Billy Corgan wants broadcast radio to pay performers

[Peejay]

Performers get paid for performing. That's it. You guys don't understand where the revenue comes from. This isn't about just Radio or Internet radio, it's about royalties distribution.

Cheeseburger in Paradise restarunt chain pays a quarter million dollars a year in fees for broadcast rights. Every broadcast venue pays it. Radio, TV, Live, rebroadcast, anywhere that plays music to the public. Now, Cheeseburger in Paradise doesn't host musicians like Billy, they have Joe Blow and the Knob Gobblers. Joe doesn't get jack from BMI for his performance at CIP, although BMI expressly charged CIP for the right to allow Joe to perform there. They take the money and distribute it to the Radio and TV pool. A formula for calculating play list is used to determine what bthe most popular SONGS are at a given point in time. It doesn't matter that Joe PERFORMED the songs, even though CIP paid a quarter million dollars for the right to have Joe come play.

If you allow performers to collect, me and Joe are going to sue BMI for the sam thing that Billy wants. Know why ? Because we PERFORM more than Billy does. And the royalties are collected from where WE perform, and they get moved over to the Radio and TV pool to make sure the most popular songs get the money. Now, if you open this PERFORMANCE door, you're going to find that most popular and most numerous performances are still going on LIVE in your local tavern. That is will always be the biggest pool of performers.

But again, despite the massive revenue collected from your local taverns and bars, I suppose it's only the washed up pop star performers you're thinking of. So the question is, when the masses of performers want to jump on this ship, where do you suppose the money is going to come from ? What will the effect on license fees be for local radio, bars and venues be ?

Again, you guys don't know what you're asking for here. As such, this should be easy enough to get over on congress too.

 

[Shogun]

Shogun, you don't know jack about how this works.

And just as I suspect, you don't care about Angie Apairo just because you don't know him. Faith Hill won a fucking Grammy for singing his song. Think she made any money ? How much more do you think she should get ? Think Angie should get anything at all ? After she gets the Grammy, the Fame and the money from the record and tour, you think she should continue to take a share of Angie's royalties forever ?

If Jack's college town band covers Dylan and IT DOESNT GET RADIO AIR then I guess they don't get paid, eh? But, if their rendition of the song DOES get airtime.. and then goes on to become a smash hit.. then yes, radio should be as obligated to pay artists as net radio is

Un huh.......And when BMI charges the local bar for the right to have Jacks Band it's OK for BMI to give that money to Grth Brooks ? You don't know what you're talking about. Internet Radio is the EXCEPTION.

All you've brought to the table are bullshit opinions and a laughable standard of application in regards to terrestrial and net radio. This is why you keep diving into straw man land with the "well, uh derrr... should the roadie get paid derrrr" bullshit.

And, again, I assure you that talking shit to me doesn't invalidate the entire list of artists that I can post that know more about the business than you who are in FAVOR of this.

And yes, if Faith fucking Hill's version of the song gets played then SHE should also get paid. End of story. The song writer sure as fuck didn't make the song famous. SHE did. Let him be paid for writing it.. But she also needs to be paid for HER performance of it. No one has said "hey, guy, let's take the money out of the fucking songwriters pocket and pay the artist". No, THIS is another of your retarded fucking straw man arguments where you try real hard to avoid what I AM saying. They BOTH get paid by the radio station that is using THEIR material; the song for the songwriter and the artist for the performance.

merely saying that someone doesn't know how the system works.. while THEY are the ones batting you about the head and neck with evidence beyond mere opinion.. pretty much means that you've lost this debate.


Yes, Faith should get paid for each occasion where HER version of the song is played. Songwriters can write all the songs they want but until they become popular by a fucking artist they mean two things: jack and shit.


Internet Radio is the EXCEPTION.

Well, it's an exception that is about to become the standard. I suggest you sit down and go write a song about it.

 

[Shogun]

Performers get paid for performing. That's it. You guys don't understand where the revenue comes from. This isn't about just Radio or Internet radio, it's about royalties distribution.

Cheeseburger in Paradise restarunt chain pays a quarter million dollars a year in fees for broadcast rights. Every broadcast venue pays it. Radio, TV, Live, rebroadcast, anywhere that plays music to the public. Now, Cheeseburger in Paradise doesn't host musicians like Billy, they have Joe Blow and the Knob Gobblers. Joe doesn't get jack from BMI for his performance at CIP, although BMI expressly charged CIP for the right to allow Joe to perform there. They take the money and distribute it to the Radio and TV pool. A formula for calculating play list is used to determine what bthe most popular SONGS are at a given point in time. It doesn't matter that Joe PERFORMED the songs, even though CIP paid a quarter million dollars for the right to have Joe come play.

If you allow performers to collect, me and Joe are going to sue BMI for the sam thing that Billy wants. Know why ? Because we PERFORM more than Billy does. And the royalties are collected from where WE perform, and they get moved over to the Radio and TV pool to make sure the most popular songs get the money. Now, if you open this PERFORMANCE door, you're going to find that most popular and most numerous performances are still going on LIVE in your local tavern. That is will always be the biggest pool of performers.

But again, despite the massive revenue collected from your local taverns and bars, I suppose it's only the washed up pop star performers you're thinking of. So the question is, when the masses of performers want to jump on this ship, where do you suppose the money is going to come from ? What will the effect on license fees be for local radio, bars and venues be ?

Again, you guys don't know what you're asking for here. As such, this should be easy enough to get over on congress too.

Indeed.. and when YOUR version of the fucking performance GETS AIR PLAY then YOU TOO can get paid for YOUR product being used to sell ad space on terrestrial radio.


again, this is simple as hell and your outright obstinance simply doesn't impress me.

 

[Peejay]

I been drinking all day for a living
I been dreaming 'bout moving on
seems like every little thing I do
they been putting in a country song

Yeah I saw you on TV
man is that some kind of joke
you been making a killing off the shoes I'm filling
while I'm sitting here gone broke

So as long as we're trading favors
a little plaesure for my pain
let me stand up there just one time
and hear 'em call my name

My friends all think I'm crazy
and my mamma wouldn't understand
but just one time before I die
I wanna sit in with the band

Well I know it must be something
your talent or your style
Your hundred dollar blue jeans
or your million dollar smile
But I don't need me no gold records
I don't need no limousines
I don't need to tear up my dressing room
with no Beaumont beauty queens


And I don't care if its backwoods country
I don't care if its rock and roll
I don't care if it's humming through my old tin roof
or playin' on the radio
My friends all think I'm crazy
and my mama wouldn't understand
But just one time before I die
I want to sit in with the band

 

[Peejay]

Performers get paid for performing. That's it. You guys don't understand where the revenue comes from. This isn't about just Radio or Internet radio, it's about royalties distribution.

Cheeseburger in Paradise restarunt chain pays a quarter million dollars a year in fees for broadcast rights. Every broadcast venue pays it. Radio, TV, Live, rebroadcast, anywhere that plays music to the public. Now, Cheeseburger in Paradise doesn't host musicians like Billy, they have Joe Blow and the Knob Gobblers. Joe doesn't get jack from BMI for his performance at CIP, although BMI expressly charged CIP for the right to allow Joe to perform there. They take the money and distribute it to the Radio and TV pool. A formula for calculating play list is used to determine what bthe most popular SONGS are at a given point in time. It doesn't matter that Joe PERFORMED the songs, even though CIP paid a quarter million dollars for the right to have Joe come play.

If you allow performers to collect, me and Joe are going to sue BMI for the sam thing that Billy wants. Know why ? Because we PERFORM more than Billy does. And the royalties are collected from where WE perform, and they get moved over to the Radio and TV pool to make sure the most popular songs get the money. Now, if you open this PERFORMANCE door, you're going to find that most popular and most numerous performances are still going on LIVE in your local tavern. That is will always be the biggest pool of performers.

But again, despite the massive revenue collected from your local taverns and bars, I suppose it's only the washed up pop star performers you're thinking of. So the question is, when the masses of performers want to jump on this ship, where do you suppose the money is going to come from ? What will the effect on license fees be for local radio, bars and venues be ?

Again, you guys don't know what you're asking for here. As such, this should be easy enough to get over on congress too.

Indeed.. and when YOUR version of the fucking performance GETS AIR PLAY then YOU TOO can get paid for YOUR product being used to sell ad space on terrestrial radio.


again, this is simple as hell and your outright obstinance simply doesn't impress me.

YOu don't even know where the money comes from. Air play ? You think that is where the license fees come from ? You're half right.

 

[Shogun]

Performers get paid for performing. That's it. You guys don't understand where the revenue comes from. This isn't about just Radio or Internet radio, it's about royalties distribution.

Cheeseburger in Paradise restarunt chain pays a quarter million dollars a year in fees for broadcast rights. Every broadcast venue pays it. Radio, TV, Live, rebroadcast, anywhere that plays music to the public. Now, Cheeseburger in Paradise doesn't host musicians like Billy, they have Joe Blow and the Knob Gobblers. Joe doesn't get jack from BMI for his performance at CIP, although BMI expressly charged CIP for the right to allow Joe to perform there. They take the money and distribute it to the Radio and TV pool. A formula for calculating play list is used to determine what bthe most popular SONGS are at a given point in time. It doesn't matter that Joe PERFORMED the songs, even though CIP paid a quarter million dollars for the right to have Joe come play.

If you allow performers to collect, me and Joe are going to sue BMI for the sam thing that Billy wants. Know why ? Because we PERFORM more than Billy does. And the royalties are collected from where WE perform, and they get moved over to the Radio and TV pool to make sure the most popular songs get the money. Now, if you open this PERFORMANCE door, you're going to find that most popular and most numerous performances are still going on LIVE in your local tavern. That is will always be the biggest pool of performers.

But again, despite the massive revenue collected from your local taverns and bars, I suppose it's only the washed up pop star performers you're thinking of. So the question is, when the masses of performers want to jump on this ship, where do you suppose the money is going to come from ? What will the effect on license fees be for local radio, bars and venues be ?

Again, you guys don't know what you're asking for here. As such, this should be easy enough to get over on congress too.

Indeed.. and when YOUR version of the fucking performance GETS AIR PLAY then YOU TOO can get paid for YOUR product being used to sell ad space on terrestrial radio.


again, this is simple as hell and your outright obstinance simply doesn't impress me.

YOu don't even know where the money comes from. Air play ? You think that is where the license fees come from ? You're half right.

Are you going to pretend that radio is an industry that operates on a wire budget and doesn't have money to throw around on the kind of shit that brought the word payola to our cultural lexicon?

gimme a fucking break. If Net radio must abide then so too can terrestrial radio. end of story.

 

[xsited1]

I actually saw Billy Corgan's head using Google Earth.

 

[Peejay]

More than 100 artists descended on Capitol Hill today, including Billy Idol and the drummer who played on Kim Carnes' "Bette Davis Eyes," to get Congress to support the Performance Rights Act.

And here it is.....already materializing. Kim Carnes drummer wants a slice for his perfromance.

How many people do you think can be paid for perfromance rights ? You have no idea of the scope of this. Are you ready to support every drummer, guitarist, soundman, every single person who made the combined sounds of individuals into a performance ?

 

[Shogun]

More than 100 artists descended on Capitol Hill today, including Billy Idol and the drummer who played on Kim Carnes' "Bette Davis Eyes," to get Congress to support the Performance Rights Act.

And here it is.....already materializing. Kim Carnes drummer wants a slice for his perfromance.

How many people do you think can be paid for perfromance rights ? You have no idea of the scope of this. Are you ready to support every drummer, guitarist, soundman, every single person who made the combined sounds of individuals into a performance ?

exactly as many performers whose performance produced the product that radio uses to hock ads.

yes, if Joe nobody played a session on a hit track that radio uses to sell ad space then he should be paid.


bummer fucking days for terrestrial radio.

 

[Peejay]

More than 100 artists descended on Capitol Hill today, including Billy Idol and the drummer who played on Kim Carnes' "Bette Davis Eyes," to get Congress to support the Performance Rights Act.

And here it is.....already materializing. Kim Carnes drummer wants a slice for his perfromance.

How many people do you think can be paid for perfromance rights ? You have no idea of the scope of this. Are you ready to support every drummer, guitarist, soundman, every single person who made the combined sounds of individuals into a performance ?

exactly as many performers whose performance produced the product that radio uses to hock ads.

yes, if Joe nobody played a session on a hit track that radio uses to sell ad space then he should be paid.


bummer fucking days for terrestrial radio.

Yep, and not just radio. This will bleed over into live performance licensing and they too will be forced to pay, just like internet radio.

Be sure to keep your DSL bill paid and get ready to pay astronomical fees for streaming music becaus the market is about to get cornered. Your favorite night club, like radio, can't afford to pay every schmuck that ever struck a cowbell for Def Leopard.

 

[Shogun]

And here it is.....already materializing. Kim Carnes drummer wants a slice for his perfromance.

How many people do you think can be paid for perfromance rights ? You have no idea of the scope of this. Are you ready to support every drummer, guitarist, soundman, every single person who made the combined sounds of individuals into a performance ?

exactly as many performers whose performance produced the product that radio uses to hock ads.

yes, if Joe nobody played a session on a hit track that radio uses to sell ad space then he should be paid.


bummer fucking days for terrestrial radio.

Yep, and not just radio. This will bleed over into live performance licensing and they too will be forced to pay, just like internet radio.

Be sure to keep your DSL bill paid and get ready to pay astronomical fees for streaming music becaus the market is about to get cornered. Your favorite night club, like radio, can't afford to pay every schmuck that ever struck a cowbell for Def Leopard.

yea yea yea.. whatever you say, chicken little.


It's called innovation. It's why families don't huddle around the giant box radio anymore to listen to mystery theatre and aliens landing. Enjoy the future.

 

[Peejay]

Sure, things have to move along and change. But I still don't think you understand where the money comes from and how it is distributed already.

Radio and internet DO NOT pay the lions share of fees. For every radio station, terrestrial or internet, there are probably 100 clubs, bars, Juke boxes, offices with overhead music and performance venues that pay license fees. As it stands, almost NONE of those revenues go to the actual artist or PERFORMERS that are broadcast to these venues. The sole calaculation for distribution comes from the radio and TV pool. Hence the line "you been making a killing off the shoes I'm filling". The numbers of registered BMI, ASCAP and SESAC performers who get nothing is staggering but regardless, the venues they play in pay license fees for the right to have them play. So, while you do seem to recognize that radio makes the "candy teen" pop stars, you don't seem to understand that those are the people who have already been paid more than the performers that continue to clock in every damn night and ACTUALLY PERFORM. Now, you want to pay them more, their drummers and bass players, from the money collected in my name, from my clients. This only means that substance will become even less important and not only will radio be stressed to pay, they will have more control over the funds than ever. The payments will end up in Cindi Laupers penny whistle players pocket who has been sitting on his ass for the last 20 years while the guys who have been PERFORMING for the last 20 years but didn't blow the right radio exec., are still performing, their venues are paying the license fees and now the fees go up so that even more candy teen "performers" can take the money, moving the working performers even further down the list.

If this was an actual attempt to get performers rights, you can bet your ass I'd be behind it. It's not. It's a spoiled ass, washed up pop star movement. Why do you think Dionne Warwick is on your list of supporters ?