jreeves
Senior Member
- Feb 12, 2008
- 6,588
- 319
- 48
Bush and Cheney.
Really Bush and Cheney gave congressional intelligence briefings? That's news to me....
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Bush and Cheney.
Perhaps I was not clear enough well so be it, as it wont change your mind anyway. but here we go again. John McCain voted with the Republican Party in THIS SESSION 88.3% of the time. thats a little less than your man Obama. Further from 2001 to present John McCain has voted Republican 81.1% of the time to help you out some (congressional record). Hardly an ardent Bush supporter, however, if you read the Daily-Kos, watch MSNBC, or any number of the misinformation outlets that are out there I can see where you might get your talking point from. As for missing votes during the election cycle, thats NOT the point im making here. I will give you the raw numbers to satisfy your need to know which i'm sure wont disuade you one bit. John McCain has missed 407 votes in the current congress , so as you can see the majority of his votes missed in his long career are in this congress while running for congress. The point though is this.
Barack Obama was elected in 2004 and took office in 2005 and announced his run in 2007 . So his Senatoral experience was two years before he began to run for office which I fault neither candidate for missing votes while running, but I do say this. to claim the US Senate as one of your strengths and run on that record with such a narrow record you would almost have to take his overall missed votes into his career as a Senator because he has not been there long enough to amass any record at all. His record also flys in the face of his statement of reaching across party lines, and working with Republicans when in fact John McCains record is much more accomplished in that area than his.
Really Bush and Cheney gave congressional intelligence briefings? That's news to me....
I have the raw numbers ...
And his record falls in line with the narrative ... John McCain 2008 isn't the John McCain of old ...
I agree with the points you make here ... McCain's record of crossing party lines is well known ... too bad he's sold it out for a chance at the big job.
Uh...that would be the wrong country right?
Kind of like MCcains push for the surge right, when he suggested Bush had executed the war poorly by not having enough troops?
Maybe we should look at Bush's energy policy act of 2005? MCcain voted no, Obama voted yes for tax breaks for Big Oil....
And where was John McCain before the poor execution of the war?
He's a day late and a dollar short ...
Obama was right on Iraq.
Hmm ... it looks like both candidates have flip flopped on this issue ...
Actually, Mccain almost immediately stated there wasn't enough troops. Obama stated he doesn't know how he would have voted had he would've been in the Senate.
So now their votes doesn't matter, afterall we could just claim they flip flopped...
What Do I Know?: Downing Street Memo for Dummies
The downing street memo right here Bush Cheney and Blair on the fiasco in Iraq and WMD's that they knew didn't exist before the war started. All the links i have posted so far are about this memo.
Bush Cheney and Blair.
]After the invasion of which McCain had a hard on for ...[/B]
I didn't say they didn't matter ...
I said both candidates have flip-flopped on energy ... is that an untrue statement?
Obama doesn't even know how he would have voted, so what is the difference between him and MCcain on that?
Yes it is an untrue statement, Mccain still opposes tax breaks for Big Oil. While Obama?? He has had so many positions when it comes to energy, who the hell knows what his positions happen to be at the moment.
Another day out there in the , I can't convince you and you can't convince me land, but ahh still we all try don't we? That's the point, to find some common ground someplace. However, Article 15 I think and this is just and editorial here based on experience, that regardless of how we got into the Iraq War now!, We are there, so today we have and admittedly so on both sides made tremedious progess there in giving the country back to it's citizens and giving them a chance at having a democracy. This well it's George Bush's fault, Dick Cheny, et al. seems to always leave out the fact that Congress and among them your candidate for VP voted for the Iraq War Resolution. Now the democrats after reading public opinion polls have now gotten a sudden mental lapse ? you tell me? Congress gets the same intelligence briefings the president gets and so are you meaning to imply that the democrats in congress are in colusion with George Bush? then based on that logic then should not your party be held equally responsibile? As for George Bush being the somehow magic architect of all this let me cite you a few examples.
President Bill Clinton " I believe that Iraq is trying to amass and secure weapons of mass destruction and therefor under U.N. madate have authorized the attack last night on Iraq" 1998 <<< hmm I had no idea George W. Bush had that much unfluence back then.
Now lets get with reality here, Iraq given the chance can be secure, and I think that John McCain as a former Navy Officer with first hand experience knows what happens to a nation that has a congress , that forces a withdrawl of forces in conflict and what it does to out standing in the world.
I'm curious, based in the logic there, so your soultion would be to what? abandon Iraq an let them fight it out and let Iran have complete control if the region all based on the premise that your mad at George Bush and Dick Cheney who by the way I am not a fan of. yoru statment seems to be that Iraq is not chums with Iran "thats bad" for US and Israel, then go on to say the solution is to abandon the region because John McCain made mention of the fact. "Like Korea, and after WW2 the United States may have to maintain a presence in the region to keep the peace? No thank you, your solution has been tried before and it took this country almost 15 years to recover from it.
John McCain doesn't want to leave Iraq, and IMO its because he knows that the US presence there is what's holding the country together and when we leave whether it be tomorrow or 100 years from now the proverbial shit is going to hit the fan there. And he's willing to burn our economy and sacrifice the lives of our brave men and women to keep the hole plugged.
Further, could it be possible that S.A. might just be purchasing "missle defense" which by the way your candidate wants to cut!. because of Iran's nuclear ambition, or perhaps the number of Iran's missle tests in the region may have given them pause? Perhaps?
Senator Obama didn't vote against going to war with Iraq?
I thought that's what he was beating Senator Clinton over the head with to win the primary.
That he voted against the war and she voted for it.
That Obama was right and McCain was wrong ... Obama said he doesn't know how he would have voted looking at the same intelligence everyone else did ... but he knew it was an unwise war and a mistake to get into the war ...
All the while McCain was pushing for the war and it wasn't until things started to come up sour that he piped up and said something.
"I don't think you're going to have to see the scale of numbers of troops that we saw, nor the length of the buildup, obviously, that we had back in 1991."
-John McCain Dec. 2002
And McCain on drilling and ethanol ...
McCain has gotten twice as much money from big oil than Obama ...
Obama has clearly flip-flopped on the issue of taxation of the oil companies ... lose the tax breaks and proposes windfall taxes.
In the end I believe both candidates will explore every possible avenue toward energy independence.