Are we taking the correct approach to Education in our schools?

[nitroz]

The department of education was an idea given to us by Rockefeller who said he did not believe in educating the masses and that competition is sin. That should be our first clue.

I'm sorry, but you lost me there.

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

I think HS should be split towards those qualifying for college and those more towards a vocational education.
One size does not fit all and we cannot hold back the gifted for the less gifted.

I think it would be a waste.
I rather go with the one size fits all with the option of an IEP for the less gifted.

My town has Plymouth north high school and plymouth south high school. South is a vo-tech type of school and north is not.

We did it because there were WAY to many students for the high school in my town 20 years ago but it can work.

It should depend on the size of the town really. If there are enough people to make it a vialble option then maybe making a "shop" section for the vo-tech types and a non-shop section for the "off to 4 year college types" in the school would be ok.

If its a small town, well, you can't really do it with the resources at hand.

 

[Mr. H.]

The failures of education stem from the retention of worthless teachers due to the "tenure" system, the inablity to release said teachers due to the "tenure" system, the ineffective hiring practices brought about by the "tenure" system.

It's a racket, fraught with nepotism favoritism and cronyism that is managed by despotic personel.

You're forgetting about the most important failure. Parents.

parents are indeed the biggest failure.
But having old women who can't stop falling off the roof (slang) is a bad choice too.
I think coaches make much better teachers.

I've had a few retired teachers tell me "I really miss the kids, but I DON'T miss the parents".

 

[dblack]

I think parents should decide what kind of education is right for their children - not 'we'.

 

[uscitizen]

I think parents should decide what kind of education is right for their children - not 'we'.

Umm there is no intelligence test for being a parent.

 

[nitroz]

I think parents should decide what kind of education is right for their children - not 'we'.

Then why have education in the first place?
Parents are literally the dumbest people here.

 

[dblack]

I think parents should decide what kind of education is right for their children - not 'we'.

Umm there is no intelligence test for being a parent.

Is there one for being elected to the school board?

 

[dblack]

I think parents should decide what kind of education is right for their children - not 'we'.

Then why have education in the first place?
Parents are literally the dumbest people here.

Yeah! Parents are idiots. We should have all kids raised in state-run orphanages.

Go team!

 

[Jessica Blume]

The department of education was an idea given to us by Rockefeller who said he did not believe in educating the masses and that competition is sin. That should be our first clue.

I'm sorry, but you lost me there.

Bankers, umm...

Do you know about the federal reserve? John D Rockefeller?
The basis for all our corruption in this country.

 

[Jessica Blume]

I think parents should decide what kind of education is right for their children - not 'we'.

Then why have education in the first place?
Parents are literally the dumbest people here.

Yeah! Parents are idiots. We should have all kids raised in state-run orphanages.

Go team!

Thanks to the state now interfering in marriage and woman's liberation, that's what happened, pretty much.

 

[Mr. H.]

Parents and teachers. Seems to be 2/3 of the problem.

 

[nitroz]

The department of education was an idea given to us by Rockefeller who said he did not believe in educating the masses and that competition is sin. That should be our first clue.

I'm sorry, but you lost me there.

Bankers, umm...

Do you know about the federal reserve? John D Rockefeller?
The basis for all our corruption in this country.

No, I need a history lesson on that. :|

 

[Foxfyre]

I'm sorry, but you lost me there.

Bankers, umm...

Do you know about the federal reserve? John D Rockefeller?
The basis for all our corruption in this country.

No, I need a history lesson on that. :|

No worries. Most adults don't have a clue about that either and this is getting into an area normally handled in college Economics class rather than highschool. And trust me, while unintended consequences have resulted from many good intentions, including the Federal Reserve, that is NOT the basis for all our corruption in this country.

More on that tomorrow perhaps.

Tonight, it is late and I'm gonna go find my pillow.

 

[Mr_Rockhead]

Parents and teachers. Seems to be 2/3 of the problem.

And students seem to be the other third.

 

[old navy]

I think HS should be split towards those qualifying for college and those more towards a vocational education.
One size does not fit all and we cannot hold back the gifted for the less gifted.
And train the really less gifted for basic living skills many will do well to hold a job in a retail store or wash dishes in a restaruant. But they should be educated to do the best they can.

This divergance of educationl routes should begin in about 8th grade.

I've been saying similar things for years now. When the idea is raised though, the conversation turns to seperate but equal, Brown vs. Board of Education, etc. Some kids do not need 12 years of education. Plumbers make more money than my daughter with an MBA.

The district in which I teach has the second highest graduation rate in the country. All the high schools routinely end up in the top six percent of all the nation's schools according to some study. Teachers line up for miles trying to work with us. Yet, a certain segment of the student body has a 50 percent graduation rate. Imagine how good the education methods in the US would look if the smart kids were split from the "others" and two sets of scores were produced.

I teach in CTE and have 170 students, most of which are non-white and receive free or reduced lunch. Why do I mention that? It makes a difference in the way education should be looked at and how we as a society conducts it. Most of my students have no chance of getting into college. I focus my efforts on job skills, resumes, interview techniques, and how to speak with a grown-up.

 

[editec]

I went to schools that expected us to take 5 real academic course a day.

Were I to found a school for the college bound it would be very demanding and probably not at all, what most of you might think somebody like myself (basically a pretty easy going guy) would create.

It would be very demanding of the kids academically.

It would also tolerate no BS in terms of behavior.

I'm kind of an ED fascist in that respect.

It would INCLUDE, but not depend on STANDARDIZED TESTING.

Basically, I'd be creating the sort of schooling I got in the 1950s.

Humanist but FIRM. Also (for you educators out there?) I have heterogenius classes...not homogenius classes

Oh yeah, one more thing, I'd like to at least try... students would get paid for performance.

Not exactly sure how that would work, but teaching kids rewarding kids for doing their JOBS seems to me to be a good object lesson to prepare them for life.

A lot of carrot and a little stick* seems to be a good thing.

* No, I do not mean corporal punishment, I mean not tolerating unruly or thuggish behavior.

 

[nitroz]

Okay.

Lets come up of a list of classes. (Required, Required-Semester, and Electives)
The goal is to have a 5 hour school day. (but will go to 6 if we absolutely need to)
And any idea for testing? (standardized)

 

[psikeyhackr]

Is standardized testing, longer schooldays, and increased stress doing it for our children?
I don't think so. If you do then please explain why.

I think we should have 5 hour school days with the following courses:
-Math
-English
-Science
-PE (outside sports)
-Computer/Economics (semester long classes)

What grade level are you talking about. I considered all of high school English to be a waste of time. It was just a super easy course I could cost in and get Bs. Just figure out what the teacher wants to hear about some book or poetry that you don't give a damn about.

Math and physics should be taught together in a single course. They teach math like it is some abstract never never land nonsense and you can't see why you are doing it other than to prove you are smart to the teacher then you get some physics senior year.

Select the physics that uses the math and teach them both so the student can see something that the math can be applied to.

Ohm's Law

current = voltage / resistance

voltage = current * resistance

The students can use the meters to measure the values. That could be done in 7th grade. So they could learn algebra and electricity simultaneously and not think algebra is silly but complicated nonsense.

Computers and accounting not economics. The economists don't know accounting. That is why the planet is screwed up.

http://www.usmessageboard.com/3536705-post148.html

psik

 

[Foxfyre]

Okay.

Lets come up of a list of classes. (Required, Required-Semester, and Electives)
The goal is to have a 5 hour school day. (but will go to 6 if we absolutely need to)
And any idea for testing? (standardized)

Five hours only? And assuming college bound?

Ninth grade.
Algebra 1
English including one term of literature and one term of composition/theory.
History with emphasis on American and World History 18th century
Social Studies including Constitution and Government
General Science

Tenth Grade
Geometry
English including one term of literature and one term of composition/theory
History with emphasis on American and Wolrd History 19th Century
Social Studiies including Consititution, Government, and Economics
Biology

Eleventh Grade
Algebra II - Introduction to Calculus
English including one term of literature and one term of composition/theory
History with emphasis on American and World History 20th Century
Social Studies including the basics of the Founding Fathers, states rights, state economies
Chemistry

Twefth Grade
Calculus II = Introduction to Trig
English including one term of literature and one term of composition/theory
History with emphasis on American and World History 21st Century
Social Studies including a grounding in theories of government and those who developed them.
Physics

If a sixth hour is included daily, make it some kind of cultural enrichment in which the student is required to master something - band, chorus, art, theater, etc.

Also have some extra credit courses the student can do on his/her own time all geared to help the student qualify for the best colleges. For instance a foreign language is a big plus and that should be part of the mix.

Testing should show mastery of the subject taught with minimum proficiency required to be demonstrated to earn each grade.

 

[Avatar4321]

No we aren't. The Public school system is a joke. It's creating a society of people who know nothing and think they know everything. We need to teach people how to educate themselves.