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NO ONE, EVER in the history of mankind, has recommended the government build hospitals that they run, for our health care.
Universal Healthcare is simply MEDICARE....you get to choose your hospital and doctors that are in the marketplace, and the gvt gives you a voucher/via a card, to pay for 80% of it and you pay the other 20%.
Do you realize that many doctors no longer take Medicare patients...because the government does not reimburse for the services at the actual cost of the service....so that isn't the market place....and the medicare system is a mess.......as one healthcare expert said during an interview...people on medicare have healthcare, they just can't see a doctor...because too many doctors refuse medicare patients.....
The only way to fix the system is to get the government out of it.....Vouchers for healthcare would be one way to support people with pre-existing conditions and people who can't afford it...then they can buy their own plans or simply pay for their treatment directly.....that would increase competition and introduce more freedom into the healthcare industry.....improving it at all levels.
That has been the pitch all along, and look where we are; the single most expensive healthcare system on the planet with some of the shittiest outcome metrics amongst advanced post-industrial nations. Sure, let's move everything over to for profit totally unaccountable private corporations. "Competition" is a lie, we've never had that in this healthcare system at all.
Nope...what has made it expensive is the government....they have created in state monopolies and forced insurance companies to do stupid things.......competition and freedom of child's....that improves everything...it will improve healthcare.......what is it about that that you guys don't understand...as you walk around with cell phones that are better, cheaper and more available than ever before....to the point that the poorest among us have personal phones even Captain Kirk didn't have........and yet you think those dynamics won't happen with healthcare.......
Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight, the gubment did it to ya.
Yeah....and what happened when Obamacare kicked in...that gave more control over healthcare to the government? People lost their plans and their doctors...premiums went up astronomically and deductibles became u payable...and oh yeah......if you don't get it, they fine you.......and if you have a business and don't have it...they fine you...unless you just don't give your employees health insurance, then they fine you less.....so they actually make it less punishing to drop your healthcare...and pay the lower fine, than to give your employees good health insurance....
And that is what you think is intelligent.....that is government handling healthcare?
Wow....
NO ONE, EVER in the history of mankind, has recommended the government build hospitals that they run, for our health care.
The G.I.Bill...thanks for bringing it up since it doesn't support your side of the discussion and in fact supports my side.....
When the government wanted to help G.I.s get an education...did they build VA schools to educate them? Like they did with Healthcare for Vets? No.
What did they do.....
They gave vets School Vouchers for education.....the government gave them a school voucher, they took that voucher into the education market place and purchased their education...which meant those schools that were good, had vets go to them, the bad schools, didn't get vets.......
So you are wrong......the government here set up VA hospitals instead of giving Vets vouchers for healthcare, the result? A horrible healthcare system that kills vets.
The government can't run things....they can hand out checks.....the market place for education handled educating the Vets...not the government....
The road system.....they poured concrete.......and what is the state of our road system now?
I would bet you guys are against school vouchers for public school kids.......the very same voucher system that you are bragging about that was used to educate Veterans......
the government than can't run the VA system....can't run a healthcare system for 320 million people.
Universal Healthcare is simply MEDICARE....you get to choose your hospital and doctors that are in the marketplace, and the gvt gives you a voucher/via a card, to pay for 80% of it and you pay the other 20%.
Do you realize that many doctors no longer take Medicare patients...because the government does not reimburse for the services at the actual cost of the service....so that isn't the market place....and the medicare system is a mess.......as one healthcare expert said during an interview...people on medicare have healthcare, they just can't see a doctor...because too many doctors refuse medicare patients.....
The only way to fix the system is to get the government out of it.....Vouchers for healthcare would be one way to support people with pre-existing conditions and people who can't afford it...then they can buy their own plans or simply pay for their treatment directly.....that would increase competition and introduce more freedom into the healthcare industry.....improving it at all levels.
That has been the pitch all along, and look where we are; the single most expensive healthcare system on the planet with some of the shittiest outcome metrics amongst advanced post-industrial nations. Sure, let's move everything over to for profit totally unaccountable private corporations. "Competition" is a lie, we've never had that in this healthcare system at all.
Please...explain this to all of us....the government can't manage the VA system competently...a small, dedicated system of healthcare to handle the healthcare needs of a tiny population of Americans........who have patients dying on fake wait lists......
Please..tell us how the government that can't handle this tiny healthcare system can then go on and handle the healthcare of 320 million people.......
Please explain how that actually works...
yes, medicare has bargaining power....they insure millions of clients and negotiate a better price with the market....when I was a Department store buyer, I negotiated with my vendors bulk discount prices because I purchased for 50 stores at once, my total corp. was buying for 250 stores, I was just buying for one division of the corp.NO ONE, EVER in the history of mankind, has recommended the government build hospitals that they run, for our health care.A question for the Libertarian/Conservatives.
Would you accept a universal healthcare system if it was cheaper/more cost efficient, as it's proven to be in almost every OECD country? In other words, would you accept it if it had ZERO impact on your life/financial expenses/overall economy?
There is no evidence that any government run program in the U.S. has ever been more (financially) efficient than private enterprise.
How about the G.I Bill which provided millions of Americans access to higher education, cheap housing, and healthcare, which also subsequently led to the creation of the largest middle class in the world? Or Eisenhower's programs to help build the international federal highway system? In fact it wasn't until the deregulation/semi privatization of major industry and banking, which occurred under the Reagan's administration, when wealth inequality started increasing and our infrastructure stagnated.
"Universal Healthcare" limits choice, by definition, limits incentives for innovation, and generally stifles growth. So yeah, I would reject it.
This is neoliberal nonsense. Growth and innovation in, which occurred most during the 1950s to 1970s, happened under governments that spent the most on social welfare programs. See above. There is ZERO evidence that a majorily privatized nation would spur "incentives for innovation." That's like saying that people won't invent anything if they don't get paid a lot of money (if you think that, you probably have never met artists, scientists, or entrepreneurs that hundreds of times more passionate about their craft/what they produce t than money, power, and status)
The G.I.Bill...thanks for bringing it up since it doesn't support your side of the discussion and in fact supports my side.....
When the government wanted to help G.I.s get an education...did they build VA schools to educate them? Like they did with Healthcare for Vets? No.
What did they do.....
They gave vets School Vouchers for education.....the government gave them a school voucher, they took that voucher into the education market place and purchased their education...which meant those schools that were good, had vets go to them, the bad schools, didn't get vets.......
So you are wrong......the government here set up VA hospitals instead of giving Vets vouchers for healthcare, the result? A horrible healthcare system that kills vets.
The government can't run things....they can hand out checks.....the market place for education handled educating the Vets...not the government....
The road system.....they poured concrete.......and what is the state of our road system now?
I would bet you guys are against school vouchers for public school kids.......the very same voucher system that you are bragging about that was used to educate Veterans......
the government than can't run the VA system....can't run a healthcare system for 320 million people.
Universal Healthcare is simply MEDICARE....you get to choose your hospital and doctors that are in the marketplace, and the gvt gives you a voucher/via a card, to pay for 80% of it and you pay the other 20%.
Do you realize that many doctors no longer take Medicare patients...because the government does not reimburse for the services at the actual cost of the service....so that isn't the market place....and the medicare system is a mess.......as one healthcare expert said during an interview...people on medicare have healthcare, they just can't see a doctor...because too many doctors refuse medicare patients.....
The only way to fix the system is to get the government out of it.....Vouchers for healthcare would be one way to support people with pre-existing conditions and people who can't afford it...then they can buy their own plans or simply pay for their treatment directly.....that would increase competition and introduce more freedom into the healthcare industry.....improving it at all levels.
Do you realize that many doctors no longer take Medicare patients...because the government does not reimburse for the services at the actual cost of the service....so that isn't the market place....and the medicare system is a mess.......as one healthcare expert said during an interview...people on medicare have healthcare, they just can't see a doctor...because too many doctors refuse medicare patients.....
The only way to fix the system is to get the government out of it.....Vouchers for healthcare would be one way to support people with pre-existing conditions and people who can't afford it...then they can buy their own plans or simply pay for their treatment directly.....that would increase competition and introduce more freedom into the healthcare industry.....improving it at all levels.
That has been the pitch all along, and look where we are; the single most expensive healthcare system on the planet with some of the shittiest outcome metrics amongst advanced post-industrial nations. Sure, let's move everything over to for profit totally unaccountable private corporations. "Competition" is a lie, we've never had that in this healthcare system at all.
Nope...what has made it expensive is the government....they have created in state monopolies and forced insurance companies to do stupid things.......competition and freedom of child's....that improves everything...it will improve healthcare.......what is it about that that you guys don't understand...as you walk around with cell phones that are better, cheaper and more available than ever before....to the point that the poorest among us have personal phones even Captain Kirk didn't have........and yet you think those dynamics won't happen with healthcare.......
Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight, the gubment did it to ya.
Yeah....and what happened when Obamacare kicked in...that gave more control over healthcare to the government? People lost their plans and their doctors...premiums went up astronomically and deductibles became u payable...and oh yeah......if you don't get it, they fine you.......and if you have a business and don't have it...they fine you...unless you just don't give your employees health insurance, then they fine you less.....so they actually make it less punishing to drop your healthcare...and pay the lower fine, than to give your employees good health insurance....
And that is what you think is intelligent.....that is government handling healthcare?
Wow....
What happened when Obama attempted to implement the Heritage Foundation hatched plan that had been launched successfully by Romney in the state of MA was that he, Obama, caved on single payer, and secondly, allowed lobbyists from big pharma and the insurance industry in the room. Of course it ended up as those things always do; the US lagging behind the rest of the industrialized world.
Do you realize that many doctors no longer take Medicare patients...because the government does not reimburse for the services at the actual cost of the service....so that isn't the market place....and the medicare system is a mess.......as one healthcare expert said during an interview...people on medicare have healthcare, they just can't see a doctor...because too many doctors refuse medicare patients.....
The only way to fix the system is to get the government out of it.....Vouchers for healthcare would be one way to support people with pre-existing conditions and people who can't afford it...then they can buy their own plans or simply pay for their treatment directly.....that would increase competition and introduce more freedom into the healthcare industry.....improving it at all levels.
That has been the pitch all along, and look where we are; the single most expensive healthcare system on the planet with some of the shittiest outcome metrics amongst advanced post-industrial nations. Sure, let's move everything over to for profit totally unaccountable private corporations. "Competition" is a lie, we've never had that in this healthcare system at all.
Nope...what has made it expensive is the government....they have created in state monopolies and forced insurance companies to do stupid things.......competition and freedom of child's....that improves everything...it will improve healthcare.......what is it about that that you guys don't understand...as you walk around with cell phones that are better, cheaper and more available than ever before....to the point that the poorest among us have personal phones even Captain Kirk didn't have........and yet you think those dynamics won't happen with healthcare.......
Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight, the gubment did it to ya.
Yeah....and what happened when Obamacare kicked in...that gave more control over healthcare to the government? People lost their plans and their doctors...premiums went up astronomically and deductibles became u payable...and oh yeah......if you don't get it, they fine you.......and if you have a business and don't have it...they fine you...unless you just don't give your employees health insurance, then they fine you less.....so they actually make it less punishing to drop your healthcare...and pay the lower fine, than to give your employees good health insurance....
And that is what you think is intelligent.....that is government handling healthcare?
Wow....
What happened when Obama attempted to implement the Heritage Foundation hatched plan that had been launched successfully by Romney in the state of MA was that he, Obama, caved on single payer, and secondly, allowed lobbyists from big pharma and the insurance industry in the room. Of course it ended up as those things always do; the US lagging behind the rest of the industrialized world.
yes, medicare has bargaining power....they insure millions of clients and negotiate a better price with the market....when I was a Department store buyer, I negotiated with my vendors bulk discount prices because I purchased for 50 stores at once, my total corp. was buying for 250 stores, I was just buying for one division of the corp.NO ONE, EVER in the history of mankind, has recommended the government build hospitals that they run, for our health care.
The G.I.Bill...thanks for bringing it up since it doesn't support your side of the discussion and in fact supports my side.....
When the government wanted to help G.I.s get an education...did they build VA schools to educate them? Like they did with Healthcare for Vets? No.
What did they do.....
They gave vets School Vouchers for education.....the government gave them a school voucher, they took that voucher into the education market place and purchased their education...which meant those schools that were good, had vets go to them, the bad schools, didn't get vets.......
So you are wrong......the government here set up VA hospitals instead of giving Vets vouchers for healthcare, the result? A horrible healthcare system that kills vets.
The government can't run things....they can hand out checks.....the market place for education handled educating the Vets...not the government....
The road system.....they poured concrete.......and what is the state of our road system now?
I would bet you guys are against school vouchers for public school kids.......the very same voucher system that you are bragging about that was used to educate Veterans......
the government than can't run the VA system....can't run a healthcare system for 320 million people.
Universal Healthcare is simply MEDICARE....you get to choose your hospital and doctors that are in the marketplace, and the gvt gives you a voucher/via a card, to pay for 80% of it and you pay the other 20%.
Do you realize that many doctors no longer take Medicare patients...because the government does not reimburse for the services at the actual cost of the service....so that isn't the market place....and the medicare system is a mess.......as one healthcare expert said during an interview...people on medicare have healthcare, they just can't see a doctor...because too many doctors refuse medicare patients.....
The only way to fix the system is to get the government out of it.....Vouchers for healthcare would be one way to support people with pre-existing conditions and people who can't afford it...then they can buy their own plans or simply pay for their treatment directly.....that would increase competition and introduce more freedom into the healthcare industry.....improving it at all levels.
Were vendors happy? Heck no....!!! But if they wanted me to buy their product, they better darn well make a deal....and they did....because I gave them HUGE ORDERS, a lot of business.....kept their factory lines running.
Medicare gives the health care industry tons and tons of business, with only one insurance company/policy to deal with which saves the healthcare industry money on paperwork and processing labor!
When large businesses negotiate with insurance companies they get a better price per employee for insurance than a small company's group plan.....because insurance companies negotiate with hospitals and doctors in their network....the more people in the plan, the more potential business, the more business promised, the cheaper the prices negotiated....
NO ONE, EVER in the history of mankind, has recommended the government build hospitals that they run, for our health care.The G.I.Bill...thanks for bringing it up since it doesn't support your side of the discussion and in fact supports my side.....
When the government wanted to help G.I.s get an education...did they build VA schools to educate them? Like they did with Healthcare for Vets? No.
What did they do.....
They gave vets School Vouchers for education.....the government gave them a school voucher, they took that voucher into the education market place and purchased their education...which meant those schools that were good, had vets go to them, the bad schools, didn't get vets.......
So you are wrong......the government here set up VA hospitals instead of giving Vets vouchers for healthcare, the result? A horrible healthcare system that kills vets.
The government can't run things....they can hand out checks.....the market place for education handled educating the Vets...not the government....
The road system.....they poured concrete.......and what is the state of our road system now?
I would bet you guys are against school vouchers for public school kids.......the very same voucher system that you are bragging about that was used to educate Veterans......
the government than can't run the VA system....can't run a healthcare system for 320 million people.
Universal Healthcare is simply MEDICARE....you get to choose your hospital and doctors that are in the marketplace, and the gvt gives you a voucher/via a card, to pay for 80% of it and you pay the other 20%.
Do you realize that many doctors no longer take Medicare patients...because the government does not reimburse for the services at the actual cost of the service....so that isn't the market place....and the medicare system is a mess.......as one healthcare expert said during an interview...people on medicare have healthcare, they just can't see a doctor...because too many doctors refuse medicare patients.....
The only way to fix the system is to get the government out of it.....Vouchers for healthcare would be one way to support people with pre-existing conditions and people who can't afford it...then they can buy their own plans or simply pay for their treatment directly.....that would increase competition and introduce more freedom into the healthcare industry.....improving it at all levels.
That has been the pitch all along, and look where we are; the single most expensive healthcare system on the planet with some of the shittiest outcome metrics amongst advanced post-industrial nations. Sure, let's move everything over to for profit totally unaccountable private corporations. "Competition" is a lie, we've never had that in this healthcare system at all.
Please...explain this to all of us....the government can't manage the VA system competently...a small, dedicated system of healthcare to handle the healthcare needs of a tiny population of Americans........who have patients dying on fake wait lists......
Please..tell us how the government that can't handle this tiny healthcare system can then go on and handle the healthcare of 320 million people.......
Please explain how that actually works...
This indoctrinated belief system that corporate bureaumania saves, and govt bureaumania winds up at different destination is fiction.
Many programs in the US start out badly because of our political system. One political party passes a program and the other party fights the program. If the voting public eventually supports the program the politicians that fought it will ease their fight and the program will be improved. Social Security is maybe the best example. SS was a program was fought with the charge that it would make America communistic, but as people saw its value, the program was enlarged and strengthened. Medicare; military integration; women voting, may be other examples.
Many programs in the US start out badly because of our political system. One political party passes a program and the other party fights the program. If the voting public eventually supports the program the politicians that fought it will ease their fight and the program will be improved. Social Security is maybe the best example. SS was a program was fought with the charge that it would make America communistic, but as people saw its value, the program was enlarged and strengthened. Medicare; military integration; women voting, may be other examples.
Social Security is going bankrupt, and can't be sustained.......they are taking money from this generation to pay for the retired people today...it is not sustainable.........not the program you want to cite to show that the government can run things....
Social Security is going bankrupt, and can't be sustained.......they are taking money from this generation to pay for the retired people today...it is not sustainable.........not the program you want to cite to show that the government can run things...
The only way to fix the system is to get the government out of it.....Vouchers for healthcare would be one way to support people with pre-existing conditions and people who can't afford it...then they can buy their own plans or simply pay for their treatment directly.....that would increase competition and introduce more freedom into the healthcare industry.....improving it at all levels.
The only way to fix the system is to get the government out of it.....Vouchers for healthcare would be one way to support people with pre-existing conditions and people who can't afford it...then they can buy their own plans or simply pay for their treatment directly.....that would increase competition and introduce more freedom into the healthcare industry.....improving it at all levels.
Are you suggesting the answer is to subsidize the purchase of private insurance for people who otherwise can't afford it? If so, what is that meant to be an alternative to?
Having the government control the payment process....since they refuse to pay the full price on medicare and medicaid and Doctors are refusing to accept those patients....if you have a pre-existing condition...why not simply give them a voucher to buy their insurance.....? That way if the policy is expensive there will be companies willing to create policies to get those dollars....you allow the free market to work...just like we did with the G.I. Bill...those G.I.s got vouchers....the government didn't build VA schools for them.....they did build VA hospitals.....and those are a mess since the government runs them...
