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if GM had failed, economist predicted over 1 million jobs would have been lost alone. yup, let em fail and watch unemployment go to 15%, then you can blame Obama for higher unemployment again.
GM HAS failed. All the loans have done is push off the inevitable. The unions have GM over a barrel until the bird finally dies then they're screwed because they couldn't figure out that the golden goose can actually be killed. Morons.
oh yeah GM has failed alright, they only recently posted their largest profit in 11 years.
GM earnings: Biggest profit in eleven years - May. 5, 2011
Forget it westwall...your not exactly dealing with a genius here.
My guess...22 year old unemployed...never really fully employed GED holder that blames everyone else for his misery.
The stock market is bleeding
I day trade Google and Apple. 2 stocks that are 5 star S&P stocks that are bleeding like stuck hogs and are trading 22% below were they were 12 weeks ago
the job market is bleeding, 800 billion dollars of stimulus and tarp gone
Are we about to have another 2008 event?
If so where is our GWB leader at?
with out tarp, (his 1/2 of tarp), we do not survive 2008
ARE WE ABOUT TO HAVE ANOTHER 2008?
ARE WE IN THE GREAT DEPRESSION ALL READY?
GM HAS failed. All the loans have done is push off the inevitable. The unions have GM over a barrel until the bird finally dies then they're screwed because they couldn't figure out that the golden goose can actually be killed. Morons.
oh yeah GM has failed alright, they only recently posted their largest profit in 11 years.
GM earnings: Biggest profit in eleven years - May. 5, 2011
If that's so why did they have to borrow government funds to pay back the governement loans? Hmmm? Give it up. GM and it's finances are so shot to hell it is only a matter of time till it undergoes its final collapse.
The stock market is bleeding
I day trade Google and Apple. 2 stocks that are 5 star S&P stocks that are bleeding like stuck hogs and are trading 22% below were they were 12 weeks ago
the job market is bleeding, 800 billion dollars of stimulus and tarp gone
Are we about to have another 2008 event?
If so where is our GWB leader at?
with out tarp, (his 1/2 of tarp), we do not survive 2008
ARE WE ABOUT TO HAVE ANOTHER 2008?
ARE WE IN THE GREAT DEPRESSION ALL READY?
And Just think not even 2 weeks ago (4 Weeks into declines) Liberals on this board were still pointing to what they called a good stock market and claiming it was proof the Stimulus worked.
LOL
The Market is falling apart today because the market trades on the Future, and with Nothing but a SHIT TON of more Debt having come from all this Stimulus. The Market appears to be saying the Future is Grim.
oh yeah GM has failed alright, they only recently posted their largest profit in 11 years.
GM earnings: Biggest profit in eleven years - May. 5, 2011
If that's so why did they have to borrow government funds to pay back the governement loans? Hmmm? Give it up. GM and it's finances are so shot to hell it is only a matter of time till it undergoes its final collapse.
you think this is an intelligent arguement?
i borrowed from the the government to pay back the government? WTF?
thats like saying i borrowed $20 from my friend, then borrowed another $20 from the same friend to pay him back with his own money.
GM paid back the loan, restructured and did an IPO, the government loaned GM money in return for shares in the company. When GM went public the fed sold some shared to get their money back and kept some to wait until the stock went higher.
or did you miss all of this?
If that's so why did they have to borrow government funds to pay back the governement loans? Hmmm? Give it up. GM and it's finances are so shot to hell it is only a matter of time till it undergoes its final collapse.
you think this is an intelligent arguement?
i borrowed from the the government to pay back the government? WTF?
thats like saying i borrowed $20 from my friend, then borrowed another $20 from the same friend to pay him back with his own money.
GM paid back the loan, restructured and did an IPO, the government loaned GM money in return for shares in the company. When GM went public the fed sold some shared to get their money back and kept some to wait until the stock went higher.
or did you miss all of this?
I suggest you look into it further. That is EXACTLY what GM did. They borrowed money from the TARP fund to pay back the initial government loan. GM has paid NOTHING back yet.
you think this is an intelligent arguement?
i borrowed from the the government to pay back the government? WTF?
thats like saying i borrowed $20 from my friend, then borrowed another $20 from the same friend to pay him back with his own money.
GM paid back the loan, restructured and did an IPO, the government loaned GM money in return for shares in the company. When GM went public the fed sold some shared to get their money back and kept some to wait until the stock went higher.
or did you miss all of this?
I suggest you look into it further. That is EXACTLY what GM did. They borrowed money from the TARP fund to pay back the initial government loan. GM has paid NOTHING back yet.
you should really stop getting your information from Fox News.
"Because most of the $50 billion G.M. received was converted to an equity stake held by the Treasury Department, Mr. Akerson said G.M. had technically repaid its debt to the government, but he added that executives were doing our level best to help taxpayers recoup the remaining amount. The Treasury, which still owns 26 percent of G.M., has recovered about half of its investment in G.M."
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/08/business/08gm.html
conversion of loans to an equity share is not borrowing from the government to pay back the government.
this is also directly from your Forbes article:
Because a loan of such a huge amount would have been politically controversial, the Obama administration handed GM only $6.7 billion as a pure loan. (It asked for only a 7% interest rate--a very sweet deal considering that GM bonds at that time were trading below junk level.) The vast bulk of the bailout money was transferred to GM through the purchase of 60.8% equity stake in the company--arguably an even worse deal for taxpayers than the loan, given that the equity position requires them to bear the risk of the investment without any guaranteed return. (The Canadian government likewise gave GM $1.4 billion as a pure loan, and another $8.1 billion for an 11.7% equity stake. The U.S. and Canadian government together own 72.5% of the company.)
I suggest you look into it further. That is EXACTLY what GM did. They borrowed money from the TARP fund to pay back the initial government loan. GM has paid NOTHING back yet.
you should really stop getting your information from Fox News.
"Because most of the $50 billion G.M. received was converted to an equity stake held by the Treasury Department, Mr. Akerson said G.M. had technically repaid its debt to the government, but he added that executives were doing our level best to help taxpayers recoup the remaining amount. The Treasury, which still owns 26 percent of G.M., has recovered about half of its investment in G.M."
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/08/business/08gm.html
conversion of loans to an equity share is not borrowing from the government to pay back the government.
this is also directly from your Forbes article:
Because a loan of such a huge amount would have been politically controversial, the Obama administration handed GM only $6.7 billion as a pure loan. (It asked for only a 7% interest rate--a very sweet deal considering that GM bonds at that time were trading below junk level.) The vast bulk of the bailout money was transferred to GM through the purchase of 60.8% equity stake in the company--arguably an even worse deal for taxpayers than the loan, given that the equity position requires them to bear the risk of the investment without any guaranteed return. (The Canadian government likewise gave GM $1.4 billion as a pure loan, and another $8.1 billion for an 11.7% equity stake. The U.S. and Canadian government together own 72.5% of the company.)
The first report is from Forbes. I suggest you start there. I put the FOX link in because they were the only ones reporting on what Grassley was saying.
The stock market is bleeding
I day trade Google and Apple. 2 stocks that are 5 star S&P stocks that are bleeding like stuck hogs and are trading 22% below were they were 12 weeks ago
the job market is bleeding, 800 billion dollars of stimulus and tarp gone
Are we about to have another 2008 event?
If so where is our GWB leader at?
with out tarp, (his 1/2 of tarp), we do not survive 2008
ARE WE ABOUT TO HAVE ANOTHER 2008?
ARE WE IN THE GREAT DEPRESSION ALL READY?
Forget it westwall...your not exactly dealing with a genius here.
My guess...22 year old unemployed...never really fully employed GED holder that blames everyone else for his misery.
So, it seems that you have nothing intelligent to say so you resort to idiotic insults.
O.K. I'm a 54 year old well employed and well paid engineer. I think that his arguments are very intelligent.
Is your strategy always "Anyone that disagrees with me is stupid!"?
I.Q. of a donut, huh?
The stock market is bleeding
I day trade Google and Apple. 2 stocks that are 5 star S&P stocks that are bleeding like stuck hogs and are trading 22% below were they were 12 weeks ago
the job market is bleeding, 800 billion dollars of stimulus and tarp gone
Are we about to have another 2008 event?
If so where is our GWB leader at?
with out tarp, (his 1/2 of tarp), we do not survive 2008
ARE WE ABOUT TO HAVE ANOTHER 2008?
ARE WE IN THE GREAT DEPRESSION ALL READY?
So, Corporate welfare is a GOOD thing?
