exactly. There is certainly enough blame to go around, but it's been a year now with his regime in place along with super majorities in the house and senate to help him expedite his plans. He can't expect to keep getting by on "well, look at what i inherited." For one, the many people in the nation unemployed or in danger of being unemployed aren't going to want to hear it, and most of the nation is getting sick of it except for the far lefty Obama nut huggers. Second; he knew exactly what he was getting into and won mostly because people genuinely thought he could "fix" things... it's what he campaigned on.

It has been over a year now, and it's time for barry to "man up" and start taking responsiblity for his own policies to ease the problems. The stimulus bill promised dividends, and has been a bust so far, we are still in two wars, Gitmo is still detaining terroists, the deficit is still rising, and unemployment is sitting at 10% when we were promised it wouldn't go over 8%. Yes, barry is not owning up to his own policies, and still playing the blame game. Fact of the matter is that Americans have grown weary of his excuses, they aren't as naive as he and his administration would like to think. Obama's poll numbers have fallen, and all of his celebrity appearances haven't helped him one iota.
Americans see barry's policies, as politics as usual, no hope and change here...move along.

So, for the third time in this thread alone, what exactly do you want him to do? Reduce taxes even further which is also a deficit producer?

 

[MaggieMae]

What's he supposed to do?

I dunno, be a man and admit he's IN WAY OVER HIS HEAD? Nah, liberal/progressives can't do that. The man is a walking, talking cliche. Fuck him.

"I dunno." At least you're honest. I have a suggestion: How about you stay the fuck out of the conversation until you DO know something or can contribute something other than your scummy comments.

 

[uscitizen]

Give businesses more incentive to move jobs offshore?

The first thing I would do is make it mandatory to label country of origin for all products, including medicines and food.

Then the people could buy American products with their choice.
WE are to blame for our problems. If we had cut off the companies that moved offshore we would be lots better off.
If we had not used our homes as piggy banks.
If we had not spent for status instead of what we needed.
If we had not gone asshole deep in debt.
If we had had the drive to better educate ourselves.

 

[MaggieMae]

That was driven home quite clearly yesterday by the defeat of the Deficit Reduction Panel, a bill sponsored by Senators Conrad (D) and Gregg (R) and widely seen as a good starting point at one time but when it came up for vote, was defeated by many of those same Republicans whose idea it was in the first place.

A so called "deficit reduction panel" or commission, would give tracit approval to a base-line of spending 24% higher this year than last, and tax cuts which would spur small and large business would always be off the table since Democrats do no believe in dynamic scoring of taxing legislation and see them as adding to deficits.

That's simply parroting someone's opinion as to why they voted against it. McCain perhaps? Nah, he's not that bright. Actually Judd Gregg is extremely bright in that regard, yet we never heard him say any such thing.

 

[Meister]

Exactly. There is certainly enough blame to go around, but it's been a year now with his regime in place along with super majorities in the house and senate to help him expedite his plans. He can't expect to keep getting by on "well, look at what i inherited." For one, the many people in the nation unemployed or in danger of being unemployed aren't going to want to hear it, and most of the nation is getting sick of it except for the far lefty Obama nut huggers. Second; he knew exactly what he was getting into and won mostly because people genuinely thought he could "fix" things... it's what he campaigned on.

It has been over a year now, and it's time for barry to "man up" and start taking responsiblity for his own policies to ease the problems. The stimulus bill promised dividends, and has been a bust so far, we are still in two wars, Gitmo is still detaining terroists, the deficit is still rising, and unemployment is sitting at 10% when we were promised it wouldn't go over 8%. Yes, barry is not owning up to his own policies, and still playing the blame game. Fact of the matter is that Americans have grown weary of his excuses, they aren't as naive as he and his administration would like to think. Obama's poll numbers have fallen, and all of his celebrity appearances haven't helped him one iota.
Americans see barry's policies, as politics as usual, no hope and change here...move along.

So, for the third time in this thread alone, what exactly do you want him to do? Reduce taxes even further which is also a deficit producer?

I do believe I have answered that in another thread. Reducing taxes doesn't mean a higher deficit, in fact in increases revenue with more liquidity with the employees, and with business. This has been proven on more than one occasion with our government

 

[MaggieMae]

Exactly. There is certainly enough blame to go around, but it's been a year now with his regime in place along with super majorities in the house and senate to help him expedite his plans. He can't expect to keep getting by on "well, look at what i inherited." For one, the many people in the nation unemployed or in danger of being unemployed aren't going to want to hear it, and most of the nation is getting sick of it except for the far lefty Obama nut huggers. Second; he knew exactly what he was getting into and won mostly because people genuinely thought he could "fix" things... it's what he campaigned on.

Once again, I ask any right-winger how you would create immediate jobs. There is never, ever an answer. Obama can't just wave a magic wand, and neither can you. People that expect him to "do something" ironically are the same people who trash any government assistance to help them get a job AND subsidize their lives until they do.

Stop the corporation bashing, would be a good start. Nothing like instablility with all the rhetoric from the administration and democrats. Stop with the cap and trade tax rhetoric. Businesses don't do well with uncertainty, this might get the economy off the floor. Then start adding some pro business incentives.
The government isn't the answer, it IS part of the solution.

He's bank bashing, not corporate bashing. If anything, he's tried to help small businesses survive. Do I really need to point out HOW all over again? Don't you people ever actually read any facts yourselves?

If business owners aren't well-read enough by this point in time to realize that the cap and trade part of the energy bill will NEVER get through, then they're too stupid to be running a business in the first place. I acknowledge that everybody's "nervous," but good grief, running a business means taking risks all the time. Are they just going to sit there and wait for opportunity to knock? Do they honestly think that the Republican party has better options for them? Do they honestly believe that they will have their taxes reduced, their employee health care plans subsidized, and that next year at this time they'll be swimming in profits?

 

[American Horse]

That was driven home quite clearly yesterday by the defeat of the Deficit Reduction Panel, a bill sponsored by Senators Conrad (D) and Gregg (R) and widely seen as a good starting point at one time but when it came up for vote, was defeated by many of those same Republicans whose idea it was in the first place.

A so called "deficit reduction panel" or commission, would give tracit approval to a base-line of spending 24% higher this year than last, and tax cuts which would spur small and large business would always be off the table since Democrats do no believe in dynamic scoring of taxing legislation and see them as adding to deficits.

That's simply parroting someone's opinion as to why they voted against it. McCain perhaps? Nah, he's not that bright. Actually Judd Gregg is extremely bright in that regard, yet we never heard him say any such thing.

Maggie, I'd appreciate it if you didn't put words in my mouth, and I do my own thinking...thank you. I have no clue what McCain has said on the subject. Stop projecting.


edit: furthermore handing over to a "commission" decisions like these takes the people out of the process. Whatever opinion they would express like the one in Mass/Brown would be disabled, and rendered moot.

 

[MaggieMae]

Once again, I ask any right-winger how you would create immediate jobs. There is never, ever an answer. Obama can't just wave a magic wand, and neither can you.

Immediate jobs would be created with some very friendly taxing legislation to small businesses. Since historically 70% of all new jobs come from that sector,... that is the place to concentrate effort. Certain tax reductions aimed to make new business ventures there less risky and problematic would cause people who are holding back to go ahead and make a move.

One time tax credits will not do that. You cannot buy a job with $7k. It can be said that a large proportion of new small businesses fail within a year, but they stiill create new jobs which don't entirely disappear. Much of the time the employees of these failed businesses see another way forward because they have taken note of the reasons for the failure; and the business education they get is invaluable.

The healthcare debacle has actually deterred those small business jobs.

I repeat: Further tax reductions at this time simply means increasing the deficit.

 

[Meister]

Give businesses more incentive to move jobs offshore?

The first thing I would do is make it mandatory to label country of origin for all products, including medicines and food.

Then the people could buy American products with their choice.
WE are to blame for our problems. If we had cut off the companies that moved offshore we would be lots better off.
If we had not used our homes as piggy banks.
If we had not spent for status instead of what we needed.
If we had not gone asshole deep in debt.
If we had had the drive to better educate ourselves.

What? Maybe you would like the government to tell you how to live your life, not me.

Most products that are made overseas are already lables as such.
Perhaps if we didn't over regulate, and have better business incentives they wouldn't move overseas. By the way....you can thank Clinton for that OK?
Perhaps with the rest of your "if we had not's" taxed the hell out of the American people, they would have had more money in their pockets.

 

[MaggieMae]

It has been over a year now, and it's time for barry to "man up" and start taking responsiblity for his own policies to ease the problems. The stimulus bill promised dividends, and has been a bust so far, we are still in two wars, Gitmo is still detaining terroists, the deficit is still rising, and unemployment is sitting at 10% when we were promised it wouldn't go over 8%. Yes, barry is not owning up to his own policies, and still playing the blame game. Fact of the matter is that Americans have grown weary of his excuses, they aren't as naive as he and his administration would like to think. Obama's poll numbers have fallen, and all of his celebrity appearances haven't helped him one iota.
Americans see barry's policies, as politics as usual, no hope and change here...move along.

So, for the third time in this thread alone, what exactly do you want him to do? Reduce taxes even further which is also a deficit producer?

I do believe I have answered that in another thread. Reducing taxes doesn't mean a higher deficit, in fact in increases revenue with more liquidity with the employees, and with business. This has been proven on more than one occasion with our government

Yes, that worked so well during the Bush Administration (oops, I said Bush...sorry). If small businesses were so propped up then by Bush's tax cuts, then how come they were so quick to fall when the recession began? The tax rate was about 38% when Clinton was president, and I didn't see businesses crashing one after another; nor did I see massive layoffs because businesses and individuals were taxed at a higher rate (plus employees knew where they stood with employer paid health care).

 

[Meister]

Once again, I ask any right-winger how you would create immediate jobs. There is never, ever an answer. Obama can't just wave a magic wand, and neither can you.

Immediate jobs would be created with some very friendly taxing legislation to small businesses. Since historically 70% of all new jobs come from that sector,... that is the place to concentrate effort. Certain tax reductions aimed to make new business ventures there less risky and problematic would cause people who are holding back to go ahead and make a move.

One time tax credits will not do that. You cannot buy a job with $7k. It can be said that a large proportion of new small businesses fail within a year, but they stiill create new jobs which don't entirely disappear. Much of the time the employees of these failed businesses see another way forward because they have taken note of the reasons for the failure; and the business education they get is invaluable.

The healthcare debacle has actually deterred those small business jobs.

I repeat: Further tax reductions at this time simply means increasing the deficit.

Not buying in to your assuption for a second. Fact is that just the oposite it would expedite a turn around for this economy.

 

[007]

How long into it before someone yells LIAR! ?

Someone ought to yell liar as soon as he say's, "my fellow Americans."