Artic Melting...Not Just a Puddle Under Your Fridge

nakedemperor

Senior Member
Aug 5, 2004
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Unfortunately none of you fragile ecosystem, global warming nay-sayers won't be around to eat your words when the shit actually hits the fan...but are you prepared to have the death of the Polar Bear, the cute, cuddly Polar Bear, on your conscience?!?!


http://www.cnn.com/2004/TECH/science/11/08/globalwarming.reut/index.html

OSLO, Norway (Reuters) -- Global warming is heating the Arctic almost twice as fast as the rest of the planet in a thaw that threatens millions of livelihoods and could wipe out polar bears by 2100, an eight-nation report said on Monday.

The biggest survey to date of the Arctic climate, by 250 scientists, said the accelerating melt could be a foretaste of wider disruptions from a build-up of human emissions of heat-trapping gases in the earth's atmosphere.

The "Arctic climate is now warming rapidly and much larger changes are projected," according to the Arctic Climate Impact Assessment (ACIA), funded by the United States, Canada, Russia, Denmark, Iceland, Sweden, Norway and Finland.

Arctic temperatures are rising at almost twice the global average and could leap 4-7 Celsius (7-13 Fahrenheit) by 2100, roughly twice the global average projected by U.N. reports. Siberia and Alaska have already warmed by 2-3 C since the 1950s.

Possible benefits like more productive fisheries, easier access to oil and gas deposits or trans-Arctic shipping routes would be outweighed by threats to indigenous peoples and the habitats of animals and plants.

Sea ice around the North Pole, for instance, could almost disappear in summer by the end of the century. The extent of the ice has already shrunk by 15-20 percent in the past 30 years.

"Polar bears are unlikely to survive as a species if there is an almost complete loss of summer sea-ice cover," the report said. On land, creatures like lemmings, caribou, reindeer and snowy owls are being squeezed north into a narrower range.
 
nakedemperor said:
Unfortunately none of you fragile ecosystem, global warming nay-sayers won't be around to eat your words when the shit actually hits the fan...but are you prepared to have the death of the Polar Bear, the cute, cuddly Polar Bear, on your conscience?!?!


http://www.cnn.com/2004/TECH/science/11/08/globalwarming.reut/index.html

OSLO, Norway (Reuters) -- Global warming is heating the Arctic almost twice as fast as the rest of the planet in a thaw that threatens millions of livelihoods and could wipe out polar bears by 2100, an eight-nation report said on Monday.

The biggest survey to date of the Arctic climate, by 250 scientists, said the accelerating melt could be a foretaste of wider disruptions from a build-up of human emissions of heat-trapping gases in the earth's atmosphere.

The "Arctic climate is now warming rapidly and much larger changes are projected," according to the Arctic Climate Impact Assessment (ACIA), funded by the United States, Canada, Russia, Denmark, Iceland, Sweden, Norway and Finland.

Arctic temperatures are rising at almost twice the global average and could leap 4-7 Celsius (7-13 Fahrenheit) by 2100, roughly twice the global average projected by U.N. reports. Siberia and Alaska have already warmed by 2-3 C since the 1950s.

Possible benefits like more productive fisheries, easier access to oil and gas deposits or trans-Arctic shipping routes would be outweighed by threats to indigenous peoples and the habitats of animals and plants.

Sea ice around the North Pole, for instance, could almost disappear in summer by the end of the century. The extent of the ice has already shrunk by 15-20 percent in the past 30 years.

"Polar bears are unlikely to survive as a species if there is an almost complete loss of summer sea-ice cover," the report said. On land, creatures like lemmings, caribou, reindeer and snowy owls are being squeezed north into a narrower range.

Hmmm for the most part, polar bears are not "cuddly". In fact, I hear they are pretty mean critters. As for the rest of it...what is your solution? maybe we all sell our cars (and I mean internationally!) shut down all the factories, quit heating our homes, etc. Of course, every nation wants every other nation to do just that meanwhile excluding themselves from having to take any action.
 
CSM said:
Hmmm for the most part, polar bears are not "cuddly". In fact, I hear they are pretty mean critters. As for the rest of it...what is your solution? maybe we all sell our cars (and I mean internationally!) shut down all the factories, quit heating our homes, etc. Of course, every nation wants every other nation to do just that meanwhile excluding themselves from having to take any action.

Did you know that Polar Bears are the only mammals that naturally hunt human beings?
 
nakedemperor said:
Did you know that Polar Bears are the only mammals that naturally hunt human beings?
So I have heard; doesn't that make them next in the war on terror? If not next, then SOON!
 
are extremely simple, and I believe that future generations will look back on the current Republican denial of global warming evidence with deep regret:

1. Raised the economy standards for cars. Remember when car makers thought catalytic converters were too expensive, along with seat belts, tempered glass, and any mpg>15?

2. Close the ridiculous loophole that exempts SUVs from emission standards.

3. Invest in getting us off fossil fuels. The New York Times estimated that $50 billion per year over 50 years would limit global warming to 2-3 degrees instead of the 6-10 currently predicted.

Who likes these ideas? Most Americans. Who doesn't? Oil and auto companies, and therefore President Bush & Co. It's beyond my why anyone who doesn't work for an oil or car company would be pleased with Bush's current approach on these issues.

Mariner
 
Mariner said:
are extremely simple, and I believe that future generations will look back on the current Republican denial of global warming evidence with deep regret:

1. Raised the economy standards for cars. Remember when car makers thought catalytic converters were too expensive, along with seat belts, tempered glass, and any mpg>15?

2. Close the ridiculous loophole that exempts SUVs from emission standards.

3. Invest in getting us off fossil fuels. The New York Times estimated that $50 billion per year over 50 years would limit global warming to 2-3 degrees instead of the 6-10 currently predicted.

Who likes these ideas? Most Americans. Who doesn't? Oil and auto companies, and therefore President Bush & Co. It's beyond my why anyone who doesn't work for an oil or car company would be pleased with Bush's current approach on these issues.

Mariner
1. I suspect the ridiculous fluctuations in oil prices will help drive that effort. Hybrid autos are becoming ever more popular and I suspect technologies in that arena will mature more quickly now.

2. I wonder just how much the SUV standards differ from the rest of the autos.

3. Investment in alternate energy technologies, while sounding like a relatively simple solution, is, in and of itself, not the only answer. There needs to be a concerted effort on the part of the international community to share technologies in that area. The Japanese seem to have the leading edge at the moment.

As for the rest of your post, blaming everything on Bush wont help anything. There have been Democratic Presidents in the recent past who have done less. There is no question that auto manufacturer and oil companies have a vested interest in keeping the petroleum based products around.
 
how much of "global warming" do you, NE, contribute to the natural fluctuations in the earth's atmosphere? Historical review clearly shows that there are time of warming and cooling that goes in cycles. Do you believe that we can reverse a natural cycle such as that? This is a serious question. Where are we in the natural cycle? From what I understand, we are in a natural warming cycle that can be traced back thousands of years.
 
Aren't these the same group of scientists who think the Earth has been around for Billions of Years?
 
How about we just ignore the environmental wackos like usual and do something productive with our lives like work hard for our families and help people live better lives than worrying about some junk science.
 
Mariner said:
are extremely simple, and I believe that future generations will look back on the current Republican denial of global warming evidence with deep regret:

1. Raised the economy standards for cars. Remember when car makers thought catalytic converters were too expensive, along with seat belts, tempered glass, and any mpg>15?

2. Close the ridiculous loophole that exempts SUVs from emission standards.

3. Invest in getting us off fossil fuels. The New York Times estimated that $50 billion per year over 50 years would limit global warming to 2-3 degrees instead of the 6-10 currently predicted.

Who likes these ideas? Most Americans. Who doesn't? Oil and auto companies, and therefore President Bush & Co. It's beyond my why anyone who doesn't work for an oil or car company would be pleased with Bush's current approach on these issues.

Mariner

While I may agree with the three premises you posted, you damage your credibility with the gratuitous attack on George Bush.

If you're looking for someone to blame - look at the American consumer. How many of those SUV drivers were forced to buy that gas guzzler? My guess would be that the answer is "not one". Auto emissions are the result of consumer choices. Government policy is a result of voter demands and preferences.

If government needs to be involved in the issues you raised, then why do you suppose that we heard barely a peep from kerry during the last campaign? Could it be that he couldn't be heard because he forgot to roll down the window of his SUV? Government will respond to these concerns when enough voters indicate that this is an issue with them.

The engine for change is at the grass roots. Voters are also consumers. Auto makers will not worry about fuel efficiency or alternate fuels so long as we continue to snatch up SUVs as fast as they can be produced.
 
Merlin1047 said:
Auto makers will not worry about fuel efficiency or alternate fuels so long as we continue to snatch up SUVs as fast as they can be produced.

Amen. Sing it preacher!
 
twice as fast as the rest of the planet

Here's where I get fuzzy. If one region is having freakishly warm weather while the rest of the planet is fine, I seriously doubt it's "global warming."

There are natural fluctuations in the global climate and have been for however long it's been here. It was hotter during the Middle Ages than now, and the worst pollution they threw up was the burning pitch used in seiges.
 
Hobbit said:
Here's where I get fuzzy. If one region is having freakishly warm weather while the rest of the planet is fine, I seriously doubt it's "global warming."

There are natural fluctuations in the global climate and have been for however long it's been here. It was hotter during the Middle Ages than now, and the worst pollution they threw up was the burning pitch used in seiges.

I'll agree that the science on this subject is far from conclusive. But the bottom line is that the less we pollute, the better off we are. The sooner we become weaned from fossil fuels, the sooner we begin to diminish the multitude of ecological issues associated with their use.

Looking to the future, we are going to reach a point where we have no choice but to forego the use of fossil fuels. The time to start planning alternatives is now. If we wait until the last minute, we will be forced to accept the quickest solution. That solution may not be the best one available.
 
Merlin1047 said:
While I may agree with the three premises you posted, you damage your credibility with the gratuitous attack on George Bush.

If you're looking for someone to blame - look at the American consumer. How many of those SUV drivers were forced to buy that gas guzzler? My guess would be that the answer is "not one". Auto emissions are the result of consumer choices. Government policy is a result of voter demands and preferences.

Voters are also consumers. Auto makers will not worry about fuel efficiency or alternate fuels so long as we continue to snatch up SUVs as fast as they can be produced.

I hope everyone here realizes that SUV's and Vans get about the same gas milage, but you never hear people bitch about vans.

I would love to buy a hybrid car, even if they're more expensive. I cant, because I have 4 children and you can't stuff them all in a small car. Hopefully the auto makers will start to make larger hybrid vehicles. Until then, YES, I and many other larger families, will be FORCED to own an SUV or van.
 
I heard that Eskimos who hunt for Polar bears have the best hunter in the rear walking backwards, because by the time they start tracking a bear, it's already hunting them.

I just rented that stupid global warming movie where everybody freezes, "The Day after Tomorrow". But it didn't make me want to sell my F350.
 

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