Are you a Christian or a Follower of Christ?

[ABikerSailor]

There are none as blind as those who refuse to see.....the Holy Father in Rome is God's messenger. Follow his teachings and you will enter the Kingdom of Heaven. Deny His Holiness the Pope and ye shall suffer the eternal hell fire.

Well, the ones that are blind are the Romans that traveled over to Israel during the Crusades and stole the Temple treasure as well as ripped off the Hebrew religion.

Why? Simple........they took a good thing and twisted it around into a parody of what Christianity was supposed to be.

BTW Yakking One......tell me something.........if people are born, that means they have a beginning, so therefore, how in the fuck can someone be thrown in Hell for eternity? Is a loving God REALLY gonna put you in Hell before you are born?

You are as deluded as homo 1 is deranged.

 

[Avatar4321]

Wow, like there is a big difference between the two? Like, say between those that worship the Easter Bunny and those that follow the Easter Bunny? Umm, well I am in the who- gives- a- darn category. Is there a reason we should care if you want to split hairs between such imbicilic crap?

I think the issue is labels and being ashamed of who you are. Well, not you specifically, but in general.

There really shouldnt be any difference, but why are people ashamed of a name?

 

[Avatar4321]

I asked a specific question; how do Muslims justify the coming of Prophet after the beginning of the intertestamental period about 420BC.

Which is when Malachi, the last Prophet, wrote.

This is; consequently, around the time of the end of the Captivity, which is what I was talking about. And it completes a part of the symmetrical "400 years" between major events in the Bible.

The Prophet Mohammad is completely out of the pattern of events in the Bible, so how do Muslims justify their faith as people of the Book when they ignore the Bible?

First, Malachi was the last book in the Old Testament. He isnt necessarily the last one chronologically.

Second, Your "symmetrical" argument is completely nonsensical. There is no reason any of us should except this ludicrous interpretation of the scriptures. Captivity ended 500 years prior to Christ's birth.

The only valid question you had is how do muslims justify their faith as a people of the book when they ignore the Bible. Their whole argument is that the Bible is corrupted though.

Of course that ignores the real facts, the Bible is a collection of Books, not just one. There is no reason we should limit God to what is said in the Bible because they are clearly not the only revelations God has given to mankind. The record clearly doesnt contain a full picture of Christ's life. Though it is useful to help people come to God, i fear too many people put their faith in their interpretations of the Bible to the exclusion of God.

 

[Avatar4321]

Really? Explain to me the difference between a follower of Christ and a Christian. I consider them to be one and the same.

A Christian is "in Christ". You cannot "follow Christ" that is meaningless to the Church. The Church is "in Christ", and Christ is "in the Church" through the Holy Spirit.

There is no compromise on this fact, it is Biblical heresy to claim anything else.

To remove the fact that you are "in Christ" is to remove a facet of Christianity, to be heretical, or an Apostate.

Someones probably responded, but am I the only person who thinks this argument is nonsensical?

Wow... i used that word twice today.

 

[Avatar4321]

I am a man of GOD, a former Priest, a follower of His Holiness the Pope. I will enter Heaven.

Alright, this may be a derailment, but hey, its my thread:

By what standard are you a man of God?

How is being a former priest good?

How is following the Pope going to help you?

What exactly do you think Heaven is?

 

[Avatar4321]

cant help myself here.

Kalam,

If as I suspect you are a Muslim than how can I possibly havean intelligent debate with you?

If you dont know that he is muslims after him being rather outspoken and obvious about it then you are correct, it would be impossible for you to have an intelligent debate. You would be unarmed.

Yours is a religion based on hatred, you worship a man you call Muhummed and this man was a confessed pedohile.

I seriously doubt Mohammad confessed to anything of the such. However, how can you possibly say that disqualifies someone from being called of God. We are all sinners. Moses killed a man. Paul lead the stoning of Stephen. Peter denied Christ three times. Yet, all of these men were called of God. All of these men were provided redemption through the Atonement of Christ.

Where do you find your standard on who can be called of God and who cant be? Because I see no such standard in the Bible. The Lord calls pretty much whomever He wants to call. And who are we to deny that?

Is your religion legitimate?

I guess that depends how you define legitimate. However, it seems difficult to imagine how you can tell someone that their closely held beliefs are contrary to some law. Especially in Western Civilization which extols freedom of religion.

I think not. It is based on hate, intolerance, slavery, and murder. Islam is such a sick religion that people actually see no wrong in hijacking jet aircraft loaded with people and ramming Office Buildings killing thousands. All in the name of Allah and Muhummed.

All I would have to do is point to the Inquisition and Crusades and he could make the same argument about your professed faith.

I have no respect for you or your religion any more than I respect Asdolph Hitler. In fact I despise your people and would willingly drop a nuclear bomb on the middle-east to rid the world of the cancer of Islam.

Are you that insecure in your faith that you'd resort to murder? If God is with you, teach them the truth with the power of your faith. The Word of God has a greater effect on the hearts of men then any physical force ever could.

 

[Kalam]

(Surah 2:190-194)[1]-)

And fight in the way of Allah against those who fight against you but be not aggressive. Surely Allah loves not the aggressors. - 2:190

And kill them wherever you find them, and drive them out of where they drove you out, and persecution is worse than slaughter. And fight not with them at the Sacred Mosque until they fight with you in it; so if they fight you, slay them. Such is the recompense of the disbelievers. - 2:191

But if they desist, then surely Allah is Forgiving, Merciful. - 2:192

And fight them until there is no persecution, and religion is only for Allah. But if they desist, then there should be no hostility except against the oppressors. - 2:193

The sacred month for the sacred month, and retaliation in sacred things. Whoever then acts aggressively against you, inflict injury on him according to the injury he has inflicted on you and keep your duty to Allah, and know that Allah is with those who keep their duty. - 2:194​

Where's the problem?

"Make war on them until idolatry shall cease and God's religion shall reign supreme." (Surah 8:36-)

Umm.... that translation is entirely wrong.

Surely those who disbelieve spend their wealth to hinder from the way of Allah. So they will go on spending it, then it will be to them a regret, then they will be overcome. And those who disbelieve will be gathered together to hell, - 8:36

That Allah may separate the wicked from the good, and put the wicked one upon another, then heap them together, then cast them into hell. These indeed are the losers. - 8:37​

"Believers, make war on the infidels who dwell around you. Deal firmly with them." (Surah 9:121-)

Nor spend they any thing, small or great, nor do they traverse a valley but it is written down for them, that Allah may reward them for the best of what they did. - 9:121​

You must be citing something incorrectly.

"Prophet make war on the unbelievers and the hypocrites and deal rigorously with them. Hell shall be their home." (Surah 9:73)

Your translation here is excessively simplistic. "Jihad" translates literally into striving, and can be used to denote resisting sin (lit. "jihad of the heart"), spreading the message of Islam (lit. "jihad of the tongue"), combating persecution and injustice (lit. "jihad of the hand") and holy war (lit. "jihad of the sword.") No clarification is provided in either this or the surrounding ayat, so the word must be rendered neutrally as "striving."

O Prophet, strive hard against the disbelievers and the hypocrites and be firm against them. And their abode is hell, and evil is the destination. - 9:73​

and so on

I have all evening.

I'll ignore the trollish inanities that make up the rest of your post.

 

[Kalam]

For the record, the extent to which I act like an asshole depends on how disrespectfully you act towards my religious beliefs. If you're capable of having a civil discussion, let me know.

Kalam,

If as I suspect you are a Muslim than how can I possibly havean intelligent debate with you?

Don't worry dude, I harbor no delusions about you being capable of intelligent debate.

 

[Avatar4321]

There are none as blind as those who refuse to see.....the Holy Father in Rome is God's messenger. Follow his teachings and you will enter the Kingdom of Heaven. Deny His Holiness the Pope and ye shall suffer the eternal hell fire.

I see no authority behind the Pope.

I do have to admit, when i started this thread i didnt think it would turn to a discussion of Catholicism and Islam. Who knew?

 

[Kalam]

Yo.......sha-zam kalam........you've just been pwned.

Welcome to the boards.

Thanks JB.

Don't break out the tissues and Vaseline just yet.

 

[JBeukema]

There are none as blind as those who refuse to see.....the Holy Father in Rome is God's messenger. Follow his teachings and you will enter the Kingdom of Heaven. Deny His Holiness the Pope and ye shall suffer the eternal hell fire.

Do not call anyone on earth your father; for One is your Father, He who is in heaven.

Matthew 23:9

“I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the father except through me.”

John 14:6-7

Acooding to Jesus, cathalocism=satanism

look up 'the god of this world'

 

[JBeukema]

The bible allows fo noone else. Any who cast aside god's word and teach new xdoctrine, seek to ursurp god- such as constantine and muhammed- is the devil

Only One Way

No religion that cites the bible can deny this, or is self-contradticting and annot be the word of an infallible god, and is therefore bullshit

 

[Avatar4321]

The bible allows fo noone else. Any who cast aside god's word and teach new xdoctrine, seek to ursurp god- such as constantine and muhammed- is the devil

Only One Way

No religion that cites the bible can deny this, or is self-contradticting and annot be the word of an infallible god, and is therefore bullshit

The Bible allows for no one else to what? What is God's word? Who exactly is usurping God?

 

[JBeukema]

The Bible allows for no one else to what?

add to or take from it

What is God's word?

according the the library compiled at the behest of the king, the library itself

Who exactly is usurping God?

according to the bible, satan

really, people, i should not know more about that idiot's religion than he does. It just demonstrates that his entrire ilk- all who follow his religion- are stupid, ignorant, uneducated, illiterate fools.

 

[Yukon]

PRAISE JESUS !

 

[Avatar4321]

add to or take from it

Bible doesnt say that.

really, people, i should not know more about that idiot's religion than he does. It just demonstrates that his entrire ilk- all who follow his religion- are stupid, ignorant, uneducated, illiterate fools.

You dont know jack. we've already established that.

 

[JBeukema]

add to or take from it

Bible doesnt say that.

Read the end of revelation. Read where the prohets got their authority- it must come from god, you idiot. That's the entire premise of yuour moronic cult

You dont know jack. we've already established that.

you've established nothing except for the following self-evident facts
-I know more about you do about your own religion
-you are a fool
-you have no reasonable or logical point to make
-you cannot show any of my points to be false
-your religion is bullshit and lies fed to ignorant masses to keep them in line and ensure the powers of self-appointed religious leaders

 

[Avatar4321]

Read the end of revelation. Read where the prohets got their authority- it must come from god, you idiot. That's the entire premise of yuour moronic cult

I suggest you read the end of revelation. Because it doesnt say at what you're claiming it says. You like so many others never bother to try to understand things, which is why you will never learn.

you've estabvlished nothing except for the fopllowing self-evident facts

This ought to be entertaining.

-I know more about you do about your own religion

Haha. which, of course, is why you cant even read a passage and understand what it says.

-you are a fool

haha. Maybe. But at least I can read. At least I can think. At least I can express myself coherently. Perhaps if you worked more on your analytical skills and style you might learn something.

-you have no reasonable or logical point to make

And yet, here you are trying to argue with me. You think I am a fool and you find it necessary to prove yourself better. Now tell me something, what sane needs to prove himself better than a fool?

-you cannot show any of my points to be false

Except, of course, the fact that the Bible doesnt say what you claim it does. Now does it? You have to prove your points. The burdens on you. You are the one claiming the Bible says that the Bible cannot be added to or taken from. You and people who seem to think the Bible has to be inerrant in order to lead them to a Perfect Savior.

-your religion is bullshit and lies fed to ignorant masses to keep them in line and ensure the powers of self-appointed religious leaders

Then why are you so afraid? You dont know a thing about my religion. If you did you would know there are no self appointed religious leaders. A man must be called of God as Aaron was. You'd know that if you read the scriptures.

You would also realize that you cant feed people lies and encourage them to find the truth for themselves. The fact is you dont know the first thing about my religion. And you think you know it better than I do. It's mildly amusing. and at the same time very sad.

I would invite you to stop being delusional. Stop hardening your heart to the truth. The beauty about the Gospel of Jesus Christ is you dont have to take my word for it. I can testify of the truth till the end of days, but I dont expect you to just believe it because I say it's so. The beauty of the Gospel is that God can do His own work. And He can reveal His will to the people, one at a time.

 

[JBeukema]

Then why are you so afraid? You dont know a thing about my religion. If you did you would know there are no self appointed religious leaders. A man must be called of God as Aaron was.

god calls all the diffrent leaders to contradict eachother? The beauty of the gospel of jesus the nazarene is allegations and claims of time travel

 

[ObamaBinLaden]

Kalam, you a very funny guy! One question: do muzzies still wipe their ass with their hand? If not, when did that change? Marco Polo bring you some asswipes too?

Followers of christ are pro-gay, they just don't know it. In the bible, gawd tells Adam: bang the chick and you're out of eden (the world's first gay bar).