Are the bans on gay marriage religious?

Discussion in 'Clean Debate Zone' started by tererun, Aug 2, 2012.

  1. TakeAStepBack
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    TakeAStepBack Gold Member

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    Once the government decided a license was required by partners to be deemed authorized to marry. They took over this debate and use it as a wedge to keep people swimming in the state box. There is absolutely no reason that any special perk should be obtained from marriage except the relationship itself. Any property, health related bindings, will or other contractual agreements should be obtained through the same means as any other contract. The only voice the state should have in this is upholding the rigths of individuals based on contractual agreements made.

    Until people realize that government has not role in your relationship except protecting your rights, this wedge issue will persist and we're the losers.

    But im sure you, your partner and the state will be overjoyed on your special day. :lmao:
     
  2. WorldWatcher
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    The dishonesty is the use of the term "marriage" without the context of which marriage (religoius or civil) you are talking about.

    In the majority of State same-sex couples are absolutley banned from entering into a legal Civil Marriage (i.e. that marriage recognized and considered valid under Civil Law).


    Speaking as as a registered Repubican since 1978, I find it funny that people think that equal treatment under the law, freedoms, and liberty must be based on what is "beneficial to society" - restricting the actions of others based on the collective mentality isn't something this country was built on.


    >>>>
     
  3. bodecea
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    bodecea Diamond Member

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    You just made the OPs point....it's a STATE issue....even tho religions seem to be in the forefront of keeping gay marriage bans, religious marriages are not banned at all. Religions are stepping into the STATE realm.
     
  4. bodecea
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    What have YOU done to get government out of the marriage business?
     
  5. del
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    del BANNED

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    if my aunt had balls, she'd be my uncle.
     
  6. WorldWatcher
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    While I understand where you are going with this thread, the above statements are not quite true. Utah's bigamy laws prevent not only multiple Civil Marriages, they also apply to a case of a single Civil Marriage while purporting to have "spiritual marriages" (i.e. additional "Religous Marriages".


    According to Utah’s bigamy statute, “A person is guilty of bigamy when, knowing he has a husband or wife, the person purports to marry another person or cohabits with another person.” Utah Code Ann. § 76-7-101(1) (2003). The law, therefore, applies not just to individuals who have obtained multiple marriage licenses, but also to those who are legally married to only one person, while also engaging in other marriage-like relationships that are not recognized by the state.

    Utah’s Bigamy Statute and the Right to Privacy and Religious Freedom


    >>>>
     
  7. midcan5
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    midcan5 liberal / progressive

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    Marriage confers rights on couples who choose to live together, divorce each other, fight constantly, create neurotic weird kids together, cheat on each other, hate each other, and sometimes live happily ever after together. We have been married longer than most on the board have existed. My brother and his partner have been together longer than most so called normal marriages. The right to do all of the above should be granted to all, for if rights mean anything and they do in marriage, all who want to tumble through it, should be granted that right and those privileges. Religion should stay with the religious and away from denying the rights and privileges of the citizenry. Gay marriage must be a federal law and considered like any contract. The intolerant can move to Iran or another religious theocracy.

    Below is information that counters the intolerant in America:

    "However, there is no evidence that the introduction of same-sex marriage will change any other elements of this social meaning. Moreover, this social meaning has already changed radically over the years.... Marriage used to be generally understood as an unequal partnership, with the wife being subordinated to her husband, whereas now — at least in law and in most of mainstream culture — marriage is viewed as a partnership of equals. In general, the social meaning of marriage must change whenever such changes are necessary to avoid injustice; so this social meaning must now be changed so that it no longer excludes the participation of same-sex couples." Ralph Wedgwood The Meaning of Same-Sex Marriage - NYTimes.com

    http://www.usmessageboard.com/law-and-justice-system/101616-a-conservative-i-agree-with.html

    Gay Marriage: The Arguments and the Motives
    [ame=http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ISBN=0684824043/scottbidstrupshoA/]Amazon.com: CASE FOR SAME SEX MARRIAGE: From Sexual Liberty to Civilized Commitment (9780684824048): William N. Eskridge: Books[/ame]

    Homosexuality and the Bible by Walter Wink


    [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GssdKvp4pLo]Circular Logic Caller: Arguing over Gay Marriage - A.E. #584 - YouTube[/ame]
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2012
  8. jillian
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    jillian Princess Supporting Member

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    the full faith and credit clause of the constitution requires that status laws in one state be recognized in all others.

    Article IV | U.S. Constitution | LII / Legal Information Institute

    now what were you saying about dishonesty?
     
  9. WorldWatcher
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    Well just to be technical...

    "And the Congress may by general laws prescribe the manner in which such acts, records, and proceedings shall be proved, and the effect thereof."​

    That's what Congress did with the section of DOMA that releases one State from being required to recognize Same-sex Civil Marriages from another jurisdiction. Now there is some question as to the validity of that because Congress made the exemption narrowly tailored toward one group, they did not exempt one state from being required to recognize all Civil Marriages that conflict with their own laws - only those based on gender.

    The current DOMA cases that are proceeding to the Supreme court are focused on the Federal recognition question of some State Civil Marriages but not others, not the exemption clause.


    >>>>>
     
  10. bodecea
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    The cost of adopting my own daughter because at the time she was born, we were not legally married is pretty much in line with the description in the video. Not exactly equal under the law, is it?
     

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