AVATAR = Awesome!

[Jon]

Just from looking at the trailers of Avatar, I can see that the movie looks fake, and childish.

From this, I assume you haven't seen the movie. Even if you did, you have no idea what you are talking about. A waste of money? We'll let the numbers decide. $77 million in its opening weekend, another $32 million since then. That's a better opening than any of the Lord of the Rings movies. It's made $191 million in foreign gross already. The Dark Knight only made $468 million in its foreign gross for its entire theater run.

So, you can call it a waste of money all you want. I don't think the producers will agree, and since it's their money...I think I'll take their opinion on whether or not it was wasted.

 

[Jon]

Didn't have me guessing once. I saw every single plot "twist" coming fifteen minutes or more before it happened.

That's because they were not plot twists. The events that led you to figure out the story are what writers call foreshadowing. The minute Neytiri talks about Turok-Machto, you KNOW Jake will end up taming Turok. If they had not had Neytiri discuss the significance of Turok-Machto, it would have made no sense when Jake shows up riding Turok. The minute they try to save Grace by allowing her to live on in her avatar, you KNOW Jake is going to do the same in the end. Again, foreshadowing. I'm really not even sure what other "twists" there are, besides the deaths. Deaths are not plot twists. You assume in an epic movie with inevitable war, someone is going to die. The question is, "Who?"

As for the "propaganda," you're all fools if you think it's relevant to today's situations. Stories like the one in Avatar date back centuries. Countless other movies have been made with similar plots. It's not propaganda, it's just a plot device. It's the same as saying that V for Vendetta was an attack on the Bush administration, yet the story was written 50 years before the movie was made. In the end, only the whiners crying foul look like asses, not the ones who made the film.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Didn't have me guessing once. I saw every single plot "twist" coming fifteen minutes or more before it happened.

That's because they were not plot twists. The events that led you to figure out the story are what writers call foreshadowing. The minute Neytiri talks about Turok-Machto, you KNOW Jake will end up taming Turok. If they had not had Neytiri discuss the significance of Turok-Machto, it would have made no sense when Jake shows up riding Turok. The minute they try to save Grace by allowing her to live on in her avatar, you KNOW Jake is going to do the same in the end. Again, foreshadowing. I'm really not even sure what other "twists" there are, besides the deaths. Deaths are not plot twists. You assume in an epic movie with inevitable war, someone is going to die. The question is, "Who?"

As for the "propaganda," you're all fools if you think it's relevant to today's situations. Stories like the one in Avatar date back centuries. Countless other movies have been made with similar plots. It's not propaganda, it's just a plot device. It's the same as saying that V for Vendetta was an attack on the Bush administration, yet the story was written 50 years before the movie was made. In the end, only the whiners crying foul look like asses, not the ones who made the film.

Well, I'm very, very sorry that I ruined your happy little fuzzy over your beloved movie. In the future, we will all be quite sure to rave over any movie you want to talk to, to avoid having you stamp your feet and scream like a child denied a cookie.

Or perhaps we'll feel free to express our own opinions about a movie we spent our own money on, and simply ignore your puerile, screaming hissy fits.

The movie gave you your very first orgasm with other people present? Fine. You can send me my ticket price back, because everything I know about story composition didn't come from the fifth grade, and I know that "foreshadowing" doesn't involve hitting people between the eyes with a sledgehammer and screaming, "This is going to happen in another fifteen minutes!" As for propaganda, gullible adolescents like you are why politicians get away with so much shit in the world.

 

[uscitizen]

My avitar is better.

 

[Jon]

Cecilie, you are entitled to dislike a movie. But when you come here talking about shit that makes absolutely no sense, don't expect not to be called out. Is it my fault you don't know the difference between a plot twist and a plot device? Is it my fault you don't know the difference between propaganda and a plot device? No.

You are free to not like the story of the movie. Some didn't. It's completely understandable. Some didn't like it because it wasn't original. So be it. Some didn't like it because they don't like fantasy or sci-fi. So be it. But to say you didn't like it because you paid attention to the movie and paid attention to the cues the producers gave you? That's just stupid. To say you didn't like it because you thought it was trying to relay a political message? That's even more stupid.

In short, you're stupid. It's not my fault. Have a nice day, dipshit.

 

[Samson]

My avitar is better.

What's that girl saying?

I swear she's saying "Back Off Bitch"

Anyway, back to the topic:

My review:

In case you didn't get enough heavy-handed-hollywood-liberalism from 2012, you'll be happy to know that "Avartar" is just chocked full of liberal themes, ranging from Evul Military that are trying some sort of "Shock and Awe!!!" to The Heroic Latina Tree Hugger that "never expected to become a Martyr."

But some on "The Right" may find the movie heartwarming because, while in 2007 US troops cannot Harm a Mosque Filled with IED's, in 2157 they are quite willing to blow apart a huge tree full of "savages" that they pre-emptively strike to "fight terror with terror."

A side from the partisanly-stomach-turning theme, the plot is a bit silly. For some unexplained reason, the "tribe" of savages decides to adopt one of the EVUL Avatars, and teach him how to ride dinosaurs. Why? I guess otherwise it would simply be a propaganda film.

I did appreciate the characters, particularly the portrayal of the US Marine assigned to play the Avatar. Sigorney Weaver didn't need to try very had to be typecast as the bleeding heart liberal bitch. Forget who played the inevitable Evul Capitalist Developer who wanted to Mine the planet for a mysterious ore. Of course, whatever benefits this ore might have given mankind were ignored in the film.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Cecilie, you are entitled to dislike a movie. But when you come here talking about shit that makes absolutely no sense, don't expect not to be called out. Is it my fault you don't know the difference between a plot twist and a plot device? Is it my fault you don't know the difference between propaganda and a plot device? No.

You are free to not like the story of the movie. Some didn't. It's completely understandable. Some didn't like it because it wasn't original. So be it. Some didn't like it because they don't like fantasy or sci-fi. So be it. But to say you didn't like it because you paid attention to the movie and paid attention to the cues the producers gave you? That's just stupid. To say you didn't like it because you thought it was trying to relay a political message? That's even more stupid.

In short, you're stupid. It's not my fault. Have a nice day, dipshit.

Jon, you are entitled to wet yourself over a movie, but when you come in here, screaming and whining because someone else DARED not to agree with you that it was the bestest experience EVER, don't expect not to be called out and sneered at. Is it my fault you didn't read the post I was responding to, which said he was "kept guessing the whole time"? Is it my fault you wouldn't know propaganda if you were tied down and your eyelids were taped open (not that I think you have the brain power to get the reference)? No.

You are free to fap yourself into a coma over the "brilliant" plot. But to say that telegraphing the entire plot of the movie in the first five minutes is "foreshadowing" is just stupid. To say you didn't notice that it was screaming political messages right and left? That's not even stupid. That's willfully gullible.

In short, I'm not impressed that "stupid" is the best you can come up with. It's not my fault, but I'll gladly take responsibility for laughing at you, ESPECIALLY for your childish negative rep because I had the sheer effrontery to criticize your precious movie. I don't give a shit if you have a nice day or not, juvenile, because you're FLUSHED!

Happy wacking off.

 

[Jon]

Jon, you are entitled to wet yourself over a movie, but when you come in here, screaming and whining because someone else DARED not to agree with you that it was the bestest experience EVER, don't expect not to be called out and sneered at.

Appears to me you are the one screaming and whining because someone else liked it. That's the beauty of opinions, ain't it?

Is it my fault you didn't read the post I was responding to, which said he was "kept guessing the whole time"?

Except I did read it. I've even made comments related to it.

Is it my fault you wouldn't know propaganda if you were tied down and your eyelids were taped open (not that I think you have the brain power to get the reference)? No.

A Clockwork Orange, dumbass.

You are free to fap yourself into a coma over the "brilliant" plot.

Where did I call the plot brilliant? I didn't. It's quite good, but I was the first to admit it wasn't original. It's well-told, and the story progresses quite well. The characters are developed, and there are not a lot of filler scenes.

But to say that telegraphing the entire plot of the movie in the first five minutes is "foreshadowing" is just stupid.

Interesting, at first it was "15 minutes before it happened," and now the ENTIRE plot was telegraphed in the first 5 minutes. The truth is...the story of Turok-Machto was told in the beginning, and Jake tames Turok in the END. There's a good hour to hour and a half lag between the two. Again, not sure what other plot "twists" you predicted, but even Grace's death and Jake giving up his human body took place almost an hour apart.

To say you didn't notice that it was screaming political messages right and left? That's not even stupid. That's willfully gullible.

Again, the plot of this movie was written about 13 years ago, and even then it was hardly original. It's a basic plot that's been told countless times. And, since you are a rabid rightwing buffoon, I'm assuming your problem is that most of the messages seemed to be liberal, right? I guess it's a shame then that James Cameron is not even a liberal, but a moderate. He actually donated to Hillary, and then McCain. He also donated to Clinton during his presidential campaigns, and Bush during his. But hey, I wouldn't expect you to know much about anything that wasn't on Huckabee last night.

 

[Samson]

Again, the plot of this movie was written about 13 years ago, and even then it was hardly original. It's a basic plot that's been told countless times. And, since you are a rabid rightwing buffoon, I'm assuming your problem is that most of the messages seemed to be liberal, right? I guess it's a shame then that James Cameron is not even a liberal, but a moderate. He actually donated to Hillary, and then McCain. He also donated to Clinton during his presidential campaigns, and Bush during his. But hey, I wouldn't expect you to know much about anything that wasn't on Huckabee last night.

I don't know who was on Huckabee last night, or care what James Cameron's politics are.

But I don't like stupid movie plots.

Do you know why the Blue Lion People blithly decided that an Avatar, who admitted he was an enemy "Warrior" should be adopted into their community???

Do you know why the EVUL MILITARY-INDUDRIAL COMPLEX could wait THREE MONTHS for the protagonist to infiltrate, but then only gave ONE HOUR for him to negotiate?

Do you know WHY the mineral that the EVUL MILITARY-INDUSTRIAL COMPLEX was worth so much?

 

[Jon]

Do you know why the Blue Lion People blithly decided that an Avatar, who admitted he was an enemy "Warrior" should be adopted into their community???

Because there was a sign from Eywa, which Neytiri saw when she first met Jake.

Do you know why the EVUL MILITARY-INDUDRIAL COMPLEX could wait THREE MONTHS for the protagonist to infiltrate, but then only gave ONE HOUR for him to negotiate?

Did I say the plot was without flaws? No.

Do you know WHY the mineral that the EVUL MILITARY-INDUSTRIAL COMPLEX was worth so much?

Because of its rarity? Do you even know what unobtainium is? In this plot, the ore is a MacGuffin.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Does 'Avatar' Contain Hidden Messages?

And from the horses mouth. IT is all the things we have stated. BUT it is still a good movie.

 

[Jon]

Hidden messages? The messages aren't hidden at all. Cameron is a staunch environmentalist. The "green" message is pretty clear. But the messages are not at all political. The film is hardly anti-war, considering the Na'vi build an army to launch a strike against the "evil military."

Plus, is there a problem with being anti-war? I wasn't aware anyone was pro-war, actually. If you are, you have problems beyond not liking a decent film.

 

[Samson]

Do you know why the Blue Lion People blithly decided that an Avatar, who admitted he was an enemy "Warrior" should be adopted into their community???

Because there was a sign from Eywa, which Neytiri saw when she first met Jake.

Yes, I recall: A bunch of glowing "seeds" from the FEMALE (of course) Goddess-Tree (Eywa) leg-humped Jake, convincing her to bring him home to dad instead of killing him.

Could anything be more ridiculously contrived????

Well, I suppose Star Wars had "The Force."

Star Trek TNG had the ubiquious "Q" character.

They are all hallmarks of weakly written stories relying on the powers of the supernatural rather than the cleverness of characters (or writers).

I suppose we should brace ourselves for more bullshit.

 

[ncarolinadixie]

Good Lord......It's just a freakin movie! All you had to do was watch every single commercial on TV about it before it hit the theaters and you knew the entire plot. But all of the politicizing of a freakin movie is hilarious to watch. Some of you PLEASE watch the movie "Up" and come back and tell me what kind of message it was supposed to be sending out. Please!!

 

[chanel]

Just saw it at Imax and loved it. It was so exciting and visually appealing that I didn't have to consider any underlying meaning. My only complaint is that it could have been shorter, Only see it in a theater with comfy seats.

I enjoyed your analysis though Samson.

 

[Big Fitz]

To be honest, with all the hype over it, and some of the jokes calling it 'Dancing with Smurfs" as a shot at it's plot rip off from "Dances with Wolves", I was nervous. Combine with that, James Hirsen, who does a good job reviewing films had panned it on the grounds it pushed an enviromentalist, anti-capitalist, anti-corporate, anti-militarist meme.

I was surprised though. It was no more those themes for the most part with the exception of a few "oh please" moments. The characters are well played, and it's a solid story, but they're stereotypes. The corporation was evil. The military was evil. The Na'vi were good. The planet was good. Meh. I expected the name for the mineral 'Unobtanium', and though that was patently stupid. Why not Handwavium or Wonderflonium? Whattever. If you got an environmentalist/anti capitalist meme from LOTR, you'd get it here too. In other words, you had to look for it, but didn't have to look hard.

Nothing should surprise you. There are no twists to the plot, but it had some interesting twists. It naturalized (made scientific) the concept of a living planet or Gaia type spirit. That was something quite interesting.

The effects, even in 2d were mindblowing. The environment was lush and alien enough to make you know it was alien without being stupid. They also did a very good job creating the alien biosphere. Everything seemed logical. Even the Hallelujah Mountains, as alien as they seemed, and the photoluminescent nights were extremely believable. They did their research and did great design work.

James Cameron has always been good at military stories, and this one is good as well in those regards. But James Horner's Score was well... TitaniBraveSneakThunderheart. A muddled mess of about 6 of his last good scores that made for mush. And of course, the other eyeroller was the obvious "My Heart Will Go On" attempt for the ONLY pop music piece created at the start of the end credits.

Sam Worthington, Giovanni Ribisi, Sigourney Weaver were all good. Unfortunately, you don't care much for any of the characters. The depth wasn't there. Sigourney does the best by far, but that's shows what a stellar actress she is as well as Cameron's occasional tin ear for giving them free reign to cut loose. The computer generated Na'vi were a great blend of the actual actors who played the voices. You could see Wes Studi, CCH Pounder, Weaver and Worthington's faces well enough in the alien bodies enough to truely get into it.

Anyway, to me, it was well worth going full price. It's a great way to spend 2:51 of your time. If you saw it, what'd you think?

 

[RetiredGySgt]

To be honest, with all the hype over it, and some of the jokes calling it 'Dancing with Smurfs" as a shot at it's plot rip off from "Dances with Wolves", I was nervous. Combine with that, James Hirsen, who does a good job reviewing films had panned it on the grounds it pushed an enviromentalist, anti-capitalist, anti-corporate, anti-militarist meme.

I was surprised though. It was no more those themes for the most part with the exception of a few "oh please" moments. The characters are well played, and it's a solid story, but they're stereotypes. The corporation was evil. The military was evil. The Na'vi were good. The planet was good. Meh. I expected the name for the mineral 'Unobtanium', and though that was patently stupid. Why not Handwavium or Wonderflonium? Whattever. If you got an environmentalist/anti capitalist meme from LOTR, you'd get it here too. In other words, you had to look for it, but didn't have to look hard.

Nothing should surprise you. There are no twists to the plot, but it had some interesting twists. It naturalized (made scientific) the concept of a living planet or Gaia type spirit. That was something quite interesting.

The effects, even in 2d were mindblowing. The environment was lush and alien enough to make you know it was alien without being stupid. They also did a very good job creating the alien biosphere. Everything seemed logical. Even the Hallelujah Mountains, as alien as they seemed, and the photoluminescent nights were extremely believable. They did their research and did great design work.

James Cameron has always been good at military stories, and this one is good as well in those regards. But James Horner's Score was well... TitaniBraveSneakThunderheart. A muddled mess of about 6 of his last good scores that made for mush. And of course, the other eyeroller was the obvious "My Heart Will Go On" attempt for the ONLY pop music piece created at the start of the end credits.

Sam Worthington, Giovanni Ribisi, Sigourney Weaver were all good. Unfortunately, you don't care much for any of the characters. The depth wasn't there. Sigourney does the best by far, but that's shows what a stellar actress she is as well as Cameron's occasional tin ear for giving them free reign to cut loose. The computer generated Na'vi were a great blend of the actual actors who played the voices. You could see Wes Studi, CCH Pounder, Weaver and Worthington's faces well enough in the alien bodies enough to truely get into it.

Anyway, to me, it was well worth going full price. It's a great way to spend 2:51 of your time. If you saw it, what'd you think?

Already a rather lengthy thread on this.

 

[Big Fitz]

huh... couldn't find it. Must be going blind. Well if a mod would like to merge me in. awesome.

merged

Thanks for the merge!

 

[Big Fitz]

WRONG that is exactly what they are portraying. They are using marines, for christ sake!

You just made me realize something. The 'skypeople' come from a fascist society. Government and military and corporations all working 'together'. Interesting to consider.

 

[007]

Good Lord......It's just a freakin movie! All you had to do was watch every single commercial on TV about it before it hit the theaters and you knew the entire plot. But all of the politicizing of a freakin movie is hilarious to watch. Some of you PLEASE watch the movie "Up" and come back and tell me what kind of message it was supposed to be sending out. Please!!

That if you tie enough helium filled balloons to a house, it will float...