Are You Going to Hell?

[Fort Fun Indiana]

I have no belief in magic,

You, of course, do, and your head is filled with supernatural,magical beliefs. But because you think your magic is "special", you recoil at the word "magic", as it places your magical beliefs on the same shelf as all others. Where they belong.

 

[Meriweather]

You, of course, do, and your head is filled with supernatural,magical beliefs. But because you think your magic is "special", you recoil at the word "magic", as it places your magical beliefs on the same shelf as a others. Where they belong.

Yawn. Again, once you decide to come out of that magic Disneyland castle of yours, perhaps we can have a discussion that is worthwhile. Until then, so long.

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

You, of course, do, and your head is filled with supernatural,magical beliefs. But because you think your magic is "special", you recoil at the word "magic", as it places your magical beliefs on the same shelf as a others. Where they belong.

Yawn. Again, once you decide to come out of that magic Disneyland castle of yours, perhaps we can have a discussion that is worthwhile. Until then, so long.

Your head is not filled with supernatural, magical beliefs? Or, are they supernatural, but not magical? Neither, just suspensions of natural law? Oops, that's magic, too. Help me out, here.


yeah, dang it, I don't think you are going to talk me down from here. Not with your skills, anyway.

 

[SweetSue92]

Joe, how many years have you been out of the Catholic schools? I figure it must be around FORTY YEARS now. Forty years. How many years has it been since your mother has died? For real, this is a long time to be carrying around so much bitterness and anger. This is not any kind of rational problem you have with Christianity. It's personal animus--as you have said, HATRED. You know that does no damage to Christianity, or very little. It eats up at you, though.

Like I said, the same people are still engaged in the same asshattery. They deserve all the score I'll inflict on them. I know that I won't see the happy day when kids point at empty churches and ask what that building was for... but some day humanity will reach that happy place.

Were you brainwashed? Tell us how the people you still know personally and have a close relationship portray this brainwashing.

Actually, what I've found is that people who grew up Catholic generally take it with a grain of salt. The real nutters are the people who coverted to Catholicism from something else if you want to see the real High Octane Crazy...

I generally try to keep religious nuts out of my life, and most people know better than to try to discuss religion with me.

The first five books of the Bible (known as the Torah) were written by Moses - an adopted son of the king of Egypt - in approximately 1400 B.C.. These five books focus on the beginning of the nation of Israel; b

Guy, Moses did not write the Torah. They were written much later than that, with the last book, Leviticus, probably being added later, around the time of the Babylonian Captivity. This is why they contain so many contradictions on issues like divorce and whether you can marry your dead brother's widow. (Henry VIII had a lot of fun with that one.).

That's a very naive viewpoint you have. First, you're not really inflicting much scorn on people. And even if you are, how is that any different from what was done to you by the nun at your mom's funeral? Shouldn't you want to do BETTER?

Second, it's unbelievably naive to think that churches will someday be empty. Really?

 

[JoeB131]

Faith is not a belief in magic. Until you move beyond this belief in magic, I do not see room or reason for discussion.

Of course it is.

 

[JoeB131]

That's a very naive viewpoint you have. First, you're not really inflicting much scorn on people.

Yet, I have you and a few other religious nutters upset here.

And even if you are, how is that any different from what was done to you by the nun at your mom's funeral?

Well, for starters, I wouldn't show up at a funeral and say mean spirited things. That's different.

Second, it's unbelievably naive to think that churches will someday be empty. Really?

The Europeans are already there... America is going to catch up.

 

[SweetSue92]

That's a very naive viewpoint you have. First, you're not really inflicting much scorn on people.

Yet, I have you and a few other religious nutters upset here.

View attachment 238169

And even if you are, how is that any different from what was done to you by the nun at your mom's funeral?

Well, for starters, I wouldn't show up at a funeral and say mean spirited things. That's different.

Second, it's unbelievably naive to think that churches will someday be empty. Really?

The Europeans are already there... America is going to catch up.

Joe, no offense, but you don't have enough original content to upset me. You're too angry to think originally. It's just fire and spit and anger, not anything even approaching rational thought. To be honest that's why I thought you were yet in your 20s...that you came out of Catholicism much more recently. You're reacting. You're not presenting rational cases.

But whatever, makes me no nevermind. Sparky with his memes doesn't bother me either.

 

[JoeB131]

Joe, no offense, but you don't have enough original content to upset me. You're too angry to think originally. It's just fire and spit and anger, not anything even approaching rational thought. To be honest that's why I thought you were yet in your 20s...that you came out of Catholicism much more recently. You're reacting. You're not presenting rational cases.

Sure, that's why you've been stalking me on two threads now, because you so don't care.

Speaking of Memes

 

[SweetSue92]

Joe, no offense, but you don't have enough original content to upset me. You're too angry to think originally. It's just fire and spit and anger, not anything even approaching rational thought. To be honest that's why I thought you were yet in your 20s...that you came out of Catholicism much more recently. You're reacting. You're not presenting rational cases.

Sure, that's why you've been stalking me on two threads now, because you so don't care.

Speaking of Memes

I did when I thought you were newly out of the church and reacting like this, like in your 20s. Now that I know you're 57 Joe, I rather think the case is more hopeless, I'm sad to say. But I will pray for you

 

[JoeB131]

I did when I thought you were newly out of the church and reacting like this, like in your 20s. Now that I know you're 57 Joe, I rather think the case is more hopeless, I'm sad to say. But I will pray for you

Meh, let me know when you can do something USEFUL, 'kay.

Because Praying to an invisible Sky Fairy, I can't think of a more useless activity.

 

[ding]

Joey, you are proving my point. Every single perception you have is negative. So you have consciously decided to see it in the worst possible light. Thought followed by deed.

Nothing is all bad or all good, Joey.

Isn't that kind of like saying, "Hitler loved Dogs, so he wasn't all bad. And the Autobahn. That was kind of neat."

No, Joe it isn’t like saying that at all. That’s just your defense mechanism defending your rationalization that your bad acts are justified.

 

[Meriweather]

Because Praying to an invisible Sky Fairy, I can't think of a more useless activity.

Neither can we...which is why we pray to God.

 

[Taz]

Because Praying to an invisible Sky Fairy, I can't think of a more useless activity.

Neither can we...which is why we pray to God.

You pray to god because it makes YOU feel better. Not that there's really anything wrong with that, well, aside from all the wars and child abuse that religion has brought to our door time after time.

 

[ding]

Because Praying to an invisible Sky Fairy, I can't think of a more useless activity.

Neither can we...which is why we pray to God.

You pray to god because it makes YOU feel better. Not that there's really anything wrong with that, well, aside from all the wars and child abuse that religion has brought to our door time after time.

We pray to God for many reasons. Foremost is to alter the fabric of our identity. Jesus taught that it is possible to change our ways. That’s what it means to repent.

 

[Taz]

Because Praying to an invisible Sky Fairy, I can't think of a more useless activity.

Neither can we...which is why we pray to God.

You pray to god because it makes YOU feel better. Not that there's really anything wrong with that, well, aside from all the wars and child abuse that religion has brought to our door time after time.

We pray to God for many reasons. Foremost is to alter the fabric of our identity. Jesus taught that it is possible to change our ways. That’s what it means to repent.

People naturally change as they get older. I would never think of doing some of the things now that I did when I was younger... Let's say you get wiser, or wisen up.

 

[ding]

Because Praying to an invisible Sky Fairy, I can't think of a more useless activity.

Neither can we...which is why we pray to God.

You pray to god because it makes YOU feel better. Not that there's really anything wrong with that, well, aside from all the wars and child abuse that religion has brought to our door time after time.

We pray to God for many reasons. Foremost is to alter the fabric of our identity. Jesus taught that it is possible to change our ways. That’s what it means to repent.

People naturally change as they get older. I would never think of doing some of the things now that I did when I was younger... Let's say you get wiser, or wisen up.

I agree. That's the universe giving them feedback and pruning them.

If the universe were created through natural process and we are an accidental happenstance of matter and energy doing what matter and energy do, then there should be no expectation for absolute morals. Morals can be anything we want them to be. The problem is that nature does have a preference for an outcome. Societies and people which behave with virtue experience order and harmony. Societies and people which behave without virtue experience disorder and chaos. So we can see from the outcomes that not all behaviors have equal outcomes. That some behaviors have better outcomes and some behaviors have worse outcomes. This is the moral law at work. If the universe was created by spirit for the express purpose of creating beings that know and create we would expect that we would receive feedback on how we behave. The problem is that violating moral laws are not like violating physical laws. When we violate a physical law the consequences are immediate. If you try to defy gravity by jumping off a roof you will fall. Whereas the consequences for violating a moral law are more probabilistic in nature; many times we get away with it.

Morals are effectively standards. For any given thing there exists a standard which is the highest possible standard. This standard exists independent of anything else. It is in effect a universal standard. It exists for a reason. When we deviate from this standard and normalize our deviance from the standard, eventually the reason the standard exists will be discovered. The reason this happens is because error cannot stand. Eventually error will fail and the truth will be discovered. Thus proving that morals cannot be anything we want them to be but are indeed based upon some universal code of common decency that is independent of man.

So the question that naturally begs to be asked is if there is a universal code of common decency that is independent of man how come we all don't behave the same way when it comes to right and wrong? The reason man doesn't behave the same way is because of subjectivity. The difference between being objective and being subjective is bias. Bias is eliminated when there is no preference for an outcome. To eliminate a preference for an outcome one must have no thought of the consequences to one's self. If one does not practice this they will see subjective truth instead of objective truth. Subjective truth leads to moral relativism. Where consequences to self and preferences for an outcome leads to rationalizations of right and wrong.

Man does know right from wrong and when he violates it rather than abandoning the concept of right and wrong he rationalizes he did not violate it. You can see this behavior in almost all quarrels and disagreements. At the heart of every quarrel and disagreement is a belief in a universal right and wrong. So even though each side believes right to be different each side expects the other to believe their side should be universally known and accepted. It is this behavior which tells us there is an expectation for an absolute truth.

If there were never a universal truth that existed man would never have an expectation of fairness to begin with because fairness would have no meaning. The fact that each of us has an expectation of fairness and that we expect everyone else to follow ought to raise our suspicion on the origin of that expectation.

 

[BreezeWood]

...which is why we pray to God.

- and for building churches for your togetherness, having written your own religion in the 4th century ... society has been correcting ever since.


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