Atheists are hoping aliens from outer space will contact us...

[BreezeWood]

I believe spiritual nature is responsible for creation of physical nature because of the paradox. Physical nature cannot create itself.

the intermediary, physiology could be responsible for both ...

Physiology is the scientific study of normal mechanisms, and their interactions, which works within a living system. - cr: Wikipedia

Physical things cannot create themselves. Repeat that to yourself a few times if you need to. It is a paradoxical argument that a physical thing can create itself because it would logically have to first exist in order to create itself. If it exists already, it's not creating itself because it already exists. I don't really know how to dumb that down any more for you, if you want to mindlessly argue that it could do this or that, it's up to you... it can't do anything until it exists. That's just basic logic.

If a spiritual entity imbibes itself into something physical, by definition, it becomes something physical. And I've never said birth is the creation of a new spirit.

If a spiritual entity imbibes itself into something physical, by definition, it becomes something physical.

I'm not sure why they would not both retain their own unique quality when absorbed into eachother - the spirit turning itself into its own physical shape would make more sense. as what I would expect the spirit to be capable of when necessary.

By definition, if something is physical, it is not spiritual. Likewise, if something is spiritual, it is not physical. Can something physical have spirituality? Sure! But it is, by definition, something physical. We are physical creatures who have spirituality. You can argue that we are spirits who have physiology but having physiology makes us physical beings.

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Physiology is the scientific study of normal mechanisms, and their interactions, which works within a living system. - cr: Wikipedia

physiology

1. 
   1 : a branch of biology that deals with the functions and activities of life or of living matter (such as organs, tissues, or cells) and of the physical and chemical phenomena involved — compare anatomy
   
   
2. 2 : the organic processes and phenomena of an organism or any of its parts or of a particular bodily process

you scream to much bossy, it causes ringing in one's eardrums, you must be cuban ...

Physical things cannot create themselves.

you just created a physical being, themselves which begs the question just what are you defining physical things - is cellulose of a tree, physical things - - try once answering a question boss you live and breed for it yourself.

By definition, if something is physical, it is not spiritual.

you're in the wrong forum, when in a room with a Lion, the Lion is Spiritual. to your existence.

 

[MarkDuffy]

Well, we have made some progress today. Both of our religionists believe the Bible is not to be trusted.

Science marches forward...

 

[BreezeWood]

If God created the universe, then why was it necessary to get Noah to build an ark? God could have easily shazaamed an ark. Much easier to make an ark than Adam.

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then why was it necessary to get Noah to build an ark ...

is there a face value to the above of its own accord distinct of the physical object.


no doubt the 4th century books version is invalid, all those innocent beings besides humanity. also no doubt all those than Noah who were evil were destroyed, only because Noah did not fit that mold was mankind given a second chance.

that parable is the religion presented by the Almighty at that time for all humanity to Accomplish or Perish ... The Triumph of Good vs Evil.

 

[MizMolly]

...and tell us there's no God.

That is why scientists like Carl Sagan so eagerly tell us there MUST be life on other planets, but it's a wish, there is no science to back up his claims.

So far, after decades of listening with radio telescopes, the skies have been totally silent.

Either aliens don't exist at all anywhere in the universe, or they are so far away their transmissions will never reach us.

And in either case, we will never have aliens visit us.

We are probably alone.

Atheism and aliens have no connection. I believe in a higher power but I also believe in the existence of other beings in the universe.

 

[ding]

Well, we have made some progress today. Both of our religionists believe the Bible is not to be trusted.

Science marches forward...

I only wish you knew some science so we could discuss it.

 

[indiajo]

Did you know that all the energy and matter in the universe was created? Or do you think this would be magic?

Did you know that repeating nonsense is still nonsense?

 

[ding]

Did you know that all the energy and matter in the universe was created? Or do you think this would be magic?

Did you know that repeating nonsense is still nonsense?

How is that nonsense? Haven't you ever heard of inflation theory? What are you some kind of science denier?

 

[ding]

Did you know that all the energy and matter in the universe was created? Or do you think this would be magic?

Did you know that repeating nonsense is still nonsense?

The best explanation for how the universe began is the inflation model. It is possible for matter to have a beginning. In a closed universe the gravitational energy which is always negative exactly compensates the positive energy of matter. So the energy of a closed universe is always zero. So nothing prevents this universe from being spontaneously created. Because the net energy is always zero. The positive energy of matter is balanced by the negative energy of the gravity of that matter which is the space time curvature of that matter. There is no conservation law that prevents the formation of such a universe. In quantum mechanics if something is not forbidden by conservation laws, then it necessarily happens with some non-zero probability. So a closed universe can spontaneously appear - through the laws of quantum mechanics. And in fact there is an elegant mathematical description which describes this process and shows that a tiny closed universe having very high energy can spontaneously pop into existence and immediately start to expand and cool. In this description, the same laws that describe the evolution of the universe also describe the appearance of the universe which means that the laws were in place before the universe itself.

 

[Taz]

Did you know that all the energy and matter in the universe was created? Or do you think this would be magic?

Did you know that repeating nonsense is still nonsense?

The best explanation for how the universe began is the inflation model. It is possible for matter to have a beginning. In a closed universe the gravitational energy which is always negative exactly compensates the positive energy of matter. So the energy of a closed universe is always zero. So nothing prevents this universe from being spontaneously created. Because the net energy is always zero. The positive energy of matter is balanced by the negative energy of the gravity of that matter which is the space time curvature of that matter. There is no conservation law that prevents the formation of such a universe. In quantum mechanics if something is not forbidden by conservation laws, then it necessarily happens with some non-zero probability. So a closed universe can spontaneously appear - through the laws of quantum mechanics. And in fact there is an elegant mathematical description which describes this process and shows that a tiny closed universe having very high energy can spontaneously pop into existence and immediately start to expand and cool. In this description, the same laws that describe the evolution of the universe also describe the appearance of the universe which means that the laws were in place before the universe itself.

Why do you always bring every discussion back to this? It's a thread about atheists and aliens. Now go take your ritalin.

 

[ding]

Did you know that all the energy and matter in the universe was created? Or do you think this would be magic?

Did you know that repeating nonsense is still nonsense?

The best explanation for how the universe began is the inflation model. It is possible for matter to have a beginning. In a closed universe the gravitational energy which is always negative exactly compensates the positive energy of matter. So the energy of a closed universe is always zero. So nothing prevents this universe from being spontaneously created. Because the net energy is always zero. The positive energy of matter is balanced by the negative energy of the gravity of that matter which is the space time curvature of that matter. There is no conservation law that prevents the formation of such a universe. In quantum mechanics if something is not forbidden by conservation laws, then it necessarily happens with some non-zero probability. So a closed universe can spontaneously appear - through the laws of quantum mechanics. And in fact there is an elegant mathematical description which describes this process and shows that a tiny closed universe having very high energy can spontaneously pop into existence and immediately start to expand and cool. In this description, the same laws that describe the evolution of the universe also describe the appearance of the universe which means that the laws were in place before the universe itself.

Why do you always bring every discussion back to this? It's a thread about atheists and aliens. Now go take your ritalin.

Because that is the point where science begins. And as a bonus... you know nothing about.

 

[Borillar]

Why would the visit of aliens negate a belief in G-d? Such visiting aliens would undoubtedly be Jewish.

 

[RWS]

Is that spiritual part of the physical being weightless? Or is that 21 or 28 grams?

And then what causes the difference between one organism having a "spirit", and another not having one? What is necessary physically to have a spirit?

Or do bacteria have spirits too? Because if they don't, there's a difference between organisms that have a spirit, and those who don't. And that will be a physical trait that science can then determine. And then we can get into the deep down science of what causes that trait to create a spirit.

You're quibbling. His point was not in defining what spiritual is. His point was in making the distinction of materialism versus spiritualism. By definition spiritualism is unseen. Discussing it's attributes like you are trying to do is meaningless. If it isn't material it is spiritual. That's the only definition you need. Communism is based on materialism. Good luck with your material world.

I'm not quibbling, I'm just saying that if there is such a thing as spirituality, and that spirituality is only possible for certain life forms, then that spirituality has a physical connection with those life forms.

My question, once we determine what has a spirit and what doesn't, is what the physical difference is.

Do rocks have a spirit?
Do bacteria have a spirit?
Do plants have a spirit?
Do fish have a spirit?
Do reptiles have a spirit?
Do dogs have a spirit?

etc... once we can agree on what does and doesn't have a spirit, we can try to find the physical difference that enables that spirit.

 

[Votto]

...and tell us there's no God.

That is why scientists like Carl Sagan so eagerly tell us there MUST be life on other planets, but it's a wish, there is no science to back up his claims.

So far, after decades of listening with radio telescopes, the skies have been totally silent.

Either aliens don't exist at all anywhere in the universe, or they are so far away their transmissions will never reach us.

And in either case, we will never have aliens visit us.

We are probably alone.

What would be hilarious is if some aliens crashed on earth and were discovered to have T-shirts saying, "Make the Universe Great again" slogans and Bible thumpers to boot.

 

[danielpalos]

Should we ask any potential Vogons, for confirmation of delivery, for any eminent domain actions?

 

[Boss]

I'm just saying that if there is such a thing as spirituality, and that spirituality is only possible for certain life forms, then that spirituality has a physical connection with those life forms.

My question, once we determine what has a spirit and what doesn't, is what the physical difference is.

What do you mean by this? Would you argue that physicality is only possible for certain life forms? Would that make any rational sense?

We have to remember that "spirituality" is only a word we invented to describe something. What is being described? The simple answer is, "that which is not physical in nature." But it's really more complicated than that because there are things not physical in nature which are also not spiritual. A fantasy, for example. What we are describing is something beyond physical nature yet also connected with it.

Spirituality is possible for everything because spirituality exists. Do all living things have "spirits"? That's an entirely different question. And it's an entirely different question as to which living things "spiritually connect." Humans appear to be the only animal that makes a conscious spiritual connection and possess spiritual awareness. I don't think it's coincidence humans are the most intellectually advanced life as well.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

...and tell us there's no God.

That is why scientists like Carl Sagan so eagerly tell us there MUST be life on other planets, but it's a wish, there is no science to back up his claims.

So far, after decades of listening with radio telescopes, the skies have been totally silent.

Either aliens don't exist at all anywhere in the universe, or they are so far away their transmissions will never reach us.

And in either case, we will never have aliens visit us.

We are probably alone.

You make a lot of assertions there for which you have no evidence, ironically in the process of accusing others of same. And you are even wrong about that. There is a lot of circumstantial evidence that life, in some form, has existed and exists all over the universe.

Otherwise, your argument amounts to, "If we haven't found any by now, we likely never will." That is silly...it reminds me of people in the year 1900 who thought we had discovered and invented all there was to discover and invent.

 

[Astrostar]

...and tell us there's no God.

That is why scientists like Carl Sagan so eagerly tell us there MUST be life on other planets, but it's a wish, there is no science to back up his claims.

So far, after decades of listening with radio telescopes, the skies have been totally silent.

Either aliens don't exist at all anywhere in the universe, or they are so far away their transmissions will never reach us.

And in either case, we will never have aliens visit us.

We are probably alone.

Good arguments. Now, how about some proof that a Christian God exists, or that we were created by some supreme being or that something as nebulous as "prayer" works, or that the bible is nothing more than a work of fiction. Please, "thrill me with your acumen!"

 

[Vandalshandle]

The Bibles says that man was created in God's image, but, oddly enough, does not say what god needs a penis for.

 

[MizMolly]

The Bibles says that man was created in God's image, but, oddly enough, does not say what god needs a penis for.

I believe that "GOD" is pure energy, light and love, therefore I don't believe it reflects a physical image.

 

[BreezeWood]

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But it's really more complicated than that because there are things not physical in nature which are also not spiritual. A fantasy, for example. What we are describing is something beyond physical nature yet also connected with it.

A fantasy, for example ...

I can't help to wonder how that makes sense, what is a fantasy ... howabout the wind, physical without a Spirit though tangentially Mother Nature is given spiritual qualities that could include a hurricane. or gravity

just being alive is spiritual irregardless the physical form and for some that quality is interrelated to all beings. the microbial zika virus could potentially wipe humanity off the face of Earth ...

it could not be what it is without a spirit.