Big protests in Arizona

[del]

Commerse in the US does not stop at the state borders.
Many businesses have more than one state with customers.

say it ain't so!!

idiot

 

[Truthmatters]

How many of these protestors are not Arizonans?

 

[Nosmo King]

from the link in post #6;
"Protesters swelled in front of the Capitol as people converged to rally against Senate Bill 1070 during the day. Some came from as far away as California.

The size of the crowd grew over the course of the afternoon, and estimates by Phoenix police and media varied between 1,500 and about 2,000. By about 5 p.m., most of the crowd had dispersed, but a new wave of about 50 to 100 protesters arrived from Carl Hayden Community High School.

During the day, some of the protesters marched around the building, chanting, "Si se puede," or "We can do it." They were joined by 56 members of the Coalition for Humane Immigrant Rights of Los Angeles, who arrived by bus."


Does anyone besides me see a problem with people from another state meddling in a state's political process? I would think that the governor might simply dismiss the entire crowd thinking they are all from California and do not represent registered voters of the state.

As an aside, the only people that have been out in the little mountain town I live in are a few local residents that do vote here urging other registered Az voters to call the governor in support of the bill.

Does that go for the Freedom Riders of the 1960s, or do you think students at the University of Mississippi helped organize the effort?

In this case, the brilliant, compassionate and liberty loving statesmen of Arizona are taking jurisdiction of the federal border. They want basically a "pass law" enacted after other repressive regimes have tried it and ultimately failed. But, they must be Conservatives. They simply don't learn from their own mistakes because they fail to learn history.

Taking jurisdiction from the INS.

Doesn't that make this case a national one by default?

It is a national problem, once they leave mexico and come through Az they go everywhere.
This law will be challenged in court, federal court. We all know and expect it. That will likely bring to light the fact this law addresses a federal responsibility that the federal government is not living up to. maybe it will force the federal government to act. That is the hope here anyway.

However; bringing in protesters from another state to try to influence a governor to sign or not sign a state bill into law is detrimental in a way that the protesters and the organizers of the out of state protesters probobly did not plan on.

It allows to governor to totally dismiss ALL the protesters as being from out of state. She doesn't have to worry about them at all, because they have no vote in the state.
Those that do live in the state, and are part of the protest then become as minimized as the out of state protesters. That was what i was pointing out.

I live in a very rural area of the state in a small town and have not met anyone that opposes the bill. Butthen last year we had one of our deputies killed by illegals. We are not guessing, they were caught, we know they were illegals and were smuggling drugs and people and were armed.

Should the governor dismiss all protests out of hand because there are out of state people involved, the governor would be showing the short-sightedness endemic to Conservative governors. If Wallace dismissed all Civil Rights protests because not every marcher was from Alabama, he would be seeking shallow comfort and showing incredibly myopic leadership.

The Arizona law as proposed is basically Jim Crow for the Brown rather than the Black. All Americans should protest this bit of bigotry.

 

[GHook93]

How many of these protestors are not Arizonans?

A good chunk, many are Illegal Immigrants!

 

[Darkwind]

These people are obviously racists.

 

[California Girl]

Does that go for the Freedom Riders of the 1960s, or do you think students at the University of Mississippi helped organize the effort?

In this case, the brilliant, compassionate and liberty loving statesmen of Arizona are taking jurisdiction of the federal border. They want basically a "pass law" enacted after other repressive regimes have tried it and ultimately failed. But, they must be Conservatives. They simply don't learn from their own mistakes because they fail to learn history.

Taking jurisdiction from the INS.

Doesn't that make this case a national one by default?

It is a national problem, once they leave mexico and come through Az they go everywhere.
This law will be challenged in court, federal court. We all know and expect it. That will likely bring to light the fact this law addresses a federal responsibility that the federal government is not living up to. maybe it will force the federal government to act. That is the hope here anyway.

However; bringing in protesters from another state to try to influence a governor to sign or not sign a state bill into law is detrimental in a way that the protesters and the organizers of the out of state protesters probobly did not plan on.

It allows to governor to totally dismiss ALL the protesters as being from out of state. She doesn't have to worry about them at all, because they have no vote in the state.
Those that do live in the state, and are part of the protest then become as minimized as the out of state protesters. That was what i was pointing out.

I live in a very rural area of the state in a small town and have not met anyone that opposes the bill. Butthen last year we had one of our deputies killed by illegals. We are not guessing, they were caught, we know they were illegals and were smuggling drugs and people and were armed.

Should the governor dismiss all protests out of hand because there are out of state people involved, the governor would be showing the short-sightedness endemic to Conservative governors. If Wallace dismissed all Civil Rights protests because not every marcher was from Alabama, he would be seeking shallow comfort and showing incredibly myopic leadership.

The Arizona law as proposed is basically Jim Crow for the Brown rather than the Black. All Americans should protest this bit of bigotry.

Don't whine when others treat a protest you support with the same contempt that the left treat TEA Parties.

 

[California Girl]

These people are obviously racists.

Yep. And they clearly hate America.

 

[slackjawed]

Does that go for the Freedom Riders of the 1960s, or do you think students at the University of Mississippi helped organize the effort?

In this case, the brilliant, compassionate and liberty loving statesmen of Arizona are taking jurisdiction of the federal border. They want basically a "pass law" enacted after other repressive regimes have tried it and ultimately failed. But, they must be Conservatives. They simply don't learn from their own mistakes because they fail to learn history.

Taking jurisdiction from the INS.

Doesn't that make this case a national one by default?

It is a national problem, once they leave mexico and come through Az they go everywhere.
This law will be challenged in court, federal court. We all know and expect it. That will likely bring to light the fact this law addresses a federal responsibility that the federal government is not living up to. maybe it will force the federal government to act. That is the hope here anyway.

However; bringing in protesters from another state to try to influence a governor to sign or not sign a state bill into law is detrimental in a way that the protesters and the organizers of the out of state protesters probobly did not plan on.

It allows to governor to totally dismiss ALL the protesters as being from out of state. She doesn't have to worry about them at all, because they have no vote in the state.
Those that do live in the state, and are part of the protest then become as minimized as the out of state protesters. That was what i was pointing out.

I live in a very rural area of the state in a small town and have not met anyone that opposes the bill. Butthen last year we had one of our deputies killed by illegals. We are not guessing, they were caught, we know they were illegals and were smuggling drugs and people and were armed.

Should the governor dismiss all protests out of hand because there are out of state people involved, the governor would be showing the short-sightedness endemic to Conservative governors. If Wallace dismissed all Civil Rights protests because not every marcher was from Alabama, he would be seeking shallow comfort and showing incredibly myopic leadership.

The Arizona law as proposed is basically Jim Crow for the Brown rather than the Black. All Americans should protest this bit of bigotry.

As always, I respect your opinion, yet I strongly disagree.

This law was created in response to the tremendous amount of crime in our state, capped off by the recent cold blooded murder of a popular rancher who's killers were traced to the border. Yet, none of the officials in mexico would do anything except admit that, yes, the killer fled south accross the border.

This state used to be mexico. There are a lot of hispanic people here. My wife for one, my grandkids for 3 more. My son in law came LEGALLY from Oaxaca. Most of us that live here have connections to hispanics.

Yes there are bigots, they exist everywhere. But this law was not "basically Jim Crow for the Brown rather than the Black". That is just the wrong assumption to make.

As far as the governor being a short-sighted conservative, I am not a fan of her. She became gov when dammit janet left to head up the DHS. We have an election in NOV.
I will say that the risk of all the protesters being minimized because of out of state protesters is real. That's all I was pointing out in previous posts. If she thinks that the protesters are not voters, and thatthe people that have been calling to support the bill are voters, who do you think she will listen to?

She is running for reelection this year.

 

[Stephanie]

How bout we call them.

the Sandbaggers.

 

[Nosmo King]

It is a national problem, once they leave mexico and come through Az they go everywhere.
This law will be challenged in court, federal court. We all know and expect it. That will likely bring to light the fact this law addresses a federal responsibility that the federal government is not living up to. maybe it will force the federal government to act. That is the hope here anyway.

However; bringing in protesters from another state to try to influence a governor to sign or not sign a state bill into law is detrimental in a way that the protesters and the organizers of the out of state protesters probobly did not plan on.

It allows to governor to totally dismiss ALL the protesters as being from out of state. She doesn't have to worry about them at all, because they have no vote in the state.
Those that do live in the state, and are part of the protest then become as minimized as the out of state protesters. That was what i was pointing out.

I live in a very rural area of the state in a small town and have not met anyone that opposes the bill. Butthen last year we had one of our deputies killed by illegals. We are not guessing, they were caught, we know they were illegals and were smuggling drugs and people and were armed.

Should the governor dismiss all protests out of hand because there are out of state people involved, the governor would be showing the short-sightedness endemic to Conservative governors. If Wallace dismissed all Civil Rights protests because not every marcher was from Alabama, he would be seeking shallow comfort and showing incredibly myopic leadership.

The Arizona law as proposed is basically Jim Crow for the Brown rather than the Black. All Americans should protest this bit of bigotry.

Don't whine when others treat a protest you support with the same contempt that the left treat TEA Parties.

I got used to it during the 1960s. Conservatives then were far more dismissive of protests then than any Liberal is today.

 

[slackjawed]

How many of these protestors are not Arizonans?

A good chunk, many are Illegal Immigrants!

i don't know how many are not Arizonans. Since it was reported in the link given, there must be some. I would say again that 'importing' protesters from out of state in an attempt to influence a state governor could end up with all the protesters, rsidents or not, being minimized.

The article doesn't say so, but for the past week there has been a campaign accross the state to get people to call the governor and express support for the bill. My understanding is that it has been pretty successful. With the recent murder on the border, and the murders and kidnappings that have happened in just the past year, I would be surprised to find that the phone in campaign has not been successful.

 

[Nosmo King]

It is a national problem, once they leave mexico and come through Az they go everywhere.
This law will be challenged in court, federal court. We all know and expect it. That will likely bring to light the fact this law addresses a federal responsibility that the federal government is not living up to. maybe it will force the federal government to act. That is the hope here anyway.

However; bringing in protesters from another state to try to influence a governor to sign or not sign a state bill into law is detrimental in a way that the protesters and the organizers of the out of state protesters probobly did not plan on.

It allows to governor to totally dismiss ALL the protesters as being from out of state. She doesn't have to worry about them at all, because they have no vote in the state.
Those that do live in the state, and are part of the protest then become as minimized as the out of state protesters. That was what i was pointing out.

I live in a very rural area of the state in a small town and have not met anyone that opposes the bill. Butthen last year we had one of our deputies killed by illegals. We are not guessing, they were caught, we know they were illegals and were smuggling drugs and people and were armed.

Should the governor dismiss all protests out of hand because there are out of state people involved, the governor would be showing the short-sightedness endemic to Conservative governors. If Wallace dismissed all Civil Rights protests because not every marcher was from Alabama, he would be seeking shallow comfort and showing incredibly myopic leadership.

The Arizona law as proposed is basically Jim Crow for the Brown rather than the Black. All Americans should protest this bit of bigotry.

As always, I respect your opinion, yet I strongly disagree.

This law was created in response to the tremendous amount of crime in our state, capped off by the recent cold blooded murder of a popular rancher who's killers were traced to the border. Yet, none of the officials in mexico would do anything except admit that, yes, the killer fled south accross the border.

This state used to be mexico. There are a lot of hispanic people here. My wife for one, my grandkids for 3 more. My son in law came LEGALLY from Oaxaca. Most of us that live here have connections to hispanics.

Yes there are bigots, they exist everywhere. But this law was not "basically Jim Crow for the Brown rather than the Black". That is just the wrong assumption to make.

As far as the governor being a short-sighted conservative, I am not a fan of her. She became gov when dammit janet left to head up the DHS. We have an election in NOV.
I will say that the risk of all the protesters being minimized because of out of state protesters is real. That's all I was pointing out in previous posts. If she thinks that the protesters are not voters, and thatthe people that have been calling to support the bill are voters, who do you think she will listen to?

She is running for reelection this year.

This law is nothing more than the repressive "Pass Laws" of South Africa reborn in the Arizona desert. Under this law, any local Arizona cop can stop any Latino and ask for his papers. As you know, Latinos are the largest minority in the country. Many Latinos are here legally or are American citizens.

Enforcement of the immigration laws falls to federal authorities at the border and at the employer. Not to the local constabulary on the streets of Arizona.

This solution is Jim Crow for the Brown rather than the Black. You're not gaining liberty with these Gestapo tactics, you're erasing it.

Justice for the victims of crimes committed by illegal immigrants cannot be found by harassing everyone who looks Latino.

 

[Angelhair]

I betcha somewhere in there is ACORN - LOL! LOL! Their largest base - illegals.

 

[slackjawed]

Should the governor dismiss all protests out of hand because there are out of state people involved, the governor would be showing the short-sightedness endemic to Conservative governors. If Wallace dismissed all Civil Rights protests because not every marcher was from Alabama, he would be seeking shallow comfort and showing incredibly myopic leadership.

The Arizona law as proposed is basically Jim Crow for the Brown rather than the Black. All Americans should protest this bit of bigotry.

As always, I respect your opinion, yet I strongly disagree.

This law was created in response to the tremendous amount of crime in our state, capped off by the recent cold blooded murder of a popular rancher who's killers were traced to the border. Yet, none of the officials in mexico would do anything except admit that, yes, the killer fled south accross the border.

This state used to be mexico. There are a lot of hispanic people here. My wife for one, my grandkids for 3 more. My son in law came LEGALLY from Oaxaca. Most of us that live here have connections to hispanics.

Yes there are bigots, they exist everywhere. But this law was not "basically Jim Crow for the Brown rather than the Black". That is just the wrong assumption to make.

As far as the governor being a short-sighted conservative, I am not a fan of her. She became gov when dammit janet left to head up the DHS. We have an election in NOV.
I will say that the risk of all the protesters being minimized because of out of state protesters is real. That's all I was pointing out in previous posts. If she thinks that the protesters are not voters, and thatthe people that have been calling to support the bill are voters, who do you think she will listen to?

She is running for reelection this year.

This law is nothing more than the repressive "Pass Laws" of South Africa reborn in the Arizona desert. Under this law, any local Arizona cop can stop any Latino and ask for his papers. As you know, Latinos are the largest minority in the country. Many Latinos are here legally or are American citizens.

Enforcement of the immigration laws falls to federal authorities at the border and at the employer. Not to the local constabulary on the streets of Arizona.

This solution is Jim Crow for the Brown rather than the Black. You're not gaining liberty with these Gestapo tactics, you're erasing it.

Justice for the victims of crimes committed by illegal immigrants cannot be found by harassing everyone who looks Latino.

I understand your opinion. I just disagree.
If it is that important to you I suggest a second home in Tucson. We let "partial year" residents vote in state elections. Everyone that owns property can register and vote in state elections as well. You too could have a vote in Arizona.

Tuscon is a lot nicer than Phoenix.

 

[slackjawed]

The bill, AZ SB 1070 is being signed into law at this moment and will be law in just a few minutes.

 

[WillowTree]

should the governor dismiss all protests out of hand because there are out of state people involved, the governor would be showing the short-sightedness endemic to conservative governors. If wallace dismissed all civil rights protests because not every marcher was from alabama, he would be seeking shallow comfort and showing incredibly myopic leadership.

The arizona law as proposed is basically jim crow for the brown rather than the black. All americans should protest this bit of bigotry.

as always, i respect your opinion, yet i strongly disagree.

This law was created in response to the tremendous amount of crime in our state, capped off by the recent cold blooded murder of a popular rancher who's killers were traced to the border. Yet, none of the officials in mexico would do anything except admit that, yes, the killer fled south accross the border.

This state used to be mexico. There are a lot of hispanic people here. My wife for one, my grandkids for 3 more. My son in law came legally from oaxaca. Most of us that live here have connections to hispanics.

Yes there are bigots, they exist everywhere. But this law was not "basically jim crow for the brown rather than the black". That is just the wrong assumption to make.

As far as the governor being a short-sighted conservative, i am not a fan of her. She became gov when dammit janet left to head up the dhs. We have an election in nov.
I will say that the risk of all the protesters being minimized because of out of state protesters is real. That's all i was pointing out in previous posts. If she thinks that the protesters are not voters, and thatthe people that have been calling to support the bill are voters, who do you think she will listen to?

She is running for reelection this year.

this law is nothing more than the repressive "pass laws" of south africa reborn in the arizona desert. Under this law, any local arizona cop can stop any latino and ask for his papers. As you know, latinos are the largest minority in the country. Many latinos are here legally or are american citizens.then they should appreciate what is being done for them. I'm an american and i have to show my papers, and my feet, and my whole body is scanned when the authorities deem it necessary and before you give me "it saves lives" bs i dare you to tell me how many americans die at the hands of illegals vs how many die on a plane because of terrorists. .

enforcement of the immigration laws falls to federal authorities at the border and at the employer.how is the federal government doing in your opinion??? not to the local constabulary on the streets of arizona.

This solution is jim crow for the brown rather than the black. You're not gaining liberty with these gestapo tactics, you're erasing it. how is proving you have a right to be in the country gestapo.. Name one country who doesn't enforce immigration laws.

justice for the victims of crimes committed by illegal immigrants cannot be found by harassing everyone who looks latino.

how is proving citizenship harassment? I have to show my papers and my feet and my whole body when boarding an airplane. If i fly to france or canada or mexico i must have papers to prove citizenship do i not/ so cry us a fucking river.

 

[Nosmo King]

as always, i respect your opinion, yet i strongly disagree.

This law was created in response to the tremendous amount of crime in our state, capped off by the recent cold blooded murder of a popular rancher who's killers were traced to the border. Yet, none of the officials in mexico would do anything except admit that, yes, the killer fled south accross the border.

This state used to be mexico. There are a lot of hispanic people here. My wife for one, my grandkids for 3 more. My son in law came legally from oaxaca. Most of us that live here have connections to hispanics.

Yes there are bigots, they exist everywhere. But this law was not "basically jim crow for the brown rather than the black". That is just the wrong assumption to make.

As far as the governor being a short-sighted conservative, i am not a fan of her. She became gov when dammit janet left to head up the dhs. We have an election in nov.
I will say that the risk of all the protesters being minimized because of out of state protesters is real. That's all i was pointing out in previous posts. If she thinks that the protesters are not voters, and thatthe people that have been calling to support the bill are voters, who do you think she will listen to?

She is running for reelection this year.

this law is nothing more than the repressive "pass laws" of south africa reborn in the arizona desert. Under this law, any local arizona cop can stop any latino and ask for his papers. As you know, latinos are the largest minority in the country. Many latinos are here legally or are american citizens.then they should appreciate what is being done for them. I'm an american and i have to show my papers, and my feet, and my whole body is scanned when the authorities deem it necessary and before you give me "it saves lives" bs i dare you to tell me how many americans die at the hands of illegals vs how many die on a plane because of terrorists. .

enforcement of the immigration laws falls to federal authorities at the border and at the employer.how is the federal government doing in your opinion??? not to the local constabulary on the streets of arizona.

This solution is jim crow for the brown rather than the black. You're not gaining liberty with these gestapo tactics, you're erasing it. how is proving you have a right to be in the country gestapo.. Name one country who doesn't enforce immigration laws.

justice for the victims of crimes committed by illegal immigrants cannot be found by harassing everyone who looks latino.

how is proving citizenship harassment? I have to show my papers and my feet and my whole body when boarding an airplane. If i fly to france or canada or mexico i must have papers to prove citizenship do i not/ so cry us a fucking river.

When you fly you have to comply with certain regulations. There is an implied contract. Show my ID at the airport? Fine. You are assuring our safety. The same goes for buying alcohol. Show my ID? Fine. I'm buying a regulated substance and I should have to prove my age.

Under this law, all you have to do is look Latino in order to get stopped and asked for papers. Are there any other circumstances when you can walk peacefully down a street and get stopped by a cop? Is this harassment? Absolutely! That's the definition of harassment.

Driving while Black. Looking Latino. Excuses for Conservatives to lean on minorities.

And then you must reap the whirlwind.

Ever wonder how that "Stop Snitchin"" attitude began? Cops harassing young Black folks simply for being Black. And now the levels of mistrust between the Black community and the law enforcement community have rendered both to ruin.

Try it with the nation's largest minority and in ten years time you will have a dysfunctional Latino community which mistrusts the police.

Why can't Conservatives learn from their own mistakes and the lessons of history?

 

[Truthmatters]

How many of these protestors are not Arizonans?

A good chunk, many are Illegal Immigrants!

How can you tell?

 

[Immanuel]

How many of these protestors are not Arizonans?

A good chunk, many are Illegal Immigrants!

How can you tell?

The same way you can tell that all those tea party protesters are right wing racists.

Immie

 

[JakeStarkey]

as always, i respect your opinion, yet i strongly disagree.

This law was created in response to the tremendous amount of crime in our state, capped off by the recent cold blooded murder of a popular rancher who's killers were traced to the border. Yet, none of the officials in mexico would do anything except admit that, yes, the killer fled south accross the border.

This state used to be mexico. There are a lot of hispanic people here. My wife for one, my grandkids for 3 more. My son in law came legally from oaxaca. Most of us that live here have connections to hispanics.

Yes there are bigots, they exist everywhere. But this law was not "basically jim crow for the brown rather than the black". That is just the wrong assumption to make.

As far as the governor being a short-sighted conservative, i am not a fan of her. She became gov when dammit janet left to head up the dhs. We have an election in nov.
I will say that the risk of all the protesters being minimized because of out of state protesters is real. That's all i was pointing out in previous posts. If she thinks that the protesters are not voters, and thatthe people that have been calling to support the bill are voters, who do you think she will listen to?

She is running for reelection this year.

this law is nothing more than the repressive "pass laws" of south africa reborn in the arizona desert. Under this law, any local arizona cop can stop any latino and ask for his papers. As you know, latinos are the largest minority in the country. Many latinos are here legally or are american citizens.then they should appreciate what is being done for them. I'm an american and i have to show my papers, and my feet, and my whole body is scanned when the authorities deem it necessary and before you give me "it saves lives" bs i dare you to tell me how many americans die at the hands of illegals vs how many die on a plane because of terrorists. .

enforcement of the immigration laws falls to federal authorities at the border and at the employer.how is the federal government doing in your opinion??? not to the local constabulary on the streets of arizona.

This solution is jim crow for the brown rather than the black. You're not gaining liberty with these gestapo tactics, you're erasing it. how is proving you have a right to be in the country gestapo.. Name one country who doesn't enforce immigration laws.

justice for the victims of crimes committed by illegal immigrants cannot be found by harassing everyone who looks latino.

how is proving citizenship harassment? I have to show my papers and my feet and my whole body when boarding an airplane. If i fly to france or canada or mexico i must have papers to prove citizenship do i not/ so cry us a fucking river.

Because we are not French or Canadian or Mexican. Because we don't have "papers". Because the feds are going to say, "nope", and then bitch slap anybody who tries to oppose it.